Yeah, that conversation

[Boondocks Kernoodle]

That jdw's avatar looks like Kawada is getting plowed from behind only makes this whole thing more disturbing.

[El-P]

You're missing John's dry sense of humour. And I echo what Jingus is saying. Especially when getting up the ass is both natural and enjoyable (supposedly), while getting your forehead sliced up by a razorblade or getting launched in the air and landing on your hip is neither.

Of course you could make analogy with old rock bands writing the same song 20 year after their hits period, but it doesn't work as well and the physical side of the activity we're talking about. Porn is about as accurate a comparison you can make.

[sek69]

I think rock n' roll makes a better (and far less creepy) analogy than porn. The Rolling Stones still can do all their classic hits (or "spots" if you will) and the long term fans will be all "YOU STILL GOT IT! *CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP*" but at the end of the day it's still 60+ year old dudes running around on stage looking like your dad when he tries to look hip in front of your friends and ends up causing you to die a little inside out of embarrassment.

[El-P]

Depends of who you're talking about. For instance Neil Young is still amazing at his age and after his accident. That said, Tenryu was never better than after he passed 40.

[khawk20]

I'm not a prude, but I do often check the board from work, and all of the talk about pornography could set off word filters from our web blocking software that leads to PWO being blocked at work, so if you could tone things down just a little, it'd be appreciated.

That your username is "cox" makes this statement even better.

[khawk20]

(a satellite dish, a gimmicked satellite box and American XXXtasy before the Alabama Attorney General got it thrown off of satellite)

American XXXtasy and the big C-band dish. Awesome. That's the setup I had as well.

[Bix]

To be clear the porn/wrestling and even porn star/wrestler comparison doesn't bother me. The "I used to love watching Ginger suck cock and get assfucked!" stuff however is something that I think is pretty bizarre. It just isn't needed to prove any point and it pretty clearly falls under the TMI category.

Same here, for the record.

[jdw]

That, and, well, do we have to be blunt about why we want this discussion to end? It should be obvious.

Beats the shit out of me why we need to be blunt. People can talk about Lawler being a pedo, or have that long ass thread about Savage banging "14 year old Steph"... Cornette and the freaking banana, DDP and Bischoff double teaming Kim... christ, the Sleaze Thread over on DVDVR was/is one of the most beloved and revered threads in online wrestling history and more than one person who is being a pantywaste in this thread flat out LOVED~! participating in that and other sleeze threads.

 

Give me a fucking break.

 

 

Hint: It's the same reason that many of us are confused by the nature of porn star autograph signings.

I've never met a porn star, nor have any desire to. I'm perfectly fine watching them perform in the comfort of my own home.

 

When did you guys turn into grads of Regent University?

 

John

[jdw]

Honestly if you can't figure out why people might not want to read about your sexual fetishes and 80's pornographic icons you regularly beat off to twenty years ago I have no clue what to say in response.

Yep, there's no doubt that I'm the only poster in the history of online wrestling discussion to have talked about a performer (be it an actress, model, porn star, singer, wrestler, diva, etc) who I found hot. It's as if you've never been to a board where someone has a hottie as an Avatar or in their Signature File.

 

"If you really need to know why I object to you using an avatar of a woman you beat off to, then you really have no clue."

 

"WTF are you talking about?"

 

John

[jdw]

Not really. No different from Stu Unger's nose rotting away from all the coke he snorted up over the years, until he finally dropped dead after his last great moment (and arguably the high point of his career).

 

John

Snorting coke isn't actually part of the job of being a professional poker player, no matter what Stu was telling people to get them to loan him money. So in that sense the comparison doesn't quite work.

Actually if you read a few people like Antonio, you'll find that a lot of people who go deep in the longer tournies take the equiv of "performance enhancers" simply to stay awake and "sharp" through long sessions. In the Stu's days, it was coke or uppers. Now people Red Bull their asses off... but there's still plenty uppers (which no one talks about) and plenty of coke.

 

Part of the job description?

 

No.

 

But it's a bit like juice and pain killers not being part of the job description in wrestling. They just happen to be very common.

 

 

Actually I would sooner compare Stu Unger to Kurt Angle. Lots of talent and a billion and one ways to flush it all down the toilet. And really it wouldn't shock me at all if Angle's death mirrored Stu's and if one day in the next 5 years Kurt is found dead in a hotel room because his heart said "fuck it, I quit" after one too many trips down the stimulant freeway. I hope that isn't the case, but if that happens to Kurt the word "shocking" had better not be applied to it by anybody that's been paying attention.

Why wait for Kurt to die. We already have someone who dropped dead on the road in their hotel room and was fighting demons for a decade that he couldn't control and stayed in a lifestyle that constantly led him back down the wrong path:

 

 

John

[jdw]

Might a better comparison be to compare Flair's athletic/in-ring ability to athletes,

Ric is a performer, not an athlete in a sport. Setting that aside, I player the the Meltzer types out there who need the sports comp by referencing Kareem playing in the NBA this year against Dwight Howard.

 

 

and then take his appearance and compare it to actors who were considered more valuable to Hollywood for their looks than their acting ability?

If you want to make the analogy of Flair to Stallone playing Rocky and Rambo at the age of 59 and 60+, go for it. I skipped the Rocky one because it got run to death back around the time of his retirement... and to be honest, Hogan coming back for a run building to a title shot would be the better Rocky analogy since he's the bigger star.

 

I went with porn because it fit the specific analogy I was trying to make. I would have loved to have seen Flair transitioned *years* ago into a strong, long term "out of the ring" performer. I don't mind seeing him on my TV helping get the product and wrestlers over. I just don't care to see him in the ring as a "wrestler" performing as he gotten older, shittier, more pathetic, and more sad to watch. It struck me as a porn star still working in their 50s and 60s because it's the only way they know how to make a living, and they've blown so much of what they've made in the past *or* it's the only way they can get the juice they need to feel like their life is worth living.

 

John

[jdw]

I agree with JDW here. Never understood your average American's total willingness to be immersed in the most sickening details of savage violence, while fleeing in horror at the very mention of genitalia.

It's part that. But what in the hell were we talking about when Lawler Is A Pedo, or Savage Is A Pedo or Art Barr Is A Statutory Rapist?

 

Ginger Lynn is a professional peformer in the porn business. Say she sucked cock is a bit like saying "Shawn Michaels Takes Bumps". Everyone in business does it (in the case of porn, all the female performers do it). It's no sensical to be shocked and outraged by it.

 

Gets banged? Again, in the porn business, everyone does it. In the wrestling biz, it would be like saying "Undertaker throws punches." No shit... everyone in wrestling throws somekind of strike, and 95% of them punch.

 

Ass? I went with that because Ginger was known for it, and it's akin to Flair being known in his prime as a big bleeder. Sure, lots of other people did it as well. But it was a regular feature in his matches in the 80s, and it wasn't a regular feature for everyone. Flair probably was up well over 50% in blading in his matcher.

 

Ric was still bleeding in the 00's. Posted a couple of links, and it's a big creepy to watch someone in their late 50s bleed like a stuck pig after cutting himself up. Obviously I don't have a problem with blading in the business. But that Ric is still out there doing it at 50+... ugh.

 

 

Plus wouldn't a better comparative be Flair and Nina Hartley? Although seeing Bix being freaked out like Phil in a diva thread is funny.

Nina has gone into a split role: part instructional/production, and part performer. A bit more limited on the strictly performer side, though I do see that she's working at a bit higher volume since the MILF/40+ niche has really exploded. In fact she did one with Ginger earlier this year for one of the larger girl-girl production companies.

 

Ric never really wanted to go into being a non-wrestling performer, which would be the closest wrestling equiv to Nina's role in her instructional series. Non-wrestlers do still "perform" in wrestling, and Nina dos in her instructionals.

 

Ric just can't let go of being a pro wrestler in the ring, and being a top one. So the Ginger analogy.

 

One kind of wish that both had the ability to just retire, walk away, and stay away with a happy life away from their respective business... both of which are cesspools.

 

John

[jdw]

To be clear the porn/wrestling and even porn star/wrestler comparison doesn't bother me. The "I used to love watching Ginger suck cock and get assfucked!" stuff however is something that I think is pretty bizarre. It just isn't needed to prove any point and it pretty clearly falls under the TMI category.

I don't see how anal in porn is any different from blading in wrestling, or sucking cock in porn is any different from the most basic thing in wrestling: bumping.

 

I'm willing to make a deal with you, Dylan. I'll never make another analogy to sucking cock ("This sucked more cock than Linda Lovelace.") if you agree to never write another wrestling post that mentioned juice or blading in anyway, or talks about any bump or bumping in a match or bumping talents of a wrestler in anyway.

 

"He was never going to carry a slug to anything special, but if you give him some one who is willing to bump for him, he's smart enough to work a compelling match with the tools he has."

 

"Just a very good, hot babyface, great at taking bumps and illiciting sympathy and tremendous at timing offensive comebacks and making creative double team offense look effective and not hokey."

 

"Sort of Flair like in that he had a standard match, standard bumps that he was going to get to, and not a whole lot of offense, but what he did he did well and he mixed things up far more than he is given credit for."

 

That's one post back on 8-27.

 

I'm not talking about avoiding variations of the word "bump". Flat out any talk of bumps or coming up with creative ways to get around using the term bump.

 

I'd also point out that I did little more than mention an *act* (or three) which set people off. If I was working up a fantasy on the board, I might have actually described it. Along the lines of how a lot of go into some detail on blading and the amount of blood.

 

"Point is that the match is a realistic massacre. Maybe to realistic. The closeup shot of Chiggy getting shoot stabbed with scissors is really cool..kind of... "

 

I mean... that's getting beyond just the act of Chiggy blading into the detail of it *and* the pysch & storytelling of the match. I didn't even bother with an detail of Ginger's blowjobs or the pysch behind any of the scenes. *That* would have been trying to creep folks out.

 

John

[Dylan Waco]

I should probably just drop this because it's going nowhere, but I do have a serious question for you John - how often do you feel the need to share your mastubatory habits and fantasies in casual conversation in the real World in order to "prove a point?" I really do have a morbid curiosity as to whether or not this is some sort of bizarre internet habit of yours or if you regularly drop references about how you "enjoy" watching various sex on acts on video all the time because you have such a deep commitment to quality analogies.

 

The fact that you can't tell the difference between talking about how much you loved to watched Ginger Lynn get fucked and commenting on a wrestler taking bumps is seriously disturbing.

[Bix]

It's not about whatever specific sex acts or anything like that. It's about you, talking to us about what you used to pleasure yourself to in detail. People don't want to hear/talk about that. Ever. There's a big difference between talking about an urban legend that involves Jimmy Valiant touching himself and YOU TALKING TO US about your self-gratification nostalgia.

 

The porn star autograph signing example was about the awkward ridiculousness of them. As a great man once put it:

 

"...porn star autograph signings – what the FUCK do you say at those, 'Hey, I really liked jerking off to your double anal scenes?'"

 

It's about the implications. There's a BIG difference between comparing aging wrestlers to aging porn stars in a way more like "It's like watching a porn star trying to relive her past glory at 60 years old" or Bruce Mitchell's various gay porn jokes in the Torch over the years and "I loved watching Ginger Lynn suck cock, get banged and take it up the ass."

 

At least you don't use your real name as your username (like other people with similar posts including actual full blown porn DVD reviews), but people know who you are and you've dealt with enough internet crazies that it's not out of the realm of possibility that someone could set up a big flashing ""JDW of ____ talks about his masturbation history on this public, google-able board here" page/post whatever, and I also thought you were smart enough to realize that.

[kjh]

Why wait for Kurt to die. We already have someone who dropped dead on the road in their hotel room and was fighting demons for a decade that he couldn't control and stayed in a lifestyle that constantly led him back down the wrong path

Just the one? You could easily come up with two dozen names that match that description. <_>

 

With regards the direction this conversation has gone in, I don't think anyone is morally outraged or shocked about the comparisons of porn with wrestling. We even had a seven page thread debating which business was sleazier over a year ago (http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?showtopic=5645). There is a line between what is and isn't normal to bring up on a wrestling message board. I'm not sure exactly where that line is, but plenty of people crossed it when the DVDVR board had a porn section.

[Loss]

This isn't going anywhere that I think has a purpose, so I'm closing the thread.