All Elite Wrestling

[sek69]

51 minutes ago, WingedEagle said:

Why would WWE release him?

He's unhappy, it's a bad look to hold on to someone you clearly don't have any plans for just to play keep away, he's in a relationship with your top women's star and pissing him off runs the risk of pissing her off. 

Of course word already came out WWE said no, there was no chance they were going to actually do it, but it pretty much makes it a lock he's gone the second his deal is up.

[Coffey]

I'll be honest, I had not even considered WWE just saying no. I don't know why that didn't even cross my mind. 

Yeah, now they have to hope they don't piss off Charlotte, I guess? Not that I think it would ever come to fruition, but Charlotte, Andrade & even Ric showing up to do something with Arn & Tully, J.J. Dillion & Sting again would be wild.

Charlotte got to main event Wrestlemania though, she's not going anywhere. 

[joeg]

On 3/5/2021 at 8:24 PM, Alucard said:

He did a few more after that. Beat Andrade & Garza in a handicap match then teamed with the Viking Raiders in a loss to Andrade, Garza, & Orton. His last was then (technically "unsanctioned") against Orton on Raw in July.

Yeah none of that made any sense what so ever..... He beats those two guys by himself. Then he loses to them when the numbers are even. Then the next week Andrade and Garza beat Viking Radiers clean. Then the next week Orton beats Big Show... Its almost as if the weekly TV for WWE the past several years has been put together by people who never watched wrestling before. AEW at least has the feel of being put together by wrestling fans with no actual professional experience. 

[joeg]

4 hours ago, sek69 said:

He's unhappy, it's a bad look to hold on to someone you clearly don't have any plans for just to play keep away, he's in a relationship with your top women's star and pissing him off runs the risk of pissing her off. 

Of course word already came out WWE said no, there was no chance they were going to actually do it, but it pretty much makes it a lock he's gone the second his deal is up.

Since when does WWE care about things being a bad look?

 

[Coffey]

Well, apparently WWE granted him his release & Dave is saying he doesn't even have the standard 90-day no compete clause.

Which, La Sombra would be a huge get for AEW but it begs the question: is it time for AEW to consider releasing some talent? Do they really need 40 jobbers for filling up AEW Dark duty? There's just not enough TV time to go around. 

[sek69]

A lot of people not being featured in AEW are on one year deals, and considering Tony's reluctance to cut people I would expect their contracts would be allowed to run out. Especially with their being light at the end of the tunnel re: the pandemic, he doesn't have to keep feeling he has a responsibility to keep everyone around. 

I mean, if someone of this caliber becomes available you pretty much have to make the attempt to land him. If you have to cut a bunch of people not being regularly featured to get someone who could be a top level guy you make that deal 7 days a week. 

[sek69]

Laredo Kid is going to be teaming with the Lucha Bros this week on Dynamite, which should be nothing short of awesome.

[Rah]

Is Rush stuck in an exclusive contract with ROH?

The fact he isn't a big thing is mind-boggling to me. I'd love to see him and Sombra teaming in AEW.

[El-P]

7 hours ago, Rah said:

Is Rush stuck in an exclusive contract with ROH?

The fact he isn't a big thing is mind-boggling to me. 

Yes. Sadly. Guys in ROH are in limbo, really. 

The issue with Rush is that as much as he's awesome in Arena Mexico with a rabid crowd, his stuff won't translate as good in the current setting because he's such a audience-interaction based pro-wrestler.

But yeah, AEW should just let some underneath people go now (they got way too much guys) and focus on the real catches like La Sombra (and Thea Trinidad).

[NintendoLogic]

Rush just re-signed with ROH last month, so if he is stuck there, it's because he chooses to be. What it comes down to, I think, is that he and his family are a package deal and AEW surely isn't desperate or stupid enough to give Bestia del Ring a job. Also, some folks in AEW apparently aren't high on Dragon Lee because he broke Hiromu Takahashi's neck a few years ago.

[El-P]

2 minutes ago, NintendoLogic said:

 AEW surely isn't desperate or stupid enough to give Bestia del Ring a job.

What's up with the whole Billy Gunn family though ? 

[Coffey]

I'm gonna talk about the roster a bit. I've been getting into AEW more lately & have pretty much abandoned WWE entirely at this point.

I saw Matt Hardy making a tweet yesterday that he misses wrestling with his brother. My first thought is that AEW should not only not bring in Jeff Hardy but if given the chance, let Matt Hardy go too. He can go back to WWE or whatever if he wants to wrestle with Jeff again. The last thing AEW needs is someone like Jeff Hardy. Jeff was one of the "big" names along with Angle, Sting & Christian that "jumped" to TNA. AEW have already brought in Christian & Sting...

Speaking of Sting, I think his in-ring days should pretty much be over. If they want to use him as an on-screen authority figure or something, sure, I guess. He still has name value - it's freakin' Sting - but he's not a main eventer anymore. He would be better in a role like that than giving Tony Khan an on-air character. Seems like right now they're using him to elevate Darby Allin some but it was at the expense of Starks & Brian Cage.

Still feel like along with Jake Hager that Matt Hardy was probably the signing I disagreed with the most for AEW. Thankfully they didn't try to bring in Zack Ryder full-time. I was listening to a Jim Ross podcast, that was about a year old, maybe longer now & he said the big name he would want to bring in the most was Jack Swagger/Jake Hager. Oof. 

Jim Ross, Jake Hager & Matt Hardy would probably free up a bit of money! Money which could be better used on people like La Sombra & Thea. Honestly, Jim Ross has been around pro-wrestling for so long he has to be an asset but it should be in a backstage role. On-air, he feels dated. I know about his wife's unfortunate passing & his comments about commentary giving him something to do but he's just not even on par anymore, let alone above average. I'm sure he wouldn't want the stress of a job like talent relations again & honestly, I'm not sure I would want his mentality in charge of it at this point anyway but he has to be doing something other than commentary, imho. I know TNT wanted him to start but the shit isn't working. He's the worst of all of them & was even surpassed by Paul Wight honestly.

Justin Roberts & Excalibur still come off as memes to me. Excalibur works pretty good with Taz my issue is they do a lot of comedy on commentary & then Taz tries to play a hardass serious guy with the Team Taz shit. It's like shooting himself in the foot. 

Also while I'm fantasizing, get the Best Friends,  Gunn family, Colt Cabana, Matt Sydal, Joey Janella, Luther, & Kip Sabian out of there. My goodness. I haven't seen Nakazawa in awhile but he's still listed on the roster. It might be time to abandon the Shawn Spears experiment if he fails to get any reaction whatsoever again in this new faction as well. Unless there's someway they can get Peyton Royce to give his ass some charisma. Orange Cassidy is at least over even if I don't get it.

Christian is fine. He's a good hand & can have good matches but he's not a top guy & shouldn't be. Same way I feel about PAC.

AEW has a ton of talent, even guys like Angelico whom don't get talked about a lot I'm a fan of. They have fresh stars in the likes of Darby Allin, Jungle Boy, MJF, Ricky Starks, Wardlow, & Sammy Guevara. They have a few solid tag teams with Santana & Ortiz, FTR,  & Young Bucks. For like the mid-card/TV title area the likes of Adam Page, Cody, Lance Archer & probably Miro for now. They have some great talkers in a guy like Eddie Kingston or some of the manager vets like Arn, Jake & Tully. Some pretty good women with Thunder Rosa & the likes of Riho, Shida & Britt Baker getting good reactions/over. Nyla Rose is improving & actually comes off as a threat. Tay Conti seems to have a ton of potential. Still have Fenix whom is one of the better high flying babyfaces in the world right now. Jericho is still a big name & looks to be winding down some, which is good. He should take a backseat & not be the focus now. Moxley is a big get for them & I like how Omega has been going lately. Scorpio Sky should probably go solo & AEW could ditch Daniels & Kazarian. 

Pentagon can be a good, dangerous heel if he would stop half-assing it & just trying to get his shit in. He was great in Lucha Underground but ever since he's been coasting on Superkicks & hand signs to the point that he's now just annoying. I don't know what's going on there. Think he got the impression he could just do the bare minimum & stay over but he's getting passed by... almost the whole damn roster at this point.

The Good Brothers are the shits. I know they're technically Impact wrestlers but they're eating up way too much time on AEW TV.

The Dark Order still stinks but they have had some funny moments lately & John Silver is getting over in the comedy role to be honest. I think Luchasaurus has a lot of talent but that gimmick is the shits. I don't really know enough about people like Ethan Page or Private Party. I don't know who The Acclaimed or Top Flight are.

If someone like Tommy End or Jeff Cobb is available, they would be good gets for AEW but I don't think they need to be thinking about people just because they're available especially if they worked in WWE. Like bringing in Erik Rowan for the Brodie special was great but it was the right decision to not sign him. I would focus more on people that haven't been overexposed on WWE TV. Like try to get people from Mexico, ROH, MLW or that. Specially people under 35. I have no idea what contracts are like elsewhere but getting someone like a Deonna Purrazzo or Jordynne Grace could help the women's division a lot. It's also for the best if AEW specifically steer clear of any... social media liabilities. You can't use guys like Marty Scurll or Jay Briscoe. Maybe they could get an Alex Hammerstone or Salina de la Renta. @El-P mentioned Alicia Atout in the MLW thread today, how has no one signed her? Maybe I underestimate the contract status of places like Impact, ROH & MLW but I just assume you get them with more money, like MJF.

I think they need some top of the card help so they need to elevate a couple names up & honestly, they could use more solid tag teams. I feel Fenix should just be solo all the time at this point & not bother tagging with Pentagon anymore. The roster is getting there & is shaping up nicely but they have a lot of dead weight right now. I get they need to have people to work Dark & Elevation now but I don't think it's a top priority to have a b-team at this point. There's nothing wrong with letting your talent like MJF, Wardlow, Britt & Darby get more reps in on those shows to get better. 

I turn forty this year. I've been watching wrestling for over thirty years. My tastes are pretty well defined at this point. I know that the in-ring style in AEW is not going to be like the Harley Race or Terry Funk days of NWA or like Stan Hansen in Japan & I understand that & get that. I wouldn't ask for that with 2021 eyes anyway. But I do feel like they've been trying new things lately & seeing what works & what doesn't. One thing that I hope going forward is that they start to make gimmick matches more rare. Every card doesn't need multiple gimmick matches & they will seem like a bigger deal if they're built to & made more special. 

Anyway, just wanted to provide some content to get a discussion going & more people talking. Need some more activity around here! 

A few potential questions. Who do you think AEW should part with? Which talent from my post do you agree or disagree with? Who do you think AEW should try to acquire? Who would you build the titles around? What changes would you make to the commentary, if any? How do you feel about Dark & Elevation & the people that are currently working those shows?

[El-P]

49 minutes ago, Coffey said:

My first thought is that AEW should not only not bring in Jeff Hardy but if given the chance, let Matt Hardy go too. He can go back to WWE or whatever if he wants to wrestle with Jeff again. The last thing AEW needs is someone like Jeff Hardy. Jeff was one of the "big" names along with Angle, Sting & Christian that "jumped" to TNA. AEW have already brought in Christian & Sting...

Fucking A. Jeff Hardy is someone I will never EVER get. Yeah yeah yeah, people always talk about "back in the days he was the biggest babyface this side of John Cena" but whatever, his work has always been pretty much the shits to me. 

49 minutes ago, Coffey said:

Jim Ross, Jake Hager & Matt Hardy would probably free up a bit of money! Money which could be better used on people like La Sombra & Thea.

I've really been enjoying Matt Hardy as a working heel manager lately. And he was mostly fun doing the crazy stuff last year.

Hager has done much better than anyone had the right to imagine considering he was the black hole that probably sunk Lucha Underground (it's a metaphor people, I know he did not do OK, but he sure sunk the fun out of it in S4 for me). Now, I don't think he's gonna do much more interesting thing that he's done so far in the Inner Circle, so he could be gone indeed.

JR I agree, it almost makes you feel bad about him when you say he should be gone because of the tragedy in his life, but the truth is he shouldn't call weekly matches. One in a while for a big match of a style he's accustomed with, why not, but...

49 minutes ago, Coffey said:

Also while I'm fantasizing, get the Best Friends,  Gunn family, Colt Cabana, Matt Sydal, Joey Janella, Luther, & Kip Sabian out of there. My goodness. I haven't seen Nakazawa in awhile but he's still listed on the roster. It might be time to abandon the Shawn Spears experiment if he fails to get any reaction whatsoever again in this new faction as well. Unless there's someway they can get Peyton Royce to give his ass some charisma.

Shawn Spears is useful in Pinnacle because you need a jobber to take the falls in midway feud matches.

I'd keep Janella as I like his team with Sonny Kiss. Colt Cabana is really good and fun to have around. Best Friends too as a midcard tag team although Trent can go places higher. The Gunns, Sydal, Luther, Sabian really.... they could be gone and I would not blink an eye (I gave Sabian the benefit of the doubt forever).

49 minutes ago, Coffey said:

Christian is fine. He's a good hand & can have good matches but he's not a top guy & shouldn't be. Same way I feel about PAC.

PAC is one of the best worker in the world, simply put.

Christian I could make a mean-spirited joke about him so I won't. Let's say I kinda got a kick of his promo being "well I'm a really good worker, even the other guys are saying I'm like a super worker" in reference to some stuff that had been said on this board about Christian... I also love the fact they use some rework of his TNA theme, because it was much better than anything he used in WWE and TNA/IMPACT themes are much better than in-house AEW themes. I would LOVE to have Don Callis tell him shit like "You think you can just show up here and challenge Kenny for the AEW title ? Do I look like Dixie Carter to you ?" Hopefully he has really good matches, because that's what he does, ya see ?

49 minutes ago, Coffey said:

Pentagon can be a good, dangerous heel if he would stop half-assing it & just trying to get his shit in. He was great in Lucha Underground but ever since he's been coasting on Superkicks & hand signs to the point that he's now just annoying.

He was doing that at the end in LU too honestly. He had that great match with Sami Callihan in IMPACT two years ago. He's got charisma like no one else though. But Fénix is the one they should push to the top.

Can I say that Cody, since gaining weight, has not looked the same as he did last year ? I dunno if it's injuries pilling up too, but clearly after his great TV title reign, he just seems to have lost something. So much for "Cody is the real star of the promotion" talking point, that was fun as long as it lasted...

49 minutes ago, Coffey said:

I think Luchasaurus has a lot of talent but that gimmick is the shits.

Actually it's the other way around. He's a big guy with a funky gimmick who can do funky moves. Take the gimmick away, there's not much to him honestly, he's just a big guy who can do a bunch of moves. I'm not sure I'd even call him a *good* worker.

49 minutes ago, Coffey said:

I don't really know enough about people like Ethan Page or Private Party. I don't know who The Acclaimed or Top Flight are.

Ethan Page was a terrific tag team wrestler with Josh Alexander. As a solo act I don't think he'll do as well. Private Party & Top Flight have potentials galore. The Acclaimed, not so much.

49 minutes ago, Coffey said:

I have no idea what contracts are like elsewhere but getting someone like a Deonna Purrazzo or Jordynne Grace could help the women's division a lot. It's also for the best if AEW specifically steer clear of any... social media liabilities. You can't use guys like Marty Scurll or Jay Briscoe. Maybe they could get an Alex Hammerstone or Salina de la Renta. @El-P mentioned Alicia Atout in the MLW thread today, how has no one signed her? 

Yeah, I don't get the Atout thing, she was supposed to debut with AEW then did not then showed up in MLW. Deonna & Grace would be assets to the women division for sure. Salina de la Renta should manage Fénix & Penta. Hammerstone would actually be a decent signee but I'm not sure what he would bring to a company that already has guys like Brian Cage & Lance Archer who are bigger and can do more. He's a good promo though.

Speaking of managers, as much as it was cool to see Jake Roberts for a while, he's just kinda passé honestly. And Vickie Guerrero is terrible. 

As far as women who have received some sort of a push that could be let go, Big Swole and Abadon can vanish tomorrow. Please. And SIGN KAMILLE.

[Coffey]

32 minutes ago, El-P said:

As far as women who have received some sort of a push that could be let go, Big Swole and Abadon can vanish tomorrow. Please. And SIGN KAMILLE.

I'm just catching up on Dark now. Red Velvet seemed to have a lot more upside than Big Swole. Also, Jade Cargill has an incredible look but no idea if she's any good. I assume she's green/a rookie. 

I love the Varsity Blonds. They're a lot of fun. Powerhouse Hobbs seemed to have potential as well (although he reminded me of Ice Train) & Ricky Starks' finish was nice. 

Kamille would be a huge get. Abadon to me just comes off as a worse version of Su-Yung. 

Interesting look for that Ryzin' preacher dude.  Looks like someone that The Sinister Minister would manage.

[El-P]

8 minutes ago, Coffey said:

I'm just catching up on Dark now. Red Velvet seemed to have a lot more upside than Big Swole. Also, Jade Cargill has an incredible look but no idea if she's any good. I assume she's green/a rookie. 

I believe Jade Cargill has had exactly 2 matches in her entire career. Both on Dynamite. So yeah, total rookie. Obviously the only reason she's featured is the way she looks. Now it can go both ways, either she gets good and it's cool, either she doesn't and it will suck so bad. The issue is throwing her so fast on TV, that could end up detrimental.

Swole has been pushed before and it sucked. She's just bad. Red Velvet on the other hand was basically a Dark JTTS bit since she showed potential and charisma now she'll probably get a better deal.

8 minutes ago, Coffey said:

Abadon to me just comes off as a worse version of Su-Yung. 

Yeah, totally. Su-Yung is not a great worker by any means, but the character and presentation in IMPACT is insane. Abadon looks like someone doing a Walking Dead cosplay in a video game convention. And she managed to have a bad match with Shida. Sorry girl, that won't work for me.

8 minutes ago, Coffey said:

Interesting look for that Ryzin' preacher dude.  Looks like someone that The Sinister Minister would manage.

If James Mitchell had a son.... (NO IT'S NOT A SUGGESTION !!! I love me some James Mitchell, but I don't want to relive the Abyss storyline !!!)

And yeah, Hobbs is soooo Ice Train 2021, for better or worse (I kinda liked Ice Train). Pillman is much better working tag team matches for now too. Yeah, that's a throwback tag-team that has potential too.

[sek69]

4 hours ago, El-P said:

What's up with the whole Billy Gunn family though ? 

He's like the inverse of the Rush deal. To get Rush, you need to give his dad a job. AEW wanted Billy as an agent, so they had to give his kids a job. 

[Coffey]

It won't be long now! Miro is gonna fucking feast on this jobber.

 

[sek69]

Funny thing is  that it's clear this was the plan the whole time and all the people upset that Miro was being ruined by being paired with Kip are going to go nuts for it. 

[Blehschmidt]

Going by this List

I would cut: Alan Angels, Anthony Bowens, The Gunn Club, Colt Cabana, Joey Janela, Luther, Marko Stunt, Matt Sydal, Max Caster, Michael Nakazawa, Serpentico, Shawn Dean, Shawn Spears

I know that Cabana, Sydal, and Janela have something of a "name value" to some people, but they are going absolutely no where. Shawn Spears is only worth keeping on the roster if they think they are going to get Peyton Royce, otherwise I have no idea what value he adds. I don't see what they see in The Acclaimed.

It seems like Brandon Cutler, Kazarian, Daniels, Peter Avalon, and QT Marshall are probably doing backstage stuff as well as being lower carders, but they could certainly stand to go as well.

Kip Sabian is only worth having as a manager for Penelope Ford.

Private Party, Top Flight, Lee Johnson, Hobbs, and Preston Vance seem like guys worth slow building as they gain experience.

 

On the women's roster, I think Big Swole, Mel, Abadon, and Leva Bates can safely be cut.

 

As for folks I would look to hire....

I think Alex Gracia, Jazmin Allure, and Tesha Price who they've had on Dark would be worth investing in long term to train with Dustin.

If they can get Andrade and Thea, they definitely should.

When it comes to WWE cast offs, they need to be careful not to go crazy, but guys like Ricochet, Aleister Black, and the like who have been criminally underused and fit their style would be good choices.

As for folks from the indies and elsewhere, Jeff Cobb, Chris Hero, Bandido, Deonna Purrazzo, Su Yung, and Zack Sabre would be a few I'd look into.

[sek69]

A lot of that list is why some people call AEW "All Friends Wrestling". The EVPs (and Jericho) all got gigs for their pals that you could make a good argument against. 

When it comes to signing ex WWE people, anyone who doesn't see the difference between "extremely talented folks WWE is wasting" and "old guys taking up space" is being intellectually dishonest. No one wants AEW to be filled with Big Lazy types, but the idea they shouldn't go after someone like Andrade when he becomes available because "he's a WWE cast off" is insane to me. 

[El-P]

1 hour ago, sek69 said:

AEW wanted Billy as an agent, so they had to give his kids a job. 

The question remains. WHY ?

58 minutes ago, sek69 said:

Funny thing is  that it's clear this was the plan the whole time and all the people upset that Miro was being ruined by being paired with Kip are going to go nuts for it. 

Pretty much, although I really expected Miro to fuck up the wedding himself in a sort of a meta angle.

37 minutes ago, Blehschmidt said:

Shawn Spears is only worth keeping on the roster if they think they are going to get Peyton Royce, otherwise I have no idea what value he adds.

aka the Lance Storm Syndrome (boring solid guy who is not getting over, put a hot girl at his side and all of a sudden he gets a reaction, worked in both ECW and WCW, did not happen in WWE and so he did not get over). I doubt it would work in 2021 though, as you don't get a woman play straight eye candy now. I mean, doesn't work for Sabian.

[Coffey]

25 minutes ago, sek69 said:

A lot of that list is why some people call AEW "All Friends Wrestling". The EVPs (and Jericho) all got gigs for their pals that you could make a good argument against. 

When it comes to signing ex WWE people, anyone who doesn't see the difference between "extremely talented folks WWE is wasting" and "old guys taking up space" is being intellectually dishonest. No one wants AEW to be filled with Big Lazy types, but the idea they shouldn't go after someone like Andrade when he becomes available because "he's a WWE cast off" is insane to me. 

For what it's worth, I would have been 100% against The Big Show coming in had it leaked before it happened. That being said, at least thus far, he's been great on commentary. Now, if he gets in the ring & starts taking up TV time from others, my stance might change, but I like him on commentary so far. 

Your point stands about the difference between the talents though. Same reason I'm against Jeff Hardy.

[sek69]

I think Jeff Hardy is very talented, but he's too much of a risk for any non WWE company to take at this point since I get the impression their rules are the only reason he's not out there racking up DUIs like Charlotte Flair title wins. 

[MoS]

Cutting Best Friends is tricky cuz they come with Orange Cassidy, who along with Darby Allin, MJF and Hangman Page, is one of the biggest home-grown stars and draws AEW have developed. 

I agree with most of the names discussed to be cut. AEW needed some jobbers when they started simply to establish hierarchy. There's no reason that complete trash like Luger are taking up spots on the roster now. 

[El-P]

38 minutes ago, MoS said:

There's no reason that complete trash like Luger are taking up spots on the roster now. 

You show proper respect to the Total Package now.