Chris, Nancy, & Daniel Benoit found dead

[Marty]

I never saw Jericho's first interview, but I did see him on Larry King tonight, and while he did give praise to Benoit's work ethic, previous reputation, family love, you name it (which was simply answering Larry King's questions, to be fair) he did say, at the end of the program, that none of what he mentioned earlier excuses Chris Benoit for his actions.

 

Maybe he said something different in the other interview, but I wouldn't say Jericho is "choosing" to remember Benoit only for his whole life excluding the last two days or so.

[Tim Evans]

I don't think there's anyone that is praising what Benoit did. I can kinda see where some people might want to remember his wrestling career and not ignore it like the WWE is but at the end of the day, He still killed his kid and that's way scummier than anything Vince has ever done.

 

Before this turns into the DVDVR benoit thread, Anyone see Lanny Poffo on Fox News tonight? Man that was bad.

[Jingus]

But yeah, guys like Regal and Jericho who have said that are obviously just as scummy as everyone else in wrestling.

Where did Regal say that? On the tribute Raw, he said (in a cryptic manner) that he refused to comment on Benoit the person, very briefly praised his work ethic, and then walked off. Of all the people on the show, you could most easily tell that he at least suspected that something was up.

[Guest teke184]

But yeah, guys like Regal and Jericho who have said that are obviously just as scummy as everyone else in wrestling.

Where did Regal say that? On the tribute Raw, he said (in a cryptic manner) that he refused to comment on Benoit the person, very briefly praised his work ethic, and then walked off. Of all the people on the show, you could most easily tell that he at least suspected that something was up.

 

Agreed.

 

He had a distinct "I don't want to be here" look on his face and you could tell it through the cadence of his speaking.

 

 

 

I noticed it at the time, but I wasn't sure of how close they were until I heard that "SR" was one of the people getting messages in addition to Chavo.

[Tim Evans]

But yeah, guys like Regal and Jericho who have said that are obviously just as scummy as everyone else in wrestling.

Where did Regal say that? On the tribute Raw, he said (in a cryptic manner) that he refused to comment on Benoit the person, very briefly praised his work ethic, and then walked off. Of all the people on the show, you could most easily tell that he at least suspected that something was up.

 

From an interview that was from Britan, Regal said that he wants to forget what happened the last 2 days of Benoit's life and remember his wrestling career.

[ohtani's jacket]

You have to give people like Jericho a break here. If a friend of mine did something like this, I'm sure I'd have a hard time coming to terms with it as well.

[sek69]

You also have to suspect this "no one saw this coming" stuff is all bullshit, especially from people who knew him in WCW. Regal was one of the guys who lived in the same plan as Benoit and knew about the domestic problems they had, which was probably the main reason he looked the way he did on the tribute show.

[Guest teke184]

You also have to suspect this "no one saw this coming" stuff is all bullshit, especially from people who knew him in WCW. Regal was one of the guys who lived in the same plan as Benoit and knew about the domestic problems they had, which was probably the main reason he looked the way he did on the tribute show.

It depends to a degree.

 

 

Guys like Chavo, Regal, and Malenko that he was close with for a long time would have seen signs.

 

 

Chavo and the rest of the Guerrero clan considered Benoit almost an adopted Guerrero from the way he talked. He'd also been invited into Benoit's home, as recently as a week or two before the murders, so he might have an idea of what his home-life was like.

 

Regal was obviously close with him, going back to their WCW days, and Regal likely has a deep appreciation for Benoit's help in saving his career with the famous match they had at the Pillman Memorial show.

 

Malenko's known Benoit since the two of them and Eddie were doing tours in Japan. The only way he'd miss a lot of the behavior differences would be if he was on a completely different travel crew from Benoit. (Which is a distinct possibility, as I'm pretty sure that Dean's agent duties have always been Smackdown because he's pretty much in charge of the cruisers.)

 

 

 

Other people in the locker room may or may not have seen it, if his reputation as someone who was all-business in the locker room and very closed about his personal life is true.

 

People certainly should have noticed that he was going overboard in the "locker-room kangaroo court" setting. When you're suddenly up there with Undertaker and Bradshaw when it comes to putting the rookies in their place, that's a Hell of a change in a short period of time.

[sek69]

A lot of people weren't surprised to hear he killed Nancy, the only shocking thing for them was Daniel. I would wager that Regal, Chavo, and probably Malenko knew what happened as soon as they were told the bodies were found.

 

This Larry King show is just aggravating me. No one mentions how people in WWE knew it was a murder-suicide well before the tribute aired. No one mentions how the company is run by a jacked up 62 year old with a daughter who shares GH with her jacked up husband. Hey, HHH has a wife and child too. There but for the Grace of God and all that. No one mentions all the horrible no talent stiffs WWF/E has pushed down people's throats just because Vince liked their build and ignored the fact they couldn't work for shit. Jason Whitlock's column was the only one to say outloud that it's as if no one gives a shit because it's only wrestlers. If it was any other profession (sports or entertainment) that had half this many deaths, there would be massive investigations. Yeah, it's a scummy carny-ass business but that doesn't make it right that it's an open secret so many people know this shit goes on and do nothing because it's just the business.

 

Also, fuck Jericho for using himself for an example of guys not being pushed on build when he's about half the size he was when he was wrestling. That was a jump-out-of-the-chair-and-yell-fuck-you moment for me.

[goodhelmet]

Agreed about Jericho.

 

Also, I loved the way they closed the show...

 

"Larry what does the panel think about the WWE erasing Chris Benoit from thier history..." "Sorry gotta go. Time's up!"

[ohtani's jacket]

You also have to suspect this "no one saw this coming" stuff is all bullshit, especially from people who knew him in WCW. Regal was one of the guys who lived in the same plan as Benoit and knew about the domestic problems they had, which was probably the main reason he looked the way he did on the tribute show.

Knowing someone has domestic problems doesn't mean you saw it coming.

[sek69]

You also have to suspect this "no one saw this coming" stuff is all bullshit, especially from people who knew him in WCW. Regal was one of the guys who lived in the same plan as Benoit and knew about the domestic problems they had, which was probably the main reason he looked the way he did on the tribute show.

Knowing someone has domestic problems doesn't mean you saw it coming.

 

Those that knew about them sure didn't seem surprised to find out Nancy was killed. That can't be stressed enough. You can argue that you don't know what someone else was thinking but all this talk that this was completely out of character and how Benoit was the last guy you'd suspect would do something like this is bullshit because there are people working for WWE who knew about the dark side of the Benoit family.

[kjh]

Sek's right. This is an excerpt from Wade Keller's cover story on the Benoit double murder/suicide that backs up his opinion:

 

The news that Benoit was considered the one who killed his wife and son seemed unreal, yet one friend of his in the locker room wasn't shocked. He told colleagues earlier in the evening, before specifics came out, that something like this was "bound to happen." In other words, he was privy to what few were - that Chris's marriage with Nancy was volatile - much more than almost anyone realized for much longer than anyone realized.

With regards to Chris Jericho, I'm not surprised he's having a hard time coming to terms with his feelings at the moment. I mean I'd probably feel pretty conflicted too if I was planning to return to work for the company that was complicit in the drug abuse of two of my best friends that helped lead to their early deaths.

[Loss]

Jericho lost a lot of the goodwill he had built up with me in his Baltimore Sun article. I don't know if any of you read it or not, but the basic tone was yeah yeah yeah benoit died BUT FOZZY SOLD OUT IN THE UK!! MY NEW BOOK - A LION'S TALE: AROUND THE WORLD IN SPANDEX - COMES OUT THIS FALL.

 

It's also REALLY seems like Jericho is doing this great job defending WWE in the hopes that he can return and not have to lay down for HHH again.

[Tim Evans]

I find it funny that people thought the Larry King stuff would be anything but pro WWE. Larry King lost respect when he kissed Brando and had on Paris Hilton. Money talks.

[Bix]

"I think Heidi Fleiss is AIDS-infected." -Superstar Billy Graham on MSNBC

[CodySave]

"I think Heidi Fleiss is AIDS-infected." -Superstar Billy Graham on MSNBC

Yeah, Billy had some real gems tonight. In fact, I can't think of a single time he made his point without going off-tangent first. At one point, he set up to make a serious point and tveered off to praise Bruno Sammartino as the "Real Living Legend" for literally about 20 seconds.

[ohtani's jacket]

Whenever this type of thing occurs, there's people who reckon they could see it coming. But that's after the fact. If you're going to take their word for it then you might as well give Jericho the benefit of the doubt.

 

We'll never know why Benoit did this. I can understand people wanting to read the Observer or news reports to get some inkling, but it's speculation and in many cases hearsay.

 

It's one thing to say "it was bound to happen" after hearing the news, but an entirely different thing to suspect he's going to kill his family before he actually does it. Looking back, maybe there were signs, maybe you could cite something as a trigger point, but I find it hard to believe that anyone believed he was going to kill his family.

 

There's a tendency to act as though Benoit was never a good person, never a good father or husband and never did anything decent in his life. Perhaps that's understandable, but people like Jericho have to reconcile the Benoit they (thought) knew with the Benoit that did this. That's not easy.

 

Maybe Jericho knows more than he's letting on. Maybe looking back there were things that didn't seem right. But Benoit's father said something similar. Are you gonna call bullshit on that?

 

Anyway, this whole thing is a mess. It's fucked up. It's easy to maintain a running internet commentary, but dealing with this shit must be tough.

[ohtani's jacket]

Jericho lost a lot of the goodwill he had built up with me in his Baltimore Sun article. I don't know if any of you read it or not, but the basic tone was yeah yeah yeah benoit died BUT FOZZY SOLD OUT IN THE UK!! MY NEW BOOK - A LION'S TALE: AROUND THE WORLD IN SPANDEX - COMES OUT THIS FALL.

 

It's also REALLY seems like Jericho is doing this great job defending WWE in the hopes that he can return and not have to lay down for HHH again.

You're being way too cynical. The guy was answering a Q&A. He was asked questions about his book and Fozzy.

[sek69]

Whenever this type of thing occurs, there's people who reckon they could see it coming. But that's after the fact. If you're going to take their word for it then you might as well give Jericho the benefit of the doubt.

 

We'll never know why Benoit did this. I can understand people wanting to read the Observer or news reports to get some inkling, but it's speculation and in many cases hearsay.

 

It's one thing to say "it was bound to happen" after hearing the news, but an entirely different thing to suspect he's going to kill his family before he actually does it. Looking back, maybe there were signs, maybe you could cite something as a trigger point, but I find it hard to believe that anyone believed he was going to kill his family.

Again, a lot of people were only surprised about Daniel, not Nancy. The idea of him killing his wife was not an out of the blue concept for at least some of the people who knew him.

 

 

Maybe Jericho knows more than he's letting on. Maybe looking back there were things that didn't seem right. But Benoit's father said something similar. Are you gonna call bullshit on that?

Sometimes the people closest (parents, spouses, etc) are the ones deepest in denial. I have no doubts Chris's parents would be taken completely by surprise. I also have no doubts that they also didn't know a lot about Chris and Nancy's marriage either. I mean, my marriage is perfectly fine and I don't tell my mom very many details about it. If I was having problems I don't think I'd tell my folks and have them worry.

 

Anyway, this whole thing is a mess. It's fucked up. It's easy to maintain a running internet commentary, but dealing with this shit must be tough.

Now commenting on it online is certainly easier than having this happen in our own families, but I don't think anyone here ever wanted to be having this discussion.

 

Dave said it best in his WO update:

 

It's not a game of blame Vince vs. absolve Vince of all blame, which is as simplistic and lazy a way to look at this as the people who just say Benoit did it because of steroids and don't look elsewhere. There is a real problem. It's a gigantic problem. Covering up for the problem or burying your head in the sand because you love wrestling will guarantee it won't get better. I love wrestling, but I've seen this stuff for 25 years and so much of the covering up on the guise or not hurting the business is a partial reason (far from the only reason) why the deaths keep happening at an alarming rate.

[ohtani's jacket]

The people who "saw it coming" are sources for Keller, Meltzer or some newspaper reporter. It's just hearsay and likely retroactive. Most of the guys on TV who are saying it was out of character hadn't seen Benoit in some time. They probably didn't know a lot of what was going on, but that doesn't mean that they're not being genuine.

[Bix]

http://www.justiceforbenoit.com/

 

No.

[Loss]

That site makes me angry.

 

What is the deal with people thinking that great wrestlers are great people? I don't think we'd see a Justice For Snitsky website.

[maxpower]

Wow. Talk about graping at straws. Who needs evidence when there's no REASON!

[kjh]

Hmm, I do wonder if that site is some elaborate piss take or an effort to con Benoit marks out of their money (see the "Donate" button), though the naivety and stupidity of some wrestling fans will never cease to amaze me, so who knows.