Judy Bagwell Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 ok lets forget the Lonely/fuckmoney parody and focus on his career in the WWE and WCW. What are your favorite memories of him or general thoughts on his run in both companies? and which run was better? notable wins Haku Ted Dibiase twice Skinner Repo Man WCW Horace Hogan Ernest Miller Prince Iuakea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 His best moment came when the fan attacked him at the cage match in MSG in 1988. His second best moment came at Royal Rumble 91 when he finally turned on Ted. The skits leading up to that turn were some of the darkest shit the WWF ever put out. Cleaning the fungus from between DiBiase's toes was so nasty and humiliating. Really quite on the line if you think about it. His third best moment came when he finally got the pin over Ted. He was not a very good worker. I also thought as a kid there was a disparity between how tough he looked and how wimpy he always turned out to be when he was the bodyguard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMJ Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 Am I crazy but I thought I read somewhere that he has a match against Bret Hart thats good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 The best part of that match is Heenan rooting for him. He has some really fun jobber squashes where he just kills guys in 1992. Then he has a number of underappreciated Saturday Night matches towards the end of his WCW run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 There was some moment during the nWo B team days where they convinced Virgil to challenge someone, I don't remember who. Virgil smartly talked Disco Inferno into doing it and added to smack him in the mouth. That was probably my favorite WCW moment for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebottom Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Say what you want, but he was over with the crowd after he went babyface. I was surprised they didn't tap into to Michael Jordan prime and appeal and try and market him to appeal to black sports audiences. Virgil = The Michael Jordan of the WWF. It could have been, I'm deadly serious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benbeeach Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Am I crazy but I thought I read somewhere that he has a match against Bret Hart thats good? it's short sweet and to the point. A very solid match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Say what you want, but he was over with the crowd after he went babyface. I was surprised they didn't tap into to Michael Jordan prime and appeal and try and market him to appeal to black sports audiences. Virgil = The Michael Jordan of the WWF. It could have been, I'm deadly serious. What the hell did Virgil have to do with Michael Jordan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrainfollower Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Both bald black guys who hit a peak in the 90's? I dunno. Virgil to me is an interesting case. He peaked at Summerslam 91 with a huge in in a great match and ended that story the way it needed to be ended. It's a shame that wrestling isn't real in his case, because selling the belt for $10 million and then retiring would have been the perfect finish to his career. Instead he does nothing after SS 91, drops the belt to Dibiase (which was pointless since the belt vanished 2 months later anyway) and then slid into JTTS status so fast it would make your head spin. His role as the guy the NWO kept around because even THEY liked watching their enemies beat the holy heck out of him was very funny, but the guy's career was done a minute after its peak really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebottom Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Say what you want, but he was over with the crowd after he went babyface. I was surprised they didn't tap into to Michael Jordan prime and appeal and try and market him to appeal to black sports audiences. Virgil = The Michael Jordan of the WWF. It could have been, I'm deadly serious. What the hell did Virgil have to do with Michael Jordan? Nothing. And I explained why I would have marketed him that way in the post you quoted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Say what you want, but he was over with the crowd after he went babyface. I was surprised they didn't tap into to Michael Jordan prime and appeal and try and market him to appeal to black sports audiences. Virgil = The Michael Jordan of the WWF. It could have been, I'm deadly serious. What the hell did Virgil have to do with Michael Jordan? Nothing. And I explained why I would have marketed him that way in the post you quoted. You did? You drew a bizarre link between a wrestler and the transcendent sports star of a generation based on "black sports audiences." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shakla Posted October 5, 2015 Report Share Posted October 5, 2015 I've always felt that Virgil is the prime example of a "one hit wonder" wrestler. Had the Summerslam '91 match, and the next best match, whatever that is, would have to be a distant second in notability/quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebottom Posted October 5, 2015 Report Share Posted October 5, 2015 Childs, yes I did explain why, you chose to call it a bizarre link. Good for you. Do you understand the influence Jordan had towards a lot of young black people in America in the late 80's / early 90's. What is so bizarre about providing that audience (or trying to tap into it) a black star kids can root for? Bruno appealed to a race, Pedro appealed to a race... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted October 5, 2015 Report Share Posted October 5, 2015 I think it's super-weird to cast Michael Jordan's impact that way. He was the best, most visually captivating player a lot of us had ever seen, and he became the rare athlete who transcended race/class/nationality, etc. If your point is that WWE should have done more to diversify its audience and that 1991 Virgil would have been a candidate for that effort, that's fine. But the tie to Jordan seemed like a poorly explained reach. Anyhow, I'm sure you meant no harm by it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkdoc Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 yea, what was so unique about jordan was how he was very strongly cast as NOT a "black athlete", which some of his own actions backed up. remember him not supporting a black senate candidate vs. one of the biggest racists in congress, because "republicans buy sneakers too"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebottom Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 yea, what was so unique about jordan was how he was very strongly cast as NOT a "black athlete", which some of his own actions backed up. remember him not supporting a black senate candidate vs. one of the biggest racists in congress, because "republicans buy sneakers too"? Jordan appealed to all races as a sports icon, for sure. He transcended barriers at a very different time. But the fact is, he made MILLIONS being marketed into the above, specifically being marketed to black youth. Growing up as a black youth in the 80's / 90's, I can personally say from my experience at least that there wasn't a strong black role model in wrestling for me on television. I was more of a WWF fan than a WCW fan, although I did see some WCW, including Ron Simmons winning the WCW world title, which was awesome. In WWF you had the butler, the voodoo man, Saba Simba, a barbarian... it's not something I necessarily noticed as a youngster, but it's something I think about with hindsight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 Do you feel like the Mars Blackmon spots were specifically targeted at black youth? I had a Mars Blackmon t-shirt, and I don't think that made me unusual among the upper-middle-class white and Asian kids who predominated at my school. I feel like if anything, marketers learned from Jordan and a number of other sources that kids of all demographics would eat up what had traditionally been regarded as black culture. I agree that WWF missed the boat on this revelation because of its incredibly backward presentation of black characters. Anyway, not arguing with you at this point. But it's kind of an interesting discussion. Speaking to Virgil specifically, I think they could have done more with him. But my gut feeling is he never had the talent to be a Jordanesque figure. Jordan's impact would not have endured and transcended if he hadn't been legitimately special. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yo-Yo's Roomie Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 I always think of the way Virgil was booked vs. the way they booked the Miz/Mizdow deal a the perfect example of how rotten the booking is in WWE these days. They really milked a lot out of Virgil turning on Ted; they had the Mania match, the Summerslam match which was the natural blow-off some 6 months+ after the initial split, and then even at the following WrestleMania Virgil was in the 8-man tag getting the pin for his team, before he fades down the card into a jobber role (which was inevitable really since he wasn't very good). Still, that's a year plus of mileage they got out of a limited talent. The fans were hot for Mizdow and chomping at the bit to see him turn on Miz, but like a month after it happened he was pretty much gone from TV. A pointless waste of an over talent, and the contrast is pretty glaring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebottom Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 I worded that bit wrong Childs. I wasn't trying to say he was marketed specifically towards black youth (i.e solely) rather that black youth was a prime demographic, and to your point it was that time frame where there was a lot of cross over with white audiences in terms of style and culture across the board. Oh, for clarity I'm certainly not saying Virgil the wrestler was anything special, but there was a connection with the audience at the time of his face turn which I think they could have done more with. He was essentially presented as just an athlete. His "too legit to quit" talk was pretty urban for the early 90's WWF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dooley Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 Virgil......as Michael Jordan. I'm just going to leave this here and ponder that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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