JerryvonKramer
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Everything posted by JerryvonKramer
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On the subject of that match, did anyone else think it was TOTAL BULLSHIT when they announced that if Money Inc. lose by countout, they also lose their belts? Why? At least mention that stip BEFORE the match. This on the same night Hogan got an impromptu title shot.
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Any time Steamboat lost it and got himself DQ'd. Steamboat was genuinely one of the stupidest babyfaces. There's a good example on the All Japan set vs. Snuka (1981). vs. Luger at GAB '89 is another good example.
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[1992-01-04-WCW-Saturday Night] Arn Anderson vs Dustin Rhodes
JerryvonKramer replied to Loss's topic in January 1992
Probably the best Dustin match I've seen -- and I've seen all his PPV matches from this WCW run. Loved the brawl at the end. DA were such a cool group. When I think of Heyman, I think of this Paul E. first and the ECW guy second. -
I agree this was a good interview, but it was also kind of dark. Bringing up the heritage of the US belt and Magnum TA's accident is pretty great pyschology for 1992. Dangerous Alliance are probably my favourite stable of all time.
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[1992-01-04-USWA-TV] The Moondogs vs Jeff Jarrett & Robert Fuller
JerryvonKramer replied to Loss's topic in January 1992
Not much to add other than ... oh my god I can't believe Col. Parker was in such great shape in 1992! Does that mean he was stacked underneath the Colonel suit for all those years? -
I didn't know that they kept the Savage / Jake feud going after This Tuesday in Texas, always thought the bit in Royal Rumble 92 was just a nice bit of "afters" or continuity a la Tito vs. Ric Martel every single year. I liked the vague hint of jealousy from Randy after Liz claimed she might even feel a bit sorry for Jake.
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I thought this was missing something. Don't think it ever really got going, Fujinami looked bored. The appearance of Inoki made me think that this was a massive deal though.
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So taken Loss's suggestion to dig into this. 6 minutes+ a bit lengthy for the intros. Very surprised to see someone comparing this to the famous Superbrawl match with Luger. I love the Steiners because they do loads of high impact spots that look cool without coming across as spot monkeys. Muta looks like he took a total pounding here. I'd have liked this match to go another 10 minutes. The finish was weird as everyone else has said. German from the handspring is one of the coolest spots I've ever seen.
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Guys, sitting in my drawer now I have: The Watts Set - watched first 4 discs 80s All Japan - watched and rated first 4 discs 80s New Japan - not touched Will's amazing 4 Horsemen set - 4 discs deep 1992 Yearbook - arrived yesterday 1993 Yearbook - arrived today One or two of the Schneider comps - not touched 2010 MotY - not touched In addition, I have my ongoing WCW PPV reviews with every NWA and WCW PPV ever recorded sitting on my desktop. Great American Bash '96 forthcoming (which might be the best WCW PPV since Spring Stampede '94) I'm also a pretty busy guy. I love my wrestling, but I might have hit a moment of overload here. I'd like to make the All-Japan ballot, but I've found that set heavy going and a bit grindy. I've been burning through Horsemen because I'm a guy who loves angles and promos. I am sort of a completest, I always feel like I want to finish one thing before moving on. Like I feel bad for moving onto the Horsemen with All Japan half done, and I felt bad for leaving the MidSouth set to watch AJ. Question is: how do you watch your stuff? Do you have any pattern? Do you see a whole set through on its own or do you mix and match? For some reason, I found myself not really having fun any more watching All Japan, and the Horsemen set was like just ... relaxing, do you know what I mean?
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I suppose the elephant in the room with this is: to what extent did the run as the fat slob in WWF hurt his legacy? And to what extent will some voters beeline to that in their thinking? Would I be wrong in thinking that's at least one hurdle Dylan's case needs to overcome?
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Hard to say looking back. It's probably one of the greatest face turns of all time, so by the time it's over the match we'd just seen between a heel and a face was retroactively face vs. face, but I'm aware this is a weak argument. The Summerslam 92 example is better. I think a face vs. face match with third-party heel shennanigans on the outside is a formula we don't see very often. I love that "Who's corner is Mr. Perfect going to be in?" angle.
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The one from KotR '93?
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El-P, you should know I hate Scott Keith more than anyone, but as a barometer for what IWC smarks were saying at the time, he's generally a good litmus test. His ratings and Meltzer's ratings are seldom more than a star apart. I mean if Bret, HBK or Benoit are part of a match with either of them you can generally expect a *** minimum rating from either of them. If Hogan is involved, likewise, you can probably expect to - a * or two. I reckon if you gave me a match, just from the two workers involved I could predict what both Meltzer and Keith would give it without seeing the match. But yeah, Keith is not a guy to lean on for making a case, but he is a guy who can reflect what people were saying at the time.
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Sigh.
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Well Meltzer gave it ****1/4 and our old friend Scott Keith gave it ****3/4, so sure it was "rated". I haven't seen it in about 10 years, but I do remember being bored for large chunks of it. But then in any 45+ minute match, you get lag periods. I mean I've found myself bored at some of the matwork on the All Japan set in some of the longer matchers, even in the transcendent Flair vs. Jumbo from 83, so you're always going to get that, no?
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MMA is Pro Wrestling, Jerry. Have you watched MMA, Jerry? Yes, I've seen it. And ... what? No it isn't. For a start, pro wrestling is worked. MMA is a shoot, correct? How are they in any way the same thing? Because they have belts, entrance music, do promos and their matches take place in a ring? Come on. Is Boxing pro wrestling too? I don't see how this can be argued unless MMA is worked.
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What is the argument for Lesnar going in based on his pro wrestling career? Well?
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Yeah I don't think Angle should have gone in when he did either. But if we get to the point where Lesner is in and Ricky Morton, Arn Anderson, Tully Blanchard and Barry Windham are not, then the HoF loses pretty much all credibility in my book. I mean it'll just look arbitrary and, frankly, smelling of generic IWC fanboyism.
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Two things: 1. I think Doc is a really really weak candidate and don't really see why he's in. 2. If Brock Lesner gets into to the HoF, it will become a total joke in my eyes.
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I knew someone would say that but ... shush ok.
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I'm not too trendy to say: Warrior vs. Hogan (WM6) - fantastically booked "passing of the torch" angle that was electric at the time and still held in extremely high regard in the popular wrestling fan's consciousness today Warrior vs. Savage (WM7) - sort of counts, great retirement match Bret Hart vs. Roddy Piper (WM8) - good match Warrior vs. Savage (SS 92) - great angle this with Flair and Perfect's shennanigans around the ring, then destroying Savage's leg and Warrior doing the honorable tihng and not taking advantage. And I think it's a pretty good match too Bret Hart vs. 123 Kid (on Raw) - decent little match Breat Hart vs. Shawn Michaels (WM12) Rock vs. Austin (WM17) And of course ... Sting and Luger vs. The Steiners (Superbrawl I)
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Things Flair does consistently well in his promos: - get himself over (obviously) - get the sport of professional wrestling over - get the importance of titles over, not just his own, but any title - get JCP over - get his opponent over Every promo is a masterclass in this, and it's why for promos in my view he is GOAT. He's almost always tick all 5 of those boxes while still being entertaining and charismatic as hell. - Jim Crockett is without doubt the least charismatic person ever to appear on a wrestling show. - I LOVED the Andersons and Tully trying to break Sam Houston's arm. I also love how much they pick on Houston as the white meat, underdog babyface - always first out of the locker room, always first to get injured in any angle. - Did Tony Schiavone wear some sort of wig in 1985? His hair is horrendous at times. - Although solid, this match with Tully hasn't done much to win me over re: my genreal antipathy towards Terry Taylor. - Is it just me or has Baby Doll's ass got BIGGER since she spent 30 days with Dusty?
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Looks like Mike Fever went on to be a jobber for WCW: There he is jobbing to PN News. Two side points on that video: 1. PN News's rapping is the worst in the world 2. Does anyone else LOVE the way Gary Michael Capetta would announce jobbers? He always made the sound like the lamest people in the world. I think he might have done it deliberately. Anyway, Fever is no fatter in that video than he is as a ref in 1985.
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- I like Baby Doll's involvement in Dusty vs. Arn. One of the things I've liked about the JCP storytelling on this set is that feuds overlap. Dusty and Magnum had beef with Ole and Arn, while they BOTH had individual issues with Tully. Mangum TA also had issues with Flair. That's pretty cool and something you never got in WWF really. In WWF, if two guys are feuding they are the ONLY ones they will have any interest in. Here, you have simultaneous angles going on. - Dusty's fired up promo after that match is absolutely amazing.
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Patrick, like Young, was one ref who'd kick the heels hand if he was getting cheap leverage on something like an abdominal stretch. He's also a ref who would shove a guy getting in his face. I'm currently watching Arn vs. Dusty from 1985 (for the TV title) - the ref is Mike Fever and he's basically fat. I don't think that's something a ref can get away with. Earl Hebner is just like average size, but Mike Fever has a massive beer gut. Did Turner / Herd fire all the fat NWA refs?