ohtani's jacket

Recently, I was prepping someone for red carpet interviews. Most performers don't want to be interviewed let alone asked tough questions, which is why most interviews in general are PR exercises where the interviewer tries to not upset the interviewee. The interviews that most of us would like to read are dream interviews for the most part.

Jake cut some killer promos in that feud like his interview at Survivor Series '91 and his post-match interview at This Tuesday in Texas. Savage's promos were a continuous stream of "Elizabit" and "blame myself" with Randy slapping himself a lot. Not quite as good. Great angle though and a great way to reinstate Savage. The ringwork wasn't that bad. It was definitely watchable from a storyline point of view.

A lot of the lucha being recommended you're not going to find anymore as it's Black Terry Jr stuff and you have to pay for it now.

I watched their '88 match again where Grey is a middleweight. The magic wasn't the same. Walton annoyed me by saying it was the first time Grey had beaten Myers even though he beat Myers in half the matches I watched recently and Walton said the same thing each time. I can't find their '85 wager match online, but I can't imagine it being as good as the two draws and the '83 showcase. I make it three matches from the 70s worth seeing and three matches from the 80s. Pretty good going and definitely one of the key match-ups in British wrestling.

From ze blog: Mocho Cota vs. Americo Rocca (1/27/84) Mocho Cota vs. Americo Rocca (2/3/84) Mocho Cota is such a compelling worker. On one hand, he looks like an evil genius like the Master from Dr. Who. On the other hand, he's so hyper with his pre-match taunting that when you hear the Bihari relayed stories about how he lost his fingers he may just be a maniac who's on something. Maybe with his "deformity" he's got a whole "if I cannot prove a lover, I'm determined to prove a villain" Richard III thing going on. Whatever the case, he laughs like a madman. Like all of the truly great workers, he puts an amazing amount of detail into his work. Whether he's working from the top or bottom, he's constantly selling. If it's a hold he's applying, he's always moving, shifting, trying to gain more leverage, selling the effort in his face. You've heard all the cliches about it being a game of human chess and having to think two or three moves ahead. It sounds like Larry Z on an episode of Worldwide, but Cota is that type of worker. The matwork in these matches isn't for show or to undo each other, it's a step-by-step effort at dismantling the opposition, and behind that veneer of maniacal laughter is a great wrestling mind. One of the best on the set. I didn't pay enough attention to the January match the first time I watched it. It really is a veritable masterpiece. Some of the best matwork in the history of lucha on tape. The rematch is beautiful and the matwork in the first caida may be even better than the January match. Americo Rocca deserves a ton of credit for the matches being good as he was a more than capable mat worker who shone in the more difficult role of technico, and his selling was every bit as careful and measured as Cota's. They should be commended for working two different mat classics only days apart, but for me it was Cota who really stood out. This was the first time I really saw him being on the level of a Satanico and elevated him to that tier of lucha workers. Watch his reactions in these matches. The way he sells the "strangleholds" that Rocca applies after they've been broken. The way he pounds his fist into his hand when a well planned sequence doesn't pay dividends, or the cocky strut when he knows Rocca has submitted even before the bell. The seriousness with which he wrestles the second caida of the rematch and his selling when he loses a fall demonstrate his range. There's never a point where he isn't selling. I loved the part after the second match where the kids are heckling him at ringside and he scares the shit out of them like a one handed Boogie Monster. These are also great matches for rudo fans as the old adage of "cheat to win" has never been so boldly played out in a lucha libre title match. Cheating of this magnitude usually doesn't occur in a lucha libre match, but Cota's genius makes all things permissible. The wonderful thing about the rematch is that I found myself wanting Rocca to win. They probably went a beat or two beyond what they needed in that second caida, as I thought Cota could have ended it sooner and added the remainder onto the third caida, but still I was pulling for Cota to knock off the bastard. The fact he lost in such screwy circumstances without Cota actually cheating was poetic and Cota rubbing it in to all in sundry was deliriously good. The part where he openly mocks Rocca by laughing at him is such poor sportsmanship for a title match and so removed from Satanico's near face turn in the Gran Cochise fight that it almost blew my mind. I am really high on Mocho Cota.

Mocho Cota vs. Americo Rocca (1/27/84) Mocho Cota vs. Americo Rocca (2/3/84) Mocho Cota is such a compelling worker. On one hand, he looks like an evil genius like the Master from Dr. Who. On the other hand, he's so hyper with his pre-match taunting that when you hear the Bihari relayed stories about how he lost his fingers he may just be a maniac who's on something. Maybe with his "deformity" he's got a whole "if I cannot prove a lover, I'm determined to prove a villain" Richard III thing going on. Whatever the case, he laughs like a madman. Like all of the truly great workers, he puts an amazing amount of detail into his work. Whether he's working from the top or bottom, he's constantly selling. If it's a hold he's applying, he's always moving, shifting, trying to gain more leverage, selling the effort in his face. You've heard all the cliches about it being a game of human chess and having to think two or three moves ahead. It sounds like Larry Z on an episode of Worldwide, but Cota is that type of worker. The matwork in these matches isn't for show or to undo each other, it's a step-by-step effort at dismantling the opposition, and behind that veneer of maniacal laughter is a great wrestling mind. One of the best on the set. I didn't pay enough attention to the January match the first time I watched it. It really is a veritable masterpiece. Some of the best matwork in the history of lucha on tape. The rematch is beautiful and the matwork in the first caida may be even better than the January match. Americo Rocca deserves a ton of credit for the matches being good as he was a more than capable mat worker who shone in the more difficult role of technico, and his selling was every bit as careful and measured as Cota's. They should be commended for working two different mat classics only days apart, but for me it was Cota who really stood out. This was the first time I really saw him being on the level of a Satanico and elevated him to that tier of lucha workers. Watch his reactions in these matches. The way he sells the "strangleholds" that Rocca applies after they've been broken. The way he pounds his fist into his hand when a well planned sequence doesn't pay dividends, or the cocky strut when he knows Rocca has submitted even before the bell. The seriousness with which he wrestles the second caida of the rematch and his selling when he loses a fall demonstrate his range. There's never a point where he isn't selling. I loved the part after the second match where the kids are heckling him at ringside and he scares the shit out of them like a one handed Boogie Monster. These are also great matches for rudo fans as the old adage of "cheat to win" has never been so boldly played out in a lucha libre title match. Cheating of this magnitude usually doesn't occur in a lucha libre match, but Cota's genius makes all things permissible. The wonderful thing about the rematch is that I found myself wanting Rocca to win. They probably went a beat or two beyond what they needed in that second caida, as I thought Cota could have ended it sooner and added the remainder onto the third caida, but still I was pulling for Cota to knock off the bastard. The fact he lost in such screwy circumstances without Cota actually cheating was poetic and Cota rubbing it in to all in sundry was deliriously good. The part where he openly mocks Rocca by laughing at him is such poor sportsmanship for a title match and so removed from Satanico's near face turn in the Gran Cochisse fight that it almost blew my mind. I am really high on Mocho Cota.

I'm pretty sure I had 11/26/84 pegged as the best of the Tito/Valentine matches.

Steve Grey vs. Clive Myers (10/11/83) Steve Grey vs. Clive Myers (3/23/83) Steve Grey vs. Clive Myers (1/28/86) Steve Grey vs. Clive Myers (3/5/84) These two are a bit like Solar and Negro Navarro in that they do a lot of the same spots in each match but are still breathtaking to watch. The second match is a tournament quarterfinal and a bit shorter than usual and the third match is ruined by a confusing double pin finish where nobody seemed to know what was going on, so that leaves us with the first and fourth matches. The first match is similar to the '85 match I was pimping the other day. They do a lot of the same spots. What makes it fun is that the crowd seem to attuned to the fact that this isn't your normal Saturday afternoon wrestling and that these two guys are a step above everybody else. The fourth match is a hell of a draw with tremendous action all the way through. Myers even did a bit of martial arts and it didn't bother me as it was possibly the best karate kick spot I've ever seen. At the end of the bout, the ref Ken Joyce gets on the mic and puts Myers and Grey over as two of the best wrestlers anywhere in the world. This really was *the* WoS workrate match-up. I'm surprised I've slept on their 80s stuff so badly.

I never liked Austin much in WCW and for Pillman I thought it was a huge step down from the Windham tag team and the end of his good period as a worker. From memory, they had one or two matches I liked but you can make a direct comparison between the Steamboat/Douglas stuff and Pillman with Windham then Austin and I don't think the Blondes stuff is as good. Maybe I'll rewatch them some day but they remind me a bit of Los Gringos Locos in terms of 90s teams that don't quite match their rep.

Yes. I would rather watch Stars and Stripes or Pretty Wonderful any day of the week.

History has a lot to account for, like telling us that the Blondes were good.

That High Flyers vs. Tito and Martel tag is all about the babyface offence. That really is one of the best face vs. face matches you'll ever see.

Why'd you vote for Daddy?

I'm writing about some of these matches on my blog: So the DVDVR set has finally been released and with it a great opportunity for folks to be introduced to lucha or have their exposure broadened. I'm going to write about a few matches I haven't seen before or which interest me for some reason, starting with this Chicana title fight. Sangre Chicana vs. Ringo Mendoza (10/28/83) First thing's first, Mocho Cota was the coolest looking second. Wearing a t-shirt and towel over suit pants and pointed leather shoes with his fresh for '83 hair cut that Gran Cochisse had inflicted on him the month before. I love that he's still sporting his Faustian beard. That motherfucker was one cool cat. Sangre Chicana is one of the greatest brawlers in lucha libre history and a tremendous performer. This was when he was still a man of the people and hadn't degenerated into one of the scummiest looking wrestlers who ever lived, and a rare opportunity to see him tackle the art of title match wrestling. The impression I got was that he wasn't much of a mat worker. He knew a few holds, but this was worked as more of a mano a mano bout than a lucha title match and I don't think it was because of Ringo, whom I've seen have some impressive first caida mat outings. What I did like about this was the general structure. It wasn't a great match by any stretch of the imagination but it had a steady build. I liked how cagey they were with their early approaches and how the first hold they agreed to ended up on the outside and back in the ring. The facets of pro-wrestling that Chicana excelled at were intensity and selling and that gave his matches a real energy even when they were low arcing and minimalistic like this one. There was a backbreaker spot that I thought could be the finish. I hadn't bitten on a near fall like that in ages and it was totally because of Chicana's selling. Where this match fell over was the finish. Double pin finishes suck. You can hem and haw and try to justify them but it's an immutable truth. It didn't seem to bother the crowd though as they mobbed Chicana at the end and carried him out on their shoulders, which seemed like a bit of an over-reaction to what actually happened in the ring, but was another snapshot of how wrestling used to be in Mexico back when fans could still enter the ring. The guy waving to his family was a great "Hi, Mom" moment for the cameras.

So the DVDVR set has finally been released and with it a great opportunity for folks to be introduced to lucha or have their exposure broadened. I'm going to write about a few matches I haven't seen before or which interest me for some reason, starting with this Chicana title fight. Sangre Chicana vs. Ringo Mendoza (10/28/83) First thing's first, Mocho Cota was the coolest looking second. Wearing a t-shirt and towel over suit pants and pointed leather shoes with his fresh for '83 hair cut that Gran Cochisse had inflicted on him the month before. I love that he's still sporting his Faustian beard. That motherfucker was one cool cat. Sangre Chicana is one of the greatest brawlers in lucha libre history and a tremendous performer. This was when he was still a man of the people and hadn't degenerated into one of the scummiest looking wrestlers who ever lived, and a rare opportunity to see him tackle the art of title match wrestling. The impression I got was that he wasn't much of a mat worker. He knew a few holds, but this was worked as more of a mano a mano bout than a lucha title match and I don't think it was because of Ringo, whom I've seen have some impressive first caida mat outings. What I did like about this was the general structure. It wasn't a great match by any stretch of the imagination but it had a steady build. I liked how cagey they were with their early approaches and how the first hold they agreed to ended up on the outside and back in the ring. The facets of pro-wrestling that Chicana excelled at were intensity and selling and that gave his matches a real energy even when they were low arcing and minimalistic like this one. There was a backbreaker spot that I thought could be the finish. I hadn't bitten on a near fall like that in ages and it was totally because of Chicana's selling. Where this match fell over was the finish. Double pin finishes suck. You can hem and haw and try to justify them but it's an immutable truth. It didn't seem to bother the crowd though as they mobbed Chicana at the end and carried him out on their shoulders, which seemed like a bit of an over-reaction to what actually happened in the ring, but was another snapshot of how wrestling used to be in Mexico back when fans could still enter the ring. The guy waving to his family was a great "Hi, Mom" moment for the cameras.

Steve Grey vs. Pete LaPaque (6/13/83) This was billed as Grey getting a title shot at British Welterweight champ Alan Dennison, but Dennison broke his thumb a few days before the bout so the promoters had to postpone the fight. Instead, these two had a heck of a match, presumably to make up for the crowd's disappointment. LaPaque was a bit of a journeyman rudo and more of a tag worker than a singles guy, but he had a great look for a journeyman rudo and he could work. The bout was built around LaPaque legally (and illegally) working over Grey's leg and forcing him to submit with an agonising looking submission, Grey firing up and bringing his A game and LaPaque using every trick in the book to avoid Grey's retaliation. Highly entertaining.

Somebody needs to teach you about the finer things in life, Jerry. Like matwork. Endless matwork.

Since I'm now an unabashed fan of Ken Joyce, I went back and had another look at his 1975 match against Steve Grey. It's not quite as even as it would be in later years as Grey was still proving himself, but there was some wonderful and creative stuff on show and a few good chuckles. Steve Grey vs. Mike Jordan (11/13/85) Not a big fan of Mike Jordan. For some reason people seem to like him, but this match did nothing to sway me in that direction. There was some decent title match action, but they weren't given enough time. It didn't help that the finish was one of those injury finishes where you're like "fuck this." Steve Grey vs. Sid Cooper (12/15/82) For a tournament semi-final this was solid stuff. Cooper was long in the tooth here, but he was a savvy vet who knew how to work a crowd, and as I said at the outset Grey is one of the most likeable babyfaces ever. This wasn't anything special outside of that babyface/heel dynamic, but it was well done.

Did the WWF commentators at the time ever refer to houseshow matches? Personally, I had read about the houeshow results on some old angelfire or tripod website, but always thought it was kind of obvious from the way it was worked and the stage it was wrestled on that Steamboat was trying to keep it clean and win the belt. What did it inspire 15 years later?

Steve Grey vs. Ken Joyce (9/3/80) Only a fall and a half of this survives. Tragedy! Looked similar to their '79 bout. They repeated the same awesome surfboard spot. Steve Grey vs. Tony Costas (11/8/80) Steve Grey vs. Tony Costas (6/15/82) The footage we have of these is only really the scoring falls, which is disappointing because I wanted to see what sort of matwork they were capable of. The first match was a looser, more up tempo tournament match with a Grey injury storyline. The second was slower and closer to the bout I wanted to see, but the first three falls were missing. Oh well. Steve Grey vs. Clive Myers (3/20/85) Every time I get a comp made I make the mistake of ordering stuff I've already seen, but watching this again was a bit of a revelation. The first time I watched Myers and Grey's 80s stuff I had a natural prejudice towards it because it wasn't as cool as their 70s stuff and I hate the Iron First gimmick. What I saw this time was an excellent match, one of the best of the 80s in fact, and possibly the most beautiful draw I've ever witnessed in a wrestling match or close to it. I usually hate draws in wrestling and I especially hate the way they're worked with wrestlers being out of sync with the clock and not showing enough urgency at the end, but here the workers were so good that the old cliche of nobody deserving to lose held true. This was wrestled differently from their 70s matches as Myers had a totally different stance doing his kung fu gimmick, but the work was sensational. They did a headscissors spot that was absolutely mind blowing. Some people may not like the comedy that occasionally drifted into the bout especially later on when the stakes grew higher, but this was about as good a face vs. face, champion vs. champion WoS bout got in the 80s.

What are these other Loss lists we aren't privy to?

Steve Grey vs. Ken Joyce (3/14/79) Ken Joyce is the maestro of British professional wrestling. When I first got into European stuff, I didn't appreciate how good he was, but the guy is basically the Blue Panther of British wrestling if that comparison works for you; the Terry Funk of British wrestling if you're the type who sticks more to your American wrestling roots. When people talk about Johnny Saint or Steve Wright being synonymous with the British style it's all bullshit. Joyce is the master. This was super fun. Grey slipped into his everyman role I told you about and was the perfect opponent for Joyce's maestroness. That's not a word, but I just coined it. Grey really was the ultimate match-up. I'm struggling to think of any worker he couldn't work with throughout his 20 year television run. Joyce came out of retirement two or three times and this was part of his final run that lasted through to '82. I haven't thought about it too seriously, but he almost represents the last vestige of the superior 60s/70s style since the stars of that era had faded out by this point par a sparing few. The amount of creativity he put into a single bout was astounding. This was really neat.

Out of interest how much Ken Joyce have you seen? I've only ever seen the match with Tony Costas from 1/9/80 and really enjoyed that to the point that I recommended it on one of the old threads at DVDVR for consideration when the 80s European set gets done. He'd already retired twice by the time this match took place, but remember thinking he must've been something pretty special in his youth. I've a load of old WOS discs that were recorded off TWC here in the UK, but unfortunately that's the only match of his on them. I'm actually about to write about a Grey vs. Joyce match, but these are the Joyce matches on tape (air dates): Ken Joyce vs. Dick Conlon (Gravesend, 22/2/1975) Ken Joyce vs. Steve Grey (Crawley, 9/8/1975) Ken Joyce vs. Jeff Kaye (Reading, 24/2/1979) Ken Joyce vs. Steve Grey (Rotherham, 31/3/1979) Ken Joyce vs. Tony Costas (Leamington Spa, 19/1/1980) Ken Joyce vs. Steve Grey (Morecambe, 13/9/1980) Ken Joyce vs. Johnny Saint (Shrewsbury, 4/7/1981) Ken Joyce vs. Johnny Kidd (Lincoln, 13/2/1982) Five of those aired on TWC and three are from surviving footage. Fortunately, I've seen them all.

To me, Steve Grey is the everyman of British wrestling. A nice, regular looking guy who just happens to be a world class professional wrestler. He was good at football, taught carpentry to old-age pensioners and handicapped people in his spare time, and had the best resume of matches of any wrestler on television. We're extremely lucky with the volume of Steve Grey matches we have. In a lot of cases, we have extremely limited samples of a British wrestler's work, but with Grey we have a fairly sizable chunk of both his 70s and 80s work. For my money, Grey is one of the best babyfaces ever, a feat he achieves by managing to be extremely likeable and an outstanding worker. He was my gateway to European wrestling through the Myers match that Bix posted once upon a time (thanks Bix) and remains the guy most likely to deliver the goods when digging through the crates. A got a Grey comp made recently, mostly of the thousand Grey/Myers matches that exist. But there's some good stuff to come like Grey vs. the maestro Ken Joyce and Grey vs. Costas.