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Everything posted by El-P
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aka Greg Valentine working handicap matches.
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Okay, I can get that. Gannosuke was able to work super fast stretches though, which really was never Valentine's style. But yeah, the back-to-basics approach of Gannosuke was definitely one of his strong points.
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Why the Valentine analogy ? (Don't get me wrong, I love Valentine, but I just never thought about such a comparison)
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There's not a lot about Hase that I like. I don't really like his look, Come on, you gotta love the stache.
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Ten years ago, I would have absolutely done it. Now ? Honestly, the idea of ranking wrestlers has passed me by some time ago. It's not even a fun idea anymore. Where I stand now, I just wanna see who's stock goes up and down depending on what I'm watching, who can be interesting even at the simple "solid" level, stuff like these. I'm nowhere near obsessive enough to binge watch a shitload of matches just to "study" a guy. At this point I know what works for me and what I dislike, and I can be pretty objective about things too (hell, I just praised an RVD vs Test match yesterday). The thing with Takada is, I found absolutely ridiculous the backlash that made him drop from "great wrestler" to "terrible wrestler" status, as an updated canon was being established. Last time I watched a lot of Takada was a few years ago when I went through a lot of UWF 1 & 2. I was wondering what I would think about Takada then, since the backlash had already happened. And the fact is I thought Takada was already pretty fucking good when he was young, and quite the terrific worker by the end of the decade. Meanwhile, Fujiwara's stock has risen a lot with me too, to the point I'd call him a great worker in the early to 2/3rd 80's (in the second UWF he was still very good/excellent but was getting a bit goofier, which always cracks me up when I have to read that he's "pure shoot style" while doing those ridiculous headbutts). Even back 15 years ago I was already saying that Takada was not a great pure "shoot-style" worker, but that he was a terrific "big match" worker. More flair than substance ? Without a doubt. See also, Flair, Ric (pun intended). My favourite shoot style worker, the best ever to me and one of my top 10 favourite workers ever is Tamura. I'm actually much more a Tamura fan than a Takada fan. But the whole Takada deal has almost become a running gag around this place (much like the Raven reference). So yeah, I probably won't make a case, because it's not where the fun of watching wrestling is to me right now (as opposed to waching early TNA and WWECW… wait… something's wrong here). But if I get the urge to watch some shoot style again (or some 80's NJ) before this thing is over, I will surely post my thoughts around here, not only about Takada but about other guys as well.
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Episode 18 was all about Extreme Strip Poker, so the matches were regularly cut off but split screens, which made them hard to follow, and there was no angles at all during the show. CM Punk vs Rene Dupree was another semi-competitive squash, and Dupree looked better this time around, doing some really good bumping and dropkicks. Joey Styles did the same stupid xenophobic joke that I guess he'll do every fucking time Dupree gets in the ring. How creative. Tommy Dreamer vs Twilight Boy could have been a good match but it looked even more rushed than the last one (no idea if it actually was shorter) and there's not much you can amount too working in such a short timing. They go 1-1. Then the main event was a decent Big Show (looking that the worst King Kong Bundy ever with no hair nor beard) & Test & Matt Striker vs RVD & Sabu & Sandman. The match was at its best when Sabu was selling for the heels, especially Test and Striker, whose work I definitely enjoy. He's a bit like a modern Billy Joe Travis. Sandman doesn't bring much anymore, especially without the gimmicks, and RVD does what RVD does in a routine match. But since the show was all about the Strip Poker (which didn't even look like a poker game at all), hosted by Balls Mahoney (who else ?), I'll be remiss if I didn't mention that having the girls already look like a bunch of strippers wearing too much makeup and acting like stereotypical bitches kinda negated the whole purpose of having a strip poker game, ya know. Trinity and Candice Mitchell didn't look attractive at all and didn't display any character either. Maria Kanellis played the airhead and looks much better these days, although she was clearly the third hottest one here. Really, Kelly Kelly looked the most genuine and cute of them all, while Crystal won me over by dropping a Kelis line. Ashley Massaro was part of the fun too, is she the one who ended up doing some escort jobs later ? She, if not, she probably should have judging by her outfit here. Kelly did remove her top but of course hid her boobs the remaining time, while Candice and Maria endend up "naked" (which was blurred, but I'm pretty positive they weren't actually naked) catfighting all over the place. All in all, a pretty stupid segment, with its share of hypocritical sex baiting and mix of vulgar yet prudish behaviour (a bunch of girls acting like strippers, shaking their ass and throwing high heels and stocking onto balls, yet acting grossed out by the idea that Mahoney got a hard-on, which was only eluded to in a semi-comical way anyway… oh, America… ) I'm all for T&A, but this episode was really kinda stupid and the decent looking matches looked like a complete afterthought. Ariel doing her bat routine was more sexy than the entire Strip Poker debacle.
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That's very true. It's easier to forgive when you get used to someone you get to like. Then again, maybe it's not. In the case of Tenryu, it sure helps his case a lot.
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Thanks for the support, because this promotion is getting noticeably worse. PPV 16 had exactly one good match. Syxx-Pac vs AJ Styles started slow, but it built into something really good. You can see Waltman's footprints all over the match, which wasn't worked like your standart X-division spotfest at all. Much more structure and escalation in the use of spots, which is why it took some time to get going (which is infact better, but we're not used to that anymore). The bad part comes from the fact Styles is now managed by Mortimer Plumbtree, which is both useless and actively hurts the match at points. Plumbtree seems right out of early 90's WCW or USWA, and no, it's not a compliment. Apart from that, it ended with a fuck finish to build to a return match. The slower pace also allowed Styles to show more heel charisma and maneurisms here, and he was good at making fun of Waltman's signature spots. The execution was kinda shaky at times, but nothing too bad. The rest of the show. Well. Lots of faceless indy guys like Ace Steel, Wylde, Chris & Rick Micheals in semi-competitive matches that weren't good not entertaining in the least to me. It seems like you're watching the same kind of stuff in every match. Norman Smiley showed up only to be squashed by Ron Harris. ZZZZzzzzz. A bad Siaki vs Estrada indieriffic match. Brian Lawler doing the usual abusive boyfriend routine, only now we know April is probably fucking Syxx-Pac behind his back. A bad Curt Hennig vs Ron Killings main event in which Hennig looked washed up, with more Mr. Wrestling II bullshit and Jarrett run-in. And some ff material involving some race car guy (I think) and Bruce. Not watching that crap. The only enjoyable moments apart from the X-division championship match was two quick interview segments with Mike Tenay, talking with Waltman and Hennig, refering to their personnal history, even going back to Global and the AWA. That was nice. But really, this whole show was a waste of time apart from that one match. Seems like the booking is getting worse by the week. Thank God for that blonde cage dancer. 2002.10.16 Syxx-Pac vs AJ Styles
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Episode 17 was probably one of the most enjoyable overall. No really bad stuff. Big Show & Matt Striker vs Sandman & Sabu was a perfectly watchable short tag match, and the Big Show is a lot more tolerable in this format. I like Striker's chickenshit work. He finally falls into the hands of the Sandman here. Way too short to amount into anything though, but way too short to have the Big Show really ruin the party also. Tommy Dreamer vs Twilight Boy was also a perfectly acceptable Thunder match, I wish I'd see more of fat Dreamer. Thorne still isn't striking me are particulary menacing, but I love Ariel and the bat pose. The vampires steal the win. This is a feud I could live with. CM Punk squashed Danny Doring, all of this being just a backdrop for the angle following the match : Kelly wants to dance for Punk, but Knox prevents her to do so and threatens Punk. This is also a feud I can live with, as I like both guys, and Knox as a jealous boyfriend is muhc better than Brian Lawler (not hard) Much to my surprise, RVD vs Test in an extreme rules match was actually…. good. I mean it's clearly a gimmick shots bomb throwing match, for for what it is, it's way better than it had the right to be, as I don't care for either of these two. They of course did some ugly looking things as far as basics goes (punches, some comebacks, with RVD being the worst at it acually), but in term of working around garbage spots, it was quite good, as they teased the same spot that injured Holly the previous weeks, did some interesting counters that actually made sense (I was already sighing at the contrived set-ups at time only to have the spot being countered, which is always a nice surprise), and sold well. RVD's Rolling Thunder onto the steel steps outside looked amazing, this guy is such a strange beast. Really pleasantly surprised by this, and Test was doing all the right stuff. Of course I have no faith in them having a good match without the gimmicks, but for what it was, and despite the annoying Heyman's security (I hate this kind of gimmick) running in at one point, it was quite good. Next week, Extreme Strip Poker. Maria Kanellis apparently plays a airhead, so that makes her the Dawn Marie of the show. 2006.10.03 : RVD vs Test.
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Not that much Colon over the years (never been very impressed by what I saw until now), although I have a *shitload* of 80's WWC somewhere on a hard drive waiting for me to watch eventually (since I prefer to watch stuff in context, I have no idea when I'll get motivated, I've been pushing this back over and over again for a long time now). I'm also interested in that Puerto Rico is an obvious big time influence on the Japan 90's garbage scene.
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Using Bahu's top 100 FMW matches list (and memory), in chronological order : Hayabusa vs Hisakatsu Oya 8/31/95 (or the 6/27/95 match) Mr. Gannosuke & Yukihiro Kanemura vs Hayabusa & Jinsei Shinzaki 12/19/97 Hayabusa vs Mr. Gannosuke 4/30/98 H (Hayabusa) & Mr. Gannosuke vs Masato Tanaka & Tetsuhiro Kuroda 12/12/99 Kodo Fuyuki vs Hayabusa 9/26/00
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The best FMW worker ever at his peak. It's as simple as this. One of my lost favourites that seems to be totally forgotten at this point, sadly (kinda like The Bloody, for instance).
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I can't believe I haven't said anything about Onita, who's an old huge favourite of mine. Funny that for the longest time he was ridiculously underrated as a worker. But *great* worker ? Let's be fair for once. He's great at being Onita, and he does some stuff better than anyone (work a death match, for instance, which is fitting; milking dangerous spots; crying). But even as a big time Onita fan, I wouldn't call him a great worker. Some of his stuff looks downright awful. Of course the whole is more important than the sum of its part with Onita. Would he make my list ? Without a doubt.
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Hayabusa could be a very good worker when he wanted to be. Super charismatic too, and had a strong connection with the FMW crowd. This poll needs some serious FMW love.
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Judging Tanaka's 20 years career on a bunch of matches he worked in ECW which cattered to the worst instincts of the time (and style) is kinda like judging Jerry Lawer based on the kiss-my-foot match in WWF and "Puppies!". He was never as good as Gannosuke at his peak, but I think I'll have no issue putting him as the second best FMW worker ever (yeah, better than Hayabusa on average although he had a few annoying tendencies). I mostly draw a blank on his post 00's years, but from what I've seen from time to time, he was still a hell of a worker.
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[1999-09-26-WWF-Unforgiven] Al Snow vs Big Bossman (Kennel in a Cell)
El-P replied to Loss's topic in September 1999
Russooooooooooo ! -
Is this a Bam Bam Bigelow special ?
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PPV 15 was awful. The only notable thing was the debut of Curt Hennig, sporting a brand new (ugly and loud) outfit, which he never bothered to get when he was in WCW. Hennig & Syxx-Pac & BJ James vs Brian Lawler & Jeff Jarrett & Ron Killings was decent, although Hennig didn't show much of anything really, and we get the second appearance of Mr. Wrestling III aka soon-to-be-Vince Russo. The rest of show show consisted of a bunch of clusterfucks X-division matches, with stupid booking and restarts and nonsensical finishes (1st contender 4-way Iron-Man match - 1st contender match ending in 60 seconds then a multi-man ladder match for the title). The only other watchable match of that bunch was Harris & Storm vs SAT, which was as "good" as a SAT match can be (Joel seems less worse than Jose, but I'm not positive about this). Chris Rock showed up for no reason. Then we get some appearance by some sport guy and Miss TNA. Yeah. That show was a complete waste. It seems like Russo was gaining more power backstage, which would explain why he would soon write himself into the shows, and why so many stupid gimmick matches and idiotic booking. A terrible show. The highlight was the blonde cage dancer.
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UWFi's Barry Horowitz.
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Well, I was praying to the altar of Volk Han, Tamura and Khosaka about 15 years ago... As far as "realistic", let's not even go there. I might drop that Fujiwara headbutt spot again. And really, nothing is less realistic than a Bitzade Tariel work. Nothing.
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PPV 14 had a few good matches and a lot of bad booking, including run-ins seemingly in or after every match. Low-Ki vs Ron Killings was Killings best match thus far, and Ki deserves a lot of credit for selling so well. They worked it like Killings would take the advantage by brawling, including some interesting spots outside, and it made for a good little dynamic. Post match smelled rotten though, with the shitty run-in of a shitty looking flabby mask guy, which I guess is Mr. Retarded himself. I dread the moment he'll actually get on TV… In the same good match/stupid booking vein, Jerry Lynn vs AJ Styles in a ladder match was really good, expect for a few quicky comebacks (I'm thinking of Styles comeback after the suplex on the ladder outside), with some creative but not contrived use of the ladder, and a good flow until the idiotic end with a Sonny Siaki run-in (the second one of the show) followed by a Dusy finish. Yep. A Dusty finish in a ladder match. Something that really didn't need to happen, but you know who's booking this shit. Anyway… Third good little match was Amazing Red vs Shark Boy (who apparently is a "cult favourite" in late WCW, which is something that totally eluded me when I watched that particular kind of crap), quite indy spotfuesque, but still fun for what is was. I kinda like Shark Boy. On the other hand, SAT vs Flying Elvises was a bad indy spotfu. I really have no time for the SAT. And Sonny Siaki, in complete Rock clone mode (which makes him quite annoying now, as opposed to kinda funny as long as he was an Elvis), doing a run-in didn't do this match any favour anyway. A watchable tag team match between Harris & Storm vs Harris (yeah, Ron) & some dude named Ashley Hudson (who was actually enjoyable as he's an old-school kinda worker) with more threats of this feud turning into the comeback of the dreaded Harris Twins tag team. And a semi-decent main event consisting of Jeff Jarrett & Brian Lawler vs BJ James & Syxx-Pac, with Lawler is total Memphis comedy heel while Jarrett & Syxx were in 99 WWF TV match mode. James was in "I got fat and don't do shit anymore since I used to be a big star, remember ?" mode, and as much as I enjoyed his mic work, his work is very disapointing. The ending saw Jarrett bash a bunch of people with a chair. This is really old already. The most notable thing was an offensive "babyface" promo by Syxx before the match, saying to Lawler that "You treat your girlfriend like a bitch, and as long as you do I'll keep on banging her behind your back.", with the added insult that if he gets nicer he might have the right to watch. Okay, none of this makes sense really, and it's the typical mysoginic shit that Russo loves, as April doesn't even get to react, she's just there to be abused by Lawler and be call a bitch. If that was a take on Jerry & Stacy, well, it was both cryptic, meta and totally useless (not to mention petty and low class). I can't say I missed watching this show very much, and this episode was particulary heavy on stupid shit. 2002.10.02 Low-Ki vs Ron Killings 2002.10.02 AJ Styles vs Jerry Lynn
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That's an argument I'll like to read, since I'd probably agree in the end.
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The Shane Douglas double edition was excellent. The oxycotin story I've heard before (on a KC release I believe), but it's still a fascinating and horrific story. Glad he got out of it. Tons of good stuff in part two also.
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That would have taken some thoughts, patience and trust into Rusev & Lana as a long term viable act. Crazy concept indeed. Rusev & Lana were the only thing of interest to me leading to Mania, and I have absolutely lost every bit of interest into them now. That's a shame, Lana was so good in her heel role.