Johnny Sorrow

It never ceases to amaze me how many people will spend endless amounts of time bitching about a wrestling product, but because it's wrestling on TV they can't stay away. What they CAN do, however, is decide not buy PPVs. See: TNA. May be funnier than the cartoon: At least it wasn't one of Will's comps that he broke in anger. Wow. I think it's time for a new boyfriend. That shit is pathetic. All I think is, "This guy has a girlfriend and I haven't had a long term relationship in years. I stink."

I was at this Starrcade, but this match was at the Omni and we were at Greensboro. So we watched this on a big screen live. At the time I was a huge Garvin fan, and I didn't consider Bubba to be an actual wrestler. I know that sounds crazy, but work with me here. To me, he was Jim Cornette's bodyguard...not a wrestler. If I had ever seen him as a job guy on TBS I certainly didn't remember it. So to my 16 year old self, I thought Bubba sucked. However, since it was a Louisville Street Fight, and I was born in Louisville, part of me wanted to cheer for Bubba. A few years later, actually, when I was going to U of L, I used to joke with my college pals that I wasn't scared to go to the rough part of town to buy beer and weed because I knew how to Louisville Street fight thanks to a wrestling match that taught me all I needed to know. Watching it again now. Bill Apter's looking fit and trim in his PW T Shirt. I love the soda spot in Bubba's eyes. Since it's Atlanta, I'd guess it burned Bubba's eyes cause it was more moonshine than soda. I love that Bubba used a roll of nickels, where as later Tully would use a roll of quarters. Not only are nickels worth less than quarters, they also don't pack as much punch. Then again, Dusty must have made sure that he got bloodied by a higher currency. Tommy Young seems gayer and gayer every time I rewatch stuff. He's fabulous and still my favorite ref. And I call bullshit on all this "concussions make you a maniac" shit. I mean, if it was true Tommy Young would have massacred a town First Blood style by now considering how many times he's been knocked out. Bubba's super green here, but it's a fun brawl. You can totally see the seeds of how great he'd become. And Garvin's his typical killer self.

Hey, any excuse for me to post this video Naylor made some years back. Ravishing and Raging fucking ruled.

Huh, the place I looked it up must've got it wrong cause it said 12/86 was a WorldWide show. The title change was on TBS Saturday Night.

No he's talking about Ravishin' and Ragin' vs. Rock N Roll Express (WWW 12/86). But that's not the title change.

It never ceases to amaze me how many people will spend endless amounts of time bitching about a wrestling product, but because it's wrestling on TV they can't stay away. What they CAN do, however, is decide not buy PPVs. See: TNA. I think the funniest thing in that cartoon is the t-shirt in the last panel.

This got a laugh out of me.

Oh, trust me. Speaking as someone from Jersey, lots and lots of people continue to be angry that the Giants and Jets play in Jersey and are still billed from NYC. I was goofing around with my post there, and I really don't care. But believe me, there's a ton of resentment in Jersey about the football teams.

I forgot, Punk taking the cover of the Spanish announce table and replacing it with a bow to the announcers was fucking hilarious.

I liked it. What can I tell ya? Here's something I don't like. Mania is in New Jersey, not New York. This whole "NY/NJ" stuff is fucking horseshit. I LOVE NYC, always have. But Mania is in Jersey, period. Fucking typical Jersey disrespect.

Man, you love everything. You are a joy. Well, what wasn't there to like? Show/ Del Rio was good stuff. Del Rio is an outstanding face and Show rules. The tag match was fun, and I love watching those four guys work.The Rumble was a stone fucking blast. The surprise guys were actual surprises, and it was just a great Rumble match. I loved the Godfather deal. I remember joking on a radio show that The Godfather should just have always had his music hit, dance out with the broads, go around the ring, and dance back up the ramp to the back. No shitty match and the fans get what they want. AND THEY DID IT! The Rhodes boys fighting each other and then teaming up to beat up Ziggler to go back to fighting each other was fucking awesome. Great Rumble. I loved Rock/ Punk. Sue me. I especially liked Vince coming out and saying "So the lights went out, do you think we're stupid?" But, MAN, did Rock just look like he dwarfed Punk? And not just muscles. It's weird, Punk never really looked small against Cena or other bigger guys, but he looked like a midget at times compared to Rock. And Rock beat Punk for the god damned belt. I marked. Punk has done such a great job lately of being a hateful, entitled, smarky, douchebag... that I wanted the Rock to kill him.

I fucking loved this show. What a blast. And I loved Rock/ Punk, even if Punk looked like Max Mini with Rock draped on his shoulders. I loved the dejected look the late twenties bearded smart fan had when Cena and Rock won. Ha, fuck that guy.

Not for nothing, but Alberto Del Rio is a really great babyface.

The thing is, the WWF treated both matches as virtually the same. Both had no build. And Muraco/ Orndorff SHOULD have had a build. When they announced the card, me and my pals were all, "Cool, Muraco vs. Orndorff" but that match didn't make or break one ticket sale. Unless Muraco and Paul had relatives in Long Island that night. And then the match sucked a giant cock, on top of everything. The Nassau part of Mania 2 was so fucking awful. And as we move on, I think the best lesson to be learned here is , if you want to piss me off and send me into a crazed argument, shit on Jimmy Valiant vs. Paul Jones and His Army.

I love Philadelphia.

I loved how the World Class announcers would generally take PY Chu Hi at face value while Lance Russell was all, "Who are you kidding, Hickerson?" Tommy Rich & Eddie Gilbert vs. Phil Hickerson & The Spoiler (Tennessee Street Fight 6/25/84) "This match fucking ruled. I remember the first time I saw Phil Hickerson on TV and I totally didn't buy into him being tough. He looked old, fat, and bald. I was a teenager at the time, so of course I was stupid as fuck. It was around 1984-85 during my yearly visit to spend a week with my family in Louisville. One of the highlights for me each visit was watching Memphis TV on the one or two Saturdays I was there. I don't recall much about Hickerson except what I mentioned before. But now, looking back? Holy shit, he was fucking awesome. This match was so great. What a bloody mess, I always loved that Memphis ringcover. It always looked like you could get Hepetitis off it. "

I love the Flair/ Chris Adams match from 2/3/84. Here's what I wrote about it at DVDVR when the Texas set came out. "I just started watching this one, and Ric Flair's entrance and pre-match stuff is just fucking incredible. It's all real subtle as he slightly acknowledges the couple of guys cheering for him, and slyly blows a kiss at some chick, as he walks to the ring. He's taking his time, being cool as this "Chris Adams" is to him, just another local hero/ flavor of the week. But since Sunshine is in the ring, he can't resist telling her over the mic, that she's "the only woman there not cheering for him." Adams is introduced to the screams of hundreds of women and he makes a point to let Flair know it. Flair keeps his swagger by ignoring Adams exists. The two come close to each other as the ref is about to ring the bell, but Flair is casually looking at Sunshine while flexing one pec at her. Awesome. The ref rings the bell, and Flair offers a handshake to Adams, as if to say, "Nothing personal, I'm the fucking champ. Let's get this exhibition on." The match starts and Flair is still more concerned about Sunshine, who looks to him to be about as easy to bang as any other chick, "but she's cheering for this Adams kid. Isn't that cute?" They start to have a straight forward wrestling match and Flair is outclassing him, even getting out of an armlock by lifting Adams up and gently sitting him on top of a turnbuckle corner in a show of "You're outclassed here, kid." Then Adams shows up Flair on a series of switchback armbars and holds and Flair starts to look a little concerned. Flair tries some fists and gets it right back and now the SHIT IS ON. Flair starts kicking his ass and Sunshine tries to get involved, but now Flair is all business kicking at her to get the fuck out of the way. They go at it tooth and nail and Flair even hits a Flop after an enziguri so fast it looked like he busted his nose and he sold it that way for a second. Adams hits the SUPERKICK out of nowhere and Flair hits the mat, but manages to roll toward the ropes as he lands. He escapes the pinfall with a foot on the ropes. They go at it awhile longer and Adams leaps facefront into the corner and springs back at Flair with a bodypress, the momentum rolls them over and wily Champ Flair hooks the leg and rolls him into a 3 count from the immobile Bronco Lubbich. Flair then is all worn out, has a new respect in his face for Adams, but is holding THE BELT. It's totally the Flair "I didn't expect THIS! Who is this kid?" match set-up and it works like a fucking charm. AWESOME match. "

Oh, between Mania 2 and Mania 3 Vince totally started making sure there were angles for almost everyone. And I'm not saying there weren't mid card angles in WWF at the time. I'm saying that for awhile there weren't a lot, compared to JCP, where it felt like everyone had a program. Compare Mania 2 to Mania 3 and it's night and day. But in 86 what sold tickets was "WWF" and "Hulk Hogan", until the last few months of the year when Piper turned. Hogan's best drawing angle in 86 was the Orndorff fued, because there was a great angle behind it, but people still would go to shows if Hogan was on the card as Hulk Machine. In 86 it really felt like WWF was coasting on grabbing names, giving them nothing to do, being a sensation/ hip deal, and thinking that was good enough. Come late 86/ early 87 Vince really started turning it around as far as lots of angles. And I remember Meltzer reporting that Vince considered not doing a Mania 3 because 2 sucked so bad. Mania 2 Paul Orndorff vs Don Muraco : No one cared Randy Savage vs. George Steele :This was a program Jake Roberts vs George Wells : No one cared Mr. T (w/ Joe Frazier & the Haiti Kid) defeated Roddy Piper (w/ Lou Duva & Bob Orton Jr.) in a boxing fight : This was a program, but no one really wanted to watch a fake boxing match. Fabulous Moolah vs Velvet McIntyre : No one cared Crpl. Kirshner vs. Nikolai Volkoff: Thewy tried to make us care by saying "FLAG MATCH" but no one cared Andre the Giant won a 20-man WWF/NFL battle royal : This was over as fuck because of Perry being in it. British Bulldogs vs Greg Valentine & Brutus Beefcake: This had a program, as it was the Bulldogs "last chance". Ricky Steamboat vs Hercules : No one cared Adrian Adonis vs Uncle Elmer : No one cared Terry & Dory Funk Jr. vs. Tito Santana & the Junkyard Dog: Best match on the card, and had a program, as JYD was feuding with the Funks and Tito was his best friend. Hulk Hogan vs King Kong Bundy : Of course, this had a program. Starrcade 86 Tim Horner & Nelson Royal defeated Don & Rocky Kernolde: No one cared Brad Armstrong vs Jimmy Garvin : This had some TV build Hector Guerrero & Baron Von Raschke vs Shaska Whatley & the Barbarian: This was part of the Valiant/ Jones angle Krusher Khruschev & Ivan Koloff vs Bobby Jaggers & Dutch Mantel: These two teams had some TV dedicated to the feud Wahoo McDaniel vs Rick Rude: Also, part of the Valiant/ Jones angle Sam Houston vs Bill Dundee: This had some tv dedicated to it , but no one cared. Jimmy Valiant vs. Paul Jones: The final match in a 3 year long feud. And set up Manny and Rude as a team at the end. Big Bubba vs Ron Garvin: Garvin and Cornette had been feuding Tully Blanchard vs Dusty Rhodes : Goes without saying The Road Warriors vs the Midnight Express: Goes without saying Ricky Morton & Robert Gibson vs Arn & Ole Anderson: Goes w/out saying Ric Flair vs Nikita Koloff : Goes w/out saying (And even though they were all kayfabe, only hardcore fans bought the mags back then.)

It makes perfect sense and explains exactly what I was talking about. WWF circa Mania 2-3 had a lot of names, but didn't do anything with them. It's meaningless depth to have name guys with no programs. And you're right, around 87-88 Vince DID do a lot more as far as giving almost everyone programs and a reason for their programs. But your argment is wrong. Names with no reason for fans to get invested outside of just names are just window dressing and no one cared. And that's fine. But a stacked card is a card stacked with wrestlers having matches that fans care about, not the names. And people flocked to see the WWF in 86 because they generally didn't care about all that. They went because The WWF itself was huge. Vince managed to convince the general public that the only wrestling that mattered was the WWF, and it was a selling point just to go to see the WWF. If Hogan was on the card then bonus. You yourself said that "Memphis is a mystery" to you, as you can't understand why it was so successful. You then poo poo'd it aside as just a territory, but I think that's telling. You're having a hard time grasping that it isn't the fame or number of the names, that defines "depth". And shit like "Mr. Sorrow" stinks. Don't do that, chief.

I bet Will cooked and ate a whole pizza while reading that.

That's it. And it was Victor Rivera I was thinking of, not Spiros Arion.

The Dusty set is fucking awesome, and the 4 Horsemen in the 80's mega set is amazing.

Speaking of that California promotion, does anyone else remember it or have any details? I can't find anything. I THINK John Tolos was in it and Spiros Arion as well but I could be completely wrong. I do remember a team called Hollywood Blondes.

Cabana had Hornswoggle on his latest show and it's fantastic. He has road stories of him, Mark Henry, Khali, and Diavari sharing a car; and they put to rest douchebags who take their dislike of Hornswoggle to weird levels. http://tsmradio.com/coltcabana/