goc

I don't think his argument is really all that bad. I don't remember him ever saying "Flair should have never been World champion" but he has said he thinks they should have put the belt on a babyface once they started really trying to compete with WWF. I think it's a fair point to make that JCP's champ looked inferior to WWF's because Hogan always went over and Flair always had some kind of shenanigans going on for him to keep the belt. That said, I find Gary to be really annoying. I appreciate the free interviews but his constant crowing about how he is the "best interviewer" and constantly interrupting guys so he can talk about his same old ass tired talking points of "do you think anyone can compete with Vince today" or "do you think anyone could have beaten Vince in the 80s?"

Flair and Onita blowing each other up and flopping around for 12 minutes might be the only freakshow that has enough going for it to get me back to watch wrestling one last time. I'd love to see the economics of this new company here though. If there's cash being thrown around the ticket prices might be high enough to kill their own novelty value. And if the money isn't there the whole thing doesn't make sense. They're selling Q&A session tickets for $750 (AUD, which includes a diamond seat). Cheapest tickets are $62. By comparison, the cheapest WWE tickets are around $30-$40 and their front row (which I assume is what Hulk's diamond seats are) are around $350. The Q&A tickets would be about $650 USD. Which is still fucking outrageous and I think they're going to have a very hard time selling tickets.

Normally I think people overreact about JR's "grouchiness", but jeez he comes off like a prick here. I did read people on message boards wonder why Dibiase's ear looked all wacky, so instead of just explaining why that is, he has to scold everyone for hypothesizing. What an arrogant ass. He did explain it, and then he ridiculed people for making up false "news" about it. Which he'd obviously have a problem with after all the BS reports about how he was going to join TNA.

That's certainly true today, but if Strikeforce somehow stole all of UFC's biggest stars, I'm sure CBS would offer them prime-time shows, which would give them greater television exposure than even UFC has got at the moment. It would be a complete game changer. I think the CBS think is a possibility but I wouldn't be SURE about it. I'd think they probably still have a sore taste in their mouth about MMA after the Elite XC thing.

It's true to a certain extent. Strikeforce is really not known, and doesn't have the hype machine behind it to where they could even get the word out that they had signed a bunch of big names and when their PPV would be. But at the same time, UFC losing the top fighters in every weight class would pretty much kill them off too. Ignoring that these guys are all champions, if Strikeforce managed to take away Brock, GSP and BJ Penn it would definitely boost their numbers and hurt the UFC's. But I don't think they would come anywhere close to some of the UFC's best PPV numbers at least in the beginning.

I really haven't seen any Bock outside of the hour long Henning match, his JYD match on the Mid-South set and his series with Lawler on the Memphis set. All of which I thought were great with the exception of the JYD match. I actually thought he had the best chemistry with Lawler out of everyone else on the Memphis set, outside of Dundee of course. Oh yea I forgot he also wrestled a young Jeff Jarrett on the set which was a very good young babyface vs. veteran champion match. So yea I think Bock probably doesn't get all the recognition he deserves. I know there is that idea that he shouldn't have been getting pushed as champ in the mid-80s which may have been true if the fans in the area had gotten burned out on him, but as far as his matches go he was still definitely worth of being the number 1 guy.

I think it's a somewhat interesting story in a stupid gossipy drama that's really no one's business kind of way. But as far as it's iMPACT! on TNA I don't think it's really going to matter whether Angle or Jarrett wind up in charge. TNA is just doomed to suck, always and forever.

Fans need to stop bitching when they don't get their way with the wrestlers. Seriously some of these guys act as though they could be the greatest wrestling booker of all time, if only that stupid Vince McMahon would listen to them.

I don't watch TNA because I'm not into self torture, but I did look up a picture of him from the most recent Impact after hearing about how bad he looks right now, and yea he looks like shit. How much time would it take him to shave? I can't believe someone in TNA hasn't told him to at least do that much. It also looks like one of his arms has atrophied but I don't think that is anything new.

Mike Adamle coming in with absolutely no wrestling experience and getting paid $300,000 a year because they thought he would be their next number 1 announcer was a pretty big financial fuck up.

I think the thing about a super over babyface doing jobs is that it HELPS them stay over. When a guy doesn't win every single match, it seems like that would the fans stay interested in every match he has because there is actually some question of the outcome. I'm not saying they should do a TON of jobs, but winning every single match starts to get old for most of the people outside of the kid fanbase.

I wasn't trying to say this, I was simply saying considering how many stories there are about fans being out of control and trying to kill heels in the Mid-South territory, I would assume that the percentage of people who believed it was real would be higher than in Charlotte. I mean, I've never really heard Ric Flair or one of the other Horsemen tell a story about fans trying to kill them, or anyone else talk about something like that while they were in JCP.

Well, this poll was also just a regional Charlotte poll. You have to take the location into account, because there were other places where the percentage of people who thought it was real was likely higher. Maybe not MUCH higher, but I'd say it probably would have been higher had it been done somewhere in Louisiana or somewhere else in the Mid-South territory where the fans seemed to be much rougher than in JCP territory.

True, but his allegations prompted several others to make similar claims. Surely they can't be dismissed as full of shit because Hodgson was. I think I have to agree somewhat with sek here. We all know the reason why the Brooklyn Brawler was employed by the WWF for so long, Sylvan Grenier too. So the chances are a few of the allegations about Patterson may have been true. The difference is Terry Garvin and Mel Phillips targeted the young ring boys, while Patterson went after the jobbers, all of whom were of age. Yeah I do believe that Pat was unfairly roped in with the pedophiles because he was gay, which is something I'd like to think even pro wrestling has evolved past at this point. Also when talking of Patterson stories, the one about how Virgil got hired was the first one that popped to mind. I also think that he's the guy Meltzer keeps talking about in these issues when he keeps mentioning a guy on the roster getting a (midcard) push beyond his abilities just because of his willingness to do favors. That thing about Virgil just smells like total bullshit to me. I mean, the guy hardly got a push at all outside of what like 2 months after he broke away from DiBiase? I mean considering how over the guy was, he got UNDERPUSHED in my view, even though I agree that he wasn't much in the ring.

TNA definitely did not learn the lesson of WCW. You have to give the fans that ARE watching what they want to see instead of putting out a product that you HOPE will gain a different audience. I mean, the only people that were buying TNA PPVs back during the weekly days were hardcore internet wrestling fans, and they never really booked to that audience. I don't really know who the 1 million or so people who watch their show on a weekly basis are now and what they want, so I can't really speak to current day TNA, but I doubt they have a much better handle on it now. I do know that Samoa Joe was probably their hottest most popular guy for a while and they totally screwed that up by trying to "make him a star" or whatever moronic ideas they had about him, so I really don't know what audience they are attempting to book for.

I came here to say the TKO, but now I have to correct you. The TKO and the F5 are different moves. The TKO had the same set up with a guy in the fireman's carry position, but it ended in a spin into a Cutter.

That belt thing doesn't even make sense. What the hell is the difference between carrying it on your shoulder and wearing it? I'll believe that one is true when I see it cuz a lot of the guys with belts today wear them, like Edge and the Colons.

I really don't think it's such a terrible discussion to talk about how countries perceive wrestling in their main stream media. Especially in the context of a myth busting topic, since I've seen a lot of people over the years that seem to have this idea that wrestling in Japan is some sacred respected sport, which it doesn't seem is true.

I just watched Buzz Sawyer & Bam Bam Bigelow vs. Antonio Inoki & Tatsumi Fujinami from sometime in February of 87 from New Japan. I was immediately excited for this because Bigelow comes in without his flame attire and is instead rocking the black gear from Memphis with the "I am a monster" t-shirt, and so I can see that he is going to be a complete bad ass in this. Bigelow and Buzz attack before the bell and the ref looks legitimately scared of Bigelow and starts calling Buddy Rose in to try and get him under control. Buddy seems to be more of a handler than a manager here, which I dig. Once things officially get started Fujinama and Bam Bam start in the ring, and Fujinama holds Inoki back from getting in there with Bigelow and instead calls for Buzz to get in there. I am happy to see guys act like they want nothing to do with the monster Bam Bam so I approve. Buzz comes in laughing and screaming like a mad man as only Buzz Sawyer can but Fujinama gets the best of him and ends up in control after Buzz misses a psycho splash. Fujinama pulls him into the corner and makes the tag to Inoki so Buzz gets away and tags Bigelow back in. And now we have Bigelow and Inoki in the ring but Bigelow comes in fired up and Fujinama tries to hold Inoki back. Bigelow is tired of Inoki avoiding him and does a cartwheel which sends the Japanese team to the apron, possibly to ponder how to get in the ring with Bam Bam and not die. Inoki finally gets in there and the crowd gets hot chanting for him. Bigelow and Rose are not pleased. Inoki runs the ropes teasing a shoulderblock but is hesitant and hangs back. Inoki backs into the corner and Fujinama tags himself in, leaving myself and Bigelow disappointed. Bigelow, tired of dealing with their fear, tags Buzz back in. The camera focuses in on Buzz's face as he looks totally unhinged in the face off with Fujinami. Rose on the outside asks "where is your champion now? why isn't he in the ring against Bigelow?" and I am left to ask the same thing. Buzz shoots Fujinama into the ropes and leapfrogs him, and is so proud of himself. Unfortunately he turns around into a Fujinama dropkick and goes SAILING out of the ring. God Buzz was never afraid to bump like a madman to the outside. Buzz is so frustrated he starts slamming his own head into the guardrail on the outside. Buzz comes back inside and Inoki has gotten the tag in. Buzz and Inoki do a test of strength and Buzz gets the better of it until Inoki starts to power back and decides he's had enough of the test of strength and starts kicking Buzz in the leg. Buzz decides it's time to get out and tags Bigelow in, and I'm hopeful that Bigelow and Inoki will finally face off. And they do! Inoki charges Bigelow and nails him but Bam Bam is having none of that and throws Inoki into the ropes and crushes him with a shoulderblock. Fujinama tags himself back in and Bigelow and myself are frustrated once again. Bigelow just wants Inoki so Buzz comes back in to try his luck with Fujinama again. Buzz kicks Fujinama in the gut and sends him into the ropes and Fujinama tries to come back with a cross body but Buzz catches him and hits a NICE powerslam. Buzz goes up to the top rope for a splash and Fujinama moves and Buzz lands awkwardly on his feet and falls down holding his ankle. Inoki gets tagged back in and hits an enzugiri on Buzz, who can barely sell it and falls down very gingerly. Inoki goes for a cover and Bam Bam comes in and tries to break it up but Inoki moves and Bam Bam elbowdrops Buzz instead. Fujinama comes in after Bigelow and Bam Bam tosses him outside and goes after Inoki press slamming him to the outside as the ref calls for the bell, I assume to disqualify Bigelow and Buzz. After the match Bigelow and Inoki face off in the ring but the ring fills up with people to hold back Inoki before they can go at it. Bigelow is pissed and starts tossing young boys around and calls for Inoki to fight him. Finally Fujinama and others get Inoki to leave the ring, and I am disappointed that I never got to see them go at it. It seems like this one came to an abrupt end as Sawyer seemed to legitimately injure himself coming off the top rope on that splash attempt. If Buzz hadn't gotten injured, it felt like this was building to an eventual confrontation between Bigelow and Inoki near the end of the match that would have been hot, but as it was this one left me a little disappointed. I will have to try and track down the eventual Bam Bam vs. Inoki singles match that I am sure happened soon after this, as they really built up Bigelow as a monster here and a very real threat to Inoki.

I'll try to contribute to this thread and start a new line of discussion. I've seen a lot of people on various message boards say that comedy has no place in wrestling. Would you guys agree or disagree with that statement? Personally, I think there is definitely a place for it, and it's called the undercard. When you start trying to inject comedy into the main event, it usually doesn't work and kind of hurts a guy's ability to be taken seriously, like Kurt Angle. But on the other hand, I think it did wonders for guys like Edge and Christian when they were just starting to develop their personalities outside of being fake vampires. And Santino would probably have gotten released by now if they hadn't decided to turn him into a comedic heel.

give it another year or so, and it will make itself history Haha people have been putting TNA on a death watch since 2002, I think at this point it is just the horrible little promotion that could...keep sucking...forever.

"Hall of Fame time. Austin rides around the ring and gets maybe the biggest pop of the night. Way to make those new stars WWE!" - I think this is a pretty unfair statment, I mean guys that get over like Austin come around VERY rarely, with only Hogan and The Rock even being in his league as far as massively over babyfaces in the last 20 years. Not to say that WWE has done a great job of making new stars, but to act like it would be easy for them to get anyone on the roster over to the level of Stone Cold is a little disingenuous.

I just watched Buzz Sawyer & Bam Bam Bigelow vs. Antonio Inoki & Tatsumi Fujinami from sometime in February of 87 from New Japan. I was immediately excited for this because Bigelow comes in without his flame attire and is instead rocking the black gear from Memphis with the "I am a monster" t-shirt, and so I can see that he is going to be a complete bad ass in this. Bigelow and Buzz attack before the bell and the ref looks legitimately scared of Bigelow and starts calling Buddy Rose in to try and get him under control. Buddy seems to be more of a handler than a manager here, which I dig. Once things officially get started Fujinama and Bam Bam start in the ring, and Fujinama holds Inoki back from getting in there with Bigelow and instead calls for Buzz to get in there. I am happy to see guys act like they want nothing to do with the monster Bam Bam so I approve. Buzz comes in laughing and screaming like a mad man as only Buzz Sawyer can but Fujinama gets the best of him and ends up in control after Buzz misses a psycho splash. Fujinama pulls him into the corner and makes the tag to Inoki so Buzz gets away and tags Bigelow back in. And now we have Bigelow and Inoki in the ring but Bigelow comes in fired up and Fujinama tries to hold Inoki back. Bigelow is tired of Inoki avoiding him and does a cartwheel which sends the Japanese team to the apron, possibly to ponder how to get in the ring with Bam Bam and not die. Inoki finally gets in there and the crowd gets hot chanting for him. Bigelow and Rose are not pleased. Inoki runs the ropes teasing a shoulderblock but is hesitant and hangs back. Inoki backs into the corner and Fujinama tags himself in, leaving myself and Bigelow disappointed. Bigelow, tired of dealing with their fear, tags Buzz back in. The camera focuses in on Buzz's face as he looks totally unhinged in the face off with Fujinami. Rose on the outside asks "where is your champion now? why isn't he in the ring against Bigelow?" and I am left to ask the same thing. Buzz shoots Fujinama into the ropes and leapfrogs him, and is so proud of himself. Unfortunately he turns around into a Fujinama dropkick and goes SAILING out of the ring. God Buzz was never afraid to bump like a madman to the outside. Buzz is so frustrated he starts slamming his own head into the guardrail on the outside. Buzz comes back inside and Inoki has gotten the tag in. Buzz and Inoki do a test of strength and Buzz gets the better of it until Inoki starts to power back and decides he's had enough of the test of strength and starts kicking Buzz in the leg. Buzz decides it's time to get out and tags Bigelow in, and I'm hopeful that Bigelow and Inoki will finally face off. And they do! Inoki charges Bigelow and nails him but Bam Bam is having none of that and throws Inoki into the ropes and crushes him with a shoulderblock. Fujinama tags himself back in and Bigelow and myself are frustrated once again. Bigelow just wants Inoki so Buzz comes back in to try his luck with Fujinama again. Buzz kicks Fujinama in the gut and sends him into the ropes and Fujinama tries to come back with a cross body but Buzz catches him and hits a NICE powerslam. Buzz goes up to the top rope for a splash and Fujinama moves and Buzz lands awkwardly on his feet and falls down holding his ankle. Inoki gets tagged back in and hits an enzugiri on Buzz, who can barely sell it and falls down very gingerly. Inoki goes for a cover and Bam Bam comes in and tries to break it up but Inoki moves and Bam Bam elbowdrops Buzz instead. Fujinama comes in after Bigelow and Bam Bam tosses him outside and goes after Inoki press slamming him to the outside as the ref calls for the bell, I assume to disqualify Bigelow and Buzz. After the match Bigelow and Inoki face off in the ring but the ring fills up with people to hold back Inoki before they can go at it. Bigelow is pissed and starts tossing young boys around and calls for Inoki to fight him. Finally Fujinama and others get Inoki to leave the ring, and I am disappointed that I never got to see them go at it. It seems like this one came to an abrupt end as Sawyer seemed to legitimately injure himself coming off the top rope on that splash attempt. If Buzz hadn't gotten injured, it felt like this was building to an eventual confrontation between Bigelow and Inoki near the end of the match that would have been hot, but as it was this one left me a little disappointed. I will have to try and track down the eventual Bam Bam vs. Inoki singles match that I am sure happened soon after this, as they really built up Bigelow as a monster here and a very real threat to Inoki.

If that Backlund-Race match is anything to go by, building up those matches as some kind of holy grail is going to lead to massive disappointment. That one turned out to be pretty boring.

I am looking forward to Portland set and getting a chance to see a lot of Buddy after watching one of his Backlund matches at MSG and the tag feud with the Rockers from AWA, even though I get the feeling it's a ways off. But as far as the Observer HOF goes, I personally don't care about it, and to me it's more of a popularity contest than a legitimate Hall of Fame for guys who were all time greats. You can't tell me some of the guys like Angle and even DiBiase deserve to be in there before a long list of others, most importantly to me: Dick Murdoch.