Wrestlemania 35: The KawadaSmile tribute thread

[SomethingSavage]

I didn't attempt to watch the show in one sitting and feel sorry for anyone who would.

I watched it fresh and in isolation. And yeah. It was fun.

I can accept that some people will just always be all LOLTNA and never give anything they ever do a chance, but the whole "he SUPPOSEDLY did something in TNA" talking point seems silly, man. Either watch the stuff or don't. If you're shitting on it without even giving it a fair shot, then what's the point? Really?

Assuming that someone is shit, simply based on WWE's ineptitude and inability to book them is extremely short-sighted. It's at least a little ignorant of anyone to base their opinions on such shitty booking.

 

[sek69]

Yeah, guys like Lashley and EC3 were actually better in TNA/Impact regardless if people who never saw them there want to accept it or not. Them failing in WWE is more on the company than the person. 

[C.S.]

I'm assuming Lashley was shit because he absolutely was in his first WWE stint, absolutely is in his current WWE stint, and EVERY TNA darling (with the exception of AJ and Drew) has been the drizzling fucking shits since moving up to WWE. Roode (does nothing for me after his entrance and isn't the star of his own team IMO), Eric Young (to be fair, miscast in his current role), Lashley, EC3 (although I can accept that his gimmick was probably much better utilized in TNA), Aries (a geek), James Storm (in his lone and very sad NXT appearance where he looked like a fish out of water bush league nobody pretending to fit in but instead stuck out like a sore thumb), and probably others I'm forgetting. Joe has been hit or miss for me in WWE, but he was hit or miss for me in TNA too, so I'll leave him out of this. 

Yes, the booking has been absolute shit too, but AJ and Drew have risen above it just fine. Yes, AJ has been booked well compared to most, but he did nothing but lose for his first few months in the company, had a million face-heel turns, and still overcome all of that. Drew is being booked to lose constantly and look like an inconsequential henchman type, but I think he'll ultimately be fine too. 

Lashley isn't even as good or as interesting as his own manager.

[SomethingSavage]

3 hours ago, C.S. said:

I'm assuming Lashley was shit because he absolutely was in his first WWE stint, absolutely is in his current WWE stint, and EVERY TNA darling (with the exception of AJ and Drew) has been the drizzling fucking shits

Lol.

Nothing eats your entire argument alive quite like you yourself speaking in absolutes and then IMMEDIATELY backpedaling on it.

Also, it's pretty generous of you to say AJ has been anything extraordinary or even consistent.

The Owens series was terrible. The Brock match was decent. The Jinder matches were better than expected. The Bryan stuff was underwhelming. Most of the Nak stuff was very basic. The Orton stuff has been passable at best.

I'm not denying that Styles is still among the best in the world or anything. But pretending like he's consistently risen above the mediocre booking in WWE-land is a big stretch and bordering on an imaginary universe.

I don't really think his WWE run has been all that more impressive or consistent than his TNA run at all. The former may be more widely publicized and recognized, but there's no need to pretend it's been something it hasn't.

[C.S.]

5 hours ago, SomethingSavage said:

I'm not denying that Styles is still among the best in the world or anything. But pretending like he's consistently risen above the mediocre booking in WWE-land is a big stretch and bordering on an imaginary universe.

I don't really think his WWE run has been all that more impressive or consistent than his TNA run at all. The former may be more widely publicized and recognized, but there's no need to pretend it's been something it hasn't.

Except, I never said anything about AJ's TNA stint at all, so why are you putting words in my mouth?

I actually agree with you about AJ, but my point was that he overcame the same shitty start-stop, flip-flop, face-heel booking, so that alone can't and shouldn't be an excuse.

Anyway, I really shouldn't post late at night when I'm exhausted. My rant was way too over-the-top. I still stand by the basics of what I said, but I could have dialed down the volume a bit. Sorry, guys...  (There's no blush emoji, so let's pretend that's it.)

 

[SomethingSavage]

All's good, man.

You'll just come around to the idea that Lashley, Drew, etc. looked like surefire bankable main eventers in TNA. Or you could, ya know, just be wrong. 

[C.S.]

8 hours ago, SomethingSavage said:

All's good, man.

You'll just come around to the idea that Lashley, Drew, etc. looked like surefire bankable main eventers in TNA. Or you could, ya know, just be wrong. 

I'm sure they did, but so did Austin Aries, and I think he's a major geek.

Looking like a main eventer in TNA and looking like a main eventer in WWE - for all of WWE's many faults - are still completely different.

Generally, for every rare wrong turn - like a Jack Swagger or Great Khali - WWE mostly gets it right with who it pushes to the World Title picture.

In before someone says "but Seth..." Okay, but people outside of this forum actually go nuts for the guy. 

[SomethingSavage]

On 4/12/2019 at 10:23 PM, C.S. said:

I'm sure they did, but so did Austin Aries, and I think he's a major geek.

Looking like a main eventer in TNA and looking like a main eventer in WWE - for all of WWE's many faults - are still completely different.

Generally, for every rare wrong turn - like a Jack Swagger or Great Khali - WWE mostly gets it right with who it pushes to the World Title picture.

In before someone says "but Seth..." Okay, but people outside of this forum actually go nuts for the guy. 

To clarify, I meant they looked like surefire bankable main eventers FOR WWE WHILE IN TNA.

That's a hell of a feat, especially when you're talking 2014-2016 TNA.

I know you hate the company and want no part in giving individuals there a chance, so I'll gladly inform you. Lashley and Drew improved their in-ring skills by leaps and bounds during their time away. Drew always had rich potential, and Lashley was basically just figuring out how to put all the fundamentals together.

Both did.

For awhile there in TNA, both guys were really flexing what they COULD do. WWE, whom you claim "get it right", royally fucked up the timing there.

Because both Lashley and Drew have gone on to become very good all-around in-ring performers - but WWE made the mistake of pushing them both before they were ready. Drew had the Chosen One shtick well before he was fully matured, and it's no secret Lashley was still greener than goose shit when he got his first big opportunity.

Yeah. I know you disagree and say you don't see it with them in their current WWE matches. But that's a twofold issue. 1) You may need to recalibrate what you view as good performances. And 2) I'm LITERALLY telling you where there are instances of their awesome matches to be found. If you're too stubborn to watch, then that's on you. It just means you're being willfully oblivious; it doesn't mean they're not actually any good.

Because they were. And they are. If you're judging them based on 'em not having any snowflake-sprinkled matches since returning to WWE, then I'd say you're confusing WWE's shitty booking and piss-poor presentation of them with their actual skill levels. And that's something a critic with any kind of analytical eye should be able to recognize and point out.

Bottom line - both guys looked like readymade, bonafide, big money opponents for Brock. WHILE IN TNA.

All WWE had to do - literally - was sign them and put them in a program against the guy. That's it. They were ready in terms of skill. They simply needed the spot and the backing of the promotional machine.

You said it yourself. They gave that match, that program, and that win to Seth fucking Rollins of all people. There aren't many wrestlers out there at a sub-Seth level in terms of actually understanding what makes a wrestling match good. But he got the match and the win over Brock, because they booked it that way. Are you telling me people wouldn't have bought a returning Lashley or Drew in that spot?

Of course they would. But WWE bogged them down in the rancid swamplands of their awful, atrocious booking for over a year now - and so they're both so badly damaged that they would literally need to go away and come back again in order to regain any kind of momentum.

WWE booking is so bad - so detrimental to talent - that they would literally benefit from another TNA run at this stage. That's not even hyperbole in the slightest.

WWE doesn't always get it right. Hell, they so RARELY get it right that you can count on both hands the times it's gone right for them. The whole issue is that they SAY they want people reaching for brass rings and shit, but they REALLY only want you to reach for brass rings if they've already decided you can reach it. It's ridiculous.

If either Drew or Lashley would be given the push they each got a decade too early, then they'd be killing it in main events right now. Give me Drew/Bryan or Lashley/Brock over whateverthefuck they have planned with Davey Richards 2.0 everyday of the week, plz&thnx.

[C.S.]

I actually don't hate TNA. It's just that I've given them various chances over the years, always to end up disappointed or frustrated.

Drew was always good, I agree.

Lashley never was, no matter how he well he was carried in TNA or how poorly he's being booked now in WWE - never mind his first disastrous stint with WECW and Donald Trump. Besides, rumor has it that he's leaving again for MMA this summer. I genuinely, sincerely wish him all the best in that endeavor and hope he becomes the greatest ultimate fighter who ever lived. I hope Brock also decides to do the same, and they both become the GOATs of MMA now and forevermore. If Bray Wyatt decided to join them, I'd be delighted at that too.

Even though you think I hate TNA, it's actually my insomnia channel on PlutoTV. 

https://pluto.tv/tv/impact-wrestling-channel

I watch it, like it sometimes, dislike it sometimes, and none of it ever makes enough of an impression for me to become a regular viewer again.

So, no, I don't hate TNA. I'm just indifferent to it at this point. 

 

[FMKK]

https://youtu.be/PqDv0PnNhU4

Dunno if this has been posted yet but it's an amazing video. Xavier getting emotional after Kofi gets the belt and Ric watching on as Charlotte enters the ring are standout moments. As is Becky being Becky at the end.

But the most significant bit was probably the conversation between Cena and Miz early on where John pretty much confirms that he's done.

[Alucard]

Agreed 100% on the topic of Drew & Lashley in Impact. Loved their feud in 2016 and both were booked perfectly there. That whole year is one of Impact's best periods and it felt like everybody was being groomed for WWE runs/returns (Drew, Lashley, Hardyz, EC3, Mike Bennett, etc.) but not one of them have been presented as well as they were there.

Lashley still talks about wanting the Brock match, but feels like the time has passed unfortunately, felt like a money match at one point for sure.