El-P

This match is the picture perfect illustration of why WWF escape cage match suck. No blood, no violence, endless climbing up and down cages.

The main event of the first joshi show I've ever saw. Great match. Both weren't in their prime yet, but they worked just a tremendous stiff match.

Yes, of course she's limited, she's just not a good worker. Then, she also sometimes is unprofessional, mostly when she works interpromotionnal matches in which she thinks she's above the other promotion's girls. But she sure was very limited as a worker to begin with. And yeah, Hokuto was awesome here.

Jeez, I really thought you were older !

And what was even smarter is that two minutes after they said it, Nash powerpombs Biscoff through the stage. And no one remembers or pay attention at the fact they said they didn't work for the WWF, all the focus is on "OMG, Nash powerbombed Bischoff through the stage". And it was at the time these things just didn't happened, it was fresh and shocking. Man, WCW in 96 was so good.

Four weeks into the build-up, at Great American Bash, Bischoff asked the question directly "Do you work for the WWF ?" Hall and Nash answer "No."

I fell less lonely.

Nope. And you don't hate UWF-I nearly as much as I hate WWE, too much Sano and Yamazaki in it for you to truly hate it.

Well, Flair is half-right in that you should also live for the day because you can drop dead at any seconds, and you won't take your money in the grave. Where Ric is wrong is if he thinks he made good choices himself. Look at him now, at 60 past, and still in need of money. There's a balance to be found here.

No idea, I'll let those who know about those things answer. Most RINGS big matches with Han, Khosaka and Tamura are extremely matwork oriented. Ditto Fujiwara in UWF and PWFG.

Yep, RINGS is more enjoyable throughs comps. Going through entire cards can be trying. But matches involving Han, Tamura, Khosaka, Yamamoto you can go for without thinking twice about it. Oh my god, you have no idea what huge can of worms you're opening here. I'll make it quick. 10-15 years ago, Nobuhiko Takada was considered one of the greatest wrestler of all time. In the GWE poll from the mid 00's I think he already suffered from *the* backlash. Right now, tons of people think Takada suck. Don't ask me why, I haven't revisited his stuff in years. But basically, Takada was always more pro-style at heart than shoot-style. If you like über crisp matwork, more "realistic" (whatever than means, eh !), match, Takada isn't your man. If you like glamorous epic fights with dramatic moments, Takada is your man. Awesome big match worker (again, from my recollection). Takada basically has more in common with Onita than with Fujiwara when you think about it. That's not a knock on him BTW, I love Onita. Ok then. Nobuhiko Takada isn't your man. Get into Fujiwara, Tamura, Sano, Volk Han, Kohsaka. Oh, and if you have nothing against joshi puroresu, the first year and a half of ARSION was basically a female version of BattlARTS. Mariko Yoshida was Volk Han is Volk Han was a cool and attractive japanese female. She was just amazing to watch. Her matches with Yumi Fukawa are just a work of art.

Awesome story. That was wrestling people.

It depends what you want in shoot-style though. If you're aiming for pure shoot-style with no bullshit, RINGS had the greatest matches ever with Volk Han, Tsuyoshi Kohsaka and Tamura. But also terrible undercard full of really shitty fake looking match with horrible martial artists. And washed up Maeda. Some may argue PWFG was the greatest shoot-style promotion since Yoshiaki Fujiwara is now considered one of the greatest wrestler ever, although some don't see that at all. If you want more glamourous fights, the second UWF and UWF-I are right your alley, with Takada coming on top in the first, and being the top star in the second. Plus a really good undercard with guys like Tamura, Sano, Sakuraba, Kakihara, some good gaijins like Lydick, the contributions of Vader, Gary Allbright, Dan Severn, John Tenta, Little Guido... Yep. First UWF was really Maeda and co searching their way into the shoot fight style. Tons of pro-style spots, Tiger Mask coming off the top rope, you name it. Still, tons of great stuff. BattlARTS is like a modern version of the first UWF last time I checked.

They're a bunch of misogynistic bullies, that's all there is to it, really.

I agree. The issue with Triple H is that it took forever and all the big legit stars for him to get over, and despite the infinite sustained push, he never got over to the point of becoming a huge star himself. No matter whow they twist the reality, Triple H was never on the same level with Austin, Rock, or even Foley or Taker during the Attitude era. And the only reason he kept his position as The Man after most of them left or retired, is because he had the political stroke. Such a huge push, sometime at the detriment of other, didn't create a megastar. Triple H was only the Man by default once Austin and Rock were nowhere to be found. And when the Cena experiment got off the ground, it was obvious Cena was on another level than Triple H altogether. Triple H's neverending push didn't result in him becoming a huge star at the level he's supposed to be. You can argue that pretty much anyone with the same ability and charisma would get over after years and years of push. Yep. And why is that? I dunno. Hall was infamous was his comical jobs, but he was never in position to hurt someone that badly either. Michaels was worse since basically, he didn't do jobs. It's amazing how many titles he won and didn't lose between 1993 and 1997.

Tag Team wrestling died in the mid-90's. WCW killed their belt in 1997 with the Outsiders, despite the fact the division was pretty hot one year before. WWF tag belts were kinda meaningless as soon as 94-95, with weak champs like the Smoking Gunns or the Godwinns... Then it died a terrible death during the Attitude era and those godawful NAO. People will argue the Hardys/E&C/Dudleys put back some flair into it for a while, maybe, but it was more about falling from high places than be the champs.

Racist HHH going over Booker T, in the ridiculous fashion he did it to boot, was a *good* thing ? Really ? HHH has been the king of doing a job while not really putting the opposition over. He learned from the best (Micheals - Hall - Nash). HHH has always been an average worker with average charisma, mediocre promo skills and tons of political pull. And boring as dirt as early as 1999. The biggest fraud in wrestling history really at this point. Without the political games and ties, this guy would have never passed midcard. It took the biggest stars of the hottest era in wrestling all putting him over for months and months before he finally kicked off, and that after years of being shoved down people's throat. Most un-entertaining guy pushed on top for so long in a major promotion. At this point it's accepted by the fans that he's "great" because it's been the WWE gospel for 12 years straight. Looking back at his work in 15 years, I think people will scratch their head at how such a boring guy with average ability on all front was considered a really good worker and a big star. That was my last HHH rant, I've been criticizing the guy since 2000, and it's only got worse with the time.

There's no real "debate" about modern WWE between you and I at this point. To me it's unwatchable. If you enjoy it, then you are right to enjoy it really. I already stated in long boring details why I think WWE's product is turgid and dull as dirt. At this point and after many tries to get back into it, the last WWE matches I'll probably watch now are maybe The Rock vs Cena next year and without a doubt Taker's retirement, because I became a fan about one year before Taker's debut and he has been a big part of my wrestling fandom at one point. Outside of that, really, I'm done once and for all at this point. Obviously, Triple H didn't get shit from being an old school mark. Isn't this mostly a PR thing? I really have a hard time believing Triple H, who probably knows as much about lucha as I do, is the one responsible for signing Sin Cara. Anyway, I'm not saying Triple H will only push bodybuilder types, but he sure shares that hobby with Vince, which is not exactly promising.

Steve Austin was amazing this week. The promo on Silent Rage had me in tears. Gotta love how they have to keep the big guy.

I agree. You would think guys like Michael Hayes do, but apparently not that much. Agreed. I don't remember who said it, but I thought it was the most pertinent thing ever written about Triple H, that the guy spent the last decade "cosplaying NWA touring champion Harley Race". To me that's it, for a guy who supposedly loves wrestling and is a student of the game, he really has shown exactly nothing to me as far as wrestling knowledge except how to bury people politically. Plus he's a bodybuilding fan, it's not like he's gonna push *workers*. Same thing here. I think I would enjoy current japanese wrestling to a degree, but there's so much older puroresu from the golden days I haven't seen... The availability of the footage makes it easy to watch shitloads of *new* wrestling without having to care about what happens today.

If you listen to Kelly's shoot interview, you'll realize he's actually a real wrestling fan, was a big NWA fan and thought WWF was bullshit.

Well, Vince is not getting younger, and Triple H is supposed to get more importance backstage anytime soon now. Really, what has Vince done that was really positive in the last 10 years ? He's living off his reputation, off the power of the RAW and WrestleMania brand, off the huge footage library and off an overseas market that is better now that it's ever been (as far as I can judge). Creatively, Vince is totally spent and set in his ways to the point I don't think he has much to offer really. That said, he's the one holding the pieces together. There's no telling what would happen if all of a sudden he wasn't able to do what he does. But at this point, I couldn't care less about what happens to WWE, since to me wrestling as I enjoy it is pretty much dead already in the US.

Dean is 45 too ? I thought Dean was about 40. Well, I'm 35, but I feel kinda old sometimes already.

Considering they even did something with Bret Hart of all people, I understand Savage would want to come back too and actually do something. Now that he's gone I wonder if the reason he was basically blacklisted will finally surge.

When referred to his brother's situation in interviews over the years, Lanny Poffo always said that Randy had been quite smart with his money. Take that for what it's worth.