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Jordan

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  1. Jordan
    Brock/Goldberg broadway
  2. Jordan
    Pretty straightforward badass match. Kind of a precursor to where (for better or worse) their matches would go structure wise in the late 90s. There's no way I can't love Misawa breaking out kicks to the face and KO elbow finishes.
  3. Jordan
    What's the feeling on 2008-2010 Cena? That was another one of my down periods for watching wrestling but I have seen some stuff I really liked (anything with Batista, some Big Show stuff) but also some things like the endless attempts at making the Orton feud feel special or the Miz stuff sorta misfiring that I'm kinda eh to. How was the NXT stuff? I don't know if it's really an out there opinion but I think from 2011-2014 he was as good as he was in 2007. Maybe not on a PPV to PPV basis but it's pretty crazy how much great stuff he put in in that time, especially looking at his mentality switch of "trying to become The Guy" in 2007 to being "The Guy" during that time period.
  4. Jordan
    Just showed up on youtube today https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpl0_wA_J_k
  5. Jordan
    Okay look, I get it. We're supposed to hate these matches because of the atrocious booking. Or because they ruined Hash's aura. I get that. By the general reaction in other threads I'm assuming a lot of people here witnessed this as it was going on and feel more upset about it. That's fine, I'm not gonna commend this as "ballsy" or something because it really is baffling booking for a feud with a guy who made you tons of money, even if MMA is on the rise and you want to seem legit. But I was seven when this happened. And I....just don't care about that aspect of these matches. I viewed Hash's rise and peak after it had long ended and I loved it all. And you know what? I loved this. The same way I loved what the first 2 Cena/Lesnar matches after he came back portrayed. To see an ace absolutely get overwhelmed and destroyed in such a surreal way is shocking, sure. But what makes these matches work is what that ace tries to do to survive it. This opens with Hashimoto again trying to mount some offense against Ogawa before getting swallowed up and having to roll outside and gameplan. This leads to Hashimoto having to make an opening creatively once again like in the '99 match and you get an absolutely awesome spinning low kick followed by Hashimoto trying to cave Ogawa's face in with stomps. It's unconventional, but it's him still finding a way to lay in a beating and Ogawa sells it well. And this is by far the most evenly worked match they had, again putting over that Hashimoto was closing the gap on not wanting to endure death by STO. We even get a section of I guess you could say legwork as Hashimoto destroys Ogawa's legs (which Ogawa sells incredibly well) and we get a submission finish tease. Every Hashimoto/Ogawa encounter to me is about what Hashimoto can do to not get engulfed late by STOs. This match more than any other one showed how much he didn't want that to happen, with the rope blocking, use of space, and struggle for Ogawa to even get a single one off. And late when it looks like he might be starting towards that we get that phenomenal DDT counter plus the armbar attempt that sends the crowd into a frenzy. Then we come to Ogawa putting Hash through the ringer with STOs and he again sells them tremendously. We can love Hash trying to fight through Choshu lariats so no reason not to love this. And I know there's always discourse about how much a crowd should matter in rating a match but the way they worked them during this entire feud is incredible. When Hashimoto finally can't rise again and gets counted out and you hear that woman just cry out from sadness at what occurred plus the looks of fans who are crushed is something else. Maybe it's something stupid, but when we remember that Hash opened a promotion after this, had excellent interpromotional feuds and matches, and even came back to NJPW a few months later anyway, it's not that bad to me. Not like any of us are on the NJPW payroll. Epic match.
  6. Jordan
    I have to confess that I avoided this match like the plague during my peak of watching 90s AJPW stuff. Basically because I saw a YouTube vid that sort of clipped this down to the highlights but still was a 10 minute long vid so you'd get the portions of Akiyama trying to destroy Kobashi's knee, but I also got to see the Kobashi pop-up lariats and headdrops so I just groaned and said "nope" and went to something else. In hindsight, that was a mistake. This to me was like that great Bryan/Sheamus 2 out of 3 falls match cranked up a few notches. They do well early on to show that Akiyama can hang somewhat with Kobashi but it becomes evident that he needs to attack that leg and he does it well. I loved the extended legwork segment here, with the guardrail chucks and Akiyama just dumping him around the ring like he has no care for his well-being. I think there is a lot of Kobashi excess in this, especially early with the half-nelson on the floor, but when he gets destroyed during Akiyama's attacks he sells well (him limping around the ring just to get in to position to chop Akiyama down was something else) and I can even buy late his thinking that he can't put together any real stretch of offense and is gonna need to just get in some very potent bursts. That "fuck you" lariat he does after one of Akiyama's knee attacks is pretty awesome. So yeah, great match, and I think 1998 AJPW, even with all the overkill and excess creeping up in these big matches was a more satisfying year to find stuff than 1997.
  7. Jordan
    Part of me wonders if this was just Kawada's approach to how an ace should work (title or not he was more or less The Guy at this point) when it comes to having your main weapon(s) attacked. Misawa has 1/20/97, sure, but he has other elbow selling performances where, out of the segment, he just kinda doesn't acknowledge it anymore either. Plus this was so focused into one section of work and not really playing off any out of match story (vs. Hashimoto '04 and Otani 03 we know coming in Kawada's dealing with a bad leg) that it feels more like a Tenryu tactic like dawho said and less about being a peak Kawada selling performance. Moving on though there's too much greatness in between that possibly misplaced section for me to really care though. An absolute slugfest where they sold the message tremendously so they make up for it anyway. Kawada limping around as he tries to destroy his mentor doesn't sound as compelling to me. Plus it's 2000 and the crowd cares about a stretch plum attempt so that's a major plus in my eyes. And you get the awesome Kawada staggered selling, the knockout at the end, Tenryu starting off as if he still thinks Kawada is a little kid still before progressively realizing he might be losing, that apron high kick, and lots of other goodies. I think 2000 gave us three MOTDCs from Japan (this, Akiyama/Misawa, and Ogawa/Hashimoto) and I think after viewing all three again this might be third with Akiyama/Misawa coming out on top. But what a year.
  8. Jordan
    Did Terry Funk vs. Vader ever actually happen?
  9. Jordan

    Hell in a Cell 2016

    Jordan replied to goodhelmet's topic in WWE

    I thought the women's match was pretty good but then I also got distracted by the godawful chat I was watching it with that had people whining about everything not looking clean or exact and making corny Botchamania jokes. So I might like it more on a rewatch. Considering Charlotte threw Sasha around on a table right before hitting her alternate finisher I didn't really see how it was deflating. I just think people got caught off guard by Charlotte winning. I can't believe how much I used to like Rollins when he was in the Shield. But the tag format and his whole gimmick just being a dick and making fun of opponent's taunts and moves probably hid a lot of his bad habits.
  10. Jordan
  11. Jordan
    Still special. I loved the mix of matwork in between some early striking. It’s not out of this world matwork, but it is gritty and has a feeling of struggle so I’m with it. This really opens up of course when we get to the bad limbs, first with Kawada. That might be my favorite spinning low kick from Hashimoto. And then Hashimoto stomping on the leg is awesome. I don’t even really understand the “Kawada no-sells” argument here: he sells great during the segment of attack (his initial “injury” sell and realizing what’s going on is incredible), sells whenever it’s truly attacked down the stretch, and recognizes the pain in “big” moves such as when he limps into the other corner and slaps some feeling back into it before unleashing. Maybe a few less kicks with it sure, but it felt more egregious in the Tenryu ‘00 match than here. Even then, the MVP of this has to be Hashimoto. When Kawada gets his opening by dropping him on his shoulder, I think we get one of the greatest performances ever from Hashimoto. Again, Kawada breaking out the armbar and blatantly aiming for that shoulder is great, plus we get the first stretch plum focused on the shoulder and a minor foreshadowing of the finish with the towel tease. This then moves into a finishing run based around them throwing kicks and strikes at already mangled body parts, Hashimoto kicking Kawada on the face, Kawada aiming shots at Hashimoto’s shoulder as he tries to scramble away and that awesome Hashimoto collapse spot where he finally falls after taking too many kicks from Kawada. Again, just out of this world stuff. I can even see the idea that some stuff late wasn’t “clean” but when the strikes do land they’re compelling and still carry the damage you’d want to see. I even love the TKO finish because of course Hash isn’t gonna know when to quit. Just a classic as far as I’m concerned. I think I love Hashimoto matches like this or the Ogawa feud as a whole because it subverts what we all love seeing Hash do which is destroy people and instead turns into him selling brutal beatings while having to find creative ways to get on offense or end up faced with insurmountable odds. The fact that the final arc of Hashimoto’s career is him having to fight through a bad shoulder like some kind of warrior almost seems fitting.
  12. Jordan
    I remember randomly checking this out during my wrestling sabbatical because I figured something featuring these two guys had to be good at the very least and this didn’t disappoint. I loved Rusev’s throws in this along with his strikes. I continue to roll my eyes at Roman getting the exact same kind of Cena hate while, just like Cena, he turns in another great performance. I thought Reigns’ selling and timing on his comeback was quality and that deadlift suplex rocked. I felt like their match at Clash of Champions was kinda disappointing and this felt more like the direction they should have gone. Maybe down the line.
  13. Jordan
    Rewatched this for the first time in years and I loved the way this opened with Eddie rightfully beating JBL's ass after everything that had taken place. The trash talk, the throwing him into the crowd and the announcer's desk, all great. Then it maintains it's mean streak when JBL doing back body drops onto outside and fallaway slams. I think that's almost what stands out to me even before the chairshot and the bladejob: this was already building to something great, and it just gets taken to another level when you get bloody Eddie trying to survive. I'm counting the post-match stuff in this because fuck it and because the chest beating + frog splash spot is still iconic. Great match, and I think if not for Kawada vs. Hashimoto this would be my MOTY for 2004. Also, is it fair to say that Eddie was at his best ever in '04 and '05? I agreed with elliott's posts about Bryan and just missing possibly his "true" peak and I agree but I feel that same way about what Eddie was doing here and especially in the Rey feud and I even liked the chemistry he and Batista had.
  14. Jordan
    Probably could cut a few of the late STOs off this and it gets the point across without going into overkill, but leading up to that this was great. The way that Hash has to stubbornly accept that going into exchanges with Ogawa is going to get him killed and then shifts his strategy is awesome. The headbutt transition rules and Ogawa sells the beating like he should. I think Ogawa performs his role well, including still selling as the match breaksdown into him rattling off STOs while still maintaining that dickish attitude. Like 2012-present Lesnar, he's the amped up shooter who knows he can run through anybody and knows that he always has his kill move in the STO. Again, this probably drags into the finish with how many he hits, but Hashimoto's selling in this is great and still offers up the idea that he might find a counter or something to find a way to turn the tide back in his favor. It's just as compelling as him taking Choshu lariats, at least to me anyway. I think they get the main ideas of this match better at the April encounter, but I still enjoyed this overall.
  15. Jordan
    Yeah, this ruled. Even with all the pseudo-mma, restarts and ring filled brawls this felt like the most "standard" wrestling match probably helped by the tag format. I liked the defined hierarchies in this of Murakami/Iizuka->Hashimoto->Ogawa (slightly) so you get Hash coming in and destroying Murakami to break something up followed by Hash having to find a way to survive STOs. Also has the most thorough beatdown of Ogawa by Hashimoto including the return of the awesome headbutt he broke out in the 10/99 match. Ultimately a great, hate-filled, action-packed brawl that works as a nice contrast to the two Ogawa/Hashimoto singles on 10/99 and 4/00 that were built around Hash's selling and figuring out ways to avoid STOs.
  16. Jordan
    Definitely Angle. I loved him as a kid but was disappointed how little his stuff did for me when I ran through some of it with a friend a few years ago. The '01 Summerslam match is still great though. Kobashi too. He hasn't fallen as hard, and he's got too many performances that are still great to me, but he has so many things he does in his matches especially from the late 90s on that just make me groan.
  17. Jordan
    Most reviews in here have covered what I want to say but this really is just an incredible match. Feels more rewarding every time I watch it again. Just the way they manage to have Akiyama control and ultimately overwhelm Misawa for a majority of the match without it seeming like overkill is amazing. I don't really know how often a situation occurs like this but in terms of being a sort of ascension/"it's his time now" match I can't think of anything that nails it any better.
  18. Jordan

    WWE TV Oct 17-23

    Jordan replied to cpst's topic in WWE

    "This was specifically something I had in mind for wrestling Brock" sigh.... Big E vs Sheamus seemed good, from what my shaky stream would let me see.
  19. Jordan
    I watched their matches back to back and I think this was more engaging to me. It might sound odd, but if you switched the order of their matches and have the big bombfest "dream match" here + interference finish and have the Summerslam match be about AJ knowing he's better than Cena and then capping it off with a (clean) win then I think it means more. I liked the idea of AJ outsmarting Cena and using his speed and strikes where he could plus I think this was one of the better sequences of countering Cena's big stuff that I've seen since Punk was doing it during their matches. There were a few things that seemed too choreographed or took too long to develop, (like Cena looking straight at AJ on the ropes for a good chunk of time and AJ going ahead with the leapfrog attempt) but I think it built to an exciting finish plus more compact final stretch than the Summerslam match. Maybe not as "big" or "epic" but I could buy this as a major moment anyway. Also I really liked Cena's selling in this, from the leg selling late after the calf crusher plus strikes but just in general how he was portraying the damage of the match with how he moved around the ring. Plus I love whenever he does a lariat.
  20. Jordan
    Okay on rewatch this didn't feel as over the top as the first time I watched it. The first half of it was actually really good with grumpy John throwing headbutts and chucking AJ around the ring, and the apron suplex looked brutal so I could work with it. I even liked the early Styles Clash as a spot to show urgency following that. But the AA following it kinda felt like too much then it turned into like an extended bombfest before AJ found an opening. However, the portion Loss spoke about with Cena's reaction to AJ kicking out of the avalanche AA was great character work but I just wish that the path to get there was better. I think the arguments presented in this thread are fair points about somebody surviving the Cena big match bombs and coming out on top being a major breakthrough. But this felt more like just a major dream match with huge pop-worthy stuff and them kinda as equals. I know that feels like a throwaway statement but to me AJ in the first match outwrestling and out-thinking John for a majority of the match seemed like a more noteworthy development than this. I will say that I'm interested to see where they take Cena with the talk of legacy. He seemed ornery in the build to this plus the first half of the match. This followed over into how he had an attitude with Ambrose in the build to the triple threat at No Mercy. It could just be slow heel teasing, but I wouldn't even mind Cena as a vet who has a right to be sorta standoffish to poor arguments about his commitment and desire.
  21. Jordan
    Tanaka talked shit and gets completely mauled for it. I watch stuff like this and it really is clear that Joe's biggest influence from Japan wasn't really the moves he was doing but it was that Hash aura and way of carrying himself. This felt like one of those 2005 Joe X-Division demolitions. Watching somebody get destroyed by Hash is probably as entertaining as watching peak Shaq put every center in a body bag in the early 2000s.
  22. Jordan
    Nice action packed sub-ten minute match. Zangiev was great in this with his suplexes and power spots plus I loved his reaction to Hash spitting at him. I liked Hash being more subdued in a sense since the danger Zangiev presented with all his suplexes and subs meant that one too many strikes could spell doom. But when he got his opening he laid it in, as expected. I feel like a Cesaro circa 2013 versus Hashimoto would look a bit like this. EDIT: My initial review for this actually really undersells how great it is lol. Seeing moves like the head scissors that you're used to just being part of the "headlock-head scissors-staredown" sequence to open a match being put to practical use to actually break an armbar attempt and create drama is awesome. Then you've got Zangiev blocking submission attempts while he's on the mat by just standing up and carrying around Hash like he's nothing. Final transition with Hash stuffing Zangiev into the corner and then hitting the flying spin kick rules. MOTYC in a really stacked '89.
  23. Jordan
    2007 Cena really was something else. The stair chuck is awesome even the building up to it with him struggling to get them up is compelling. Love the selling throughout and the "DIEEEEEEEEE" ending is incredible. I think Cena's had a few matches I like more than this but I don't think I like any isolated Cena performance more than this.
  24. Jordan
    Thought Albright was pretty good in this but my god the Akiyama/Kawada interactions. Kawada casually walking away and tagging out after Akiyama was getting fired up might legitimately be one of my favorite things he ever did in a match.
  25. Jordan
    Had this in mind as a rewatch because of how it disappointed me and I......think I like it now? I'm not entirely sure? It's just so frustrating because I think there's stuff here that's top level, stuff that conceptually kinda works and stuff that is just...bad. I loved the opening exchange especially the corner strikeoff where Misawa blocks Kawada's reversal attempt and then back elbows him. I think this kicks into high gear after the early tiger driver on the floor, which lead to Kawada kinda strolling around the ring and regrouping (I actually liked this tactic - no reason to rush back in there if Misawa's not looking to come get you). What comes after is him gaining an opening off Misawa hurting his arm and you get a really gritty segment of the match where Kawada's destroying his arm and trying armbars and throwing him at guardrails. This section sorta gets forgotten as the match moves on and I wonder if attacking Misawa's arm was just a built-in continuous narrative that was going to happen regardless because Taue did it in his TC match against Misawa as well. Ultimately I think the problem is an issue of doubling up on ideas. There's a section of Kawada working the arm (again, conceptually it's not a bad idea considering how Kobashi destroyed it at 1/97 and Taue tries it himself after this), and a section of Kawada working the neck and going for two major sub attempts (stretch plum and the triangle). If you cut the armwork, cut the stretch plum sub attempt section, and just leave the idea being Kawada going for Misawa's neck this feels more complete since you don't have to remember that they more or less move away from some brutal armwork early. And for the sub just leaving the triangle then doesn't momentarily confuse the crowd and they probably buy the spot even more than they already did. Plus cutting the stretch plum segment cuts out two backdrops leaving us at "only" three for the match. So I dunno, I loved the amount of hate that was coming through in this match, I really don't think they had a match where Misawa seemed as pissed off at Kawada as he did here. And '97/'98 shoot-style/njpw influenced Kawada continues to be something I wish had materialized better in AJPW around this time, so I enjoy the bombs+sub idea that seems more in line with a finish Hashimoto would go for. However ultimately the match just has a feeling of being excessive to it that understandably turns people off. But I think this is the best singles match between them post-7/95 other than 1/99.
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