Current New Japan

[Control21]

They finally killed NJPW. This will be the first G1 final I will not bother watching. This is just totally inexcusable. That company needs surgery to remove a deep cancer.

[Dav'oh]

For a variety of reasons, the first time I got to view a Young Lion's excursion contemporaneously was when EVIL went to ROH and I was pretty excited at the prospect.

Then I saw him getting smoked by the ROH crew and it was clear he didn't have it/get it. I've never expected anything good of him since.

4 hours ago, El-P said:

And yeah, Covid did a number on them,

Covid may have oiled the dildo, but it still took NJPW to roger themselves.

[Boss Rock]

5 hours ago, El-P said:

Gotta love the discourse in "american NJPW fans" (*sigh*) about EVIL being super over in Japan and shit, but the dismal drawing power of the promotion in the last few years seems to indicate otherwise. Since he got pushed to and around the main event spot, it's been nothing but a disastrous run both creatively and business wise.

I've seen numerous arguments that HoT are big merch movers. But the NJPW merch sites don't have any of their gear in the top 10 of sales.

I know some of NJPW's woes can be blamed on losing talent to AEW and the company becoming very draconian with gifs on social media which has resulted in less buzz for their big matches. But good Lord is the booking absolutely fried. Takeshita winning would be cool and all, but unless he's going to devote more time to NJPW or leave altogether, I'm not sure putting a part-timer in the main event of WK is a good idea. Especially considering Mox's run with the title in 2024 did nothing for them.

[Jmare007]

Can't believe fans have reached "EVIL is popular in Japan" narrative  some folks will just head cannon anything, LMAO. 

It's insane to me I started complaining about Gedo 10 years ago, he's gotten worse each year since then and he still has the book. Complete insanity.

Poor Tsuji man...

[Tetsujin]

You can trace back Gedo's awful booking run to WK 12 in 2018, but 2019 as a proper year was the first time NJPW felt out of its new golden age, both story wise and in ring. COVID only made far worse a situation that was already beginning to stink, except for Naito's two first months of reign before the pandemic.

[El-P]

1 hour ago, Boss Rock said:

I've seen numerous arguments that HoT are big merch movers. But the NJPW merch sites don't have any of their gear in the top 10 of sales.

Picture me not surprised. The whole "EVIL is popular" is pure copium to distract from the obvious : Gedo's booking sucks. And yeah, I did love G1 last year and the whole ZSJ ascension. It was awesome. And the Goto win this year was a terrific feel-good story too. But apart from those and the Naito wins the previous year, the booking overall has been bad for a while now. The SANADA title reign still baffles me to this day. The House of Torture shit has been going on for 5 years now (the rumor was at one point that it was Dick Togo's influence, if true this guy needs to be fired yesterday).

[Jmare007]

I think what's hurting the company the most is what's been happening outside of the IWGP title picture. There's been no new rivalries worth a fuck since the return from COVID, no angles worth a damn and no real come up story from any new guy because they've been stuck in the same place trading wins and losses for the past 3 years. 

It's not about who is the main champion right now, it's that there's nothing really exciting about the roster. They've been badly needing a hard reset for years and Gedo keeps trotting out half assed efforts with a few months of cool IWGP title defenses sprinkled in here and there, and that's clearly not enough. There's no vision about the future nor anything really and it's depressing as all hell. 

[El-P]

23 minutes ago, Jmare007 said:

I think what's hurting the company the most is what's been happening outside of the IWGP title picture. There's been no new rivalries worth a fuck since the return from COVID, no angles worth a damn and no real come up story from any new guy because they've been stuck in the same place trading wins and losses for the past 3 years. 

It's not about who is the main champion right now, it's that there's nothing really exciting about the roster.

Yeah, also that. The heavy focus on a David Finlay (with all due respect, I find him to be really good in-ring) all foreign heel faction, calling a brand new stable JUST FIVE GUYS (might as well call themselves "We're generic", made even more terrible, or funny, by the fact they were led by charisma vacuum SANADA), or keeping a United Empire alive after Ospreay left (and giving the lead to *gasp* TJP) are exemples of what makes the mid/undercard pretty uninteresting indeed. They're also resting on the multiplication of titles which has plagued the promotion for years and has only got worse with the TV title being added. Yeah, there's absolutely a feeling of staleness. There was no surprise in the G1, no outsider, no cool veteran from another era...

Now that I think of it, it actually could have been even worse. Imagine Jake Lee coming back and getting the push to the top... (*looks around*... hoping Gedo isn't listening)

[Boss Rock]

2 hours ago, Jmare007 said:

t's not about who is the main champion right now, it's that there's nothing really exciting about the roster. They've been badly needing a hard reset for years and Gedo keeps trotting out half assed efforts with a few months of cool IWGP title defenses sprinkled in here and there, and that's clearly not enough. 

If I had a nickel for every time someone tried to claim NJPW was "back"....

[El-P]

If you told me even two months ago that Takeshita would win the G1 and I would not bother to watch, I would not have believed you. But here we are. The irony is that he's actually the right guy, if his dual contract allows him to commit. But the EVIL stuff. Nah, pass.

[Boss Rock]

I'm curious if this means he's going to spend more time in NJPW or essentially continue as a part-timer.

[El-P]

"What are you talking about, EVIL is over with the domestic crowds !"

 

[strobogo]

Just seems like Tanahashi isn't good in the office. Can't keep anyone, and not even guys going to AEW. Except the guys who just won't go away.

[Ma Stump Puller]

2 hours ago, strobogo said:

Just seems like Tanahashi isn't good in the office. Can't keep anyone, and not even guys going to AEW. Except the guys who just won't go away.

The Yen is HORRENDOUS at this point and time, Tanahashi could be the greatest businessman ever and it wouldn't mean anything, especially when the other major companies have significantly stronger currencies and thus much far more money to play with. If someone wants to leave to go to either of them for financial reasons there's not really anything he can do.

Native audiences seem to have gravitated towards EVIL than Takashita; which is expected since one of them is a home-grown native who's been there for over a decade and the other isn't even signed and will never be. It's a hard sell even excluding the above to get people to spend their ever-deceasing money on frivolous things when salaries in Japan are similarly awful. 

 

 

[El-P]

Takeshita is actually signed to NJPW. He's got a dual contract. Since he's talking about challenging "as soon as possible", possibly he can get a title reign until WK, then maybe drop the title to Tsuji there. Or something. 

Also, Tanahashi is the president of NJPW like Jack Tunney was the president of the WWF. 

As far as people leaving, sure, that's one issue. But it was always gonna be an issue. Gedo's shitty booking of the young talents and his over-reliance on the fucking House of Torture is a much bigger issue, really, since it is legit tanking the product.

[Ma Stump Puller]

1 hour ago, El-P said:

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Takeshita is actually signed to NJPW

AEW is his prime contract and is the one he'll be undertaking the most. He's "signed" to DDT as well and he has done like a couple of shows per-year. I'm sure this'll lead to a strong title shot at WK but the draw will be Tanahashi ultimately, you could have anyone in that slot and it wouldn't matter all that much. 

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He's got a dual contract. Since he's talking about challenging "as soon as possible", possibly he can get a title reign until WK, then maybe drop the title to Tsuji there. Or something

Probably

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Also, Tanahashi is the president of NJPW like Jack Tunney was the president of the WWF

This is simply untrue: many wrestlers in Japanese promotions obtain substantial roles within the companies they frequent especially Tana who's been pivotal to the admin and restructuring of NJPW since the rear-end of Inoki-Ism. He's a CEO with a board to answer to but is nevertheless the CEO. 

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As far as people leaving, sure, that's one issue. But it was always gonna be an issue. Gedo's shitty booking of the young talents and his over-reliance on the fucking House of Torture is a much bigger issue, really, since it is legit tanking the product.

It's a substantially larger issue than it was in, say, 2005 (where it was non-existent bar memes like Kenzo Suzuki) and 2015 (where it was only in exceptional conditions/was mostly non-native stars like AJ). Now that the economy is so weak and COVID has done its damage we're seeing a lot of open season hiring by both major Western companies that rest assured will continue to happen. 

HoT is fine, it's the same thing as what Voodoo Murders/Makai Club were in the 2000s and other silly heel groups from even earlier than that. They sell a new shirt for them every tour and it seems like they make enough money to necessitate their existence, even if smarks hate their style (which is understandable). If they weren't profitable I imagine they wouldn't be around. 

 

[El-P]

Well, maybe Tana has some actual power, but Bushiroad got the checks, and Gedo does the booking, so from there, Tana can only do so much.

Totally agree House of Torture are like Voodoo Murders/Makai Club in the 2000 : complete unfiltered shit. (EDIT : damn and now I have memories of those VHS tapes of NJPW shows I used to BUY with GOOD MONEY and that had some Makai Club matches on it. Why ? Just WHY ? Talk about some names from the past you never ever want to be reminded of 😁)