JerryvonKramer Posted December 21, 2014 Report Share Posted December 21, 2014 http://placetobenation.com/where-the-big-boys-play-69-starrcade-91/Chad and Parv welcome Steven Graham (Pro Wrestling Super Show) to review Starrcade 91.- [11:16] Wrestling Observer roundup: Luger - man of the people, TV ratings performance vs. house show performance.- [30:22] Review of Starrcade 91: In-depth analysis of Lethal Lottery / Battle Bowl concepts, Mike Graham talk, Spider-Mandiscussion (inspired by Arachnaman) ...- [2:16:46] End of show awardsAND be sure to check out Matt Ds great companion piece at PTBN: http://placetobenation.com/the-column-beyondwrestling-shared-universes-and-the-obsolete-joy-of-the-lethal-lottery/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted December 21, 2014 Report Share Posted December 21, 2014 Thanks for having me on, this was a lot of fun to record. I feel like I didn't get enough of a Spider-Man defense in there though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheapshot Posted December 21, 2014 Report Share Posted December 21, 2014 Early Christmas gift! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W2BTD Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 We just talked about this show on VOW, and i'm making Rich watch it before our next show. Inexplicably one of my favorite shows ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJRogers Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 The very popular 1990s Spidey cartoon didn't start until 1994 and it had been about 4 years since the last time Spidey had a cartoon in first run production. My best guess is Spider-Man was hotter than ever on the comic racks in 1991 as the Todd MacFarlane "adjectiveless" Spidey title launched with great fanfare the previous year. And if memory serves, I think rumors of a James Cameron helmed big budget movie were very loud at that particular pint in time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sturm316 Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 I haven't listened yet to the episode so I don't know if this was mentioned, but WCW also had a short-lived comic book published by Marvel Comics in 1992 - the first issue was cover dated April 1992, and, like wrestling magazines at the time, the cover date was usually a few months later than the actual month it was published. I always found it odd that Marvel had problems with the Arachnaman character at (roughly) the same time it was publishing a comic book based on the company that featured him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJRogers Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 Oddly enough, that might have explained the gimmick! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJRogers Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 Wiki sez, that the gimmick was stopped due to a potential lawsuit by Marvel, the comic book may have been part of the settlement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 Chad talked about re-booking the show, so I thought I would follow suit. Part of the problem was too many matches, so I say drop it down to 24. Then add a title match! That is 8 matches on the show, more than enough. You should even do the Battle Bowl winner gets a shot at the World Champion at SuperBrawl II. 1. Lethal Lottery: Scott Steiner & Mr. Hughes defeat Rick Steiner & Z-Man 2. Lethal Lottery: Dustin Rhodes & Jushin Liger defeat Richard Morton & Bobby Eaton 3. Lethal Lottery: Ron Simmons & Thomas Rich defeat El Gigante & Larry Zbyszko 4. Lethal Lottery: Rick Rude & Steve Austin defeat Tracy Smothers & Terrance Taylor 5. Lethal Lottery: Arn Anderson & Big Van Vader defeat Cactus Jack & PN News 6. Lethal Lottery: Sting & Abdullah the Butcher defeat Brian Pillman & Steve Armstrong 7. WCW World Champion Lex Luger defeats Ricky Steamboat 8. Battle Bowl won by Sting! I think this would be a pretty entertaining, all around better card. Too much dead weight on the original. For the World Title match, around the horn Luger was defending against Rick Steiner. That doesn't seem like a World Title match, so I say do a Lethal Lottery with the top 10 and pull out Steamboat's name to contend here. If you don't like that switch Rick Steiner and Steamboat everywhere above. Here PN News plays the Buddy Lee Parker role.You get good matches up and down the card, plus a title match and a clear direction for SuperBrawl II. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soup23 Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 I would switch News and Hughes but that card looks bad ass Steven to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 I would switch News and Hughes but that card looks bad ass Steven to me. Thanks. Did you finish your version? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoe Posted December 23, 2014 Report Share Posted December 23, 2014 Thank you Chad for shutting down Parv's Dory/Graham Australian Rules match from 81 as good Graham talking point.I think the gimmick hid a lot of the weaknesses between both guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownNDirtyTN Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I was an 11 year old kid watching this show and have some fondness of it. I have pretty much every single NWA/WCW and WWF Pay Per View on VHS tapes from 87 onwards and this was one I watched quite a bit growing up. There was something about the Lethal Lottery format that really got me pumped up to see who may face off against one another. Now, looking back as a 34 year old guy, I can see many holes in this broadcast. And why in the world do you gimmick up your flagship show? It's not like the WWE has an Elimination Chamber at Wrestlemania. This show should have been a PPV showcasing the best wrestlers in WCW with the titles on the line. Everything changes with hindsight but I don't know why they didn't use this gimmick for a Clash show or even Superbrawl in February. If I were to be able to go back there and just rebook things leading up to Starrcade I would have had Rick Rude brutalize Sting after getting DQ'd allowing Sting to remain US champion at the Clash. Rude would drop Sting with several Rude Awakenings after the match and be getting interviewed as Sting is stretchered out as the Main Event is about to take place. Luger would be walking down the aisle and looking like he was worried about his old friend showing some signs of compassion. Luger would look at Rude a bit disgusted and Rude would shoot Luger a "what you gonna do about it" stare and Luger would go on for his match against Rick Steiner. That match would be similar to how it went down except at the very end Rude would come down and waffle Luger with a chair after the match as the Steiners and Race/Hughes would brawl down the aisle and away from the ring. Rude would hit the Rude Awakening on Luger taking him out also and telling Luger he should have just stayed out of this situation. This leads up to Starrcade where Luger will defend the title against Rude in the cage. Luger will be a bit of a tweener, and I know having him flip flop so shortly after turning at the Bash isn't the ideal situation but Luger would be fighting for his friend Sting as Rude went over the line. Sting would sell the injury through Starrcade and not participate with Luger carrying the banner for Sting who may have to retire due to the injuries to his neck from the Rude Awakenings he took. In the match I'd have Rude get the upper hand and drop Luger with back to back Rude Awakenings. Sting will come down with a neck brace on and after Luger continues to be decimated he will throw in the towel for his old friend handing Rude the title in shocking fashion. This would carry over to TV and over the following couple of weeks. Sting would be interviewed and asked why he done it and he would be giving a heartfelt promo about not wanting Lex to wind up like him. Sting will say thankfully he will be cleared to wrestle by Superbrawl but the Rude Awakenings could have ended his career and not wanting his best friend Lex to face a similar situation so he stopped the match and the damage to Luger. Lex would come out and be teary eyed himself. He would hug Sting and tell him that he loves him. Sting would raise Luger's hand and say that the Total Package will get a shot at Rude at Superbrawl. Luger will grab the microphone and say well that's not possible. Sting will of course question Luger and say why not. Luger will then give Sting a vicious clothesline. He'll pick him up and Rack Sting until he's unconscious. Luger will say that's for costing him the thing he loved the most. He will say that Sting may have been his best friend but Luger will say he realized that his very best friend in the world is the color green and Sting cost him a lot of money when he threw in the towel. This will lead to Sting signing up to face Luger at Superbrawl in a retirement match. This will allow Lex to job clean and leave WCW - still losing to Sting but with a much different twist. For the rest of my fantasy Starrcade card it would go something like this: Brian Pillman vs The Tailor Made Man Terry Taylor for the Light Heavyweight Title Firebreaker Chip/Todd Champion/Tom Zenk vs The Freebirds & Diamond StuddPN News vs Cactus JackVader/Mr. Hughes vs The Steiner BrothersMarcus Bagwell vs Bobby EatonStunning Steve Austin vs Van Hammer for the Television TitleDustin Rhodes and Ricky Steamboat vs The Enforcers for the World Tag Team Titles - best of 3 fallsLex Luger vs Rick Rude for the World Heavyweight Title. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted January 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2015 Welcome to the board Down n Dirty, and thanks for sharing your thoughts. This show seems to stir a lot of feelings in people for some reason. I am not sure about Luger vs. Rude to be honest, but there'd be a lot for the ladies to look at in that one! Sexy Lexy taking on Real Man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBadMick Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 Good recap. Have to agree with Chad about not letting nostalgia overpower reality. I first saw this in 92 or 92 when a glut of WCW videos were released here. Loved it then, but I can see that it doesn't hold up and lacks any real substance. Looking forward to the 91 tv episode - watched loads of it a few months back so it's fresh in my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lust Hogan Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 Great job guys! "Grumpy" Chad was awesome. LOL!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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