Should John Cena Turn Heel?

[goc]

Of course there could be an invasion right now! TNA is going to go out of business and WWE can do that big TNA vs. WWE feud everyone has been dreaming of!

[goodhelmet]

Dylan's secret friend gave a "jaw-dropping-in your face-so obvious why didn't we think of that" scenario on the upcoming Fixing WWE: Booking podcast episode that Charles and I were starting to pitch possible RAW segments for the Cena heel character. Stay tuned.

[goodhelmet]

Why Jon Cena should turn heel...

 

http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/27938-good-will-wrestling-fixing-the-wwe-part-three/&do=findComment&comment=5618212

[Jmare007]

That Miz & Cena pairing would be heel heat gold.

[Kostka]

If Cena/Brock double turned, what happens to Heyman?

[Matt D]

Heyman and Cena would work well together.

[sek69]

Oh my god, a Heyman and Cena heel pairing would be off the charts.

[Johnny Sorrow]

Man, I just watched that Cena/ Brock special on the Network and it's fucking outstanding.

[Mr. Lacelle]

The problem with turning Cena is that it will still make Cena the focal point of the promotion and those who have been pushed away because of his huge shadow will still see him all over the place. They need to Honky Tonk Man him and just have someone squash him and then drop him down the cards but they won't because they're safe and you all know this.

[ButchReedMark]

While people will pay money for John Cena and John Cena accessories there's no need to drop him down the cards. Especially when there's no-one ready to take his place yet.

[Steenalized]

The problem with turning Cena is that it will still make Cena the focal point of the promotion and those who have been pushed away because of his huge shadow will still see him all over the place. They need to Honky Tonk Man him and just have someone squash him and then drop him down the cards but they won't because they're safe and you all know this.

That's a terrible idea. Cena is in no way comparable to the Honky Tonk Man and is without a doubt their biggest draw. Like BRM just said, no one can take his place right now either. Cena should be putting guys over, and he has been, but squashing him would do nothing to help business and might ruin his aura for the kids who buy all that merch.

[sek69]

While people will pay money for John Cena and John Cena accessories there's no need to drop him down the cards. Especially when there's no-one ready to take his place yet.

 

 

Dave uses this argument all the time, and while it's not wrong, it's a self fulfilling prophecy because they haven't even tried to create someone to take his place until Roman Reigns came along. Ever since WWE became all about the brand and the WWE UNIVERSE it's been established that the company is the star. Since Cena was the last guy established as a difference making star prior to that, he's been the defacto #1 draw and merch seller since they've been making a conceited effort to not create a star that might become bigger than wrestling and have the gall to want to leave at some point.

[Johnny Sorrow]

Well, Cena is gonna have to either semi retire and fued with Larry Zybysko, go to WCW, have a career ending injury, or become a legit movie star. Cause them's the only precedents for guys at his level.

[Steenalized]

Three or four (though not as big as the Rock) I could see happening, but the heart wants #1.

[Sidebottom]

They need to Honky Tonk Man him and just have someone squash him and then drop him down the cards but they won't because they're safe and you all know this.

 

Nothing to do with being safe. They wont do this because it is an idiotic idea.

[Shining Wiz]

 

They need to Honky Tonk Man him and just have someone squash him and then drop him down the cards but they won't because they're safe and you all know this.

 

Nothing to do with being safe. They wont do this because it is an idiotic idea.

 

It's about as idiotic as turning their biggest heel heel.

[KrisZ]

Meltz dropping knowledge in the WON

 

 

 

Cena was interviewed by Power Magazine this past week and said that he’s got a heel run in him, but says he does what the company tells him to do and that a heel turn will never happen. To me, never doesn’t exist in pro wrestling, because circumstances constantly change. That said, right now, the idea of turning Cena heel would be mind-bogglingly stupid. The key is merchandise. With Bryan and Punk gone, Cena’s merchandise was recently and may still be outselling the entire rest of the roster combined. Heel turns kill merch sales, not to mention ticket sales to kids, which make up a strong percentage of the WWE audience and the Cena shows this year were doing more than $60,000 above the non-Cena shows in ticket sales (and shows without Cena are doing well below the usual levels for house shows in the cities they have been in while Cena shows have not). There is always the chance that Cena will get hotter as a ticket seller with a heel turn. Historically, with the exception of Hogan (whose merch sales were dead when he made the turn), modern era top babyface turns didn’t work unless you have the hotter babyface on the rise (like Austin was with Bret Hart when they did the double turn). Dwayne Johnson turned back-and-forth, but Austin’s turn, no matter how entertaining it was, led to huge drops in attendance, ratings and merch sales and the company never got back to previous levels. WCW attempted turns with Sting and Goldberg were such flops they flipped back every time within a few weeks. If Bryan, or Reigns, or someone, is at the point as champion where they are outdrawing Cena and selling at close to the same level, you could consider a turn, but even then, you still have the issues where Make-a-Wish and other corporate partners who bank on Cena as a spokesperson or face would get upset. But today, with no Punk, no Bryan, and Reigns months from being ready, any suggestion of turning him today is up there with the ill-fated Austin turn. Austin’s turn failed for these reasons. The first was there was no super face to oppose him (the idea was HHH as the face, but then HHH decided against turning and forming a team with Austin, and if you remember that period, HHH was actually positioned equal or even ahead of him when they were together). The other is that there are some talents who bring new people into the game. When those people are faces and turn, and there are only a handful of them in the last 30 years and of them, only Hogan and Lawler (who was successful going back-and-forth) ever did for any length of time and with had success. I would call Hogan’s turn a success because the company did great business for two-and-a-half years, but the long-run of the cool heels killing the faces was not good in the long run. Whether a percentage of the audience boos him, and they do at TV and PPVs and they don’t at house shows, those are already paying customers, many of whom came in before Cena. Of those who came in with Cena, their big favorites were Cena, Mysterio and maybe Batista, and Cena was No. 1 throughout and is the last one left. They are clearly building Reigns and Ambrose for a future, and Wyatt is probably going to be a face at some point as well. When the new characters are at the point they are carrying the ball, and Reigns may already be on track getting there, you absolutely could consider a Cena turn from a wrestling standpoint. But perhaps Make-a-Wish changes the game and it won’t happen even when the storyline time down the line could be right.

[Shining Wiz]

The problem with turning Cena is that it will still make Cena the focal point of the promotion and those who have been pushed away because of his huge shadow will still see him all over the place. They need to Honky Tonk Man him and just have someone squash him and then drop him down the cards but they won't because they're safe and you all know this.

This turned out 1/2 right so far.

[Fantastic]

Yeah, Make-A-Wish will always be the biggest issue when thinking about a Cena heel turn. And while we're on that subject, I can't think of anybody else in showbiz who goes more out of their way to do things for that charity than Cena.

[Loss]

While I absolutely see the logic in keeping him a babyface, I'm also not sure about Make-A-Wish. I think we are long past the point where Cena would have to live his gimmick and wouldn't be able to do charity because he's a heel and supposed to be a bad person in real life. Why doesn't that logic apply to HHH and Stephanie? The merchandise argument is a strong one in favor of keeping him babyface, but I dispute the idea that he can't do charity. Even Hogan did charity and public appearances from 1996-1998. He made kids' movies during that time and even was part of some activist group against companies testing their products on animals.

[Matt D]

I get the argument that Hogan wasn't hot in 94-95 and that Cena is moving merchandise now, but I'd argue that Hogan sold a heck of a lot more merch after he went heel. I don't think that a turn would actually hurt Cena's bottom line that much, so long as they were able to produce a piece of merchandise that was iconic. What's his biggest shirt ever? The Rise Above Hate one? the NES one? Has he ever really had that Austin 3:16 or NWO shirt? They were nuts not to keep him in the Nexus for another month or two, even reluctantly, long enough to have a Cena-branded Nexus shirt to sell. I think we've reached this crazy point where people are as willing as ever to wear goofy gimmicky shirts. If they turn him, a ton of his current fans would come along for the ride. They did with Hogan since it felt cool. It'd also open up to a slightly older demo who might have more disposable cash.

 

I don't know about the merch thing. I think they'd be fine there. The charity thing is trickier.

[Loss]

This brings up something that I think would be an interesting separate topic that I might start soon - alternative revenue streams (any way for a wrestling company to make money other than the live gate or PPV buys) are the enemy of good booking. I think it says a lot about WWE that they would rather sell merchandise than sell out shows and have more Network subs. A Cena heel turn has the potential to bring back lots of people who stopped watching if it's accompanied by a new promotional concept.

[Matt D]

Schiavone told a pretty good story on Jim Ross' podcast which explained how he became the soulless hypeman he was for the last couple of years of WCW. It's so funny to go back to, let's say 1991, and how viscerally and desperately he was trying to get the action over and make sense of everything that would happen in a match whether it was Flair or Oz in the ring, and then listen to something, like, let's say this random Super Calo vs Barry Houston match I saw where he and Larry Z didn't actually call one move in the entire match until it hit the replay, and they were doing dives and all sorts of stuff too. Not one move because the PPV was that weekend.

[KrisZ]

The main factor here isn't really merchandise it's the marketing to kids in general. Cena is a hero to children who watch the shows and who get their parents to bring them to the shows. My deal with Cena is and I've seen this from first hand experience what is the exact ratio of adults booing Cena but bringing their kids to cheer him or just chlldless adults who boo him.

 

I think in the end Cena will turn heel when Reigns or Ambrose is hot enough to be his nemesis.

[Matt D]

Revenue streams are an interesting point and maybe we should have a note on it. We know that TV has sort of hit a ceiling given what WWE is. What should they be most focused on? The Network? Live gates? International markets? Merchandise?