Judy Bagwell Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 did anyone here enjoy this? how the fuck was this greenlit? why was he MIA on TV between WM9 and King of the ring? if he had met Bret at Summerslam what would the match have panned out like? and IF Hogan had put Hart over does it finally make Bret the MAN? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Jackson Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 Still to this day, Mania IX is my darkest day as a wrestling fan. Literally, the sky was dark with ominous clouds as my friend and I left the building where we watched the show on closed circuit. Horrible ending Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judy Bagwell Posted December 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 its the day I stopped watching right up until 98, I watched WM9 with a group of friends who were not wrestling fans and I was embarrassed for them and myself for sitting through it there were 3 average matches and the rest was the absolute drizzling shits, Savage was unbearable on commentary, ross was out of place, the theme was kids play and Hogan had was balls deep in Vinces ass That fucking mask on Brutus haunted me for years as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyonthewall2983 Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 I liked it. But bear in mind that I was 9, and I really only knew Hogan through watching old tapes which I enjoyed watching as much, if not more than the product at the time. It's also a big reason why I would prefer watching WCW eventually, because I got to see these guys every week. One reason he was MIA was because he went to New Japan in May for the match with Muta, and brought the belt with him. I can imagine that that didn't go down well with Vince because they had no deals with NJPW at the time and WCW did. Even at such a young age I had an inkling he'd end up in WCW when I saw that PWI cover with him and Sting on it. Hogan was probably skeptical about "passing the torch" again, which is reasonable enough if you consider what happened the last time they tried that. It's got to be a major source of the bitterness Bret has about him now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ButchReedMark Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 I was 7, hence I thought it was the dogs bollocks and was jumping around the front room pumping my fists in celebration. I never took to that Bret Hart. I was Hogan all the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 Something interesting about this last time Dave talked about it on WOR. Vince told pretty much everyone at the time that Bret couldn't be Hogan, but Bret could be very big if they were patient and stuck with him. Original plans were for him to beat the Ultimate Warrior at the Royal Rumble and then Hogan at Summerslam. Vince felt like those two wins would make him. The resentment over the WMIX finish was by design and was the intended reaction, as Vince was banking on that resentment to be the selling point for Hogan-Bret. Unfortunately, Warrior was fired long before the Rumble and Hogan wouldn't put over Bret at Summerslam because he made his stardom in a time where he would never put over a smaller guy, so he didn't understand the reasoning. There was resentment from a lot of wrestlers at the time toward Bret because a lot of them didn't understand wrestling was changing. So you had a lot of guys who felt like they had better bodies than Bret and didn't understand why he was pushed higher on the card. Dave used to hear the same complaint from guys about Shawn during this time. Even Curt Hennig was putting over Bret because he thought he was done in '91, but in his mind, he wasn't doing it to pass the torch or anything like that. He resented the push Bret got above him in 1993, because he felt like he was the bigger star. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCS1988 Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 I think the original plans were for Bret to beat Warrior at Rumble, Flair at Mania IX Flair would win the Rumble that year, there was a poster I saw awhile back that had Bret & Flair on the Mania IX poster, then Hogan at Summerslam 93. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judy Bagwell Posted December 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 Bret had no chance of going over Warrior then Hogan can you imagine the political minefield Bret would have had to cross for that to happen? hell Hogan would never have let Bret get a win over Warrior before him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebottom Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 I would love to see the photographs that Bret swears were taken, and explains in enough clarity for me to believe is true, of the two doing a tug of war over the belts in the Spring of 1993 to be used to market a Summerslam match. But if the two had met in 1993, I can't picture a scenario where Bret isn't worse off for it. My gut tells me Hogan would have worked circles around Bret, the two would have been playing different games in the ring, and Hogans game would result in the crowd on his side which would have been terrible for Bret's chances of being used in a top spot again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 It's evidence for why a strong worker is always needed near the top (not that Hogan was terrible, but I mean a great working heel). A worker can convincingly put over another worker. A worker can convincingly put over a gimmick. A gimmick can even convincingly put over a gimmick. But a gimmick putting over a worker is a tough one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebottom Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Yup, this is why I bawk at people who diminish DiBiase in the WWF for his run, esp 89 -91. He had both down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrainfollower Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Ticked me off a bit at the time but the LONG Yokozuna reign ticked me off more. Mainly because my best friend just hated Yoko so much and thought he was such a lousy character, he stopped watching wrestling. We always make the joke that when Yoko pressed Randy Savage out of the Royal Rumble he pressed him out of wrestling, at least for a few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
victory Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 I hated when Hulk won at WM9. Especially the way it was done. I was almost 20 years old at the time and I was enjoying Bret as champion despite being a huge Hulk fan 10 years prior. Hulk was just stale by this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenjo Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 Yes it was a horrible idea that I hated at the time and now. But if it were just a one off then it wouldn't be so bad. Far worse is that it probably inspired one of my least favourite concepts in modern wrestling history, the MITB briefcase. There was one thing I liked about WM IX. It was all downhill once Heenan had dismounted from the camel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Following Contest Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 Hell, I'll admit it: I was newly turned 13 and I loved this like a tubby kid loves fudge. I was sold on the idea (as was Vince I might add) that a second golden age was about to begin and the flirtation with "nobodies" like Bret and Yoko was over. Today, looking back as an overweight, fudge-loving, 35 year old, I see how completely counter productive it was... unless Hogan was willing to put over Bret or Yoko clean. Since he was clearly willing to do neither, and he was all pissy when he went to Japan and put-down his own title at the presser, the whole thing looks like an odd and uncharacteristic short-sighted move by Vince and Pat. Maybe pending federal prison time for the Vin-Man was beginning to get to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeCampbell Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 Why was he MIA on TV between WM9 and King of the ring? Hogan went to Japan and worked the 5/3 Dontaku show. He gave a rather infamous interview trashing (proverbially, not literally like Madusa) the WWF Title, and calling it a toy and trinket. It's not on Youtube, but I know I've seen it somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eegah Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 https://youtu.be/aju__tSkvGE Is this the interview discussed? I hadnt seen it before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyonthewall2983 Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 No, it was a press conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Russian Daydream Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 Ive always been one that looked for logical explanations in my wrestling, and in this instance, the ten-year-old me couldn't find any. The match hadn't been scheduled or sanctioned, how can a title change hands like that? It made no sense at all, to the extent the belt would need to be declared vacant and determined later. About a week after Wrestlemania, I was to be giving a 'public speaking' talk to my primary school class about wrestling. When it came to explaining that there were two main companies each with their own champion, I had a bit of an argument across the room with another boy who adamant that Hogan was WWF champ while I maintained that the title holder was unknown and the belt surely was held up. To this day this title switch irritates me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 If Yokozuna agreed to the impromptu title match and there was an official sanctioned referee that recognized the accepted challenge then the title switch is legit. Stupid yes but logical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happ Hazzard Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 I hated it probably more than anything in wrestling before or since. Just saw it as WWF throwing away all the progress they'd made in moving past Hogan/Warrior muscleman garbage and onto great workers and having great matches at the top of the card. I was a massive Bret fan, he's still my favourite wrestler of all time. My biggest mark out moment ever was him being introduced as the new champion on TV in 1992. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 Even if it was designed to anger fans into wanting to see Bret take the belt back, I always wondered what Vince thought making Hogan champ in 1993. Considering both Vince's legal issues and Hogan seeing the writing on the wall he wasn't long for the company I don't see how either side thought this would work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 I think Vince legitimately thought there was a little juice left in having Hogan win the belt, even in 1993. He learned quickly though that even that wasn't worth the trouble with Hogan being an asshole afterwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted December 24, 2015 Report Share Posted December 24, 2015 In 1993, U.S. business was in the toilet and Hogan knew that the money was in Japan, which was why he cut that promo. According to another WOR story, he did it not realizing anyone outside of Japan would ever see it or discuss it, but he was just trying to put over their title to let them know he would love to stick around if the money was right. The problem was that it got reported in the WON and the WWF was furious. When Hogan was confronted about it, he denied he ever said it, not realizing that the WWF office had already called Dave Meltzer and asked for a copy of the tape. Most of us were younger at the time and even formed fond memories of the 1992-1996 period, but wrestling was really in terrible shape at that point. We should have a thread about just how dire things were some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted December 24, 2015 Report Share Posted December 24, 2015 It's funny to see folks who are probably 10-15 years younger than us running around saying today's WWE is the lowest point in history. Some of the 1 hour Raws in the early days were more of a slog than the three hour ones today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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