MoS

Okay, so, if I am not wrong, you are commending her for participating in absolutely silly stuff one week, and yet having the credibility and the presence to do something serious and intense the next? Okay, that makes sense, and I apologise for misunderstanding you. I mean, I do not agree, but I can see where you are coming from. Sort of like, to compare the great with the mediocre, how Arn Anderson could go out and make an absolute fool of himself one day, and yet be completely believable when he would talk about murdering someone the very next day, right? I have no idea if Trish did that week-to-week, but I do understand where you are coming from. Please do not stop participating in the project, for what it is worth. The more diverse the views, the better in my view.

I now want Parv to rank actors based on this modified BIGLAV criteria.

Versatility means having a varied skillset that lends you to perform admirably in different situations. An actor in a Michael Bay movie, for example, might be judged on the basis of how badass their delivery of "cool" (read: cheesy) dialogues is, and how they acquit themselves in action scenes. Unless you consider looking good and being fit skills or talent in a wrestling context, I have no earthly idea how participation in lingerie matches and shit can be construed as a positive. I confess I find the argument baffling.

This is my favourite thread of all-time. If Dylan is still taking requests, I put forward: Del Rio Dolph Ziggler Sasha Banks The Ascension Road Warrior Hawk

I turn 23 on January 29.

Just curious about this: do you hate all runs of DX equally viscerally, or is it one particular run that has made you loathe the group as a whole? Because while I can certainly see early 1998 heel DX being hated by people, I do not think they deserve this level of hatred. Or maybe they do. Been some time since I have revisited that era.

If WWE and the MNW series are to be believed, DX single-handedly changed the course of wrestling, and destroyed WCW. While that is revisionism so blatantly misleading it would have been hilarious if it were not so sad and infuriating, DX was actually quite popular during Attitude. Going back, however, the only period of time where I actually liked DX was between January and March 1998, when they were feuding with Austin. It seems to me that even someone as fucked-up as Shawn had realised by then that Austin was hotter than volcanic lava and was going to be the next company ace no matter how much politicking he did, so he just decided to go with it and become a full-fledged, actual heel and he played his part quite well in the build-up to WM 14. The subsequent babyface iteration of the group, which is by far their most remembered, actually annoyed me quite a lot. In real time, I was too young to understand all the dick jokes, so I used to just get annoyed at these idiots who were taking valuable screen time when it could have been Austin on my TV. Now, as someone in their 20s, they are ridiculously juvenile and flat-out unfunny, to the point where I wonder how anyone could have liked them. The 2000 heel run was okay, I guess, but at that point, the other DX members were basically the minions of HHH and Steph, so it doesn't really count. I did like Austin destroying their bus though. I hate, loathe, absolutely despise the 2006 reunion of DX, where they were pushed far too much, were way too visible, and did not do anything of note at all. I still remember how Shawn and Hunter basically single-handedly eliminated all 5 members of Edge and orton's team at Survivor Series, and it was intensely annoying. As was what Shawn called "comedy", which was basically acting like he was spastic, contorting in the most hammy way possible, and then stealing old Friends jokes and doing skit after skit of horrible quality. Not to mention, there was this time when Shawn and Trips on one leg basically destroyed Edge and Orton; on the next night, Shawn actually beat both of them in a handicap match, which has to be the most pointless burial ever. These two were supposed to carry WWE's heel division for the next decade, and here a run-down past-his-prime old dude made them look like chumps. I wish I could give an opinion on the 2009 and beyond reunions of DX, but I have blocked them from my memory. Fuck HBK and his cowboy hat. DX got 2 segments on Raw's 1000th episode, which was 2 more than they shold have got. As an aside, the "invasion" of Nitro has to be the most pointless segment ever pushed as an epic and game-changing moment by the WWE machine. Did it even lead to any ratings increase or even louder pops? Thoughts?

This has absolutly nothing to do with pro-wrestling, but I am part of the Potter generation. I read the first one as a wide-eyed 8 year old, and I have been completely, utterly hooked ever since. As such, his death comes as a huge shock and brings immense sadness to me; I grew up with him and Harry Potter; they are like Star Wars for me. Not to mention, his turn as Hans Gruber in Die Hard, and in so many other films like Robin Hood and Sense and Sensibility makes him an all-time great actor. He might just be the greatest actor to have never received an Oscar nomination. If I had to make a wrestling analogy, I guess he would be William Regal. Someone who never had the opportunity to be a huge star or a great box office draw, but who would churn out ridiculously amazing performances every time he was on stage or in front of the camera. RIP. RIP.

Sorry for continuing the off-topic train, but I find this analysis of pop-culture seeping through generations very interesting. I am an Indian who will turn 23 at the end of this month. Until I was 7, I actually thought India was the only country that had TV shows; I thought America just made movies. Yeah, I was stupid. The first foreigb TV show I watched was Friends, in 2007 I believe, because it was on TV and had subtitles, so someone not used to the American accent could understand it. I was hooked. Completely. Even now, if you ask me to bame my favourite TV show, I will say Friends without a moment of hesitation. However, that did lead me to wanting to ecplore more foreign shows. Sometime in 2010, when I figured out how torrents worked, I started devouring old shows with a passion. And I would have never been able to do that had it not been for the internet. However, my interest was initially piqued only because I saw Friends on TV while surfing channels. So I do understand Parv's point; if you take India to be 4-5 years behind America in terms of trends, then the practice of watching TV if you had nothing to do was still alive. So, I really think there is no right answer to the debate. Watching TV randomly does help, but ultimately it depends on how you are as a person. Also, my tastes are weird. I love all the classic British shows from the 60s - 80s. Absolutely love Monty Python, Fools and Horses, and really like stuff like Fawlty Towers, the fourth season of Blackadder, Yes Minister, and so on. However, my interest in British shows made since the 90s has been much lower. I do not like....Coupling, was it? And I think The Office is overrated; I actually prefer the American version. It is the opposite with American shows. I really, really tried to enjoy Happy Days and MASH, but they bored the crap out of me. I think Cheers is okay, but not too great, which is weird, given my love for Friends. Same with Cosby Show. In contrast, I like many 90s American shows: Seinfeld; Frasier; Sopranos, etc. Big fan of recent dramas like Breaking Bad and The Wire. I don't really know why. Cultural differences is not a good excuse, because it is not as if the British culture is remarkably like ours. Oddly, most of the mainstream modern comedies I don't like. Modern Family is okay, while The Big Bang Theory and 2.5 Men make me want to kill people. Oddly, and this might come as a huge surprise to Americans, but in India, by popular opinion, Friends beats Seinfeld every day of the week. Almost all urban youngsters love Friends, while most haven't heard of Seinfeld, while those eho have seen it do not like it in general. I guess it is because Friends had a much more easily translatable humour, while Seinfeld was more American. Also, Parv, I watched Godfather when I was 17, and Goodfellas when 18, so I would say your students suck. Wow, really long, really off-topic post. Apologies.

I started watching Raw in 1999, and although I have gone back and watched the 1997 and 1998 shows, it's been a while, and I was looking for some e-book that would have comprehensive reviews of Raw. I looked it up, and there are 2 series of books for that, basically: Dixon's and Arnold Furious's Raw Files and Thomas Hall's Monday Night Reviews. Now, I am the opposite of filthy rich, and cannot afford to buy both series for what is essentially the same thing. So, I was hoping to get an opinion on which one is better. Maybe Bix or someone who reviews such books can help me out please? Thanks.

I disagree that fans did not care if Rock lost or not. Fans were pelting the ring with garbage after WM 2000 ended, something which happened rarely in WWF. The pop he received for everything he did at Backlash one month after was also incredible, especially when Austin's music hit and they realised Rock was going to win. Rock had a weird trajectory. Only man in 1998 apart from Austin and Taker to pin Kane. However, in December 1999, he jobbed to Big Bossman and Al fucking Snow. I think that what is more important, however, is his Corporate heel run, where he was ruthless against Mankind and others. It gave the impression that he might talk trash a lot, but in the big matches, he got shit done.

Agreed with OJ on Bret's opponents. Bret has himself said his matches with Taker are some of his favourites. And the match with Waltman might be the most famous Raw match of the early years. I would like to see Parv rate the Attitude main-eventers. I know he dislikes the era, so he won't be nearly as high on Austin and Rock as I am. The only ones I would argue is if Austin and Rock do not get a 10 in intangibles. Hunter might as well get a zero in that. His lack of charisma compared to the level of his push is staggering.

Since there is no "Comments that don't warrant a thread" thread anymore.... I had actually never seen this before. I had heard a lot about it though. Rock was great in it, but my personal favourite was Big Show's 3 lines. That dude has a really good comic timing. Triple H.....well, he tried, like he always does. I know he likes to pretend that he could have easily been the Hollywood superstar that Rock is, but chose wrestling over movies, but he just doesn't have it. I would actually argue that Austin has a much better and more entertaining personality and comic timing, even though in his prime, he almost never cracked jokes on-screen. Anyway, since I did not even know what the internet was in 2000 - I was 7, but I am Indian - how was this received online and the wrestling journalists like Meltzer? Was it considered a seminal moment in wrestling being mainstream? Or were people rather wary of it, since wrestling may have been mainstream in the Attitude Era, but to my understanding, it was as well respected in America as the Kardashians are now. How was it received in the wider media? I know everyone connected to wrestling thinks The Rock absolutely nailed it, but for what it is worth, some YouTube comments (I know, I know) were very critical about this. As an aside, it must have hurt Triple H that Rock was the main focus here, despite Hunter being the champ and scheduled to win the WM main event. I mean, they were not exactly in character: they did not break kayfabe, but they were pretty open about it.

I like Trish quite a lot, but I would like to see an argument for why she deserves to be in the Top 100 and Triple h doesn't. I know their contextual circumstances were not at all similar, but I don't think this project is the place to right historical wrongs.

Yay everyone, some dude (wait, who the hell are you?) is here to insult me for no goddamn reason whatsoever! For your information: I've talked with Si in the chat about "serious" academic analysis of all kinds of wacky pop culture, my post here was an extension of those conversations. And my post didn't mention a single thing about my time "in DA BZNSS", I was referencing the fact that I'd just spent the last few years as an English major and have written countless citations just like the ones Si did here. It's an in-joke that you're on the outside of, so take your assumptions and shove off.

Yay everyone, Jingus is here to contribute nothing to the topic but pour scorn and snark over the people discussing it, smugly self-satisfied in his ivory tower of elitism, which he gained access to because he was "in DA BZNSS"! Rejoice! I loved, loved, loved the article. My mindset is diametrically opposite to Parv's; I hate the racist, misogynistic, xenophobic, homophobic (ad idem.) elements in professional wrestling, and it shocks me that wrestling manages to get away with it even in 2015, purely because of its status as low-brow entertainment. I am radically left-wing and a feminist, so you can argue that wrestling is not for me; to some extent, I have learned to embrace the disgusting elements in wrestling, but that does not mean I like to see such elements being celebrated.

Have at it. Serena Williams - Ric Flair. Excellent from the beginning and amazing longevity. There were others better at their peak, but no one has had the kind of longevity she has enjoyed. Steffi Graf - Toshiaki Kawada, most probably. Not as long a career as Williams, but when she was at her peak, there was no one better, except for Monica Seles, who was threatening to spoil the party before a lunatic stabbed her. Martina Navratilova - Jerry Lawler. Great at singles, great at tags, great on so many levels. Margaret Court - Hmm.... probably Ray Stevens? Not enough footage exists, and competition was easier in her time, but was dominant in a huge way. Suzanne Lenglen/ Helen Wills - Jim Londos. The first superstars, and amazing talents.

Not speaking spanish at all, that totally went over my head. However, I did learn what "tossing your salad" meant while listening to Konnan, and for that, I'm forever grateful. And peeling my potatoes... Funny how Konnan used to be able to get away with using prison/street/hip hop slang because nobody running the show was young or hip enough to know what was going on. I'm not even sure they had anybody aware of what was hip and cool other than Hall, Nash, Konnan, Rey, Jericho and a couple others. On the Spanish slang, to be fair to WCW, WWE is not censoring it either. I saw somebody (perhaps Alberto) using Spanish swear words fairly recently (2012 or after) that he would probably be fired over if they were in English on live TV. This makes me think of Dave Chappelle having a big laugh about white people finding out what "skeet skeet" meant after allowing it to play all over the radio. Oh, and for something wrestling related, when Khali had Runjin Singh as a translator apparently Khali was saying really nasty stuff in Punjab. I remember someone saying one of his promos on Cena was talking about raping Cena's mother and shit like that. Khali said "maa chodh doonga" which literally translates to "I will fuck your mom". It is a very common way of colloquially insulting someone in India, although that, of course, is no justification. He also called Batista "kutte", which means "dog", which is again a common insult in India. Different culture.

See, that is something I just do not understand. A bunch of oh-so-masculine-and-macho jocks dissing gay people in a casual environment is literally the embodiment of homophobia. Same with wrestlers using the n-word. Words can never be divested from their context or their historical use. When I was in Alabama for my law school semester exchange program, there was this charming dude who kept on calling me "Paki". His roommate tried to justify it by saying that he was not a xenophobe; he just did not know the right "PC" word for Indians. It makes no sense.

^ A case of account hacking? Fair play if you want to be a douche, but why the need to be a homophobic douche?

Also, the Divas Revolution crap was just a smokescreen to push Charlotte without her getting Reignsed, it seems. After giving an all-time performance last Saturday, here is Sasha being almost beaten by Paige in less than 1 minute 20 seconds. Utter nonsense.

Speaking as an Indian, where swastikas are found on the doors of literally every house, and from where Hitler poached and perverted its design, I have to say it is not a traditional Hindu swastika. It is very much a Nazi memorabilia. Hindu swastika - Hitler's perversion of it -

Think he meant the Survivor Series Austin-Bret match.

Yeah, the Attitude Era apologists loved this talking point. Wasn't it unfortunately also parroted by Meltzer? We know that WWE promos are all scripted ahead of time and that the guys have to sit there and wait for the other guy to finish before it's their turn to talk, so I was always confused by the idea of anyone getting destroyed unless they were scripted to get destroyed. Unless people meant he was getting destroyed in terms of delivery or emotion or whatever. Rock has always scripted his own promos, so I don't think Creative was writing his promos for him this time around. Pretty sure he wrote them himself. THe content fell absolutely flat. And I had a problem with the delivery as well. There seemed no charisma in his delivery. He wasn't Randy Orton, exactly, but he sure as hell wasn't the lively charismatic Rock.

Yeah, the Attitude Era apologists loved this talking point. Wasn't it unfortunately also parroted by Meltzer?