JvK books WWF in 1983

[ButchReedMark]

Where do you go from here? Greg Valentine?

[Karl]

Having played the game myself, its so easy to fall into the trap of going with guys on the basis of who they are to become rather than who they are at that point. Be interesting to see how the turn round takes place.

[Smack2k]

Fuck that Parv, I LOVE the chances you are taking, and if Vince is smart, and gives it some time, your stuff is gonna grow from here and with decent booking along the way, it can be good...just hope Vince sees it the same way...think of this as late 1997 WWF...putting the pieces in place to grow over 97 and into booming...most didnt like 97 in WWF (look at their ratings, no matter what people say today about how "great" it was, not many were watching outside their WWF loyalists), but look what happened when they got out of their comfort zone.

 

I know its 1983 and not 1997, but the same thing applies...taking a chance...when one of these things gets over, things will go from there...have fun with it...You have completely motivated me to do this game and take some chances with 2000 WCW...

 

In terms of the booking, doing the other "safe" things (Bruno over, Main Event title match last) are things that would be easy booking decisions and the game wouldnt be any fun at that point, and would just be doing the same thing others have done. Would it work? Maybe, but in they end, you've already seen those results in reality.

 

I like the chances you are taking and the risks, especially taking new guys and putting them up and seeing where it goes...are you gonna get fired? Quite possibly, but at least you know you tried...If given time, this COULD work...stay with the plan..STAY THE COURSE..if you get fired...take your guys somewhere else and keep building...

[Jesse Ewiak]

I honestly think most of Parv's problems with the results are more of a result of the games limitations than what he actually did. After all, random heels coming in to main event programs are basically what the WWF was built on. So, Arn, Tully, Savage, and Ted coming in and wreaking havoc isn't totally out of the realm of possibility.

 

However, TEW 13 doesn't allow for people to become immediately "stars" on their first night in the company and by the same token, really doesn't allow you to put on shows that would've sold out the Garden in 1983 because well, they sucked by 2013 standards and even though people have done a good job at kind of using TEW as a background, small problems like this build up and you either have to ignore/readjust the ratings you get for the story you're writing, or rewrite your story.

[JerryvonKramer]

My all-purpose defense is as follows:

 

- The roster is old. My big stars were Andre, Bruno and Backlund. As I started, Bruno was working in the backroom, I brought him out of retirement. Andre is constantly being loaned out by Vince Sr and the NWA, and is missing for at least a third of the time. Backlund walked out. My plan, therefore, was to build the promotion around a Bruno comeback. Using his overness as a "rub" for my new heels.

 

- I had to bring in new talent. Steamboat wouldn't come. Martel, Flair, Valentine, none of them would come. Arn, Tully, Savage and DiBiase all agreed to come. Three of them were completely unknown in the North East and the fourth, Ted, was familiar to fans because of the 79 run. That's why Ted was pushed on top. Savage is a much longer term prospect. Arn and Tully are building nicely.

 

- If you look back to my booking from the Royal Rumble, my plan was always to headline Wrestlemania with Bruno vs. DiBiase. Then Backlund walked out and I had to throw in the tournament to the mix and it made sense for Bruno to win the title at the same time as he beat Ted in the big blow off. The plan was for Bruno to hold the strap from Mania to Summerslam while Ted kept being built up to the point he could run with the title. And long, long term Savage would get to the point where he could turn and you've got an instant Ted vs. Savage feud for the belt.

 

- That was the plan, but as I was executing it week-to-week, two things became clear: 1. Bruno couldn't perform in the ring and 2. Ted wasn't over enough to carry the strap. So I'd booked myself into a corner. I had this main even match for the title that no one could win.

 

- After Andre, Bruno and Backlund, the next most over people in the company are Billy Graham who can't work (and whose limitations I think I've worked well with) and Jimmy Snuka. Snuka is showing signs that he can't really work that well either, but of all the available options, he was the best. Yes, a last-minute change of plan and yes, if I known he was about to be champ, I'd have built him up more, but sometimes circumstances dictate things. There was no way I could make either Bruno or Ted champion. But that was clearly my number 1 match, so the title had to go in the semi-main slot.

 

- As for Ted over Bruno. I looked at it like this: Bruno is done. There's only so long I can try to carry the company through angles carried by his overness. And he stunk it up in every single match he had in the comeback run -- five matches in a row with the "Bruno was really off his game" road agent note. What that means is that Bruno is done in the ring. So what? Feed the heel I've been building for 3 months just to send the fans home happy one night? I've got the next 9 months to think about. So it's a choice between "give Bruno the fairytale ending" or "make the top heel a made man". Like I said Bruno is Undertaker in 2014 here, his sole use from a long-term stance is putting someone over.

 

----------

 

None of these things are ideal and the situation has not been ideal. Half of the guys on the roster are 40+. I can't book looking back to 1975, I have to look forward. I get the idea of "foresight bias", but that's honestly not what is dictating who I'm pushing. DiBiase, Savage, Arn, Tully and Hennig all have tremendous stats within the game. None of them are that over at the moment, but no one gets over without being built. There is literally NO POINT in sacfricing any of them to put Chief Jay Strongbow or Ivan Putski over. The young guys need to start getting elevated. If you look back in history, Ole Anderson when he was booking WCW was massively criticised for putting the veterans over the young up and comers. He was criticised for burying Brian Pillman. For putting his old friends over time and again. I'm doing the opposite here and I'm getting criticised for it. But Dibiase in 1983 IS Brian Pillman in 1990. I have to push him. Hennig and Savage aren't there yet and it will take at least a year for those guys to rise up the card. Savage did fine in the side-feud with Andre, but in game-terms his overness rating is "E+", he's a long way from main eventing anything. But Savage's popularity will rise faster than most people's because he has that X-factor. To an extent, yes, knowing what happened in real-life is a benefit, but like Arn is great on the mic and we know that and the game knows that. So I want to get Arn to a point where he can cut money promos. What's the alternative? Arn and Tully jobbing out to the Samoans?

 

So I defend myself on the basis that I have to look forward and sometimes that means changing direction in the short-term. I'll admit, Wrestlemania was disappointing. I thought I'd built really well to that point, but I had to change the card for practical reasons. That's booking.

 

 

---------

 

As for "what to do". At the moment I'm out of ideas. I'm still waiting for the territory to pop into being "cult", which will let me transfer the TV to a bigger cable network, get PPV and (hopefully) it will mean I can get guys like Steamboat or even Hulk Hogan to come in.

 

Bruno being past it and Backlund walking out has left me with no top babyfaces. Snuka can have his moment but you can tell I have no conviction behind that. I was thinking that him vs. Slaughter could be a feud, but Slaughter is looking like my answer for the ailing IC division.

 

Ideally I want to fire about half the roster and replace them with fresher faces. But it's tricky. Anyone who is anyone in the North East is kind of here already and I need those guys to get other guys over. I'm worried that it's all going to take too long and I'm going to get fired before I get to that point, but let's see.

 

I should also mention that I've been playing this game for years and years and before now have never been fired. It would be ironic that the only time I've shared this is the only time things go tits-up.

[Beast]

I'm still digging this. The key is that the game judges based on modern day expectations so Parv is correct to load up on guys with great stats rather than the old plodding roster of WWF 1983.

[Bierschwale]

In terms of lower-level guys, what level of cachet do Gilbert and Santana have? Is Dino Bravo stuck in AWA limbo? Where the hell is Rick McGraw? Is a Soul Patrol split-and-feud worth trying? Not that any of that's gonna fill up Shea Stadium, I'm just curious as to how they're viewed by the game and if they can give you anything at all.

[Smack2k]

I dont know TEW13 that well as I am getting my feet wet, but what does the game usually need for the software to trigger you being fired?

 

Anyone that knows the software to know what triggers it usually?

 

Also, Parv has tried to get a TON of guys in and they are saying no, so he's going with what he has and having some fun with it..this thing will grow with these guys and get bigger. Once he hits the next levet (Cult) a lot of those guys are gonna come in and you he will take off from there..

 

For now though, what is your entire current roster? The Snuka / Slaughter World TItle feud sounds like something those crowds would come see and they could have some really good matches as both were rocking in 83...curious who else is there you could insert in a good IC feud with Pedro?

 

Can you put a list of your current roster?

[JerryvonKramer]

I dont know TEW13 that well as I am getting my feet wet, but what does the game usually need for the software to trigger you being fired?

 

Anyone that knows the software to know what triggers it usually?

Many of the program's algorithms are mysterious, and I've never been fired before, but then I've never worked for Vince before. I have booked Mid-South under Watts though, but he was a bit more patient.

 

Later on I'll provide a blow-by-blow account of who is on the roster together with some of their key stats and overness ratings. Post-Mania, I need to perform a stock taking exercise, because I currently have virtually no live storylines, feuds, or plans. The Bruno situation threw me for a loop.

[thebrainfollower]

Okay here's the problem with your plan as I see it.

 

You had 4 young good workers who agreed to come work for you.

 

You brought them all in as heels

 

HUGE mistake. You've admitted for years you don't like Bob Backlund and his style wouldn't work for you and he's gone. You based a Bruno comeback that didn't work out as a short term plan.

 

Did Vince Jr have a short term plan once he got full control of the booking in early 84? Nope he had a long term plan, strap that rocket to Hogan and let him run with it.

 

IMO you should have brought Savage and Liz in as faces. The idea of "I can always turn Savage later and have him feud with Dibiase" is fundamentally flawed. Hogan wasn't brought in as a mid card heel and then turned and went to main event status. Austin was.........but that's 14 years later with a completely different society than in 1983.

 

Right now you have a babyface world champion who's not really a main eventer and a top heel who just retired the fans hero and that didn't work either.

 

Parv I love Ted Dibiase a lot too. But the fundamental truth is the man got as far in his real career as he SHOULD have reached. There's a fundamental lack of the "it" factor in Dibiase to be the leading figure in a major national promotion. Great worker, occasional main eventer, good promo but something's missing. Hogan's critique of Ted in his awful bio (at least his WWF run) strikes me as fairly accurate to be honest.

 

You compare 83 Ted to 90 Pilman. Fair enough. But imagine if Starrcade 90 would have been heel Pillman RETIRING face Flair. For good. For real. Now do you begin to see how far you went with this? And Dibiase is not the star Savage is. Nor the performer IMO but certainly NOT the star.

 

Your top faces right now are upper midcarder Snuka and non-factor Andre.

 

Your top heels are Dibiase, Savage, Arn, Tully, Slaughter.

 

That's heel overkill even by Kevin Sullivan booking standards.

[thebrainfollower]

And in a promotion dominated by babyfaces since day one.

[Beast]

Hogan coming to WWF at the end of 1983 as a face isn't comparable to Savage here because Hogan had the name value and popularity before coming back as a face.

 

Dibiase retiring Sammartino in 1983 is less like Pillman retiring Flair in 1990 and more like Pillman retiring Dusty in 1990.

[thebrainfollower]

I agree Savage in 83 is nowhere near Hogan and not ready for it. But you need somebody for that top babyface spot. The company was built around it. Bruno too old, Savage too young, Backlund doesn't wanna sell. Maybe time to turn the Sarge?

[JerryvonKramer]

I'm biding time until the company grows to "cult" at which point I'll bring in Steamer or Martel who will be my babyface. Or Hogan, if I can prise him away from Verne (AWA doing v. well).

[ButchReedMark]

Has Slaughter been there long enough to be turned babyface and not have the crowd shit on it yet? Or perhaps phase DiBiase away from the main events and have him and Savage start tension on the way to a programme to turn savage and solidify him as an upper babyface?

 

Or you could always see what Spiros Arion is up to. He'd be over well in the North East wouldn't he?

[JerryvonKramer]

Spirios Arion is semi retired and won't come, I tried week 1.

 

Also, this thread is not the best place to debate it but the Pillman in 90 comparison sells Ted short. He was Pillman in 79-80. By 83, he was already a bigger star. A much bigger star actually.

[ButchReedMark]

Ha! Who'da thunk Spiros fucking Arion would big league you?

[JerryvonKramer]

This is what I've been trying to tell people, I'll continue to get big leagued till I get to "cult".

 

I actually think the designers of the mod significantly underestimated how big Vince Sr's promotion was. Which means, I think, that I'm more up against it than they would have been in 83.

[ButchReedMark]

Well, you're a more determined man than me. By now I'd have thought "Fuck it", and put Salvatore Bellomo over in every match on the card and have the "celebration ceremony" segment for him after every bout. When I go down, I take the company with me.

[JerryvonKramer]

I'm a bit puzzled why they've underrated Vince Sr's WWF so much, because the guys who put the Death of the Territories mod clearly know their stuff, but I've got a feeling it's because of game balancing issues (i.e. if they set WWF as it really was, Vince would curb-stomp everyone every time). Just a theory, but I think "B-" in the North East is not an accurate reflection of the territory in 83. UNLESS, they are going with the narrative of the crowds turning on Backlund or whatever, even then it was B+ at the very least, if not higher. This is one of the reasons the crowds haven't been very hot and I had to stop running MSG. Whatever the case, I can't stop now, just makes things more of a challenge. Just wait till I get to cult and get cable, you people will see what booking is about! Ha ha.

[ButchReedMark]

Is there a save game editor you can download so you can make little tweaks like that? As B- in the Top-Right of the states takes piss a bit.

[JerryvonKramer]

There is an editor than can be used to fix whatever you want, but since I've started it would feel like "cheating" now.

[JerryvonKramer]

Battered and bruised from the critical reaction of the smart community to his booking of Wrestlemania, and rapidly running out of grace time with a certain Vincent Kennedy McMahon, the intrepid JerryvonKramer picks himself up off the floor, dusts off his suit, and his booking pen, and gets to work on the turning around the company ...

Week 14 (April, Week 2):

Challenge:



Not a lot happening here, and when the time comes to re-negotiate the TV contracts, I'm going to try to get Challenge bumped up to an A-show because it is becoming a bit of a waste of time.

Pushes for Savage and Hennig continue as The Brainbusters make their first defense of the tag titles.

Superstars:



This show was mainly built around dealing with the fallout from Mania: namely, Snuka as the new world champ and Bruno's loss to DiBiase. For the time being, the plan is to forget about Bruno within reason. Ted will bring up that he ended his career, but only as a means of putting himself over.



So one of the little short-term plans I have is to partly rehabilitate SD Jones from jobber status so he can be a partner to Jimmy Snuka and friends in six-mans and so on.



The pushing of Curt Hennig continues. He'll get over eventually.


Jesse: Well, it gives me great pleasure to introduce the first edition of my new show "The Bodyshop" by welcoming my esteemed guest, Ted DiBiase!! And the NEW tag-team champions Arn Anderson and Tully Blanchard. Only winners come on The Bodyshop, and just like the host, these gentlemen are winners. And all of them -- like me -- won at Wrestlemania this past week. And you can be sure, with me at the helm, you will only get top quality investigative journalism. I'm going to ask the hard-hitting questions that matter, unlike that hack Billy Graham!

DiBiase: Jesse Ventura, you can write it in stone tablets and you can put it in the scriptures my friend, because when the historians look down the annals of history they'll see that the Great Bruno Sammartino's career was ENDED by a true wrestling Elite, me, Ted DiBiase!

Jesse: What do you think that match will mean to your career?

DiBiase: Make no mistake, Ventura, Bruno Sammartino was a great man, and a great wrestler. But he met his MATCH when he stepped into the ring with the next big thing in wrestling, me. And I have to tell you as elated as I am, as happy and gleeful as we all are that I put the great man out of wrestling, I also have this nagging feeling that there's now a PRETENDER holding the world title. Jimmy Snuka has something that belongs TO ME. I've been saying for weeks that there's been a conspiracy in this place and Sammartino made sure that I didn't get my hands on that title. Well I made him PAY in that steel cage. And that's a message to anyone who thinks that they can meddle in the affairs of The Elite. Jimmy Snuka, start polishing that belt, boy, because it needs to be nice and shiny when it goes around my waist! I'm a winner, all of the members of The Elite are winners. Like my business associates here, Arn Anderson and Tully Blanchard, the NEW world tag-team champions.

Arn: There's a storm brewing in the WWF and if you go to the eye of that storm, the epicentre of destruction and mayhem, you'll see our faces there! Tony Atlas! Rocky Johnson! You found out that out already, that no one steps in our way. We don't stop until we get what we want. And now we're going to be the Tag Team Champions for a very long time!

Tully: "Elite" means don't lose. "Elite" means we stick together. "Elite" means when I wake up in the morning I've got this belt put over my shoulder. We're sending a message to everyone in the WWF: we're here to stay. And you'll have to prise these belt from out cold head hands if you want them, because we ain't giving them up!

Jesse: Powerful words there from the tag-team cha ...

*Billy Graham gate crashes the set*

Graham: Well, well, well, what have we got here ...

Jesse: Now, wait! You lost this slot to me inside that ring! Security!!

Graham: You and all of these people know that you CHEATED, Jesse Ventura, when the referee's back was turned. I'm going to show this footage, watch it.

Jesse: I don't need to see any footage from a sore loser!

Graham: Well when the WWF President Vincent J. McMahon reviews this he's going to have other ideas!

Jesse: Do you mind, I'm trying to present a show here, some of us are broadcast professionals.

*Graham saunters away as Jesse signal to go to a commercial break*




Story here is that Kamala still has five appearances left on his contract and Andre has nothing to do ...


Snuka: I am so happy to be your new WWF champion! And now we're gonna have an island celebration man!! Come on, SD, bring the chicken and rice boy!

*SD Jones dances down the aisle in an Hawaiin shirt. There is a fleet of kettle drum players around the ring. Jones is leading a troop of Hula dancers in traditional dress. They are shimmying up the aisle.*

Snuka: SD, mon, good to see you! We got to get all the brothers out here!

Jones: Ohhh we're gonna have a party!!!

Snuka: Come on! Afa! Sika! Come represent the isle of Samoa!

*Afa and Sika shimmy down the aisle in celebration (this signals their face turn)*

Snuka: Da Samoans! We need all the Pacific to represent mon! The Island of Hawaii!! Come on, DON MURACO!!

*Muraco is in a Hawaiin shirt, he seems reluctant at first, but then he hears the kettle drums and sees SD Jones dancing and gets into the party spirit and, like Balloo the bear out of The Jungle Book, can't help himself get carried away with the rhythm. He dances down the aisle to join the party in the ring.*

The five islanders embrace and Snuka gets back on the mic.

Snuka: We are going to bring the good times to the WWF, ya ya ya!!

*The Samoans do a traditional ritual dance. SD Jones brings out bowls of rice with jerk chicken. Don Muraco has a big smile on his face*

Muraco: It's time to party in the WWF!

Hey, it's 1983. The promotion isn't above playing on some racial stereotypes. The babyface stable is admittedly awful, but it's literally all I've got until I can get some better talent in. Afa and Sika don't work well as babyfaces, but Arn and Tully need some competition. Don Muraco's career is greatly flagging, so maybe he can find a new lease of life here. The only positive is that Snuka seems to be getting good reactions from the crowd.

New England Live Show:



This New England region is taking FOREVER to get to the popularity pop. Basically using up some more of Brisco's dates, while pushing Hennig even more and trying to get Ted over in the region, while also trying to get over the new babyface Islander stable.



Yeah, about that ... But look at the note on Snuka. He's doing well, even though he's surrounded by shit.

---------------

Forthcoming: complete run down of roster.

[shoe]

Parv you should be using a pencil not a pen when booking.

[JerryvonKramer]

Okay, here goes. There are currently 42 active wrestlers on the roster, plus I'll show you Bruno, who has just retired. I've not included the guys who are still in on loan (Brisco, Dusty, Kamala, Hiro Saito)

 

This will give you an idea what I'm working with. This for all intents and purposes is their "overness" rating. In each case, you want to be looking mainly at the stat in "Tri-State", but we're also interested in the rating for "New England" as well, as it is my main secondary market.

 

There is no point pushing into other territories until the promotion "pops" into cult. But it is taking an age. Until that time, there's also not much point in looking to bring in new talent. However, there is no harm in looking at potential areas to "invade" once the time comes. You'll notice certain guys are more over elsewhere than they are in New York.

 

Jobbers

 

Rene Goulet

He's on his way out in less than a month. Contract running down.

 

Mike Jackson

 

Iron Mike Sharpe

 

Frankie Williams

Williams has been the drizzling shits even in 2-minute matches. He's not even good enough to be a jobber and I will probably fire him soon.

 

JTTS

 

Brian Blair

 

Butcher Vachon

 

David Sammartino

 

Doug Somers

 

Eddie Gilbert

 

Johnny Rodz

 

Jules Strongbow

 

The Riverias

 

Midcarders

 

Big John Studd

 

Chief Jay Strongbow

 

George Steele

 

Ivan Putski

 

Mr. Fuji

 

SD Jones

 

Ray Stevens

 

Tony Garea

 

The average age of this lot is well over 42.

 

Upper Midcarders

 

Arn Anderson

 

Curt Hennig

 

Don Muraco

 

Iron Sheik

 

Ivan Koloff

 

Mil Mascaras

 

Randy Savage

 

Rocky Johnson

 

Tito Santana

 

Tony Atlas

 

Tully Blanchard

 

The Wild Samoans

 

Main Eventers

 

Andre

 

Bruno Sammartino (currently kayfabe retired)

 

Billy Graham

 

Jesse Ventura

 

Jimmy Snuka

 

Masked Superstar

 

Pedro Morales

 

Sgt Slaughter

 

Ted DiBiase