KrisZ

Regarding Parv's point about the project and what it is....I think Grimmas hit it pretty much perfect right here in May. http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/28589-the-rules/&do=findComment&comment=5668974

World of Sport is my blind spot as I haven't watched nearly enough that I should but before I turn a ballot in I will definitely watch as much as I can. I don't want anybody to leave this project because everyone that is involved likes different things and adds flavor to the project whether you are a hardcore CIMA fan or a hardcore Dory Funk Jr. fan it's those differences that make this place and this project what it is in the long run. This place is one of the few if not the only places that a list like this can be done with some sort of merit because of all of everyone's different tastes. Most places if they did a list like this would be heavily skewed towards 1980's and beyond American wrestlers and we don't have to worry about that here......at least I hope not.

Yeah but how long has this project been going on.....and we still have until the end of March 2016 to hash this out.......that's 5 fucking months.....if you really want to open your mind and search stuff out there is plenty of time left. A line I've always used in regards to picking up women is "Closed Mouths Don't Get Fed"......well Closed Minds Don't Get Fed either.......

But wasn't one of the main goals in this project to get people to watch stuff out of their comfort zone to become more inclusive in their watching instead of just focusing on what they already liked to begin with. Especially if you are trying to get people to watch more of certain wrestlers because you like them but totally dismiss others because they don't fit your preconceived notions as a fan.

So if Ted DiBiase or Jerry Lawler does nothing for you then it is the same if El Satanico or Akira Hokuto does nothing for you. I want to make sure that everyone is in agreement here.... I'm not a Joshi fan but I can definitely recognize that they had some of the best wrestling in the world in their heyday and I kinda feel inclined to have that represented on my list because that's the way it should be if we are going "Greatest Wrestler Ever." I'm not going to totally dismiss the style because I don't feel comfortable with it.

One thing though is that if you are making such a big argument about people voting the way they vote, then you shouldn't be going on record saying that you won't be voting for certain genres of wrestling. Your opinions on the matter then should be taken with a grain of salt because you have closed your mind on some of the best performers ever in the business because you don't feel comfortable with it.

One sports example I can think of is when the NBA put out their Top 50 Players Ever in 1996, Dominique Wilkins was left off the list when most experts easily could point out was a travesty of justice especially when Shaquille O'Neal (who would prove his greatness later) was on the list after only being in the league for 3 or 4 full seasons. Nique's stats and impact on the game definitely warranted him being on the list but the people that made up the list obviously thought differently. Lists like this are supposed to have arguments because what fun would it be if everyone had almost the same exact list. Plus everyone will never have the same criteria unless it was set from the start that you have to follow certain rules and if there was such a thing I doubt a lot of people would be involved in the first place as who wants to be limited in their decision making.

This is completely ridiculous. Any project like this in any form or fashion will ALWAYS come down to personal taste....it's human fucking nature. Joe may hate Lawler & Dundee which is his personal belief and while it may be offbase in a lot of our minds....it's what he doesn't like about wrestling. There will be people that feel the same way he does about his personal favorites and yes that is why this project is good is because everyone doesn't think the same way and are able to expound their beliefs. This isn't Communism......Chairman Mao isn't in charge of this project folks. When we have people that want to act like children because their favorites aren't getting the love they think they deserve then that falls on the person themselves not the project. If you aren't able to stand your ground and fight for who you believe in that much then maybe you are not fit to participate in a project like this.

El Corsario = Savio Vega aka TNT

Lawler vs. Tenryu not happening makes me so sad

1994 Hogan & 1998 Shane Douglas rank at the top of the list

It was Paul Jones not Valiant.......but that is a great photo And I knew that Halcon '78 wasn't the same as the original hence the '78 in his name. Regarding Dave.....I asked him to be on a show a while back and he never answered

Once Duggan eventually left in January.....the writing was on the wall.....he was the heart & soul of the promotion.

Kris & David are joined Bruce Mitchell (Pro Wrestling Torch) to discuss the week that was October 13-19, 1986. We discuss the tragic car wreck that ended Magnum T.A.’s career in the ring and how the territory was affected from it. We also discuss the impending departure of Hacksaw Jim Duggan from the UWF, the return of Roddy Piper to the WWF, Riki Choshu to WWF?, and Mad Dog Vachon in his new role in life as……INSPECTOR GOURMET!!!!!! Time stamps: 0:00:00 Jim Crockett Promotions 0:52:37 UWF & WCCW 1:29:50 International: AJPW, NJPW, EMLL, & Lutte International 1:56:56 Other U.S.: AWA, CWA/Memphis, Championship Wrestling from Florida, Hawaii, ICW, L.A. Lucha, & Portland 2:27:13 WWF http://placetobenation.com/between-the-sheets-ep-13-october-13-19-1986/

I prefer this one because of the novelty and they were just so good so young. The Boston match may have been better as a match but this one has more of an emotional attachment to me

Holy Shit that brought back memories.....I totally forgot Berk was working a Texan gimmick. The old DVDVR Road Reports were always classic.

Baseball and other stuff has delayed my indie rewatching but I'm back and watching CZW's "Best of the Best #1" on 5/19/01 in Sewell, New Jersey. This starts with the legendary CZW announce team of Eric Gargiulo & John House with House picking his boy Trent Acid to win the tournament before we get promos from the contestants which was hilarious especially Nick Berk looking at the wrong camera angle when he talked, Minoru Fujita playing arcade games, and the SAT's trying to steal John House's truck!!!!!. Danny Rose calling everyone "cockplate" was awesome as well as Trent Acid saying that W*inger beat him in Japan by a "cunt hair." Ring announcer Dennis Shock comes out to introduce all of the Best of the Best participants and the fans are more welcoming of Shock than the last show I watched. What a crew of guys that were in this tournament....John Zandig then comes in the ring in his jorts and weedwhacker in hand to hype up the tournament. Best of the Best - Round 1: Red vs. The W*INGER vs. Ric Blade The deal here is that the man who loses is eliminated and the next two men advance to the next round. Red coming out to Dispoable Teens by Marilyn Manson is so great. Blade looks terrible to start whiffing on takedowns and spots and everything is disjointed which was kinda expected since it was a 3-way. W*INGER would hit a nice tope con hilo to the floor on both men. Holy shit Blade's Drug Bomb on Red was awesome and I'm surprised more people don't use that move today. Red then would come back though hitting his Red Star Press for a nearfall and the fans are now starting to get into the action. Blade pushing Red off the top rope hitting a tope con hilo to W*INGER on the floor with Blade following up with a corkscrew splash of his own was great. Blade hitting rolling Fisherman's Busters on W*INGER then the Edge of the Blade on Red looked like it was going to be the end of both men but it wasn't as W*INGER threw Blade off the top rope and Red hit a wild looking corkscrew press with W*INGER hitting a Senton Bomb Togo style to eliminate Blade in a huge upset. Blade then cut a promo after the match putting over how tough W*INGER is as well as giving Red love before leaving. It was mentioned on commentary that Blade's wife Shorty was expecting their baby at any time so this may be why Blade lost so early but it was still very weird. Best of the Best - Round 1: Jay Briscoe vs. Mark Briscoe vs. "Sick" Nick Mondo This is another highly interesting matchup. Mondo cuts a fun promo on the fans before the match for being sheep which has Green Lantern Fan at ringside looking outraged. Young Briscoes are so fun to watch and they should bring back the old black shirts with "BRISCOE" in red letters on the front. Gargiulo talking about Jay being a high school Junior and Mark being a high school Sophomore is wild considering they are wrestling as pros. Briscoes faced off against each other for the first time here and the early part of this match was better than the last match because of the Briscoes working together although they would attack each other as well. Jay hitting a reverse wheelbarrow suplex on Mondo was fucking sweet and another move that should be brought back. Mondo countered a swinging DDT by Mark with a sitout driver was also sweet. Mark hit a nice running springboard dive on Mondo followed up by a twisting splash by Jay and Mondo was in deep trouble. Jay & Mark would fight each other allowing Mondo make a comeback and he would bring steel chairs to the ring holding them up to his head as the Briscoes came off the top with stereo dropkicks. Briscoes then started working together again but missed diving legdrops off the top rope on steel chairs. Mondo again fought back and hit the Assault Driver on Mark for a nearfall before getting out a table where he puts both Briscoes on the table as the crowd chants "DEW SUCKS DICK" for Dewey Donovan. Mondo went running to dive on the Briscoes but Jay would get in the ring and Mark stood up on the table where Jay would backdrop Mondo over the top onto Mark for a powerbomb on the table which looked dangerous as shit. The Briscos would then hit a Phoenix Bomb to win the match and Mondo is eliminated in another upset. Mondo snapped and attacked the Briscoes afterwards until Justice Pain ran out to attack Mondo before they got pulled apart. Pain wearing a "HARDCORE NICK SUCKS" shirt while cutting a promo on Mondo is great. Best of the Best - Round 1: Nick Berk vs. Minoru Fujita vs. Jose Maximo NICK FUCKIN BERK!!!! always thought that guy was underrated. Fast but sloppy action to start although Jose hit a sweet Asai Moonsault to the floor on both men. Fujita looked very impressive and the most polished here which should come as no shock and then you had Berk hit Fujita with the Berkolater on Maximo and that was the match as Maximo was eliminated. Berk & Fujita then brawled after the match to set up their match later. Gargiulo even hinted these guys could be shooting on each other while House dropped a "Pearl Harbor" line. Best of the Best - Round 1: Trent Acid vs. Ruckus vs. Joe L Maximo Ruckus is taking Juventud Guerrera's place in this match because Juvy had travel issues and if Ruckus advances then Juvy will take his spot later. Gargiulo mentions that Ruckus had lost 35 pounds over the last couple of weeks which is crazy. Ruckus hits the "Fatass" dive from the ring to the floor on Acid & Maximo and god I loved fat Ruckus. Maximo nuked Ruckus with a backdrop driver then Acid followed with a nice missile dropkick off the top rope. Ruckus was a house of fire here hitting some big moves on both men before eating a tough lariat and moonsault from Maximo. Ruckus came back though and started cleaing house again until eating a Yakuza Kick from Acid. Acid would then follow with an Acid Bomb but it wasn't hit cleanly so Ruckus kicked out. Acid would sit out on Maximo as he tried to cradle him so Acid & Ruckus advanced. Ruckus & VD (Eddie Valentine & Jon Dahmer) vs. The Rachies (Adam Flash & "Doomsday" Adam Rose) & Jeff Rocker Ruckus is now in his scheduled match for the evening. Jeff Rocker is still looking like a roided up Lance Storm. Rocker using a Fisherman's Suplex into a Sharpshooter which he called the "Rocker Locker" was hilarious since he is basically doing a Canadian wrestling star tribute gimmick. VD hitting a powerbomb into a shoulderbreaker on Rocker was pretty sweet. Dahmer & Rukcus being two big men hitting smaller guys spots was fun and I dug the shotei/backdrop suplex combo on Rocker. Dahmer's spinebuster on Rocker was damn good and Rocker is getting his ass kicked. Rocker tried to tag in Danny Rose but he was denied so Rocker took a missile dropkick into a powerbomb from VD and still kept fighting. Rocker caught Dahmer with a desperate belly-to-belly suplex then picked up the big Dahmer for a TKO and a nearfall. Rocker then slapped Danny Rose on the chest for a tag and the Rachies would double up on Dahmer and they were good as a team giving this match some psychology as Dahmer played FIP plus they were no-selling Rocker's attempt at a tag. Dahmer would finally get a tag to Valentine and Ruckus would come in as well for a 6-way brawl that would spill to the floor where chairs would get used and Ruckus would climb up to the camera area where he would hit an INSANE moonsault where Ruckus almost slipped and ladned headfirst. The match ended up back in the ring with the heels working over Ruckus as Rocker held up Ruckus so the Rachies could hit him with a conchairto but Rocker got it instead and Ruckus followed up with a huge 450 Splash to win the match. Best of the Best - Quarterfinals: The W*INGER vs. Red Winger changed his gear from the first match to this one as he had the Onita jeans look earlier and now he has the red mask with the pony tail out of the back and his Hayabusa pants. W*INGER is another guy who no one talks about any more but was so damn fun. Red took the battle to W*INGER early sending him to the floor where he would hit a crazy twisting corkscrew press off the top rope on W*INGER. John House then talks about how Red has a history of banging the rats after shows which was hilarious. W*INGER was fun playing to the fans who chanted his name as he was dropping Red with suplexes. Red would hit the Sliced Bread #2 which was the first time I ever saw that move at the time for a nearfall then a Red Star Press but he hurt himself which got worse after missing another corkscrew press off the top rope. W*INGER then dropped Red with a Michinoku Driver followed up by his huge Senton Bomb to advance to the semifinals. This was a very short match not even 4 minutes long and I would've liked to have seen these guys definitely go longer. Best of the Best - Quarterfinals: Jay Briscoe vs. Mark Briscoe This was their 1st ever singles matchup but Dewey Donovan doesn't want them to wrestle and wants Jay to advance but referee John Hartock kicks Dew out of the ringside area. This starts with the brothers working holds and counters which is way different for this crowd but they don't shit on it. Funny watching the Briscoes working a Dory Funk Jr. vs. Jack Brisco type match but Mark sent Jay to the floor and did springboard tease sending a message to Jay. That signaled the end of the holds and then they started to work a faster pace with Mark hitting a leg lariat which caught Jay offguard. The fans are really into this match and chanted "FUCK THE HARDYZ" which was great. Mark became the more aggressive at this point taking the battle to his brother but Jay would fire back hitting a Tiger Driver for a nearfall. Jay works over the neck and back hitting a big tombstone piledriver but doesn't capitalize on it as he poses in the corner. Jay then climbs up top and hits a big diving body press across the ring on Mark for a nearfall then dropped him hard with a DDT. Jay would hit the J-Driller and fucking spiked Mark but Mark kicked out. The fans are hot for this match now as Mark comes back hitting a Fisherman's Buster then climbs up top hitting a big huracarana on Jay who was on the apron sending them to the floor. Jay is now laid out on the floor as Mark climbs up top and hits a moonsault press on a floor that had ZERO give. The battle goes back to the ring where Mark continues working over Jay hitting a Northern Lights Suplex off the top rope which was cool as the fans gave them a standing ovation. This now becomes a total war of attrition as Mark hits a Cutthroat Suplex on Jay which was sick as hell. Mark then dropped Jay with a jackknife powerbomb but missed a moonsault press and ate a half-nelson suplex right on his head for his trouble. Jay then used it again but Mark still kicked out so Jay used a top-rope Tiger Driver which was insane to put Mark away. This was a simply amazing match and maybe the best brother vs. brother match ever. These guys were still in fucking high school and were tearing fucking shit up. The fans then demanded they come out for a curtain call afterwards which they did and this was a great moment. Everyone should see this fucking match. Best of the Best - Quarterfinals: Minoru Fujita vs. Nick Berk Good luck following that shit up here. Gargiulo claimed these guys had real heat earlier but they didn't really show it here as they went into just regular pro wrestling stuff. Fujita started strong until Berk got the Muta Lock on him which Fujita countered with a wakigatame which started him working over the left arm. Fujita again looks more polished than most of the other guys on this show but Berk is solid and hangs with Fujita using some high impact moves to offset Fujita and also worked a limb as he went over Fujita's left ankle. Fujita though was a savage working over the arm with Berk getting to the ropes as much as possible. Berk was now basically working with just one arm making it tough for him to do anything. Fujita would eventually hit a Dragon Suplex hold to win and advance in a fine match with some actual limbwork and psychology. Best of the Best - Quarterfinals: Trent Acid vs. Juventud Guerrera Juvy finally showed up coming out to Ruckus' music no less which was funny. Juvy of course cuts a Juvyriffic promo before the match and he starts kicking Trent's ass as the match starts. Juvy hit a baseball slide to the floor on Acid & Z-Barr then followed up with a springboard plancha so at least he was trying in this match. Acid then tried to leave but Juvy chased him and threw him through some chairs. Juvy took the match back to the ring where he dominated some more even hitting his People's Elbow which was a nice callback to WCW. Z-Barr got Juvy to chase him around and into the ring where Juvy ate a Yakuza Kick giving Acid the opening he needed. Juvy though didn't stay down long and went back to work on Acid hitting an ugly springboard legdrop for a nearfall. Juvy then spiked Acid with a powerbomb then called for the Juvy Driver which brought in z-Barr who ate the Juvy Driver instead. Acid though got an inside cradle on Juvy to get a cheap victory. You fly Juvy in and you put him in a 6 minute match. Juvy then celebrated afterwards though pouring water on himself so nice of him to not give a fuck about losing as the fans cheered him. I definitely wanted more but oh well. Best of the Best - Semifinals: The W*INGER vs. Minoru Fujita It's a Battle of Big Japan stalwarts in the semifinals. Fujita hits a tope suicida to the floor 30 seconds into the match and starts throwing chairs taking the fight all over the building before they take it back to the ring where of course they start working holds and counters. Fujita with the half crab and boot on the back of the head was nice. They took it back to the floor again where W*INGER would drop Fujita with a piledriver on the floor before taking it back to the ring. W*INGER tried putting Fujita away with an STF and really cranked it in before a Blue Thunder Driver for a nearfall. Fujita would come back though with a flying forearm splash and then a missile dropkick off the top rope before starting to work over W*INGER's right leg getting a swank modified Bow & Arrow but W*INGER broke free. Both men now start trying to put the other one away with Fujita kicking it into high gear trying to get his Dragon Suplex but W*INGER kept finding a way out of it. W*INGER would hit his Senton Bomb but Fujita would kick out then he would hit W*INGER with a lariat for a nearfall. W*INGER though would catch Fujita in a Casita to win and advance. This was a pretty damn good match here which was expected since these two had some chemistry against each other. Best of the Best - Semifinals: Trent Acid vs. Jay Briscoe Mark accompanies Jay to the ring which is cool with Gargiulo saying that Mark suffered a concussion in the match earlier. Both guys are starting to show wear and tear but still hit some big spots but Jay looks better than Trent even after that war earlier. Jay works over Trent's left leg some before hitting a springboard lariat for a nearfall followed up by a Tiger Suplex for a nearfall. Jay would climb up top but Trent tossed him off right onto some steel chairs before Trent would lay Briscoe across some chairs so Trent could hit the "Bad Trip" off the top rope in a scary spot where Trent looked like he fucked up his knee. Jay then hits the fucking Big E. spear through the ropes spot on Acid through the steel chairs as the crowd chanted "HOLY SHIT" and they were right. Jay missed his version of a Senton Bomb but fired himself up to get back on his feet and he ate a Yakuza Kick while standing on the top rope to set up the Acid Bomb which gave Acid the victory. This was a pretty damn good match considering both men were beat up from earlier matches. The Briscoes were done for the night but they were made into God Damn stars from this show. Then we get a promo from W*INGER in the locker room in a mix of Japanese/English about his upcoming match with Acid. War Games Rules: The H8 Club (Justice Pain & Wifebeater) & Lobo vs. "Hardcore" Nick Gage, Nate Hatred, & "Sick" Nick Mondo Pain gets on the mic before the match and puts over all the BOTB matches so far as being amazing. The first two men in the ring are Justice Pain & Nick Gage and these guys beat the shit out of each other with Gage hitting fucking rolling piledrivers then a sick Hot Shot on the top turnbuckle. Gage then hit a spinning powerbomb on Pain through the table on the floor as the crowd went nuts. Pain comes back with a kick to the balls then the Alabama Slam into an STF but Nate Hatred would come out to make it 2-on-1. Pain fought back a little but Lobo would come out next to even the odds where he would take out Gage & Hatred with a tope con hilo to the floor followed up by one from Pain. Mondo would then come out and the action was going all over the building now which would get even more wild when Wifebeater joined the match and now we have everyone involved. Weapons now come into play as guys are swinging chairs as Gage dropped Pain with a brainbuster on a steel chair which was one of his key spots. There is a lot going on here as everyone is battling all over the place so it's kinda hard to keep up with but that god damn Nick Gage hit a big tope con hilo off the top rope to the floor taking out everyone. Pain would get a Pain Thriller on Gage but Nick wisely rolled outside the ring where everyone else was still brawling. Lobo & Wifebeater put Mondo through a table with a sideslam then Hatred was pinned after a Chokenstein by Wifebeater and a moonsault from Pain. Fans chanted BULLSHIT at the finish as it did kinda come out of nowhere. Gage cuts a fun Nick Gage esque promo where he says fuck and shit a lot and at this time of his life he really did look like Private Pyle from Full Metal Jacket. This was still a fun ass brawl though. Best of the Best - Finals: The W*INGER vs. Trent Acid Acid being hailed from South Philly, Japan is always hilarious and he limps down to the ring selling his leg injury from the match with Jay Briscoe. They shake hands before the match and of course Acid jumps W*INGER when he turns his back on him. These two had issues the year before in Big Japan so this is playing off that feud. W*INGER hits a big tope con hilo from the ring to the floor and W*INGER looks fresh until he takes a big moonsault press from Acid from the top to the floor. Acid sets up chairs in the ring but W*INGER would try and counter with a bulldog onto the chairs which was countered by Acid in a cool spot. W*INGER then NUKED Acid with a reverse powerbomb onto a chair and kicked him in the face for a nearfall. Acid though would put referee Brian Logan in the way of a missile dropkick who went down and Acid followed up with a Yakuza Kick which W*INGER no-sold into a cradlebreaker. Z-Barr then slapped W*INGER who unmasked to reveal Johnny Kashmere which was a really good shock. and he threw Z-Barr out of the ring where they brawled to the back. The real W*INGER then showed up hitting a big missile dropkick on Acid but missed his big Senton Bomb. The fans didn't know what to think now as Acid went for his "Bad Trip" but missed hitting all chairs then rolling to the floor where he ate a springboard twisting press by W*INGER. W*INGER gets help from guys to set up two tables side by side and he lays Acid on top as he climbs up top to the camera area where he hits his huge Senton Bomb in an insane spot. W*INGER rolls Acid into the ring but he still can't put him away so they do the RVD/Lynn cradle nearfall exchange for a crowd pop. W*INGER would cut back an Acid attempt of an O'Connor Roll and won the match and the tournament. This match had a lot going on with the Kashmere surprise then the huge W*INGER dive...was it a great match no....it was a pretty fun match although Acid was running on fumes but gutting it out hard. Zandig walks out after the match and talks about the fans saw the "WRESTLING" in CZW as the other BOTB competitors came to the ring where Zandig put over everyone in the building. Acid then demanded the mic and put over W*INGERd demanding that he shake his hand which he did and they hugged with Acid giving W*INGER the BOTB Trophy as everyone applauded. Zandig then called for all of the BOTB guys to enter the ring and they lifted W*INGER on their shoulders. The fans then started chanting for the Briscoes and Zandig put them over saying they had the best match of the night and they got two trophies. I hope those trophies are on a mantleplace at the Briscoes Ranch next to some fucking deer heads. Zandig also confirmed that Best of the Best would be coming back in 2002.

No I was born in 1979 in Georgia but I've seen enough of Flair from that era from different places to see that he was working fairly different than he did in the mid-late 80's.

Flair didn't start relying on formula matches until probably his 2nd run as NWA Champion......The Ric Flair of the late 70's-early 80's is a different beast than 1985 Ric Flair

1986

Oh god the stuff covered in this show would have Wrestling Twitter going insane

Daniels, Modest, & Morgan were going to be involved

Lawler got over in Florida & Southwest because they kept bringing him back and put him in main events especially Florida......and this is with him not even working their TV

I just don't see it.......someone dies the day before the show maybe but not finding out until right before the PPV......

I would definitely have Karl on either on this show or on Exile....just gotta find the right topic.