Grimmas Posted October 3, 2014 Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 Discuss here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steenalized Posted October 3, 2014 Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 Since I was the one to nominate him, I should probably say something. If you can't tell, I'm a huge Steen fan. For the GWE though, I don't think I'll rank him, largely because what makes me such a huge fan is his promo abilities, charisma, humor, etc., so the out-of-ring attributes. I still rank him as one of if not the best indy brawlers of the last decade. He's also a guy who changed his style a ton as his knees went out and he put on weight, which I give him credit for. He's had some of the top indy feuds of the last ten years vs. Super Dragon in PWG, vs. the Briscoes with El Generico, and vs. El Generico. I might sneak him in at the bottom of the list just as an honorable mention sort of thing. Strong tag and singles worker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbo Slice Posted October 3, 2014 Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 As far as his knees go, I wonder if working at the performance center and having some strength and conditioning work is going to help him going forward because he's already lost some weight and that's gonna help his knees going forward. I don't see him making my list, and I love Steen, but if he comes through in the WWE, he'll be interesting to revisit if this happens again down the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steenalized Posted October 3, 2014 Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 That's the other thing. Steen is barely 30 years old. He could have quite a career ahead of him still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Wiz Posted October 3, 2014 Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 Call me crazy, but I think Steen is well past his peak. I don't think he's going to going to be well loved by WWE fans at all. Good brawler, but he'll be small by WWE standards for that style, I've never liked his promos and he's not funny. I say when this gets done again in 2026, not even a blip on the radar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted October 4, 2014 Report Share Posted October 4, 2014 Is he a good brawler? Every "brawl" I've seen him in has been defined by overly elaborate spots involving ladders, weapons, etc. I like Steen as an agile fat guy and think he has some really good epics under his belt. But a brawler? Not sure about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Wiz Posted October 4, 2014 Report Share Posted October 4, 2014 I was trying to not be overly critical His brawling is his best attribute I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Wiz Posted January 11, 2015 Report Share Posted January 11, 2015 So, first few weeks in NXT are the most interested I've been in Steen possibly ever. Might - and I stress MIGHT - be interested in seeing how the next year plays out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOTNW Posted August 22, 2015 Report Share Posted August 22, 2015 I've seen praise for Steen as a brawler and I don't get it. His strikes never looked good. His strikes look less bad now but I'm not sure if it's because of the constant camera changes, him doing less strikes because of how they are used in WWE or is it just a case of them looking better in contrast to other WWE workers who have even shittier strikes. Maybe they did improve. During his indy run his biggest strenghts were his bumping and his move-set and his best matches were all faux-deathmatches. I liked that run a lot. Haven't been very impressed with his WWE run so far. Zayn totally outperformed him in their first match and that's the only WWE match of Steen's I'd call great, and even that would be borderline. On the other hand he has stuff like the Balor matches and the last Cena match that I absolutely loathe. He's good, but not top 100 good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbo Slice Posted August 27, 2015 Report Share Posted August 27, 2015 He looked terrific with his punches in the Balor ladder match. Steen's on my short list for WOTY right now, but he won't make my list in the end, sadly. That being said, in 10 years, we might have something here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W2BTD Posted August 28, 2015 Report Share Posted August 28, 2015 Owens has been the best and most compelling worker in WWE this year. Even as a Kevin Steen fan, and someone who thought he'd do well in WWE, even i'm a little shocked at how great he's been. An absolute lock for my list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRGoldman Posted August 28, 2015 Report Share Posted August 28, 2015 I think Owens has benefited from working in the WWE much the same way that Evan Bourne did. It's not that he dramatically improved the moment he got there it's that what he excels at tended to blend in a little on the indies, while it really stands out in WWE. I think he has a really strong resume, but ultimately, he has too many periods where I didn't think he was particularly motivated or compelling prior to WWE to be anything but a fringe candidate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted August 28, 2015 Report Share Posted August 28, 2015 Owens has been the best and most compelling worker in WWE this year. Even as a Kevin Steen fan, and someone who thought he'd do well in WWE, even i'm a little shocked at how great he's been. An absolute lock for my list. Not sure that I can see anyone over Cena in WWE this year. What makes his 2015 so great is how he's made just about everything and everyone he's touched that much more interesting -- from Brock & Rollins at the Rumble to Rusev to the US Title, to Cesaro, to Zayn, to Owens to Rollins to Jon Fucking Stewart. Brock's been far and away the best part of WWE when there, which is never, but take away Cena and this year is hard to fathom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazeUSA Posted August 29, 2015 Report Share Posted August 29, 2015 He is one of the best heels in the business right now IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peachchaos Posted August 29, 2015 Report Share Posted August 29, 2015 He was also one of the best heels in the business in 2010. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 It's really hard for me to see an argument for Owens as the best guy in WWE this year. The only match I even liked out of the Cena/Owens series was the first one, after that it was all diminishing returns and the fact that they seemingly had no ideas other than "lets just do our finishers a bunch and repeat the same spots from the first match" did not impress me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W2BTD Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 Owens matches this year I have rated at **** or better 2/11 vs Zayn **** 2/18 vs Balor **** 5/31 vs Cena ****1/2 6/14 vs Cena ****1/2 7/4 vs Balor ****1/4 7/19 vs Cena **** 8/10 vs Orton & Cesaro **** 8/23 vs Balor ****1/2 8/24 vs Cesaro **** Nobody else in the company comes close to this output imo, and when you throw in the fact that he's easily the most compelling character in the company, he's my fairly easy pick for WWE WOTY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 Well...at least you and I agree that The Nightmares are awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parties Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 Would have Cena, Sasha, Cesaro, Reigns, Lesnar, Rollins, Sheamus, Rusev, Harper, and maybe even Big E, Bayley and Wyatt ahead of him right now. The idea that Owens isn't even one of the ten best workers in the company right now sounds insane, but (I think?) I stand by it. I also think he's a joke in an All Time 100, but to each their own. In general I'm finding a lot of the "currently working/in their prime" candidates to be really surprising if not outright baffling. It may be unfair to present-day workers, but I just find it difficult to judge them in context. And I do have a pretty strong bias against the general state of wrestling today compared to what it was at every other time in history. Almost everyone working today is a victim of current affairs. If someone like Sheamus worked in JCP in the mid-80s, he'd stand such a better chance of making my list. Only guys still working on a regular basis who make my list are Liger, Akiyama, Cena, and all the lucha maestro types (Casas, Panther, Mysterio, Liger, Black Terry, Virus, Solar, etc.) And just to give Steen his due: he's a good talker who generally speaking seems to understand heat, which makes him an exception in today's scene. Saw him have two good matches in two days last week. Did not enjoy him in ROH at all. Haven't seen enough PWG to comment on him there, but what I've seen was better. Top 100 of 2015? Yes, but he isn't even at the top of that list, let alone all of wrestling history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 I have one Owens match at ****+, the work just isn't there for him in the ring. The Cena series was diminishing returns, the Zayn series never really got going, the Balor series is hampered by Balor being involved, and that's not much else. I like Owens a lot, enjoy his character too, but he's not the best wrestler in WWE/NXT this year, nor is he putting in the best character work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomethingSavage Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 I love a lot of Steen's PWG stuff. He's charismatic and witty as a babyface. Plus you can tell he genuinely enjoys playing to the crowd. But he's absolutely at his best as a heel. The guy's got GREAT instincts as a sinister, borderline sociopath type of prick.But there's a LOT of times where he'll ditch those instincts and go WAY overboard with the comedy shtick and fan interaction crap. It's okay in smaller doses, but he really let the Reseda atmosphere dictate his style more often than I'd like. That being said, I think he's brilliant at improvising and working through things on the fly - which is truly a testament to just about ANY worker that can manage it these days. His ROH stuff fell off a cliff for me sometime after the original Generico feud & story arc. That whole thing was tremendous for both guys, and it was the first time I really got a sense of us seeing the murderous, villainous side of Steen unleashed. But once Steen returned from the Cornette suspension thing & the whole SCUM stuff kicked into gear, it all quickly went to shit in a hurry for me. His in-ring work in the WWE has been spotty - more good than great - but never anything less than good, for sure. And I think his character work has been outstanding for the most part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W2BTD Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 The Steen/Generico feud was the best feud in modern wrestling, which should count for something, and would have fit like a glove in any territory during the territory days. The Steen/Generico heel/face tag team was pretty great, too. They dropped that aspect of the team towards the end to set up the turn, but they had some killed matches vs teams like the Briscoes. I don't like ladder matches very much, but Owens is probably the best ladder match worker in the business. The Generico match is an all timer, the tag stuff was top notch, and I loved the Balor match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 I think the first Cena match is at worst Top 3 in the company. The second and third iterations absolutely don't hold up on that level as they really didn't add anything new to the meat or booking of the matches, but were still very good, four star affairs in my book. I also really liked the Balor title change in Japan and thought he put him over very effectively. Beyond that, I haven't found the rest of his run to be much better than your standard 3-3.5 star, solidly long Raw match. Easily behind Cena, Brock, Rollins and Reigns when it comes to top level matches this year and probably Cesaro and another name or 2 I'm forgetting with respect to volume. Perhaps somewhat unfairly penalized by how blazingly hot those first few weeks were leading to and coming off of the first Cena match, but I haven't been blown away by anything since that time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazeUSA Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 I have one Owens match at ****+, the Zayn series never really got going Guess you haven't seen the 20+ disc feud comp of these two guys, that series has been going for years & Steene helps make it awesome, its not just Generico, but thats just my opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted August 30, 2015 Report Share Posted August 30, 2015 I have one Owens match at ****+, the Zayn series never really got going Guess you haven't seen the 20+ disc feud comp of these two guys, that series has been going for years & Steene helps make it awesome, its not just Generico, but thats just my opinion My comment was in reference to Joe's comment on Owen's work in WWE/NXT, not his indie work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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