Kronos
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Great thread! 6-8 years ago, I was huge into women's wrestling (even flying to Chicago for the SHIMMER 19-20 tapings). But I have long since fizzled on it all. The NXT gals have really piqued my interest again, and your guide to current joshi is going to help a lot in catching up on what's happening.
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That all makes perfect sense. I just watched this Backlund/Koloff match for the first time the other day. As someone not used to the blood-stoppage gimmick, I was all WTF JUST HAPPENED??!! I almost rioted.
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Is that the one where they spend half the match with their head stuck between the other dude's knees? That does turn out to be a pretty good match and well worth watching, but the blood stoppage does seem kind of out of nowhere.
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www.keepvid.com also works
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Watching USWA 1990. Southern Rockers? Really? They even have the ribbons on their arms.
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One of the things this commentary demonstrates is how well kids will respond to a basic heel and face dynamic. Watch how they comment on obvious but little things like Jessie refusing the hug from Bayley or Tye being a jerk. It's refreshing.
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If I used signatures on this forum, I would steal this line for mine.
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I have been watching the 6/27/77 MSG on the Network, inspired by this thread. Superstar/Bruno is far from a technical wonder, but Bruno carries him to lots of fun times. Also, Andre/Strongbow vs Volkoff/Patera is terrific. Did Bruno ever wrestle Backlund? I am guessing not, since they were both faces. But I have seen two Bruno matches lately that I quite enjoyed. I am coming around on the guy finally, and I would curious to see that match-up.
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18:39 Graham cuts one of his classic promos before the match. Bruno looks great here with his 'fro and pornstache. He comes out guns blazing, and the crowd eats it up. He dominates for awhile, with Superstar doing a lot of cowardly heel schtick. Things slow down when they do an extended sequence of trading full nelsons. But even then it's not so bad because the crowd's excited about everything. It's been awhile since I watched any Superstar. I forgot how limited he really was - friggin Goldberg had a bigger move-set. Full nelson, bear-hug, test of strength, a few bumps. Not much even by 1970's WWWF standards. But this match really makes me appreciate the skills of prime Bruno, as he carries Graham to something that is way more entertaining than it has any right to be. Flair himself couldn't have done better with this broomstick.
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2/3 Falls, 16:25 Oh man, this one starts out fun! Andre lifts Strongbow into the ring (to not muss his headpiece?). Jay apparently has a major beef with Capt Lou and eventually chases the manager out of the ring and back to the locker room. I have never seen Strongbow this energized. From there, it's just awesome moment after awesome moment: Andre stealthily tagged in while Patera showboats. Strongbow coming off the ropes and sliding between Volkoff's legs to tag Andre. Patera and Volkoff fighting each other outside the ring, following the first fall. Patera does an extended sleeper, which could be boring as heck. But Volkoff does some stooging to distract the ref, and Andre is able to reach half way across the ring and tag Strongbow's foot. They keep a resthold segment interesting until Andre gets a hot tag. In the second fall, Patera and Volkoff continue the arguing I mentioned above. Incidentally, Volkoff throws some nice-looking punches. Not saying much since I haven't seen many, but I have never seen a better match from Strongbow. If this is how he acted in his younger, less lazy years, then it's no wonder the crowds loved him so much. Volkoff, too, I only really know from his broken-down comedy villain years in the mid-80s. It's a treat to watch him mobile and motivated. -
Yes Piper came back a shell of himself in terms of Charisma and heat. He seemed to be go on cruise control and came off corny rather than edgy. Would you say that he had a taste of Hollywood and came back bitter that it never worked out for him? I wonder what changed.
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His Memphis work is awesome and he could have been one of my favorites of the 1990s if he was stuck in Memphis or Dallas the entire time. After Memphis, I agree with every single thing you said. Jarrett played the church youth pastor at the beginning of SPRING BREAKERS. He played it so perfectly according to my memory of Baptist youth pastors when I was a kid in Dallas that he gets a pass from me. YMMV
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After a couple of high risk moves that end up outside the ring, they settle into an extended sequence where Kikuchi sits on the mat like Baby Huey. Hashikawa throws kick after kick, which K completely no-sells with a "ho hum bored now" look on his face. It goes from awesome to amusing to when-will-this-end. Then you come back full circle and start to wonder if Hashikawa can actually come up with a strike that will work. Sadly, nothing comes of it. Eventually, Kikuchi gets bored and stands up. He no-sells a few more strikes, and then they move into a plodding your turn-my turn rest of the match. I found most of this one to be a bit of a snoozer. The out-of-nowhere kimura submission that ends the match is pretty great, though.
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Couple of matches from OVER THE EDGE '98. Bradshaw/TAKA vs Kaientai - this was awesome. I love how the Kaientai guys just scatter anytime B gets tagged into the match. When he's not in the match, they all get to work a simplified MPro match, and it's super fun. Later they swarm Bradshaw and stun him for a moment, which leads to their showboating a little bit. Until he wakes up and stands up like the Hulk or something, flinging tiny Japanese bodies everywhere. The highlight for me is TAKA getting fastball-specialed over the top rope to the floor. Austin vs Dude Love - great main even brawl. What shocks me the most is how many nasty-looking bumps Austin takes on the concrete. Foley's crazy, so I can understand his taking those bumps. But Austin's not the healthiest body, and it seems unwise.
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Pro Wrestling Moves in Other Sports
Kronos replied to theconstipatedsmark's topic in Pro Wrestling Mostly
Some years ago, I tried my hand at some jiujitsu. One night, I was was rolling with a dude and ended up trying to use a leg scissors choke. Eventually, I stopped trying. We laughed about it. He said it didn't do a thing towards choking him out. -
I have been watching a bunch of matches tonight, and this long one was the last. I confess to only half watching it. The most entertaining thing was wondering what un-PC thing Russ Davis was going to say next. This match deserve a second, more focused look.
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Just starting the match. But I have to say it felt really weird when I realized not only that the commentary is in English - but that it's friggin JR??!! Weird.
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Agree that this match is decent but not world-shaking. This match ends with another example of the dick-ish things babyface Hogan used to do: After the match, Hogan grabs Heenan and beats him up. This is a guy who could be twice his age and half his size. Hogan has already beaten Orndorff. But somehow he feels the need to rough up a little dude?
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[1987-01-03-WWF-Boston, MA] Randy Savage vs Bruno Sammartino
Kronos replied to Kronos's topic in January 1987
The most basic of heel/face psychology going on here: Randy has insulted Bruno, calling him "washed up". Bruno needs to defend his own honor and teach this loud-mouth punk kid some respect. Randy proves what a coward he is, several times hiding behind Liz and taking every opportunity to cheap shot Bruno. In fact, he's only in control when he's not playing fair. Bruno has right on his side - as well as a fairly rabid crowd. When he's in a fair fight, he dominates. It's a tricky line to walk for booking your young star. Do you have him humiliated by the obviously fatter, older man? Or do you have him demolish the old man and risk turning Randy's healthy heat into x-pac heat? It works here. They kept it simple and didn't spend too much time. Highlight: Three refs trying to break Bruno's bear hug after the match. It tales half the locker room to finally do it. -
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x33agko
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There's a sequence early on that includes a handstand, a headscissors, and a suicida. It's rather slow and choreographed, but it's still pretty awesome. I like how NC comes back into the ring all pissed off at having been manhandled that way. Titan pays him back with a badass stretch submission. It was nice to see a submission recognized quickly as such. That's probably a case of rushing the fall, as you guys mention. But it works for me. How can you not love this dude? Watch him running around outside the ring, laughing and enjoying himself after a good spot hits well. Negro! Negro! Negro Casas!
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"One member of the dreaded Four Horsemen!" Remember when being only a 5x World Champion was something to be astonished about? I was just thinking about this very thing. Flair gives so much to his opponents and acts like a chickenshit coward. But he never seems to come across weak. He knew just how much to use, and it worked a charm. (PS - thank god the crowds weren't Woo'ing chops yet.) I sometimes think about what would have happened if the roads had reversed: Sting to WWF, and Warrior to Crockett. Sting doesn't do anything more than Warrior was doing at this time. What if Warrior had worked the big program with Flair in 1988? Would he have learned how to sell and how to put over his opponents? Would he have have developed into a better worker who had respect for the business?
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[1983-01-01-WWF-Championship Wrestling] Ray Stevens vs Curt Hennig
Kronos replied to Kronos's topic in January 1983
The official time is 4:43, and it looks like a squash. Hennig gets about 90% of the offense. Stevens sells and bumps like a MoFo, too. In the end, Curt makes a rookie mistake that allows Stevens to take the win -- much to the crowd's displeasure. My favorite spot: Hennig throws a dropkick that barely touches Stevens with the tips of his toes. Stevens goes flying out the ropes and onto the floor. I always forget just how soft and floppy early 80's WWF ropes were. They could never have done modern high spots on them. But then, the modern ropes make it all but impossible to do the "choke yourself" spot we see in this match - as Foley of course discovered in 1993. -
This one starts out as a fun little quick TV match, with Barrett playing the large bully to Dolph's scrappy underdog. Wade dominates until Dolph gets a lucky pin. (by the way, it's interesting how the match is showing Barrett to be dominant, while Booker T spends the whole first fall talking about how Wade has never lived up to his potential) After the match, Barrett throws a massive tantrum and beats the shit out of Dolph. Following said beating, Corporate!Kane comes out and declares the match to be 2/3 falls. Fittingly, Barrett wins the second fall in a matter of seconds. "Look at how interesting and compelling this is!" Thanks, Bradshaw. The third fall continues the Barrett dominance. Dolph gets a couple of shots in to signify that he's scrappy. I don't know how Dolph was booked in the months leading up, but I don't feel like he's particularly harmed here. Enjoyable match that really puts Barrett over as a vicious monster. But please, why is Booker T on the announce table? He sucks so hard.