AWA Thread

[JerryvonKramer]

How come Vince didn't pick up Billy Robinson when he bought out that territory?

 

I mean he took Dino bloody Bravo.

[khawk20]

A big part of the problem is that he shouldn't have been challenging Zhukov, Hayes and Garvin in extended programs (actually I think some of those programs did good in Canada, but you get my point). If they were set on Martel as the ace, they should have done something to get him more credible challengers. I honestly think if they had been booked right both Superstar with Adnan and Larry Z could have been quality challengers at that point for programs. Certainly better than Zhukov, Garvin or Hayes. I also think they would have been better off running face v. face if they were dead set against turning anyone.

Zurkov was a Winnipeg-only thing, and in that one specific market I think it worked great. If they had run it anywhere else, probably not so much.

 

Larry Z had been effectively buried in the mid-card since his arrival in early 1984. He was beaten soundly by Dusty Rhodes on the June 84 St. Paul card in a match that aired in all the tv markets after the fact. that he even got a title shot in Winnipeg was done strictly to have a one-and-done type of challenger to segue to Zurkov's push. Superstar I agree with, although that may have actually been booked: In an interview before the Saito match in Winnipeg, it is noted that Saito is a late sub for Superstar who did not show up. So who knows? A better plan might have been in the offing but a no-show curtailed it.

 

One of Garvin or Hayes would have worked fine...Garvin moreso. Both was overkill, but again I often wonder if the original plan was to have Gordy get the extended program with Rick, only to surmise that he was too unreliable to run a two or three match program in their major markets. Gordy did no-show a lot in the AWA, which is why we ended up with more Hayes-blackell matches.

Garvin-to Gordy would have been considered good booking if it had happened; garvin-to-Hayes is rightly considered poor booking. Maybe it was a forced situation more than a planned one.

[Dylan Waco]

The Bruiser could have been cajoled by Verne for a limited stake the AWA gates in the town. It's not like he was pulling down anything on his own. Verne was willing to run in other areas with established territories. I still don't know what the story of him running St. Louis in 84 was. I assume that was after Vince swept in there?

Are you going by the local promos? Verne had a stake in the St. Louis office. When Vince paid to get the NWA promotion's TV deal, the NWA promotion ran off a block of WCCW, AWA, and Central States TV with local St. Louis promos.

 

I knew Verne had a stake there. He ran a random show there in 84.

[Dylan Waco]

I actually like the Martel v. Zhukov feud, but you ideally want your champion working someone more credible. Then again you do note it was only in Winnipeg and Martel seemed to be strongest there so he may not have needed a better opponent

[Mad Dog]

Wow... Mighty Igor was still wrestling in 1983?

[KrisZ]

He was working in WWC in 1988.

[khawk20]

I actually like the Martel v. Zhukov feud, but you ideally want your champion working someone more credible. Then again you do note it was only in Winnipeg and Martel seemed to be strongest there so he may not have needed a better opponent

Zurkoff and his Manager, Chris Markoff, were pretty effective in Winnipeg even after the cage blowoff. They ahd that great little tag match against Bockwinkel and Vachon, a quick singles bout between Mad Dog and Markoff, and even the Road Warriors were brought in to take them down. By contrast, Zurkov and Markoff were fed to Sgt. Slaughter in a two-on-one match in St. Paul since Zurkov wasn't deemed an effective enough draw to have a singles match with the Sarge there.

 

Booking those guys so differently in two different major cities in the territory was still somewhat plausible at the time since TV wasn't completely all-encompassing. Still interesting to see happen, though.

[CFTV]

It's no wonder why Detroit popped so huge for WWF when they came to town after looking at how crummy the WWA cards looked. I remember watching WWA in like 85-86 when I first got into wrestling and thinking it was pretty crappy compared to WWF and the Crockett stuff I was seeing. George Crybaby Cannon was the lead announcer with the Great Wojo and Chris Carter feuding with each other on top. The only thing good that came out of their TV was a green Scott Rechsteiner.

[Tim Evans]

Will any of the AWA matches taped at the Mid South Coliseum be on the set? I know two were on the Memphis set. Always wondered what the deal was with AWA taping at the MSC. It looked like a totally different building compared to how Memphis was running it at the time.

[KrisZ]

Yes they will be on the set.

[FLIK]

Rick Martel vs. Michael Hayes, St. Paul, MN 7/14/85

This match was JIP to the middle but what was shown wasn't good. Crusher was ringside as an outside ref/special enforcer type. I generally like Michael Hayes but this was way too chinlocky before going into a clusterfuck of a finish with the Birds and Crusher brawling ringside.

Did this ever lead to any Crusher vs Freebird matches, singles or tags?

I'd dig seeing Crusher vs Gordy atleast.

[khawk20]

Rick Martel vs. Michael Hayes, St. Paul, MN 7/14/85

This match was JIP to the middle but what was shown wasn't good. Crusher was ringside as an outside ref/special enforcer type. I generally like Michael Hayes but this was way too chinlocky before going into a clusterfuck of a finish with the Birds and Crusher brawling ringside.

Did this ever lead to any Crusher vs Freebird matches, singles or tags?

I'd dig seeing Crusher vs Gordy atleast.

 

There was this one from Winnipeg:

 

14 AWA The Freebirds vs. Larry Hennig, Baron Von Raschke and Crusher

 

I don't remember thinking much of it, and I'd have to watch it again to see if Gordy and Crusher actually hooked up during the bout.

[Tim Evans]

Do any of the Bobby Heenan vs Brad Rheingans matches exist on tape? Readying Bobby's book and he doesn't put Brad in a bright light.

[khawk20]

I don't think so.

[Frankensteiner]

Rick Martel vs. Jerry Lawler, 10/12/85, Nashville, TN

I guess this would be considered more of a Memphis match but it was for the AWA title on a Pro Wrestling USA show so I don’t mind including it here.

 

As a match, I thought this was pretty disappointing. For one, after watching the stuff Martel did with Bock, Rheingans, Jumbo, etc. I totally didn't buy Lawler outwrestling Martel in the early going. Then it seemed as if they spent an eternity with Martel working over Lawler’s right leg. It would have been fine had they done a longer run to the finish or if Lawler actually bothered to sell the leg on his comeback. Only aspect that was really interesting was Martel working as a heel, and on that end he did a good job. I wonder how many times he worked heel up to this point in his career; it couldn’t have been more than a handful, if any at all.

 

Overall not really on the level of Martel's best title defenses in the AWA.

[khawk20]

Tidbit regarding Lawler vs. Martel: Earlier in 1985 (March-ish as I recall), Lawler did not think Martel would draw in Memphis in a title match vs himself, so they did an AWA promo with Nick where he had regained the title in Vancouver in a disputed decision that was being looked at by the "AWA Championship Committee". In the meantime, Bockwinkel was being recognized as the Champion, so it was Bock that was coming in to defend the title against Lawler.

 

I'm not exactly sure if Lawler drew the conclusion that Martel would not draw from advanced sales for their upcoming title defense or if it was just a feeling he had.

 

...The AWA was running shows in Vancouver at that time so that part of it was at least plausible. The promo Bock did with I think Ken Resnick was filmed I believe in Winnipeg, though.

[goc]

Rick Martel vs. Jerry Lawler, 10/12/85, Nashville, TN

I guess this would be considered more of a Memphis match but it was for the AWA title on a Pro Wrestling USA show so I don’t mind including it here.

 

As a match, I thought this was pretty disappointing. For one, after watching the stuff Martel did with Bock, Rheingans, Jumbo, etc. I totally didn't buy Lawler outwrestling Martel in the early going. Then it seemed as if they spent an eternity with Martel working over Lawler’s right leg. It would have been fine had they done a longer run to the finish or if Lawler actually bothered to sell the leg on his comeback. Only aspect that was really interesting was Martel working as a heel, and on that end he did a good job. I wonder how many times he worked heel up to this point in his career; it couldn’t have been more than a handful, if any at all.

 

Overall not really on the level of Martel's best title defenses in the AWA.

I'm pretty sure Martel started his career as a heel with his brother. At least they were heels in the IWA footage I saw that Martel was in. I was pretty surprised to see him and realize who it was, I've never seen him with facial hair at any other time.

[Johnny Sorrow]

Some cross thread pollination, but on the last WHATAMANOOVER! show hosted by my pal Bryan and Me, Will and Dylan joined us in the second hour to talk all things AWA.

 

 

http://www.gamerrage.co.uk/wam/2012/05/rig...illed-that-guy/

 

It's the show entitled, "Right Before He Killed That Guy".

[khawk20]

I listened to the AWA section last night.

 

There were a couple of times that the remembrance of a match or angle was right-on, but the person remembering it shook it off to themselves like "no, that can't be right...". Bockwinkel piledriving Verne on the concrete in 1985 is the first one I think of...that actually happened just like it was remembered on the show, at StarCage 85 in St. Paul.

 

I found that sort of funny.

[Al]

Do any of the Bobby Heenan vs Brad Rheingans matches exist on tape? Readying Bobby's book and he doesn't put Brad in a bright light.

It wasn't so much that Brad was a terrible worker. But he was Verne's *wink,wink* enforcer.

[Tim Evans]

I'm watching a AWA show on ESPN classic from 1990 and Tully Blanchard is in the main event. I had no idea he wrestled in the AWA after his WWF? How long did he last?

[khawk20]

I think he was in for one taping, which by then they would stretch out for several weeks of TV.

[Mad Dog]

Yeah, they got like 4-5 months of television out of Nikita Koloff working like 3 dates for them.

[khawk20]

THey were down to the TV Taping being their only show in a month sometimes, so it's not like they even had a choice to do the tapings on multiple shows.

 

You can seen the de-evolution of the AWA in those Rochester TV Taping crowds. The first one or two has a decent crowd and it's reflected by the lighting, noise level, and to a point the performance of the wrestlers. By the last one or two tapings before the doors were closed, there were so few people there that literally everything except for the ring and the area immediately outside the ring was blacked out. There might have been 50 people there watching.

[vikingsfan73]

THey were down to the TV Taping being their only show in a month sometimes, so it's not like they even had a choice to do the tapings on multiple shows.

 

You can seen the de-evolution of the AWA in those Rochester TV Taping crowds. The first one or two has a decent crowd and it's reflected by the lighting, noise level, and to a point the performance of the wrestlers. By the last one or two tapings before the doors were closed, there were so few people there that literally everything except for the ring and the area immediately outside the ring was blacked out. There might have been 50 people there watching.

 

I was at the last two TV tapings in Rochester. For the first one (June 1990?), we walked up 15 minutes before the start of the show and had ringside seats. We were right behind where they cut all of the ringside interviews. There might have been 150 people there. It was really hard to tell, because the Mayo Civic Center was a pretty big arena, they had lots of it curtained off, but there were bleachers behind ringside. There were only ringside seats on 3 sides, with their hard camera on the fourth side. I think that show had the Harley Race vs. Larry Zybszko match, and I was disappointed when Race & Nikita didn't show up at the following taping. Like Khawk mentioned, they got a lot of mileage out of their footage, making it seem like guys were in the territory for much longer than they really were.

 

For the last show (August 1990?), we again walked up and had to settle for second row seats. Before the show started, they had everyone from the bleachers move down to ringside to fill the empty seats. Might have been 100 people in attendance. Seemed a lot more empty than the prior show.

 

That's how I remember it, but I was 16 and a lot of damage has taken place to my memory since then.