WON HOF 2013 discussion

[pantherwagner]

You forgot east Asia. We basically know nothing about Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong, etc other than that Barnett and Rickard both promoted there sometimes, but there's clearly more to it than that

Is that true? I have been to those three countries a number of times and I have never seen a trace of anything about it.

 

Another interesting place that we know nothing about is Lebanon. Wrestling used to be huge there and I know there were tours at least up to the 80s. Spanish and French wrestlers would tour Lebanon all the time and make big money compared to what they'd make home (and I know that in Madrid and Barcelona the bullfighting stadiums and theaters were sold out or close to being sold out every week for years).

[Indikator]

Does Cornette know about Aileen LeBell Eaton?

 

India had some 30-50k houses from around 1953-1955. I am not aware of any huge houses in Lebanon, do you have numbers? The old timey Euro workers tend to say that they drew ridiculous numbers, but I try not to parrot the claims untill I know that they are at least likely to have happened.

[El Boricua]

On the subject of Invader I and Brody, let's flip the analogy. Let's say someone told Undertaker that Papi Chulo threatened Vince. Undertaker beats the shit out of him over the misunderstanding, disfigures him and he is never able to wrestle or even walk again. Or maybe he beats him to death, or stabs him to death. Would people be arguing the Undertaker shouldn't be in the HOF for this? Would there be real debate around it?

 

I think there's an American privilege associated with the current HOF, and territories that had newsletter buzz like Memphis are going to get a bigger platform than places like Puerto Rico which drew much bigger crowds. Perhaps the same could be said for other pockets of the world that have had lots of wrestling, but didn't have the benefit of heavy tape trader penetration in the early days of the WON. I don't know if there are Australian candidates that should go in, for example, but I do think there's a lot of lost history out there that's worth uncovering, even if that means ... *gasp* ... watching old footage to gain understanding.

This is a great post.

 

As someone who is going through all the Puerto Rico footage, with the benefit of a good guide in Boricua, it seems obvious to me that Invader is at worst a pretty good HoF candidate. I get why Dave says he could never put him on the ballot for essentially political reasons (though as noted before that strikes me as a tacit admission that he's easily a good enough candidate to put on the ballot), but this is a ballot with a guy who is very likely responsible for the death of his girlfriend, a death that was allegedly covered up by an HoF promoter. This is an HoF where a guy who killed a kid as part of a vicious training culture is in, and got in in a year when a similar scandal involving him (absent death this time) broke again. The sad reality is that Invader can't get on the ballot because even though any honest assessment of the situation would note that it is at least possible that the murder he committed was self defense, he killed a "star" and worse yet he did it on Puerto Rican soil and "you know how those people are" (that is an almost verbatim quote from an HoF voter talking about the details surrounding the trial). If he had killed a woman or a trainee, he'd have been on the ballot years ago.

 

This was touched on earlier in the thread, but watching the PR, I think Loss second point is definitely true. There are certain niche's that were promoted, talked up, represented very well (maybe too well in some cases as has been discussed in this thread as well) in the HoF, but then you look at Mexico and there is no trio unit in. The Duseks were in via fiat which is fine, but the Birds being the first trio voted in seems really nuts when you think about it. Fuck a Mexican trio has never even been tested on the ballot.

 

Sticking with PR you have a guy like Hugo who was a manager of note for years, produced the tv and was an announcer and Dave doesn't even think he's worth mentioning as a theoretical candidate in the HoF issue this year. You've got Jovica, who I wouldn't necessarily argue for, but he had some massively impressive numbers for a promoter. You've got Chicky Starr who was basically Jimmy Hart, if Jimmy Hart had to also wrestle (often in good or even great matches), while getting over new talent and angles, except in Chicky's case half or more of his charges didn't even speak the common language in the area (worth noting that Starr was in the main event v. Invader of the second highest drawing show on Earth in 1987 behind only Mania III). You've got TNT which was an enduring believable gimmick, a guy who got over elsewhere (this is something I don't care a ton about, but it is often touted when guys talk about Lucha or even Japanese candidates), was a good worker and was involved in several big money drawing angles and programs. Hell, I feel like The Sheepherders have a career that is much more interesting than I previously would have thought after watching this stuff, though I'm not holding them up as a team I would support. If there were voters from PR I wouldn't be surprised to see guys like Ayala, Profe or even Ron Starr at least get Owen Hart/Curt Hennig level support. The point isn't that these guys are all HoFer's, or even that they should get the consolation prize of a trip to the ballot for their careers, it's more that when I read Dave basically say "no one from PR is a decent candidate other than Colon, the guy who killed Brody and maybe Perez, but only for the time he was teaming with Rocca who is already in), it makes me wonder how much of the context he really gets.

 

I think Dave has done a good job trying to get more credible Lucha voters involved based on what I've heard from Steve and Jose. He has definitely done a good job trying to get more credible voters for Europe and Australia, though I do wonder if there are guys from those regions that realize they can push for other candidates. Still there are places that seem really under explored, including much of Mexican wrestling history, South America, Australia, Puerto Rico, South Africa, Europe, et.

 

Without wanting to get too much into Invader/Brody talk (I don't want to derail the thread into this tangent), the dynamic at play can be seen in that you see any accounts by American wrestlers taken at face value by many people, while any accounts given by the Puerto Ricans are met with skepticism or inclination to think they are lying to some degree. Honestly, my feeling on this has always been that everyone is lying to some degree about what happened, since the blowback would have made anyone scramble to cover their ass to minimize what fell their way. The other thing is that a lot of people parrot things about what happened a t the trial but I've never really seen a source for where most of what happened there comes from.

 

With regards to the unexplored areas, I think it mostly stems from a language issue and the ethnocentric focus people tend to give to their wrestling vs. other wrestling. Outside of Japan (treated as the Valhalla of wrestling) and Mexico (an area not fully delved into as evidenced by the logjam of candidates), every other bracket is from English speaking areas (Europe is basically British candidates). There's definitely more that can be done for other regions, but it would require some local 'eyes' in those places to really get started.

 

I forgot to look at El Profe, Sheepherders and Ron Starr as potential ballot nominees in the previous post running down possible ballot candidates, but you're correct that they could be credibly considered for a ballot nomination. And I owe an answer to the previously asked question about Hugo and Chicky.

[El Boricua]

Excellent post as always from Boricua.

 

I am curious, because after I mentioned Chicky, I started to mention Hugo, so I want to ask - who was more important or viewed as more significant? I ahve seen very little of Hugo as a manager, but I know he was a key heel act and similar to Starr in some ways.

 

My argument for Chicky - and I'm not at all sure he should be in - is that he was sort of a hybrid between Bobby Heenan and Jimmy Hart. He was the guy asked to carry the heel side in terms of promos, setting up angles, delivering the payoff on angles, and in many cases working matches. One thing I would like to know is how many Puerto Ricans have a good command of English? I have no earthly idea and feel like an idiot for even asking, but that would matter to me in some respects, because Starr being a mouthpiece for guys with a language barrier adds to his value and effectiveness.

Well here's the delayed reply. Sorry if the following post is a bit rambling.

 

I'll tackle the command of English question first. Honestly, I would say only a minority have a good command of English. A larger segment may understand English to varying degrees, but it's a low proportion that I would say have a good command of English in terms of speaking and writing, particularly outside of the major metropolitan areas. There is also the phenomenon that there is Spanglish and a bit of adopting and incorporating English words into the everyday Spanish spoken here that's cropped up in recent years.

 

Before getting to Hugo and Chicky, there are a few details of how Capitol Sports Promotions (CSP) would present their shows that I should mention. The dynamic was usually faces (for the most part native Puerto Ricans, with some foreign allies sprinkled in) against invading foreigners. That was more or less the basic formula from the start of the promotion. What's interesting is that native Puerto Ricans were usually not heels. Those that were, were almost always under a mask and billed of unspecified origin (ex. Invader when he first appeared, The Medicos, etc.). Rosters would be small, around 10-14 wrestlers who worked the house shows (with some additional jobbers for TV). You're only consistent roster members were those that had established residence in Puerto Rico (be it native or foreigner). With the semi regular churn of foreigners who did not speak Spanish, two roles were very important for the TV shows: Show host/presenter/interviewer and the heel manager.

 

In the case of the show host, the role included:

- Be the constant presence, the glue of the TV show broadcast

- Inform fans of events and news and hype them (think Event Center or Update with Mean Gene)

- Conducted interviews and would translate where needed

- Usually doubled as announcer for big shows

- Was the voiceover person for the house show card ads

 

Basically, think of Lance Russell in Memphis and you get the idea of the role. The one additional detail is that the show host was also typically the show's producer during this time. For example, Rickin Sanchez's production company was in charge of the show and he served the role of host (he's the man in glasses you see conduct those desk interviews with the wrestlers about upcoming cards in the 82-83 shows).

 

The other important role is that of the heel manager. This person would basically serve as the anchor for the heel side, since the heel side usually featured foreigners who would come in for a run and then leave (although a few would come back with some regularity). These heel managers were usually active or semi-active wrestlers, and because of the small roster size they were called upon to get in the ring on a somewhat regular basis to fill out the cards. Basically, the heel manager would:

 

- Provide the promotion with a stable heel anchor and provide a sense of continuity to the heel side

- Serve to help introduce the newcomers to the territory by hyping them up when they arrived ('this is my new weapon to take out so and so'), which allowed them to gain instant heat or feuds due to being aligned with said manager. (Ex. Jason arriving as Chicky's new hired gun to take out his hated rival Invader 1)

- Serve as the mouthpiece for the heels or translate for those that did their interviews if needed

- When the heels are only coming in for a couple of dates per month, the heel manager is the one that has to keep the feud alive either via promos or getting in the ring. (Ex. Chicky when Hansen was not around during the Colon/Hansen feud)

- If a heel left abruptly, the heel manager could easily pick up the feud and have the heat put on him (Ex. When Manny Fernandez left soon after Invader 3's injury, credit for masterminding the attack was taken by Chicky to continue the feud).

 

As far as I'm aware, the first wrestler to also serve as heel manager was El Rayo de Bayamon. He was originally a lower card face who turned on Miguel Perez Sr. during a tag match. Afterwards, during an interview where he was denouncing the betrayal, Perez exclaimed that El Rayo was nothing more than a Barrabas (clearly a mix up, I presume he meant a Judas but said that name instead). El Rayo adopted that as his name, and he served as the first notable heel manager (while still wrestling) for Capitol Sports. Barrabas would lose a hair vs. hair match vs. Miguel Perez which led to him adopting his trademark bald head and facial hair look. Barrabas would serve in this role for a couple of years before leaving the company due to some legal problems. He would return around 82-83.

With this background and context, we'll move on to Hugo and Chicky. First we'll talk about Hugo Savinovich.

 

Hugo first arrived to CSP in 1978, after wrestling for Arturo Mendoza's promotion on the west coast of the island. He would have been 19 years old. When the heads of the promotion heard Hugo's mic skills, it was decided to make him a heel manager. His first two charges were Kendo Kimura and Hiro Sasaki. This highlights the role the heel manager had of being both the mouthpiece and getting across the storyline points for the heels who didn't speak.

 

His third charge would be none another than a debuting Abdullah the Butcher. It is well known that the Carlos Colon and Abdullah the Butcher feud is what really pushed the promotion forward in the late 70's and from there onwards. What gets forgotten is that Hugo was a key player in this feud, since he was Abdullah's manager. He was the one who antagonized the crowd, cut the interviews and pushed the madness that was Abdullah. From 78 through 83, Hugo was one who would bring in Abdullah, whom he called 'mi monstro, mi maquina' ('my monster, my machine') whenever he was attacked or injured by a face to avenge him.

 

To give an idea of how important Hugo was during those years as a manager, here is a list of wrestlers he managed: Kendo Kimura , Hiro Sasaki, Abdullah the Butcher, The Medics (Jose Estrada , Johnny Rodz & Don Kent), The Fabulous Kangaroos, Mr. Fuji, Toru Tanaka, Mr. Pogo, Mitsu Ishikawa, Haru Sonoda, Tamba, King Tonga, Gorilla Monsoon, Buddy Landell, The Mongolian Stomper, Ox Baker, Bob Sweetan, Dory Funk Jr, Terry Funk, Kendo Nagasaki, The Sheik, Bruiser Brody & los Pastores(The Sheepherders: Luke Williams, Butch Miller & Jonathan Boyd who was billed as Jonny Miller). Many of these names were the top rivals of Carlos Colon, the Invaders, Jose Luis Rivera and their allies during those years. Basically, any heel that was to be positioned at the top of the card was usually paired with Hugo.

 

During the early 80's, Hugo also served as the English commentator for the shows that were sent to air in Trinidad & Tobago, Barbados and the Virgin Islands (places where CSP held shows).

In late 83, they ran an angle where Hugo was injured by Carlos Colon. By his time, Barrabas had returned to the promotion and was serving as a manager. While Hugo was out injured, he entrusted his wrestlers to Barrabas so that he could manage their affairs while he was gone. When Hugo returned, Barrabas had hijacked all of his wrestlers, including Abdullah. This started a feud between Hugo and Barrabas which turned Hugo face. By late 1984, he became the TV show presenter when a disagreement between Rickin Sanchez and Capitol Sports resulted in Sanchez leaving and his production company no longer produce the show. Thus from 84-91, Hugo assumed the role of TV show host/presenter/interviewer/commentator and also became the behind the scenes producer of the show. In interviews Hugo has mentioned that he is very proud of Aniversario 87, an event he was the producer of and had the complication of occurring at three different locations at the same time. He even donned the tights during this period a couple of times to face off against Eric Embry, El Profe and Billy Joe Travis.

 

Hugo would go to the newly formed AWF in late 91, where he would serve the same roles he had for CSP. A lot of local fans point to Hugo leaving CSP as one of the clear signs of its decline in presentation. The AWF would do well initially, but would eventually collapse due to a bloated payroll and the financial backer dropping out. From there, Hugo would make his way to the WWF and would eventually serve as the Spanish commentator for many years. He would also be involved with the IWA during it's first few years in Puerto Rico, but was not heavily involved after the first couple of years.

 

With Hugo transitioned to the TV host role, other managers were brought in, but none of them lasted too long. Barrabas himself left sometime in 1985. Throughout 85 you had a different dynamic with the top heels. The Sheepherders had a flag bearer, Abdullah was accompanied by someone from JCP (ex. JJ Dillon at Aniversario 85), Eric Embry had Sasha as a valet, but there was no focal heel manager. That would change in 1986 when Chicky Starr stepped into the role.

 

Chicky was different from the previous heel manager anchors. For one, he remained a full time active wrestler. He also happened to be the first prominent local in a very long time to go heel. At first, Chicky was not a manager. But after a month and half of feuding with Invader 1, he was offered the role . Ron Starr would be brought in to team with him and Chicky also became Abdullah's manager. Thus began his Sports Club stable.

 

Another thing that made Chicky unique was that he was given a Piper's Pit style segment called Chicky Starr's Sport Shop and he would also have periods where he would serve as a commentator, all while remaining an active wrestler and manager. Chicky was given the top heels to manage and to serve as their translators or as the promo man / hype man for those that were incoming or not around full time. He also was credited as he mastermind behind several schemes, thus helping keep the heat from feuds going even as wrestlers cycled in and out on the heel side and also serving as the catalyst for some heel turns.

 

In the fall of 1986 El Profe would be introduced along with TNT to help take some of the load of Chicky (he was already managing Ron Starr, Bruiser Brody before he turned on him, Abdullah the Butcher after Brody turned, Jason the Terrible and Stan Hansen in addition to wrestling and hosting the Sports Shop segment and to have someone manage the tag teams and mid carders. El Profe would increase in prominence by adding the Ninja Express to his stable, with Chicky and he teaming up for a few schemes throughout that time.

 

Chicky was also the manager of two of the top heels of the late 80's, Hercules Ayala and Steve Strong. When Iron Sheik was brought in for a short run against Carlos Colon, he was put with Chicky.

In 1990, Chicky would leave the company and would eventually help establish ASW. When that went under, he would resurface a few years alter in WWC, rekindling the feud with Invader 1 and once again being a prominent presence on the heel side.

 

Any questions or details that need clearing up from this hopefully coherent post?

[Bix]

Does Cornette know about Aileen LeBell Eaton?

Yup.

[Ricky Jackson]

Awesome info as always El Boricua!

[pantherwagner]

Does Cornette know about Aileen LeBell Eaton?

 

India had some 30-50k houses from around 1953-1955. I am not aware of any huge houses in Lebanon, do you have numbers? The old timey Euro workers tend to say that they drew ridiculous numbers, but I try not to parrot the claims untill I know that they are at least likely to have happened.

I have never heard any numbers. Only claims I heard are similar to when Mexican wrestlers would go to Japan in the early 90s. They'd stay there for two weeks and make enough money to come back home to buy a car or put a big chunk of money for a new property.

[Indikator]

Were you by chance talking about guys from South America like Bill Martinez? His brother has the best wrestling name ever - Rudo Martinez

[Dylan Waco]

Excellent post as always from Boricua.

 

I am curious, because after I mentioned Chicky, I started to mention Hugo, so I want to ask - who was more important or viewed as more significant? I ahve seen very little of Hugo as a manager, but I know he was a key heel act and similar to Starr in some ways.

 

My argument for Chicky - and I'm not at all sure he should be in - is that he was sort of a hybrid between Bobby Heenan and Jimmy Hart. He was the guy asked to carry the heel side in terms of promos, setting up angles, delivering the payoff on angles, and in many cases working matches. One thing I would like to know is how many Puerto Ricans have a good command of English? I have no earthly idea and feel like an idiot for even asking, but that would matter to me in some respects, because Starr being a mouthpiece for guys with a language barrier adds to his value and effectiveness.

Well here's the delayed reply. Sorry if the following post is a bit rambling.

 

I'll tackle the command of English question first. Honestly, I would say only a minority have a good command of English. A larger segment may understand English to varying degrees, but it's a low proportion that I would say have a good command of English in terms of speaking and writing, particularly outside of the major metropolitan areas. There is also the phenomenon that there is Spanglish and a bit of adopting and incorporating English words into the everyday Spanish spoken here that's cropped up in recent years.

 

Before getting to Hugo and Chicky, there are a few details of how Capitol Sports Promotions (CSP) would present their shows that I should mention. The dynamic was usually faces (for the most part native Puerto Ricans, with some foreign allies sprinkled in) against invading foreigners. That was more or less the basic formula from the start of the promotion. What's interesting is that native Puerto Ricans were usually not heels. Those that were, were almost always under a mask and billed of unspecified origin (ex. Invader when he first appeared, The Medicos, etc.). Rosters would be small, around 10-14 wrestlers who worked the house shows (with some additional jobbers for TV). You're only consistent roster members were those that had established residence in Puerto Rico (be it native or foreigner). With the semi regular churn of foreigners who did not speak Spanish, two roles were very important for the TV shows: Show host/presenter/interviewer and the heel manager.

 

In the case of the show host, the role included:

- Be the constant presence, the glue of the TV show broadcast

- Inform fans of events and news and hype them (think Event Center or Update with Mean Gene)

- Conducted interviews and would translate where needed

- Usually doubled as announcer for big shows

- Was the voiceover person for the house show card ads

 

Basically, think of Lance Russell in Memphis and you get the idea of the role. The one additional detail is that the show host was also typically the show's producer during this time. For example, Rickin Sanchez's production company was in charge of the show and he served the role of host (he's the man in glasses you see conduct those desk interviews with the wrestlers about upcoming cards in the 82-83 shows).

 

The other important role is that of the heel manager. This person would basically serve as the anchor for the heel side, since the heel side usually featured foreigners who would come in for a run and then leave (although a few would come back with some regularity). These heel managers were usually active or semi-active wrestlers, and because of the small roster size they were called upon to get in the ring on a somewhat regular basis to fill out the cards. Basically, the heel manager would:

 

- Provide the promotion with a stable heel anchor and provide a sense of continuity to the heel side

- Serve to help introduce the newcomers to the territory by hyping them up when they arrived ('this is my new weapon to take out so and so'), which allowed them to gain instant heat or feuds due to being aligned with said manager. (Ex. Jason arriving as Chicky's new hired gun to take out his hated rival Invader 1)

- Serve as the mouthpiece for the heels or translate for those that did their interviews if needed

- When the heels are only coming in for a couple of dates per month, the heel manager is the one that has to keep the feud alive either via promos or getting in the ring. (Ex. Chicky when Hansen was not around during the Colon/Hansen feud)

- If a heel left abruptly, the heel manager could easily pick up the feud and have the heat put on him (Ex. When Manny Fernandez left soon after Invader 3's injury, credit for masterminding the attack was taken by Chicky to continue the feud).

 

As far as I'm aware, the first wrestler to also serve as heel manager was El Rayo de Bayamon. He was originally a lower card face who turned on Miguel Perez Sr. during a tag match. Afterwards, during an interview where he was denouncing the betrayal, Perez exclaimed that El Rayo was nothing more than a Barrabas (clearly a mix up, I presume he meant a Judas but said that name instead). El Rayo adopted that as his name, and he served as the first notable heel manager (while still wrestling) for Capitol Sports. Barrabas would lose a hair vs. hair match vs. Miguel Perez which led to him adopting his trademark bald head and facial hair look. Barrabas would serve in this role for a couple of years before leaving the company due to some legal problems. He would return around 82-83.

With this background and context, we'll move on to Hugo and Chicky. First we'll talk about Hugo Savinovich.

 

Hugo first arrived to CSP in 1978, after wrestling for Arturo Mendoza's promotion on the west coast of the island. He would have been 19 years old. When the heads of the promotion heard Hugo's mic skills, it was decided to make him a heel manager. His first two charges were Kendo Kimura and Hiro Sasaki. This highlights the role the heel manager had of being both the mouthpiece and getting across the storyline points for the heels who didn't speak.

 

His third charge would be none another than a debuting Abdullah the Butcher. It is well known that the Carlos Colon and Abdullah the Butcher feud is what really pushed the promotion forward in the late 70's and from there onwards. What gets forgotten is that Hugo was a key player in this feud, since he was Abdullah's manager. He was the one who antagonized the crowd, cut the interviews and pushed the madness that was Abdullah. From 78 through 83, Hugo was one who would bring in Abdullah, whom he called 'mi monstro, mi maquina' ('my monster, my machine') whenever he was attacked or injured by a face to avenge him.

 

To give an idea of how important Hugo was during those years as a manager, here is a list of wrestlers he managed: Kendo Kimura , Hiro Sasaki, Abdullah the Butcher, The Medics (Jose Estrada , Johnny Rodz & Don Kent), The Fabulous Kangaroos, Mr. Fuji, Toru Tanaka, Mr. Pogo, Mitsu Ishikawa, Haru Sonoda, Tamba, King Tonga, Gorilla Monsoon, Buddy Landell, The Mongolian Stomper, Ox Baker, Bob Sweetan, Dory Funk Jr, Terry Funk, Kendo Nagasaki, The Sheik, Bruiser Brody & los Pastores(The Sheepherders: Luke Williams, Butch Miller & Jonathan Boyd who was billed as Jonny Miller). Many of these names were the top rivals of Carlos Colon, the Invaders, Jose Luis Rivera and their allies during those years. Basically, any heel that was to be positioned at the top of the card was usually paired with Hugo.

 

During the early 80's, Hugo also served as the English commentator for the shows that were sent to air in Trinidad & Tobago, Barbados and the Virgin Islands (places where CSP held shows).

In late 83, they ran an angle where Hugo was injured by Carlos Colon. By his time, Barrabas had returned to the promotion and was serving as a manager. While Hugo was out injured, he entrusted his wrestlers to Barrabas so that he could manage their affairs while he was gone. When Hugo returned, Barrabas had hijacked all of his wrestlers, including Abdullah. This started a feud between Hugo and Barrabas which turned Hugo face. By late 1984, he became the TV show presenter when a disagreement between Rickin Sanchez and Capitol Sports resulted in Sanchez leaving and his production company no longer produce the show. Thus from 84-91, Hugo assumed the role of TV show host/presenter/interviewer/commentator and also became the behind the scenes producer of the show. In interviews Hugo has mentioned that he is very proud of Aniversario 87, an event he was the producer of and had the complication of occurring at three different locations at the same time. He even donned the tights during this period a couple of times to face off against Eric Embry, El Profe and Billy Joe Travis.

 

Hugo would go to the newly formed AWF in late 91, where he would serve the same roles he had for CSP. A lot of local fans point to Hugo leaving CSP as one of the clear signs of its decline in presentation. The AWF would do well initially, but would eventually collapse due to a bloated payroll and the financial backer dropping out. From there, Hugo would make his way to the WWF and would eventually serve as the Spanish commentator for many years. He would also be involved with the IWA during it's first few years in Puerto Rico, but was not heavily involved after the first couple of years.

 

With Hugo transitioned to the TV host role, other managers were brought in, but none of them lasted too long. Barrabas himself left sometime in 1985. Throughout 85 you had a different dynamic with the top heels. The Sheepherders had a flag bearer, Abdullah was accompanied by someone from JCP (ex. JJ Dillon at Aniversario 85), Eric Embry had Sasha as a valet, but there was no focal heel manager. That would change in 1986 when Chicky Starr stepped into the role.

 

Chicky was different from the previous heel manager anchors. For one, he remained a full time active wrestler. He also happened to be the first prominent local in a very long time to go heel. At first, Chicky was not a manager. But after a month and half of feuding with Invader 1, he was offered the role . Ron Starr would be brought in to team with him and Chicky also became Abdullah's manager. Thus began his Sports Club stable.

 

Another thing that made Chicky unique was that he was given a Piper's Pit style segment called Chicky Starr's Sport Shop and he would also have periods where he would serve as a commentator, all while remaining an active wrestler and manager. Chicky was given the top heels to manage and to serve as their translators or as the promo man / hype man for those that were incoming or not around full time. He also was credited as he mastermind behind several schemes, thus helping keep the heat from feuds going even as wrestlers cycled in and out on the heel side and also serving as the catalyst for some heel turns.

 

In the fall of 1986 El Profe would be introduced along with TNT to help take some of the load of Chicky (he was already managing Ron Starr, Bruiser Brody before he turned on him, Abdullah the Butcher after Brody turned, Jason the Terrible and Stan Hansen in addition to wrestling and hosting the Sports Shop segment and to have someone manage the tag teams and mid carders. El Profe would increase in prominence by adding the Ninja Express to his stable, with Chicky and he teaming up for a few schemes throughout that time.

 

Chicky was also the manager of two of the top heels of the late 80's, Hercules Ayala and Steve Strong. When Iron Sheik was brought in for a short run against Carlos Colon, he was put with Chicky.

In 1990, Chicky would leave the company and would eventually help establish ASW. When that went under, he would resurface a few years alter in WWC, rekindling the feud with Invader 1 and once again being a prominent presence on the heel side.

 

Any questions or details that need clearing up from this hopefully coherent post?

 

This is an excellent post and I don't want it to get slept on.

 

A few things that stand out to me:

 

I don't think I'd read that origin of Barrabas story before but it is fucking awesome. Incidentally Barrabas was an extremely fun worker going from the early 80's studio footage we have. Unfortunately very little of that is competitive enough to be considered for an 80's set, but he could go. I knew from reading some other stuff that he had been a big star for the promotion, and I know I have heard about the hair v. hair match with Perez specifically, but I didn't know that he was the first guy to take on the heel manager/wrestler role. He's a guy I'd like to see more research done on if that is at all possible (more on that later).

 

Another thing of note to me is that Capital Sports/WWC was technically an international promotion. I'm sure a lot of people will roll their eyes at that, or see it as a mere technicality, but I've seen matches from Trinidad that had huge crowds who were incredibly hot for the wrestlers, matches and angles that were being delivered. It interests me that they ran Barbados, Trinidad and the Virgin Islands as it increases the scope of the promotion and to me puts the lie to the "Colon was only over" in his little fiefdom. Yeah it's the same promotion, but that's never stopped people from giving Bret Hart or Rey or any number of other guys credit for "international star" status. I know Jovica promoted a lot of the Trinidad shows, but if Hugo was indeed the mouthpiece of the local t.v. in those areas that would mean something to me in terms of giving him a stronger look as a candidate. It shows another area where he had real value to the promotion, and an area that could be easily underrated.

 

Overall I think you make a very strong case for Hugo not just deserving to be on the ballot, but actually being a Hall of Famer. If he was just the heel mouthpiece manager maybe not, though I tend to think the role you outline is super important to a promotion like WWC. But the fact that he was that heel mouthpiece, he was the heel mouthpiece of the heel that was the main rival of the promotions biggest star in the feud that established the promotion is a big time fed, and then the fact that the guy was a strong t.v. personality who had to hop back and fourth between languages for different markets, translate on the spot with interviews, and apparently actually produce the shows....Yeah I think that thirteen year run is a very strong one. Having said that, I would be interested to hear what you would consider Hugo's negatives as a performer or as an HoF candidate. I'm not trying to sink him, I am just curious what his weaknesses or perceived weaknesses would be.

 

With Chicky you laid out the role he worked and some of the positives, but as someone watching the footage right now it is completely impossible for me to fathom the WWC tv show or promotion in the second half of the 80's without Chicky Starr. I've compared him to Heenan, Jimmy Hart and Piper before and I think really he was a little bit of all of them. Because of the fact that Colon didn't work television all that often, his feud with Invader, or the guys he was managing, or his team with Ron Starr seemed to carry the shows. That's to say nothing of the sports shop itself. When I started with the Blackwell researcher while watching the AWA, khawk called Blackwell the MVP of the AWA from 1980-84, a sentiment that clawmaster (another huge AWA fan and results guru) agreed with. The one caveat was that both guys thought Blackwell had to give way to Heenan if you were counting managing. Well Starr was not the worker Blackwell was, but he was a solid hand, and like Heenan he had a role in damn near everything that was going on in the promotion, both weekly on tv, and on the major shows. He will pop up a ton on the PR Set, and was a big part of some major, major main events. In fact look at this:

 

1987

1- 3/29 Hulk Hogan vs Andre the Giant- WWF Title (WM3) Silverdome, Pontiac MI 78,000* (75,700 Paid $1,599,000. Vincent K. McMahon)

2- 9/20 Invader #1 vs Chicky Starr- Retirement & Mask vs Hair Match/ Road Warriors vs Dory & Terry Funk (14th Anniversary) Juan Ramon Loubriel Stadium, Bayamon PR 23,000* ($400,000 CCTV Locations. Victor Jovica & Carlito Colon)

3- 12/26 Honky Tonk Man vs Randy Savage- IC Title MSG, New York City NY 22,076* (Vincent K. McMahon)

4- 11/26 Carlos Colon vs Hercules Ayala- WWC Title Figure Four Match Roberto Clemente Stadium, San Juan PR 22,000 (Victor Jovica & Carlito Colon)

5- 11/26 Hulk Hogan & Bam Bam Bigelow & Paul Orndorff & Don Muraco & Ken Patera vs Andre the Giant & King Kong Bundy & One Man Gang & Butch Reed & Rick Rude- Elimination Match (S.Series) Richfield Coliseum, Richfield OH 21,300* (Vincent K. McMahon)

6- 2/21 Randy Savage vs George Steele- IC Title/ 20 Man Battle Royal: Hercules winner- Hulk Hogan & Andre the Giant (SNME) Joe Louis Arena, Detroit MI 21,000* (Vincent K. McMahon)

7- 1/02 Hulk Hogan vs Kimala- WWF Title Tacoma Dome, Tacoma WA 20,476* ($209,443.50 Turn Away Crowd. Vincent K. McMahon)

8- 9/21 Hulk Hogan vs One Man Gang- WWF Title MSG, New York City NY 19,745* (Vincent K. McMahon)

9- 10/16 Billy Graham vs Butch Reed- Cage Match MSG, New York City NY 19,700* ($235,000 Vincent K. McMahon)

10- 2/14 Hulk Hogan vs Kimala- WWF Title The Spectrum, Philadelphia PA 19,416* (Vincent K. McMahon)

 

1988

1- 7/31 Hulk Hogan vs Andre the Giant- Cage Match (Wrestle Fest) Milwaukee County Stadium, Milwaukee WI 25,866 ($350,000)

2- 1/30 Carlos Colon vs Iron Sheik- WWC Universal Title Chicky Starr Suspended in Cage Roberto Clemente Stadium, San Juan PR 25,000* (Some Reported as 30,000* Victor Jovica & Carlito Colon)

3- 8/23 Carlos Colon vs Hercules Ayala- WWC Universal Title Roberto Clemente Stadium, San Juan PR 23,000 (Victor Jovica & Carlito Colon)

4- 8/29 Mega Powers (Hulk Hogan & Randy Savage) vs Mega Bucks (Ted DiBiase & Andre the Giant)- Jesse Ventura Ref (Summerslam) MSG, New York City NY 20,000* ($335,345 Vincent K. McMahon)

5- 1/25 Hulk Hogan & Bam Bam Bigelow vs Ted DiBiase & Virgil w/Andre the Giant MSG, New York City NY 19,750* (Vincent K. McMahon)

6- 11/28 Hulk Hogan vs Big Bossman MSG, New York City NY 19,700* ($240,000 Vincent K. McMahon)

7- 11/04 Hulk Hogan vs Big Bossman/ Ultimate Warrior vs Honky Tonk Man- IC Title Bradley Center, Milwaukee WI 18,662* (Vincent K. McMahon)8- 6/25 Randy Savage vs Ted DiBiase- WWF Title Cage Match MSG, New York City NY 18,500 (Vincent K. McMahon)

9- 3/27 Randy Savage vs Ted DiBiase- WWF Title Tournament Finals/ Hulk Hogan vs Andre the Giant- WWF Title Tournament (WM4) Trump Plaza, Atlantic City NJ 18,165* ($1,400,000 Vincent K. McMahon)

10- 5/05 Perro Aguayo & Villano III vs Black Power I (Vincente Carbajal Salas) & II (Johnny Vanelli Guzman)- Double Hair vs Double Mask Match El Toreo de Cuatro Caminos, Naucalpan Mexico 18,000* (Carlos Maynes)

10- 9/30 Bestia Salvaje vs El Hijo del Santo- National Welterweight Title/ Fabuloso Blondy (Ken Timbs) vs Lizmark- NWA Light Heavyweight Title (55th Anniversary Part II) Arena Mexico, Mexico City Mexico 18,000* (Paco Alonso)

10- Royal Rumble: Jim Duggan/ Hulk Hogan & Andre the Giant & Ted DiBiase Interview (Rumble) Copps Coliseu, Hamilton ONT 18,000* (16,200 Paid. Vincent K. McMahon)

 

Chicky was basically a main event attraction on the second highest drawing show in the world for two straight years - on top of being a huge attraction for the company on a day-to-day basis. He doesn't have the longevity of Hugo and I can't compare them directly because so little of Hugo's peak as a manager/wrestler is available. But Chicky certainly is a strong enough guy to at least put up for discussion in the "Other" region.

 

A couple of questions:

 

Can I send that post to Dave or copy and paste it to the Observer board in the thread I have about possible candidates to add to the ballot?

 

Is there any place with WWC attendance figures and/or detailed results? If someone can point me in the direction of the tools, I have no problem working on a results review/data dump for Colon, Chicky, Invader or even TNT. Actually TNT in a way interests me the most, because I think he is a guy where if he had almost the exact same resume as he currently has, but was born on the mainland and had his career in mainland promotions he would be seen as a solid candidate and might already be in (in some ways I see him as similar to a Chris Jericho sort of candidate, but with something more like Taker's gimmick). I'm not even saying he's an HoFer, but he's a case of a guy where I think to steal a JDWism, he "ticks a lot of the boxes" that people look for in Hall of Famers - except the bulk of his career took place in Puerto Rico.

[pantherwagner]

Not him, but guys like Rocky Nelson who I think is from Colombia, Rocky Tamayo from Peru (who was a journeyman in the US for a while), and a bunch of old school Spanish wrestlers like Joe Adell (who also worked in Japan for IWE) and other euro guys like Gilbert Cesca or Jack Lasartesse.

[Dylan Waco]

Cesca is one of the guys who popped up in that random match that was on youtube a couple of years back which was completely incredible IIRC. Now there is a guy I'd like to learn more about

[kjh]

Actually TNT in a way interests me the most, because I think he is a guy where if he had almost the exact same resume as he currently has, but was born on the mainland and had his career in mainland promotions he would be seen as a solid candidate and might already be in (in some ways I see him as similar to a Chris Jericho sort of candidate, but with something more like Taker's gimmick). I'm not even saying he's an HoFer, but he's a case of a guy where I think to steal a JDWism, he "ticks a lot of the boxes" that people look for in Hall of Famers - except the bulk of his career took place in Puerto Rico.

The problem with TNT is that his North American run was largely mediocre. Konnan had the same problem, but his drawing power in the early 90s in Mexico couldn't be denied. I can't see TNT's numbers being as impressive coming at the tail end of the peak of Puerto Rican wrestling.

[Dylan Waco]

Without doing the research I don't think TNT is a strong candidate. At best he'd be behind Colon, Abby (who is already in, though you could argue he would be in even without Puerto Rico), Invader I, Hugo and Chicky. I think you could argue the PR run of the Sheepherders makes them candidates who are equal to or better than TNT as well, though I feel less strongly about that. Not sure how he would compare to Miguel Perez Sr., but a lot of that would depend on how you look at Perez run teaming with Rocca which has nothing to do with PR.

 

But that is before any research. More importantly, the initial point of all of this was that Dave's claim that there were no candidates from PR he could even dump into that "Other" category with Colon strikes me as pretty obviously untrue. Again, a surface level review of TNT tells me he is a better candidate than a lot of the people currently on the ballot. In fact you could argue that TNT "ticks a lot of the boxes" as noted before that a lot of guys who are already in have ticked. A memorable, enduring gimmick, that was a part of multiple big angles? Check. Major title wins/feuds against top stars? Check. Headlining major shows and house show runs that did strong business? Check. Longevity as a star by the standards so often applied to others? Check. I actually think his international career would be considered a plus in almost any other situation. It's often held against Colon that he didn't get over anywhere other than PR (really that's untrue, but anywhere other than WWC/Capital Sports promotion I would concede), but I think it's fair to say that Savio definitely got over in the WWF. If you compare his international run to the run of guys like Jericho or Ultimo or even Sting (all of who's international careers I've seen cited as evidence they should be in) it's hard to see how it's worse.

 

Please note that I'm not arguing "these bad candidates are in, so TNT should be in," so much as I'm noting that I think if TNT had the exact same career but it wasn't based out of PR he'd be considered a strong candidate by the same voter base that has voted in some other questionable candidates. And more importantly, I think A. deserves more research as does PR as a whole and B. could easily be put on the ballot in the "Other" section

[KrisZ]

WWC detailed results are extremely hard to find especially post 1982

[Dylan Waco]

WWC detailed results are extremely hard to find especially post 1982

I've heard that before, but I figure it's worth a shot to see if Boricua has any clue where they could be found.

[JerryvonKramer]

Some excellent discussion here past few days, been a joy to read.

[pantherwagner]

Boricua, how true is it that the Aniversario numbers are lower than they could have been because after the first one the police and fire marshalls were incredibly mad at the promotion for letting in a ridiculously dangerous number of people?

[El Boricua]

Wow, quite a few things to reply to. Going in order:

 

With regards to Barrabas, the story I’ve heard is that he was the first notable turn and heel manager. In terms of matches, the only one I know that features a younger Barrabas is the El Santo/Carlos Colon vs. El Rebelde Loco/Barrabas from the movie En Santo en Oro Negro: La noche de San Juan. What hurts his profile in terms of being remembered for his contributions by certain groups of fans is that he had long stretches where he was out of the mainstream fed locally (he did stuff on the independents). The first absence in the 70’s was supposedly due to “legal problems” he had. He would come back around 82 and stick around to about 85. When Barrabas resurfaced with All Star Wrestling in 91, I had no clue who he was since I had started watching after his last notable run with Capitol Sports. Although to be fair, his absence from the late 80’s until 91 may have been in part because of his injuries from the Dupont Plaza fire.

 

From what I’ve been able to gather, the Capitol Sports TV show was shown in other countries in the Caribbean, Central and South America. Not sure of which ones, but there supposedly was coverage there. Hugo on commentary would sometimes during some matches send greetings to the fans from the different countries where the show aired (ex. There’s an Invader 3 match where Hugo sends greetings to the viewers in Colombia). The program also supposedly aired in the New Jersey /New York area. But again, Latin America is a region where knowledge is vague about what happened in terms of wrestling.

 

With Hugo, there is likely the impression that he’s basically a Spanish Jim Ross based on his tenure at the Spanish announce table. In terms of negatives I have a hard time thinking of them. Maybe that he didn’t do much as a wrestler, but his run as a wrestler is really before my time as a fan and he supposedly had a couple of hot runs in the Dominican Republic against Jack Veneno. Honestly, his run as top heel manager is before my time as a regular viewer, I basically first knew Hugo as the fan friendly host on TV. It was a WTF moment for me when I found out that Hugo used to manage Abdullah (may have actually been via the Starrcade 83 match how I found this out). Just remember that Hugo’s career is divided into the phases, the top heel manager and then the TV host/everything that went with it. Both were of immense importance to CSP. And if you were to utter the phrase Atangana! to people around here, they’ll likely know who you’re alluding to.

 

Chicky was all over the shows, it’s not an exaggeration to say he anchored the heel side of things during the late 80’s. Quick correction to Aniversario 87, the event was held simultaneously in three cities, so there were three billed main events (one for each city), but the two that were pushed more heavily were the Invader 1 vs. Chicky Starr (Retirement vs. Hair) and Carlos Colon vs. Hercules Ayala (Universal title, barbed wire, figure 4 vs. figure 4). The third match was TNT vs. Mr. Pogo which was TNT’s big coming out party as a face. Overall, I’d agree Chicky is definitely a strong enough guy to at least put up for discussion in the "Other" region.

 

Of course you can use this information. Who knows, it may (hopefully) bring someone out of the woodwork with more info and context.

Attendance figures and/or card results are difficult to find. There are likely some local historians that may have some information about this. The person I’ve heard mentioned that may know is Manuel Gonzalez (he wrote many of the blurbs in the WWC territory section of Kayfabe Memories). Unfortunately, I don’t know where to contact him or of someone else that could know.

 

You’re right that TNT is not necessarily a strong candidate, but deserves some digging. I know he was super over, but I can’t tell you how that translated at the box office. He became the top star of ASW when he jumped, but again, I don’t know what that means in terms of drawing. His involvement in that hot run the IWA had from 00 to about 05-06 could also be a point in his favor. And if you’re looking at longevity, TNT was finally brought back after 22 years to WWC and won the Universal title last week. I sometimes wonder if TNT’s career (and also Miguel Perez Jr. and Huracan Castillo Jr.) was hampered a bit by being here when Brody died.

 

The key to the Sheepherders is to look at their 1985 run. My impression is that they were the top heels that year (basically feuded with the Invaders while Carlos was busy with dory Funk Jr.). Someone with more knowledge is needed to provide details and context. They had a few short runs after that too, but 1985 is the key one I think.

 

One detail about Carlos Colon, he would sometimes do shots in Africa (another area were we know almost nothing about). Not sure with what frequency and when he stopped doing them.

 

About the Aniversario numbers, I can’t say for sure although it sounds credible to me knowing how locals are with regards to these events and, particularly, the mess they can cause parking for these events. I also wouldn’t be surprised if their decision to hold more than one day of Aniversario events in 1986 was due lost ticket sales due to the limits imposed.

 

According to a special produced in 1987 for that year’s Aniversario show, they mentioned the following:

 

Anviersario 83, the first one, was a huge 14 match card that took place from Hiram Bithorn Stadium with an attendance of 36,000. They had to turn away 8,000 people at the gate and there were cars parked up to 3 to 4 miles away because there was not enough room at the stadium lot.

 

Keep in mind that Hiram Bithorn Stadium is part of a complex that also has Roberto Clemente Coliseum and another smaller venue (Coliseo Pedrin Zorrilla). You know, I think it’s easier to show you:

 

https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&amp...73a779999a3b7f8

 

The map is centered on Coliseo Pedrin Zorrilla, but scroll up until you have Hiram Bithorn Stadium, Roberto Clemente Coliseum, road 23 (Roosevelt Ave.) and the buildings on the other side of street 23. You’ll notice that Hiram Bithorn Stadium is right by the expressway entrance and exit for Roosevelt Ave. Across the street from Hiram Bithorn Stadium is Plaza Las Americas, the largest shopping mall in Puerto Rico (and which had way, way less parking facilities at the time). Continuing to the left, you have the National Guard armory. Beside that is the U.S. Post Office. And after that, the building tagged as Insular Government Number Two, that’s actually police headquarters. The entrance and exits to the complex are located on Roosevelt Ave., with a much smaller entrance and exit at the other end (further down from Coliseo Pedrin Zorrilla), which feeds into an immediate expressway entrance and exit and is right by a hospital.

 

Just imagine the nightmare traffic jam the full parking lot and people parking in the street would have caused considering everything that’s right in that vicinity. Considering all this, it’s quite credible to me that they had limits imposed.

 

For the 1984 event (again according to the 1987 special), due to the traffic and overcrowding problems of the previous year, WWC was allowed to only sell 25,000 tickets due to police and fire department restrictions.

 

The 1985 event once again was only allowed to have 25,000 tickets sold.

 

For 1986, the decision was made to expand the Aniversario event from one day to three and hold it in three different cities. Ponce, Mayaguez and San Juan would play host to the Aniversario 86 event.

[jdw]

I don't have a twitter account and really don't ever want to have one (though it's increasingly likely that I will go that route), but if it was me I'd point out that he is unquestionably wrong - Linda and Stephanie McMahon have FAR more power than Moolah ever did by any sane metric, so if that's his standard it's time for him to intensely lobby Dave for them to be included on the ballot.

I considered pointing that out but since his reply would almost certainly be "They're not in the wrestling business, they're in the sports entertainment business. Just ask them if you don't believe me!" I didn't think there was any reason to tweet it.

 

Motoko Baba.

[jdw]

I don't have a twitter account and really don't ever want to have one (though it's increasingly likely that I will go that route), but if it was me I'd point out that he is unquestionably wrong - Linda and Stephanie McMahon have FAR more power than Moolah ever did by any sane metric, so if that's his standard it's time for him to intensely lobby Dave for them to be included on the ballot.

I considered pointing that out but since his reply would almost certainly be "They're not in the wrestling business, they're in the sports entertainment business. Just ask them if you don't believe me!" I didn't think there was any reason to tweet it.

 

How about Motoko?

 

 

Damnit! You beat me to it, Jose!!!!

[jdw]

Dave wrote a horrifying bio for Moolah in the WON when she died.

That's what I thought, just wasn't sure. Been a long time since I read it.

 

Good god... and I'm being blamed for keeping her out of the WON HOF?!?!

[Dylan Waco]

A few more things on the PR front:

 

I'm a bit confused about the 87 Anniversary show numbers. My assumption was that the 23k was the number of people in the building for the stadium show headlined by Chicky v. Invader, not the combined number of the three shows together. If that were the combined number for the three shows I would have to assume it would have been a disappointment, but then again maybe not. Also having seen the footage of the show it sure as hell looks like a stadium show attended by a massive crowd - 23k doesn't seem out of the question. Is it possible that that show did 23k paid and the other two shows did strong numbers as well? Where were the other shows held?

 

I know IWA/WWC was a really interesting rivalry and period in Puerto Rican wrestling history, but I'm less certain how well the shows were actually doing. You often hear about guys getting credit for things done during that run, but I have no clue how strong a period it was. Obviously it wasn't anything close to the peak, but my question is was business noticeably stronger during that period? Also what kind of business did the AWF do before it collapsed?

[El Boricua]

I'm reasonably sure that the 23,000 number would be for the Bayamon portion of the show in Juan Ramon Loubriel Stadium. Quite a few places list the show as occurring from Bayamon without noting that it was from three separate locations (like WrestleMania 2). Other places I've seen list it as 23,000 for Bayamon, and around 9,500 at each of the other two sites (Ponce and Mayaguez). Heck, Wikipedia lists the show as being only from Bayamon with an attendance of 11,000 and that doesn't pass the smell test (it's more likely they are listing the attendance of one of the other two towns but stating that the event was from Bayamon). I can't 100% confirm if those are the actual numbers though.

 

For this event, they basically went one step further from 86, where they held the event in three days in three different cities. Here they held it one day in three different cities. The Ponce part of the show was held at Coliseo Pachin Vicens (the same place as the first day of Aniversario 86) and was headlined by the Carlos Colon vs. Hercules Ayala barbed wire title match. The Mayaguez portion was held in El Palacio de Recreacion y Deportes (should be the same venue as the Hugo vs. Profe loser is painted yellow match) and was headlined by TNT vs. Mr. Pogo. For reference, here is the full card:

 

 

One thing, the Sheepherders couldn't make it and instead the Fantastics faced Buddy Roberts and Iceman Parsons. You'll notice they announce the three headlining matches first. Of course, although the Colon vs. Ayala match is mentioned first in the ad, it's telling that Invader vs. Chicky was the one chosen to headline the largest location of the three being run. Colon vs. Ayala was at the second largest location, TNT vs. Pogo the third.

 

Business never boomed back to how it was during the glory days of the 80's, but most local fans would put that period from 99-05 as a sort of revival due to the IWA/WWC rivalry. To someone who watched as a fan, the period was definitely stronger than what had been the 90's, but I can't say to what extent in terms of attendance and ratings. Of the two, it was IWA that was hotter. It's amazing to think about, but if you had told many fans in 2003 that only one promotion would be left standing in 2013, everyone would have said of course. If you had then said that it would be WWC, people would have thought you were a complete loon. Funny how things work out.

 

From what I've heard, ASWF did well at the beginning and was even out drawing WWC for shows. ASWF had Chicky Starr, Hercules Ayala, Jose Luis Rivera and Barrabas as the well-known locals at the start, but then they raided WWC's roster (it was easy to do since the roster was disgruntled over lack of pushes and/or back pay delays). They ended up getting Hugo Savinovich (who has said in interviews that he left because he was tired of broken promises, they owed him $14,500 of back pay), TNT, Huracan Castillo, all of the Super Medicos, Invader 4 and a young Ray Gonzalez. WWC was left with Carlos Colon, Invader 1, Miguel Perez, Bronco, and Ricky Santana among the regulars (not counting guys like Abdullah). WWC then resorted to doing a Carlos Colon vs. Invader 1 feud which which did very well for them.

 

ASW started having problems due to a combination of bloated payroll (more wrestlers than WWC), wrestlers starting to demand for more money, some people in charge started trying to stack things in their favor and the financial backer eventually backed out. The first notable problems for ASW were when they ran their big card in the summer of 92, when Solid Gold (the Estradas in Conquistadors garb) held the promotion up for more money right as they were supposed to head out to the ring for the final match of the night. From there they jumped back to WWC and things started unraveling bit by bit for ASWF from there until they closed sometime in 1993. Hugo Savinovich said in an interview that he heard that they were supposedly 1.5 million in the red when they closed.

 

I have the card lineup for that show somewhere on another computer. I’ll post it later when I can track it down so you can get an idea of who was in ASWF at the time.

[El Boricua]

OK, I found the card results. They are from a blurb in one of the 92 Observers. Here it is as written in the Observer:

 

The AWF's big show called "The Event" at Sixto Escobar Stadium in San Juan on 6/6 drew a $19,000 house

 

Jose Luis Rivera beat King Kong (Awesome Kong aka Dwayne McCullough) via DQ,

 

Dr. Terror beat Super Medico #4 in a loser must retire match,

 

Galan Mendoza beat Gino Paoli in a bloody coal miner's glove match,

 

Invader #4 (Maelo Huertas) beat The Wizard in a match where the loser had to be thrown into a pool filled with pig food,

 

television announcer Hugo Savinovich beat a bloody Billy Joe Travis,

 

Chicky Starr beat Barrabas in a double juice dog collarmatch,

 

Butch Reed beat Manny Fernandez via DQ,

 

Tony Atlas pinned Chris Adams to retain the North American title after hitting him with a gimmick,

 

Sadistic Steve Strong (Steve DiSalvo) went to a DDQ with The Barbarian (Sionne Vailahi),

 

TNT pinned Hurricane Castillo Jr. in a ring surrounded by fire match to win the Americas title,

 

Hercules Ayala beat Crash the Eliminator to win the AWF title when Steve Strong distracted Crash in a double juice barbed wire match and after the match Strong attacked Ayala as well.

 

The final match on the card was supposed to be Solid Gold (Jose & Julio Estrada) defending the AWF tag team titles against Tom Brandi & Ray Gonzales with Brandi & Gonzales winning the straps. Solid Gold had a money dispute at the last minute and held up the promotion which didn't give in, literally as their music was playing. So instead of Solid Gold coming out they had Crash, Strong and Barabbas come out and they did a five minute brawl which was the wildest action on the entire show.

[goc]

So I guess Tony Atlas DID go back to Puerto Rico after Brody's death?