WingedEagle

Just want to add that SenorLARIATO is great for gifs and teasers on the big NJ shows. Always nice to have someone whet your appetite before you get a chance to check out the show.

The thing that struck me about the Okada series, is how different each match was. You had the shocking Okada win in the first match, you had the match where Tanahashi worked over the arm trying to take away the Rainmaker (this was Invasion Attack if memory serves, which I went ***** on), the knee injury bluff Alan mentioned, the G1 30-minute draw, etc. Tanahashi demonstrated this ability again with the recent series of matches vs Nakamura, which again were all very distinct in structure & layout, even more so than the Okada matches. You both hit then nail on the head here. I haven't found any of his main events unnecessarily long but rather consistently building to hot finishing stretches with different focuses, be they the arm the Okada arm or G1 draw matches, the arm vs leg limb war vs. Suzuki or the Nakamura series this year.

Usos and Bryan definitely the 2 most impressive showings on those lists from my reading.

Is there footage of that angle and the split?

I can understand it to an extent. I wanted to grab a Daniel Bryan shirt when wweshop had a big sale going. But at that time he had the goat face line. I wouldn't even want to wear that in the house, much less going downstairs to get the mail. But I grabbed one when they had the YES! in large block letters.

I wonder how much actual merchandise positioning has to do with it. Safe to say Cena merch is featured prominently at all stands but I believe it'd be selling leaps and bounds more than others no matter what. Is Reigns getting significantly more and better window space than others? The Usos stood out to me on that list as I wouldn't suspect their gear is promoted as much as top singles act so something is definitely connecting there.

There are definitely facts in the drawing debate. A million dollar gate is a million dollar gate. But then you get into who is responsible for that gate which is not always that clear. That's why I've found the Murdoch HOF discussion so interesting.

I might enjoy Choshu more in tags than singles and play to his strengths of coming in and going hard and fast for spurts. The series with Jumbo/Tenryu were my favorites on the AJ 80s set. The WAR tags & multi-mans in the 90s are all spectacular.

Speaking of organized -- it might be helpful if there were a thread for mod-only posting that collected all the various match lists that people are including in the wrestler threads. Looking at those for Misterio, Flair, Danielson, etc. I would hate for those resources to get lost in the shuffle.

That's what I figured, which is really a shame. It'd be great to have a comparative basis for evaluating who drew and moved numbers as opposed to relying on slotting and what we can infer from that, but I can't imagine too much data survived from that era.

Probably the guy I'm most interested in watching as I crawl my way through Ditch's Best of 2000s list. Depending how that goes I could see him slotting in the either the top or bottom quarter.

Do we have attendance figures for the shows Murdoch headlined versus others? I'd be interested in looking at how he drew when featured and how that compared to business before and after as well as on dates when others might have headlined.

I'm curious to check out the Morishima match and a few others from that period, but am more interested in rewatching matches from the 90s that fall below the elite/classic level. By the mid-aughts Misawa is MIsawa and I can't see my thoughts on him changing based on that period. But definitely looking to the primes to help me order him, Kawada and Kobashi.

Watching it I thought Rusev got a pretty big rub just from being in the ring on camera with Rock for that long. So he took a couple punches and bailed. Not like he was stretchered out and made to look impotent. This may very well be the biggest thing they can do to build him until he eventually goes down.

Shinobu Kandori & Utako Hozumi vs. Bull Nakano & Takako Inoue (LLPW 11/9/93) -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2M2uotMgvY4 Thought this was phenomenal, and a great example of how you put together a hot match without going long and building a superfight down the line.

I wouldn't be at surprised to Cena see finish incredibly high. The quantity of good to great matches is staggering, and should be tough to ignore.

I'm about to watch Devil & Plum Mariko vs. Chigusa Nagayo & Cutie Suzuki from the '93 yearbook and had to stop to nominate Devil here as well. Just an all-time joshi chin.

I love a good facial. I think its often one of the more effective ways, either on its own, or often in combination with other mechanisms to sell. But its not at all something I insist upon. I may point to someone's lack of facials as a catch-all for their failure to effectively sell any damage as its occurring. Its a fantastic communication device and can certainly enhance a match but isn't necessary to get it over the hump. Last night I watched a PG-13 match from the '93 yearbook and absolutely loved their facials and basically every heel antic and stooge spot they put on throughout the match. But on the whole the match really didn't do much for me because the action was pretty dry and seemed designed simply to lead to Wolfie & Ice's heel performances rather than the heel performances being part of the action. On the other hand, look at a guy like Misawa who will very often have the same facial expression for much of a match. The man's been part of more classics than most, partly because of how he stood out in contrast to his peers and the character he played, *and* because of when he would drop some other worldly selling or aggression facials.

That's the impression I have and I personally hope to check out many of them. I was speaking to the suggestion that he could be someone's #1 after only a few matches.

The Wagner Jr. and Mesias brawls are some of my favorites from this decade. I haven't seen anything approaching that stuff from earlier in his career so definitely keen on finding some others. Ultimo Guerrero match from '04 just didn't resonate

Not trying to rain on anyone's parade, but I hope it takes more than a few matches for anyone to earn a #1 or similarly high ranking. I could see myself dropping in a couple names lower on my list who I haven't seen a ton of, but not sure its fair to do that high up.

How much quality is there after leaving WCW in '92?

I didn't think the match was bad as the stretch run and finish were exciting, but man was it ever long and I can understand why you might have been down on it on the whole. There was just no reason at all for going to long. I just can't dislike something that wraps up so well.

I'd like to think even a heel can promote a charitable cause while wearing a t-shirt without slipping into a moving promo about the charity. I also wouldn't want a heel doing something overtly offensive to wear the shirt. Basically I'd look at it like a watermark on the screen.

Vader also didn't flop and take wild, exaggerated bumps. He'd stagger, eat some big offense and eventually go down, always making his opponent earn everything. Definitely not a cheap date. He insisted on flowers, a nice dinner, dessert and provocative conversation before even considering going home with you.