El-P

They won't until they are absolutely forced to. As long as they can have Brock, can bring back Goldy, legit fantasize about having that Rock match at Mania and as long as Roman is not going to Hollywood, they just won't. One reason is that they SUCK at booking, of course. They other is that they have pre-existent and dated idea of what a star should be. They have learned nothing from the Bryan Danielson years, nothing. The concept of not wanting anyone with actual wrestling experience because they want to brainwash model their own workers from the very start won't make things better. No one will learn how to get over in a company that doesn't let anyone actually get over unless it's a pre-planned decision. Meltz mentioned the Brock interview in which he criticizes the younger guys who "don't know how to make money and get over", which is ridiculous coming from someone who was destined to be pushed as a big star even before day one (much like Orton or Roman BTW). No one will ever get over organically in this company anymore.

MAJOR FACEPALM And they seem proud of the idea too, considering this is the official Twitter account. This company, for fuck's sake. Zero conscience whatsoever.

Arabic is the most talked Semitic language in the world, ya know... And yeah, I know what you mean, but it's not like Goldy has not been cheered over there before. #Influencing the world my ass. To me this shows really have been the wrestling equivalent of the Overtone Window. At first there was some outcry about it, now it's like, nobody cares, business as usual. When really, it isn't. Then again, how are the Olympic Games in China going ? Uyghurs concentration camps ? What's that ? Hey, a Gold medal, play our national anthem now !

Yeah, it's insane he worked for so long at that ridiculous level while being so banged up. Vertigo, for fuck's sake.

Oh, for sure, it was an important part of the show. The match itself wasn't that great and tons of smokes and mirrors (Aldis just isn't that great), but it played as a memorable moment. Just like Cody vs Dustin looked like the biggest match coming off Double of Nothing to a lot of people. Funny thing in retrospect, is that if you look at the booking of Cody's big matches, there was always that aspect of him doing the "Codyverse", of sorts. From winning the NWA Title like his father, to the match against his brother, to creating the TNT Title, everything was more or less about his own little heritage. Meanwhile, the Elite, and by that I mean Omega, Hangman & the Bucks, basically booked themselves into a long-term storyline (referred around here in what I find to be an annoying and honestly ridiculous derogatory term as "Elite drama", when in fact it's just good storytelling based on actual personal relationships and long-term history through several promotions) designed toward one goal : making Hangman Page a legit main-eventer. That was the entire purpose from day one, from the split from the Elite to the tag-team with Omega, to the betrayal through Callis, the Bucks heel turn in a Bullet Club reunion of sorts to finally Hangman beating Omega with the Bucks looking out and not interfering. Cody had basically no role in this and once he got done with the TNT title reigns, the last real good thing he did in the company, getting over many people in the process, it seems he had no direction anymore, and this is where he gets lost into the jingoist promo and lost the love of the AEW audience. In the end of the day, the name of the company was All Elite Wrestling, and it seems that Cody, by getting estranged with the Elite in more than a kayfabe way, lost the sense of a common vision for the company because of his own tunnel vision, which was all about his dad's name legacy.

No shit ! For that reason only I want to see it, it would be epic on that level alone. And ridiculous stiffness too, as White, for as light a frame he's got, throws really wicked chops.

Not sure putting a bunch of big men in a ladder match is the brightest idea ever though. Especially Keith Lee, the last thing he needs is to get injured again. Intriguing choice though. Hobbs is a cool choice, he's also much better than Wardlow. Jay White vs Trent was a great TV match. White is still one of the best wrestler in the world, watching him is taking a masterclass. It's tricky because both are heels and I guess Jay is not here for the long haul at all, but White vs Danielson is a dream match of mine, that would be a ridiculous level of brillance. Jade's outfit !!! Hey, I'm all for a match against the Bunny, that's a pretty cool mix. Yeah, Jeff Hardy is coming BTW... It's interesting focusing on Adam Cole's work (which I'm not overly familiar with, since I only seen like two NXT matches before), because he really comes off like a total star despite the fact he's really small (let's be real) and not the greatest athlete around. Again, watching him work against #10, who looked quite good, is like taking a lesson. So many tiny little stuff he does that makes him stand out. Of course he's a great mechanic too, which doesn't hurt, great control of timing and space. That bump he took on the lariat was godlike. No wasted motion either, even in the little steps he takes. That guys knows...

Like I could not love Bret more than I did. Bump him one spot higher on GWE.

She's a Cancer too. Well, apparently she is.

This thread is completely baffling to me with all the praise for this match, with a few exceptions. Even not considering the godawful booking that contributed to kill NJPW in the 00's, this match, like every other Hashimoto vs Ogawa match, was the drizzling shit. Don Frye and Scott Norton had a WAY better match (not hard, but I mean, it was quite good) based on MMA guy vs wrestler. Ponder that for a second or two. Piss poor work as usual from Ogawa (I wonder if even Takada in his prime would have gotten a decent match out of him), Hash gets a few little flashes of really cool spots, like turning one STO into a DTT, or the leg swipe when he enters the ring, but he already looks like a shell of his former self, following one year and a half of legit character assassination by Inoki. Sure, it's heated. So what ? The work is terrible and could have only been redeemed if the right man had won. Not only does that not happen, but the finish is a stupid anti-climatic KO following a bunch of STOs. The only good half-match that happened between those two was the late 99 match, before it turned into STO City. This was not good at all, slimmed down Hash has already lost a ton of aura and self-confidence it seems. Legit one of the worst major feud ever, both in execution (apart from the heated angles part of it) and of course, in booking. Rewatching this entire feud, with an open mind I might add, it's even worse today because Hash comes of even worse than I remembered (and really kills his prime dead, as his last great match appears to be the G1 finals in 98, which really makes it a short stint as a top worker, 5 years at best) while Ogawa is mostly the same (aka, not good). Their 97 match was better than any other one during this entire debacle. No wonder Inoki is so hated by NJPW people today.

So, I guess the Austin level stuff is Taker getting in the HOF. Apart from a Rock appearance, I just don't see anything else. Hogan can't be it, not anymore.

Off the top of my head, it absolutely would be my 2021 MOTY too. Maybe some Takagi match would take it upon further reviews, but I'm not sure about that. Yeah, seems about right.

The fact wrestlers still have to rent cars by themselves is completely ridiculous. How many billions WWE made last year ?

I wonder why he doesn't go by his real name. I mean, Émile Charles Baillargeon-Laberge, easy for you English-speaking folks to say. Just discovered him in IMPACT. He's surely one of a kind (in a very RVD way in that he looks unique). Very interesting guy to watch.

Depends what you call impacting the rest of the match. To me the injured knee of Sammy did impact the match, in the way it flowed. On the other hand, if you spend 15 straight minutes working the leg and then the guy gets back on offense and basically no-sells it (yeah, I've been watching some Koji Kanemoto matches lately), I agree, it's a waste of time and a cop out. Just JIP then for the good parts (wait, that's why NJ matches in the 90's did this !). That being said, I was thinking another thing about this lately : if you know the guy you're working against/with is not interested in (or suck at) doing that kind of sell job and you still insist on going into the "I'm gonna work on a limb" route, then it's on you. The guy is a shit seller (hi Koji Kanemoto !) ? Let's approach this a different way then. To me there's shared responsibilities here. It's a dance. If you know your dance partner can't or is never interested in doing a tango, go for a waltz instead.

KAIRI back to Stardom. A much more exciting and promising news in term of actual content than Cody back in the E.

Great show (only the Warldow segment was meh to me, but although I get why it works for he audience, Wardlow is just meh to me for now) They are setting up one hell of a PPV. Mox vs Danielson, Adam vs Adam (that only would get Vince totally insane), Rosa vs Baker, Punk vs MJF in a dog collar, a three way tag team clusterfuck, a hoss ladder match clusterfuck, Jericho vs Kingston, surely some variation of Sammy vs Andrade vs Darby. Only having 4 PPV's a year is a huge plus, because they can stack the cards and really make every match look big time. The issue is that pro-wrestling today requires a lot more than 20 or 30 years ago. It was okay to sell the shit out of your leg all the time when the biggest offensive move you had to do was a cross body or a fucking discuss punch, but modern pro-wrestling has way past that point. Also, the idea that you can't perform a move because your a limb is damaged is overrated. It very seldom happens, and not just in "modern" (whatever that means, is that the last 10 years, 20 years, 30 years ?) pro-wrestling. Also, if everybody was doing it, at some point every match would look like Ole & Gene working the arm for 30 minutes, and that shit was already boring as fuck in the 70s. Pro-wrestling is a spectacle, big spots (and in this case, finishers) are the hits and the pops, and if the narratives always prevents the players from playing the hits and getting the pops, especially in an important setting like a big TV championship match, then it's simply bad narrative. Which is why when I hear about some case of "smart" pro-wrestling, I kinda roll my eyes because the point is being missed in term of what actual pro-wrestling psychology means. It's *mostly* a relationship between what is produced in the ring (really, a bunch of signs, at a certain pacing, under a certain form) and the audience, way more than an inner narrative dictated by a physiological logic, which itself is completely skewed (because nothing in pro-wrestling makes actual sense, even UWF style was not "realistic", as showed by what actual MMA is). And sure, sometimes body work actually preventing the expected action from taking place is great psychology, and the failed or non-happening spot is actually *the spot* (a negative spot, of sorts), but it should also be reserved from some token moments, making those occurrences even more striking and dramatic. Plus, let's be real, having a body part hurt does not prevent you from using it. Especially if you consider the adrenaline flowing in a context of major championship match. Pain, like fatigue, comes and goes. Sometime, 5 minutes after feeling my knees hurt when I'm training, I feel perfectly fine and even better than before actually. Then I get tired and some body parts shake, then I fell stronger when I do the same routine on the other side a few minutes later. The idea that "leg hurt = can't do this" / "too tired = must long-term sell = can't jump back up" is just not realistic to begin with.

Not an excitable response at all. Just putting things back into perspective. I guess I'm invested because I find the situation pretty fascinating ! Fun times really. There it is. I'm actually not defending anyone, because there's no one to defend, there's no bad guy here, neither Cody nor TK. Seems to me like a bittersweet separation because interests have gone into different directions. As far as "All profits goes to the boss", wait, what ? Just the fact AEW exists is a huge benefit for the entire landscape of pro-wrestling. It's better for the workers who can get paid more than when there's only TNA and ROH in the 00's, not to mention the fact now guys can play both sides to get more money. It's not a matter of being a benefactor offering salaries, it's a matter of actually building a company that stays sustainable in the long haul. Meltz mentioned that TK was adamant since day one that 100% of the promotion was his and that it wasn't a discussion (I mean, he's a capitalist entrepreneur, I love AEW but I'm not wearing rose-colored glass either). Also, it's easier to say they should have battled for equity now with hindsight, but when it started no one knew it would be as successful as it is. Also, I remember Cody's line against unionization, so there's this in term of "defending the boss" stuff. There's plenty of things we don't know, first being why TK did not roll over Cody's contract. Was that because of a money issue ? Because of Cody not being happy because of the booking ? How much Brandi's situation weigh in this ? We just don't know. You're trying to paint the picture of good ol' Cody seeing the picture on the wall (what picture exactly ?) wanting to go out because the "outsider" owner (who from inside had the financials and the contacts to put that operation moving in 2018 exactly ?) has robbed the Elite of whatever booking duties they really never had to begin with, when the situation is a bit more complex than this. Fact : Cody's stint had turned into a complete mess in the last year or so (although he redeemed himself lately with really good performances) while the company was growing due to Omega & the Bucks (those other EVPs who seem quite happy and aren't going anywhere) and bigger profiles (which has a cost) showing up, making Cody less of a focus in the company and for good reasons. In the end, I pretty much agree with this :

Yeah, it's huge for the Spanish speaking fans. Can't even think what the reaction would be if WWE would not use Christophe Agius anymore (he's been doing it for almost 20 years now). I think this would legit hurt them a lot in France (not that they care that much probably considering the market, but still).

The most fascinating thing to me, and probably the most important, is that TK simply did not pick up Cody's option. He picked up all the other ones from the first signees, but not Cody's. So that basically means that if Cody wanted out for whatever reason, TK agreed to let him go, knowing he would be a catch for the opposition.

When did I say "without Khan it's nothing" ? Oh yeah, I did not say that at all actually. I said "Without Khan it does not happen". And without the Elite making waves on the indies and *mostly* Jericho vs Omega in NJPW, it does not happen either. It's the right people at the right time under the right circumstances. But to say that it could have been anyone else, well, ok then, but that's pure conjecture on hypothetical stuff that did not happen. And Khan isn't just a "rich Internet poster", you make it sound like he's a random money mark. He's a long time fan who has studied the business, including the mistakes of the past, and had been thinking for a while about it. Who are the other potential people who could have made it happen ? It's not like no one had tried since WCW collapsed. Jarrett and the Carters have tried, and failed miserably. ROH never reached the mainstream. Still waiting for that Shane Douglas promotion that gives pensions and all... So no, TK did not "take all their momentum and squirrels it off for himself, cuts the head off any individual promotions momentum & makes it about "his" brand.", that's simply not factual at all and really paints him as some carny leeching off of the Elite, which is ridiculous honestly, especially considering how successful they have been thus far. To realize what exactly ? That the company wasn't about him chasing his dad's legacy ? Sure. It never was. The guy managed to turn an audience who absolutely loved him to death against him because of his tone-deaf obsession, really, and it made the product awkward to watch at times. Hell, PWO is the best instance of it, most people here were much more into Cody than they ever were into any other member of the Elite, but by the end the threads were all about making fun of the Codyverse and how awful all that stuff was. And considering he spent the last 5 years talking about making a Revolution and money was not all that mattered and breaking throne and shit, well, he sure gonna get a ridiculous payday (hopefully for him), but his character kinda looks fickle as hell now. Not to mention how he's gonna be booked (come on people, WWE, 2022).

You realize that the promotion just doesn't happen if there is no one with actual money and contacts to make it happen, right ? TK did not cut the head of anything, he made the thing happen. As much as All In was a success, it could not become an actual meaningful promotion without serious financial backing and TV contracts. If TK doesn't make it happen, maybe we get another All In show if ROH is willing to helps again, but probably the Elite signs with WWE, who was throwing big-ass money at Omega. The Khan family put 100% of the money. It was never gonna be anything but their promotion. Everybody knew this from the start. EVP is a job and a title, not an ownership stamps.

To be fair, although All In did play a part, the real kickstarter was Omega vs Jericho in NJPW. This is where TK saw that there was subscription boom in the US. There's a reason why the three guys TK wanted to build AEW around were Jericho, Omega and Punk. Which, in the end, he's been doing. Plus, All In was not all about Cody, at all. The NWA match with Aldis did have traction, but Omega & the Bucks were the bigger stars on the indie scene, ROH and NJPW, which basically was the All In audience. And you had that Okada fellow on the card too... There's a very high possibility of this, indeed. And really, he's not gonna have the same creative input as he had in AEW, for better (the first two years) or worse (ya know...), he's not gonna be seen as the "Head of the revolution" but a guy who crept back to good ol' WWE Universe after being unable to come to term with the hot new promotion he helped create and which is bringing fresh guys WWE was stupid enough to let go (Cole, Keith). Like I said, some people are going to paint it as a major "victory" for Vince, but in reality, it must just be bittersweet for Cody. If he thinks he's gonna take HHH's place on the broken throne, he's quite delusional.

Okada had a great match (I know, shocking) with him just after he left WWE. I dunno, he seems to be really good but at the same time, there are several guys like him already in AEW aka really excellent mechanically but not earth-shattering in term of charisma (Neese, Lethal).