Loss

There's also the story Dave shared recently of having dinner with a bunch of WWF guys in the late 80s who had never even heard of the Midnight Express. Owen Hart was the only guy who had seen them and agreed with Dave on how good they were. The response from everyone else was if they're so good, how come they never made it here?

I'm sometimes surprised at how little wrestlers know about environments they didn't work in. I think about Bret not knowing much of anything about JCP-era NWA or All Japan, or Flair not realizing that Mike Tyson was the big selling point of Wrestlemania XIV. I'm curious, especially for those of you who know wrestlers, how in tune most wrestlers are with what's happening on a global scale, and how good their knowledge of history is. Wrestlers obviously understand wrestling, but it seems like most of them don't understand versions of wrestling that they were not a product of. Is that a fair statement?

All I notice on WCW box covers like that is that the photographs look so amateur because of the lighting. I always thought that reading WCW Magazine at the time too.

Vince did a sit-down interview with Diesel where he talked about his history of knee injuries, they admitted his name was Kevin Nash and that he was married and otherwise tried to humanize him. There was TONS of strategy talk in every match. And they were building Wrestlemania with Ernie Ladd talking about the football-to-wrestling transition and giving strategy tips. It didn't last, but the presentation was almost too old school for a few weeks.

I'm kinda happy for Heath Slater. Deserved or not, it's about time he had a lucky break.

I don't know, I can appreciate the announce duo of Todd Pettengill and Stephanie Wiand in an ironic way. And also, "In Your House", which is probably the single dumbest name idea for a show in the history of major league wrestling. The year is also bookended with good stuff. Jim Ross was booking at the very beginning of the year and the TV was laid out like it was the 1970s for a few weeks, which was fun. Then, the year ended with Diesel's fake shoot interview and the Shawn Michaels collapse, followed by Bret-Davey Boy with BLOOD.

Rollins on top makes sense to me. He's been pushed to the point of nausea, and this is a kayfabe list.

Oh yeah, WCW was much worse. The WWF would have been just as bad without Shawn, Bret, Owen and Kid as the four pillars up and down the card, but they did have them. Flair/Arn vs football guys was 1996, after the NWO angle had already started in fact. Luger/Sting was also '96. 1995 is the Hogan/Vader feud, formation of the Dungeon of Doom, Flair-Savage (which was a rare bright spot), the horrible first Uncensored and DDP winning the lottery. Booking was pretty bad in both companies, but the WWF had the better wrestling.

Yeah, we're more likely to see an episode where he's too touchy feely with the Bellas and it makes them uncomfortable. But have no fear -- by the end of the episode, they will have learned that it's just how he shows affection to those around him.

Also, if I'm watching something from 30 years ago, I'm already not watching it the way it was intended, which frees me up to look at how they did work it for their intended audience.

I really like the ability to change and manipulate pre-existing perceptions and I find it fascinating to see the multiple ways they can do that. I was never a huge sports fan and looking back, I think a lot of that was because the people involved seemed so boring. That's not the case with wrestling. l also like the mythological side. It exists in this entire universe that blurs the line between fantasy and reality. I also think it's cool that if you make it credible within the confines of that universe, you can get away with just about anything.

- Monster heel/foreign menace goes on long undefeated streak to set up a match with one of his top babyfaces. Then the monster heel/foreign menace loses that match and doesn't get another true run at the top of the card and he loses interest - He loves a match/feud with a good tagline (Title For Title, A Match Made In Heaven A Match Made In Hell, etc.)

Kongo Kong vs Tank Old style big man vs big man match. If only I hadn't watched Andre-Khan from New Japan so recently, I might have been able to clear my mind of that comparison. It's not fair but this match can't hold up to that. Kong sells exactly the way someone with that gimmick should sell, though. They built and built to Tank's superplex as the highspot of the match, and it got maybe the biggest reaction of any move so far on the show. So these guys have a good grasp of psychology. Kong's splash looked great. This was an okay spectacle that didn't really grab me, but I can't complain about all the variety we're seeing on this card.

KT Hamill vs Moose They had what some may call a handicap by having an undersized heel against a big, dominant babyface, but Hamill's stalling and comedy made this work where Moose could dominate Hamill without garnering sympathy for Hamill. This is the most Southern style match so far. I'm liking the diverse approaches to the matches. Hamill ends up targeting Moose's leg. The announcers foreshadow that his cockiness will be his downfall when he keeps stopping when he's in control to taunt the crowd. This was fun in how they made it competitive without undermining Moose's dominance, which is his calling card. Hamill made Moose look like a million bucks. There's a real shortage of enhancement guys who can do that so convincingly in wrestling now. ***

Ace Rockwell vs Mark Vandy I like the booking of this following the more action-packed opener. I don't mean this as an insult in any way, but it's a good "cooling off" match. The goal of the opener was to give a really good match and get people excited for what's to come. This seemed more like a showcase to tell new viewers like me that they showcase a variety of styles. Not much of a match I'll remember and I wouldn't call it anything better than decent, but it was the right match for the spot it's in. I also feel like I'm underselling what they're doing. This is a solid, hard-hitting match. Kinda feels like a miniature version of that Hero-Cannon match from IWA Mid South years ago in how it's paced. So far, the guys I've wanted to see more of have both advanced to Round 2!

I picked this up today based on the hype and thought I'd start a thread to capture my thoughts. Other than Jimmy Rave and Moose, this is the first time I have seen any of these guys work. Corey Hollis vs Joey Lynch Well, this show certainly started off with a bang. Joey Lynch was fine and his selling was very good, but I was more focused on Corey Hollis here because of how the match was laid out. In fact, I was worried he was going to lose since he was taking so much of the match, which would have been disappointing since he's definitely a guy I want to see work more matches. Hollis works a lot like a young and slightly modernized Arn Anderson. He will probably be a great worker in a year or two, and he's already bordering on it. As mean as he already is, the meaner he wrestles in the future, the better he'll be. Anyway, he seems like a guy who is on the verge of finding himself. The pacing of this match was really good. When I complain about the WWE working style, it's this type of pacing I wish there was more of there -- giving everything a little more time to breathe and adding a sense of importance to everything. That reverse top rope Michinoku Driver thing was an awfully big move to just be used for a nearfall, and that was the most glaring flaw of this match, but other than that, this was really good. At first, I thought they were doing too much in an opening match of a tournament, but I'll reserve judgment on that until I see how it's followed. I loved the finish with Hollis positioning the referee to his advantage (another lost art) and throwing in an eye poke to help secure the win. Hollis seems like a guy whose career will be fun to follow as he really sinks his teeth into his character, and I'm looking forward to seeing him work again. They packed a lot of good stuff into a relatively short match. ***1/2

And that's what I did. Respond to them. The end.

It's interesting and could mean that Reigns' push is working deceptively well, or at the very least, not harming business. But it's complicated by the idea that a lot of people have adopted recently (I'm not sure if you subscribe to this or not), that it's the WWE brand that sells the show. This is more of a general statement than something I'm rolling out at anyone in particular, but it seems like we credit the people on top when it's convenient and roll out the WWE brand argument when it's convenient. Realistically, it's probably a little bit of both. I don't even think that applies to Reigns exclusively -- Dave tried to make the case for Kevin Owens as a draw in the latest WON based on impressive house show numbers against Cena, which were higher than Cena's run with Bray Wyatt at this time last year. I don't know if that holds up to scrutiny. It might but I think we should also look at the on-sale date, what angles had aired on TV by that time, what percentage of the house was walk-ups, if a lineup was announced immediately when tickets went on sale, how long it had been since they were last in those markets, etc. Plus, WWE in general seems to be hotter now than it was last year at this time. And I still haven't figured out why in that case.

Has anyone compared Dan's 1982 New Japan season to the Classics runs? Does the season set contain a lot of "exclusive" footage?

True, I just don't know why Dave would lie about that either.

Dave has always said the standing-o was started by WWE plants.

There's no way I'd still be watching wrestling without looking at it through a hypercritical eye as you phrase it. There's only a limited amount of enjoyment to be had from experiencing pro wrestling on the surface level. If following storylines and supporting all the fan favourites is good enough for someone then I don't look down on them. Most pure marks only watch for as long as they're enjoying themselves. The worst place to be is the middle ground. Being a smark isn't about knowing it's a work. Nor about knowing insider terms or backstage gossip. When fans spend all their time complaining and fantasy booking then it's all too easy to forget that it's meant to be fun. Hoping for things that probably won't happen rather than accepting them for what they are. If you don't appreciate what you're seeing then seek a better path. Ultimately what has kept me a fan for over 20 years is a deep love of the art of pro wrestling. I don't mind about knowing the result in advance. It doesn't bother me knowing the match duration or what's about to happen. It's about enjoying the journey. There's pleasure to be had in the extraneous aspects, but match quality is the core. That's why I mainly watch historical wrestling. Expectation of high quality wrestling rather than hope. There's no 'one great art' to watching a match. You're just making personal comparisons against prior experiences and expectations. Finding things that you like or don't like to see. There's many different ways of looking at things, and that's what makes wrestling endlessly fascinating to me. Analysing and determining what constitutes good wrestling is what being a smark really is. I look upon the Yearbook threads as a great tapestry with thousands of layers. All the time people come up with observations and viewpoints that I'd never have considered. Some of them may be fascinating, others pointless or far fetched. The opinions of others naturally shape your own over the course of time. It's all about you though at the end of the day. If trying to view wrestling in a certain way isn't enjoyable then don't do it. The path to enlightenment is about maximising your own wrestling experience. Come on, he took the time to give a thoughtful response to a question. If you see it differently, that's fine, but it would be cool if you used words to explain why instead of just dismissing him with a GIF.

When I enjoy something, I want to understand it. And for me, the best way to understand something is to toss up my impressions of it and listen to what other people are saying. It's all a process. All wrestling lives and breathes. What I don't understand -- and I don't mean this in a confrontational way, I just don't understand it -- is what people who don't really consider this approach right for them are looking to get out of a message board about wrestling.

Motoko is going to be livid! It would be very Johnny Ace to accidentally marry the wrong Bella, though.

Heels who put their feet on the ropes to score a pinfall.