Ridiculous quotes from WO.com columnists

[Bix]

Oh, I know he was reviewing movies before that.

Sorry Bix, should have been clearer: I was responding to SLL.

Gotcha.

 

So the anthrax/lost package thing with Mailman was legit and he just felt he was in over his head since he spent the money after sending the orders out?

[KrisZ]

Yep he freaked out and left especially after random Irishmen would come into the DVDVR chat stalking him.

[S.L.L.]

Oh, I know he was reviewing movies before that.

Sorry Bix, should have been clearer: I was responding to SLL.

 

John

 

I knew that, too. Really should've been clearer, if only because it makes the story all the stranger, as it really just boils the decision down to "the best way for me to stop watching/reviewing/talking about wrestling is to fake my death".

[Bix]

That really is a better way to put it.

 

I'll ask the same thing I asked at DVDVR: It's not overly presumptuous to be sure that's why he did it, right? What else is there?

[Death From Above]

Even if there was another motivation how big would it have to be to justify faking your own death?

 

That would be a pretty bizarre reaction to most any situation that isn't... I dunno, the mafia putting a price on your head, or something in that class of incident. Otherwise there's not really a way I could see spinning that one.

[KrisZ]

IIRC he was on vacation at the time of the fake death right. Because he was from Italy but it happened somewhere else.

[ohtani's jacket]

Vanes sent his friends e-mails after he "died." There were probably clues in them had we been smart enough.

[Bix]

You mean he sent them other under names?

 

Magnificent 7 at DVDVR emailed Mike and posted his reply.

 

I don't know what to say about Vanes at the moment. It's really hard to put this

sort of thing into words. I can't say this surprises me, but only because Jerome had

pointed out some writings on some Asian TV site that were signed similarly, and both

of us thought it was most likely the same dude since he's not that famous that

someone would call themselves basically the same thing and be an intelligent person

w/ not so great English.

 

The whole reporting of his death always struck people as somewhat peculiar, so there

was some rumor from time to time, but I generally try to give people the benefit of

the doubt, especially when it comes to something like this. He had talked of various

health problems from the moment I became friends w/ him, and was always complaining

about post concussion headaches making it difficult for him to spend too much time

in front of the computer even before he was writing for Quebrada or RB or doing his

joshi puro website.

 

It's hard to imagine the sort of scumbag who would fake their own death, much less

when it's someone you are dealing with regularly, but now I wonder if he'd been

thinking about it even before he became involved, so to speak, with anyone. Like,

was it some grand plan to get people to care about him and then abandon them, or

something he had in the back of his mind if things didn't go the way he hoped? Or

was he really sick (ie the other problems were legit), and he just figured the

computer was adding to the problem so the easiest way to escape was to do something

that would ensure no one bothered him about wrestling, movies, or whatever anymore.

Really, all he had to do was say I'm not going to write for the moment, I may come

back to it later and I may not. Is that really that difficult? I mean, it's not like

it was going to effect his future in terms of the opportunities available to him or

whatever. Sure, he would have gotten a few emails trying to prod him back, just like

you try to prod me back into fantasy football or I try to prod you back into

reviews, but, you know, that's kind of a sign that you are actually wanted and

appreciated rather than something that's going to make you jump off a cliff.

 

In general, the problem I saw w/ Vanes is he wasn't really the type of person one could

disagree with too strongly. I mean, there are things we will never agree on, but we

can have fun with them, whereas with Vanes it always seemed a sort of life and death

struggle where everything rose to the importance of the battle between god and the

devil, so you had to be converted in every area in order to be "saved". I mean, it

was okay if you rated something as good that he thought was great, but if you didn't

like something he did, it was kinda like a tumor that needed to be excised from your

being.

[ohtani's jacket]

The first e-mails we got were from his business partner. Then I got a couple of e-mails from his girlfriend.

[Bix]

Right after the "death," later, or both?

[KrisZ]

Lorefice was so right on Vanes being one of these life or death winning argument guys. I remember when he used to have near coronarys in the chat room when someone dared say that Metallica wasn't the greatest band of all-time.

[jdw]

Good set of comments by Mike.

 

Including the "life or death winning argument" thing. I've been in that same category, with Mike one of many on the other side. I've spent the last several years trying to shed the trait. Don't always succeed... "work in progress"...

 

John

[ohtani's jacket]

Right after the "death," later, or both?

It was a long time ago and I don't have the e-mails anymore, but the way I remember it Vanes supposedly co-owned a gym with a guy named Frank (IIRC) and it was his business partner who logged into Vanes' e-mail account and told us that Vanes had been in an accident and was having emergency surgery. Then, however many hours later, he sent another e-mail saying that Vanes had died. A few days later, his girlfriend or fiance, Sarah I think her name was, sent me some e-mails bequeathing me some of Vanes' stuff.

[Sean Liska]

Meltzer addressed the issue with Orlando Jordan's boyfriend in this week's Observer. Sounds like Flair was justified, although I'm sure some here will be skeptical.

 

"(Boyfriend) was not used on the television show the past two weeks. This was based on an incident at the hotel bar after the tapings three weeks ago where he was doing something described as very lewd in front of the wife of a major executive who was offended. Ric Flair ended up getting him to stop and cut a promo on him over it, but it may not have saved his job."

[Bix]

Of course, he posted a more detailed version on the forum:

 

Flair yelled at him because there was the wife of a major executive at the bar who was very grossed out when she saw the kid making out with Jordan. Flair went up to both of them and told them to stop because it was not good for the company. Jordan respected Flair and stopped. The other guy stopped what he was doing, then did something apparently almost as embarassing.

 

Guys were about to kick his ass. Flair cut the promo. The kid cried.

 

Homosexual bashing had nothing to do with it. There was fear TNA would suffer repercussions because of it.

 

Everyone I spoke with felt Flair handled the situation perfectly and may have saved the kids job, although he was not used at all at the last taping and one person involved in that process said the mood was not to use him going forward. There are those who still want to for the shock value of Jordan's act, but they really don't want him.

The original report at the Torch site said he was dancing. At any rate, the questions still stand: Would this woman have been "grossed out" or would "guys" (wrestlers? other bar patrons?) be ready to beat up up if it wasn't 2 men kissing? Exactly what was boyfriend guy doing that was so lewd while dancing?

[Sean Liska]

That's oddly worded. I would assume Dave is a progressive enough guy to not describe two guys kissing as, "very lewd". Sounds like there's more to it.

[kjh]

Exactly what was boyfriend guy doing that was so lewd while dancing?

A ton more questions for people to ponder: Was it anymore lewd than what TNA wanted to show or have shown on Impact? What would the wife of this TV executive think if she actually watched the show? Remember the Goldust angle. Didn't Dustin Runnels get tons of heat in the locker room for the lengths he was willing to go to get over in his gay gimmick? Didn't Scott Hall get upset over working a long program with him? Haven't people within the locker room tried to sabotage the angle from the get go? Does the fact that the angle had heat like the Goldust angle had, mean that the participants had heat too like Dustin Runnels did? Whatever the answers to these questions the conclusion is obvious - gay pro wrestlers are accepted.

 

The story is a complete mess and has already mutated from the one given on the board to the one given in the newsletter. So did the story about the first aborted bisexual angle:

 

I don't know if he kissed the guy (there are people who said he did and thought Spike would edit it, and someone in the company who said it was weird but didn't think there was an actual kiss) or not. But there were families in the crowd who walked out of the taping at that point.

On the deal tonight with Orlando Jordan coming to the ring against Samoa Joe. He and the guy he comes to the ring with don’t kiss, but the guy puts his hand all over Jordan’s body and goes very slowly around his crotch. Not sure how much makes air. They are doing a bisexual gimmick with Jordan. Correspondent B. Klein said he wasn’t sure families were leaving over it because the next day at the tapings people were leaving as well.

[MJH]

I would assume "very lewd" is a quote given to Dave rather than anything on his end, I mean he lives in San Francisco, right?

 

And to play Devil's Advocate, I'm not sure an executive's wife would be enamoured with a girl giving a wrestler a hand job in the middle of a club, either, if we say it was that.

 

And if it was just kissing, I still don't think it would've been the smartest thing to take them up on being homophobic. Someone with more pull could perhaps do it in a diplomatic fashion, but Jordan's at a "shut up and do what you're told or get fired" level, unfortunately for him.

[jdw]

Was it a club? Or a bar? A bar with dancing? Or a dive bar where a couple of people dancing and necking catches everyone's attention?

 

Why in the fuck would an executive be taking his prim and proper wife to a bar to hang out with wrestlers, given all we know about how they drink, talk and act? It doesn't sound like this was at the country club bar.

 

John

[kjh]

I would assume Dave is a progressive enough guy to not describe two guys kissing as, "very lewd".

Not everyone in the locker room is a progressive enough guy to not describe two guys kissing as "very lewd". Anyway, they were making out not kissing. Big distinction there. Another question comes to mind - doesn't Eric Bischoff love worked shoots? Go on kiss in front of the boys, like Chris and Nancy did!

[Sean Liska]

Was it a club? Or a bar? A bar with dancing? Or a dive bar where a couple of people dancing and necking catches everyone's attention?

 

Why in the fuck would an executive be taking his prim and proper wife to a bar to hang out with wrestlers, given all we know about how they drink, talk and act? It doesn't sound like this was at the country club bar.

 

John

It was at the hotel bar.

[Loss]

Was it a club? Or a bar? A bar with dancing? Or a dive bar where a couple of people dancing and necking catches everyone's attention?

 

Why in the fuck would an executive be taking his prim and proper wife to a bar to hang out with wrestlers, given all we know about how they drink, talk and act? It doesn't sound like this was at the country club bar.

 

John

That's exactly what I was thinking.

 

Bix makes a good point also. Even if whatever they were doing was inappropriate, I doubt it was so over the top that he can't even discuss it on his message board. "Flair was just cutting a promo on him to try to save his job" is a hilarious talking point.

 

I really try to avoid talking about gay issues on message boards anymore. I used to bring it up, and it never turned out well, so I dropped the subject. That said, with the Kanyon suicide and this, it's sort of relevant at the moment, so that's the only reason I'm saying the next part of this post.

 

But here's how it breaks down. If all kissing and public displays of affection offend you, that's fine and you're entitled to your opinion. If only same-sex public displays of affection offend you, then that's also fine and you're still entitled to your opinion, but you are also a bigot.

 

Dave also mentioning families walking out of the taping is something he was sort of cryptic about. Was he just reporting as fact, or was he saying that based on that, they should drop the angle? Because Dave has spoken out against portraying black wrestlers as heels because of the perception the audience is racist in the past, so this would be no different, would it not?

[KrisZ]

Nasty Boys also got fired because Knobbs did something in front of an executive's family. If anyone should be pissed it's Jerry Sags.

[Loss]

Who are all these nameless TNA executives and wives anyway? This from a company that has had little people masturbate in trash cans on television.

[jdw]

It was at the hotel bar.

One can see an executive bringing his wife to the hotel bar. Not bright given wrestlers are likely tossing out f-bombs and vulgar cracks. But a bit more understandable for an idiot executive to do.

 

John