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Everything posted by ohtani's jacket
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Owen worked short gimmick matches with Shamrock, so unless they had a straight match at some point it's tough to make a comparison since Shawn was liable to make a guy look bad on purpose. Not that Shamrock was a bad worker. He was just more adept at shoot style. It's not like Owen was all that great at the time either. That whole era of WWF is checkered if you're looking for great matches.
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The Beginner's Guide To British Wrestling
ohtani's jacket replied to ohtani's jacket's topic in Megathread archive
It's their 6/18/81 match from Wembley Arena. Joint Promotions, or Dale Martin Promotions in conjunction with Joint Promotions if you want to get really picky. itvwrestling.co.uk is the go to site with dates along with britishwrestlingarchive.co.uk, but you have to use the way back machine for the latter. That's a bollocks version of the "fight" though as they've dubbed over the top of Walton. EDIT: Okay, it was only an intro. -
Great Match Theory is okay as a theory, it just has a poncey name. Might as well go all the way and call it Auteur Theory. John Tenta was an auteur working within the confines of the WWF studio system to produce iconic works about the fat man's struggle in post-Regan America.
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Tenta was better than Albright, also that is not what I was saying. Williams` resume was greatly padded by his opponents and most wrestlers would have more great matches in that environment than without it. Look at Johnny Ace. Was Tenta better than Albright in UWF-i? Williams was significantly better than Johnny Ace in All Japan. I don't think anyone thinks Ace is a great worker because he had good performances in All Japan. Williams rose to the occasion in All Japan. If he hadn't lifted the standard of his own work, his matches against Misawa and Kawada would have been on the same level as Misawa/Gordy or some other solid albeit less memorable encounter. Besides, if you take away All Japan, Williams still has US work to fall back on. Take away Tenta's best run and his position is far flimsier.
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The problem is they stuck him in there with Mutoh, who was more popular than him but wasn't taking this Tenryu thing seriously. They should have paired him with another lower tier guy like Nogami so that he stood out head and shoulders above his partners; the way Tenryu's poker buddies are only ever there to have Tenryu's back. Hashimoto came across as second fiddle to me despite the bout having little to do with Mutoh. It didn't help that he left his feet so often. I don't think Hashimoto trying to bowl Tenryu over with leg lariats is the most bad ass way to kick start their rivalry. You'd expect to see them go nose to nose or something. There was a cool spot where Tenryu was beating on Nogami and Hashimoto broke it up with a kick to the jaw, but after that they flubbed Hashimoto and Mutoh making the save and the War team stopping them a second time. The finish was weak compared to the usual Japanese tag finish because of the mistimed interference, but they didn't coil the Tenryu/Hashimoto issue around it either, which is kind of a running theme with these WAR vs. NJ tags so far in that they're not that sophisticated. Fun and heated, but not that clever. So far, anyway.
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The New Japan side were way too peppy in this. Tenryu's team looked like he brought his poker buddies along while the New Japan guys were bouncing around playing to the crowd and reveling in their early-nineties-ness. I don't know what Mutoh thought he was doing on the apron, but evidently a blood feud was the last thing from his mind. That spot where the New Japan guys all dropped elbows on Tenryu was the lamest thing I've seen in forever. Ostensibly, the bout was an excuse for Tenryu and Hashimoto go at it, but only one of them was acting badass and it wasn't the New Japan guy. Tenryu punting Nogami was about the only thing I dug here. Which isn't to say it was a bad match, it just wasn't that cool. Who will step up to the plate and match Tenryu for charisma?
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I guess Dave is bored with New Japan this year.
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I'll do a full write up later, but it wasn't my cup of tea. I appreciate what Alex says about them going in a different direction but they left me at the station. Thanks for the upload, though!
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The Beginner's Guide To British Wrestling
ohtani's jacket replied to ohtani's jacket's topic in Megathread archive
Alan Sarjeant vs. Jon Cortez (8/25/76) Alan Sarjeant vs. Jon Cortez, could this be anything less than brilliant? Well, for the first two rounds it was completely mesmerising and I was ready to declare it one of the best WoS bouts ever. Then Sarjeant injured himself from an awkward fall and Cortez easily took the one fall required for victory. It looked like the planned finish, but if so, why couldn't they have gone another two rounds? Bitterly disappointing. -
The 1/8/93 Tenryu/Hara vs. Aoyagi/Kabuki handheld is really good. Four older guys stiffing the heck out of each other while the feud rages on. Ditch called Aoyagi limited, but if anybody knows a guy who does a better karate gimmick let me know. Tenryu vs. Aoyagi is a thing of beauty and the best thing about the Mew Japan feud so far. They absolutely pelt each other every chance they get. Tenryu is a colossal prick and busts Aoyagi open with the heel of his boot, and there's a killer spot where Hara is holding Aoyagi's leg up and Tenryu does this running elbow strike that almost sends Aoyagi's leg two rows back. Tenryu was the goods in this. Momentum swings back in his favour after the ugly Tokyo Dome match.
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The trouble is there wasn't much CMLL taped during that era because everyone wanted to trade AAA. We'll probably never know who had the best year in '94.
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The Beginner's Guide To British Wrestling
ohtani's jacket replied to ohtani's jacket's topic in Megathread archive
THE ARTHUR PSYCHO HOUR Ep 9 Chic Cullen vs. Rasputin (Unknown location, taped 1983) One of the best guys around vs. one of the worst workers I've seen, what's gonna happen? Rasputin was a tall, Rasputin-looking Irishman who some of you may be familiar with from that Fit Finlay documentary. He was a classic kick/punch wrestler with almost nothing else in the way of offence aside from elbows and eye rakes and the occasional choke; but I'm happy to say that on this particular evening goodness won out and Cullen got the best match out of him I've seen. This was a lot of stomping the canvas to make the strikes sound good, but it at least looked like they were laying their shit in and Cullen sold well. Won't blow your mind, but would fool you into thinking Rasputin wasn't that bad if you didn't know better. Get back to me in six months and I'll probably be claming 'putin wasn't that bad, but that's my story for now. Greg Valentine vs. Jimmy Ocean (10/26/88) "Farmer's Boy" Greg Valentine? Shouldn't that be Promoter's Boy Greg Valentine? This was the second to last match on ITV ever. If you haven't seen Jimmy Ocean, he's actually worth checking out. A pint sized little showman with peroxide hair and an 80s tache doing an age old Adrian Street gimmick with a fair bit of panache. Pretty zippy worker and a big bumper; I think he would have carved out a niche for himself in the era of TV stars if he hadn't come along right at the end. Probably as an enhancement talent like Black Jack Mulligan. Marty Jones & Steve Taylor vs. Skull Murphy & Johnny South (8/24/88) This was hands down the biggest disappointment of The Arthur Psycho Hour to date. I thought this had the potential to be really good w/ Jones, Murphy and South all involved, but it was an incredibly shitty attempt at playing WWF style wrestling instead of beating the tar out of each other. It started off promising with South having shaved his head to form The Manchester Hardman with Murphy, who was bedecked in La Parka's wardrobe. Skull cut an amusing promo where he claimed he didn't even know who Steve Taylor was. Jones retorted in his inimitable style. One of the greatest workers to ever live and one of the single worst promos in the history of the racket. Steve Taylor was the older brother of Dave and I guess coming out of retirement for this. He should have stayed retired. This sucked. Murphy and South cheated like brats instead of dishing out an asskicking and Marty spent more time posturing with his lazy eye then proving he was still world class. Taylor might as well have been invisible. Not good. Alan Kilby vs. Colonel Brody (3/5/87) What's a South African colonel doing being valeted by a black French woman? I'd love to say that was a political statement but somehow I doubt it. You've got to love Walton mentioning Brody was born in England. Why don't you just tell everyone that he's Magnificent Maurice, Kent? You know you want to. They barely aired any of this, but I doubt we missed out on much. Gary Clwyd vs. Jack Davey (Porthmadog, taped 1988) I had to ask on another forum whether Mike Jordan and Jack Davey were one in the same or separated at birth, and it turns out that they are two different people and that Davey was a ref for Orig Williams. I'm not sure whether that means he was a legit proper worker or not because he looked like the world's poorest version of Mike Jordan and I've never been that high on Jordan, but man were they the splitting image of each other. -
Santo seems as good as anyone else in trips that year. Rey and Psicosis weren't as good as they'd become in '95. Panther might have had a case if the Octagon matches hadn't been so bad. Satanico fell off in '94, and Patka and Lizmark were victims of Pena's irritating booking. I always have positive things to say about Mano Negra in '94! My pick would have been Dandy if he'd shown me anything outside of the Llanes feud and maybe some exchanges opposite Casas. I'm figuring it has to be an AAA guy.
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That was pretty funny. Jerry should make an appointment to see a shrink.
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You should watch his peak years from '96-99. I don't know how much of it is online still. Real Man's Man uploaded a bunch of it, but it was on Megaupload and went poof. I'm not a huge fan of the BattlARTS style, and I'm kind of anti tag matches in shoot style, but I do like Ishikawa and you probably won't have as many hangs-up as me. Plus you get to check out guys like Ono. Also worth checking out, if you really get into him, is his PWFG stuff. Looking through my old shoot style list on WKO, I have these matches listed as worth watching: Yuki Ishikawa vs. Alexander Otsuka (2/28/97) Yuki Ishikawa vs. Hiroyuki Ito (10/9/04)
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The NBA Playoffs are pro wrestling
ohtani's jacket replied to goodhelmet's topic in Pro Wrestling Mostly
Warriors aren't playing as well as you said they would, Elliot. The Cavs are uglifying things. It's Choshu vs. Tenryu out there. -
If Tenta could have had all these great matches in mid-90s All Japan then how come Albright didn't? Williams not only held up his end of matches but grew as a worker in the promotion. Don't agree with this "plug and play" theory at all.
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I can't speak for why people pimp modern day Parka matches, but it may have something to do with the fact that lucha brawls aren't what they used to be, particularly in CMLL. Similar to how maestros wrestling became a throwback for the old-school title match style, perhaps Parka brawls are a throwback to how wager matches used to be. I dunno. Just a theory.
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I'm not a fan of the Mesias stuff, or even the Wagner stuff tbh, but I do remember liking the Monterrey brawl with Santo. It doesn't seem like you really dig the gimmick, though. Half the appeal with Parka is the dancing skeleton guy is having violent, bloody brawls.
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WoS was chock full of heels. Aside from Breaks, the only ones people would consider super workers are Rocco and Finlay. For gimmicks, Tally Ho Kaye was always enjoyable. Brian Maxine was a shameless self-promoter and created a tremendous Jerry "the King" Lawler style gimmick for himself that allegedly predated Lawler. Boscik after he turned heel, especially against Grey whom he had tremendous chemistry with. Kendo Nagasaki in small doses. The Caribbean Sunshine Boys, which had a underlying racial element to it, but Kincaid especially was a brilliant heel. Skull Murphy, a bruiser who grew on me to become one of my top 10 workers of the 80s. Sid Cooper, who was perhaps the closest in character to Breaks and tremendous at putting over the faces. Bobby Barnes, who was the tag partner of Adrian Street and carried on the exotico gimmick when Street went to the indies. Steve Logan, the tag partner of McManus, but I think you'd find him a bit boring. Tony "Banger" Walsh, who basically made being a rugby player into a gimmick. These were all guys who appeared regularly.
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There are a number of Saint matches I'd recommend, but largely because of his opponents. He may have looked good against Breaks; then again pretty much everyone looked good against Breaks from '72 through to '84 in the footage we have available. That's one of the reasons why Breaks was on TV so often. It's not until you see Saint against guys you've never heard of, where Saint is the focal point of the bout and the driver of the action, that you start to realise he's not capable of much more than a wink and a smile and an exhibition in escape holds. I've gone back and forward on guys in the seven years I've been doing this, but not with Saint. It doesn't help that for a long time he was treated as the poster boy of the old-school WoS style, which I kind of resent, but it's mostly because he doesn't have the same body of work as so many of the others. Even accounting for the fact that he wasn't a dramatist, his exhibition style isn't as fun as a guy like Ken Joyce or even Faulkner if you like his smart aleck shit. I do like Saint's early 70s work and he was good in the late 80s in the German tournaments, but Breaks and Grey blow him out of the water.
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This is interesting. If you just go on talent then I think Casas has it sewn up for 1992 and 1993, but had a bit of a drop off in '94 from what I've seen. I like the idea of Fuerza for '91, but wonder if Pirata Morgan isn't a bit of a darkhorse candidate. 1994 is tough. It would require watching more AAA than I care to. Perhaps Santo?
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Even though we don't have a lot of footage, Sangre Chicana clearly had an all-time great year.
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Any Harley matches in particular? I agree it's not commonly mentioned. Believe it or not, I'd start with the Hogan feud. They had good matches together. Harley adapted better to working in the WWF than a lot of young territory workers, IMO. Really nice veteran run in an environment where you wouldn't expect him to do well.
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You don't like the Destroyer bouts?