JerryvonKramer

Hey mate, what's this doc? I'd love to see it.

Pretty good example, in action, is this Terry Funk vs. Sal Bellomo match I stumbled on the other day: http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/31685-terry-funk-jvk-edn/?p=5768333 That's a truly incredible performance from Funk, but I don't think it would mean much to anyone who doesn't have a good idea of what a typical WWF house show from 1985 was like, what a typical Sal Bellomo match looks like, and so on. To me that's an example of Funk working miracles, but if you showed someone that match in isolation (i.e. someone who doesn't watch 85-WWF much, doesn't remember it, spends most of their time watching other types of stuff), I suspect they'd see it as "just a match".

My feeling is that the way we were watching wrestling during GWE wasn't a very good way to watch wrestling. What I mean is: watching lots of matches from the same guy all in a row. I think it's much better to watch whole cards, including all the undercard shit, whole TV shows, whole TV runs, etc. to get a better feel for what's going on. I know some people look at me or Kelly strangely when we say that Mr. Fuji was a good worker, but he definitely was when you see the stuff in context. If I was to pick out all the highlights and make a big youtube list or 3-disc "Best of Fuji" comp, I'm not sure it would come through in the same way. It's less about watching lots of matches of the same guy in isolation as it is about getting a feel for certain times and places. Here is the stuffy old historian G.R. Elton talking about his ideal "professional" historian: Now while there are issues with this in terms of the historigraphy, I think that if we think about what he's saying when to comes to judging wrestling matches and workers, there are some some decent ideas at stake. As one example, I don't think one can appreciate Roddy Piper fully just by watching clips of Piper on Youtube. Part of his explosive impact in the places he worked, you have to see what the norms of the environment are in order even to feel the impact. I felt it pretty strongly when I watched Dynamite Kid vs. Tiger Mask from MSG. If you look at it with 2016-eyes, it's just a bunch of spots. But if you look at it from the 1982-MSG perspective, it's totally mindblowing. In a sense, to appreciate Ric Flair or Tully Blanchard, you kinda need to see Ron Bass or whoever else was on the card. I don't beliebe people build up their views of wrestlers from deep-diving on them, it comes from seeing them on many shows over many years. The whole culture of splitting up matches, watching only the best stuff, etc. etc. has the overall effect of creating a kind of false economy, a false set of standards, etc. I guess now some guys have matches knowing that it is going to be separated off from the rest of the show, and in effect they are "wrestling for youtube", but probably the vast majority of workers ever were not thinking like this.

For those interested, part 4 is up.

Episode 3: http://placetobenation.com/letters-from-kayfabe-3/ Allan and Parv once again delve, quite literally, into some of the lesser known corners of the WWF. 1. The Mailbag: Ron Garvin after Royal Rumble 90 / Tito Santana-Virgil relationship / Col. Mustafa in 92 2. The Event Center with JT Rozzero: Big changes in talent and broadcasting arrangements in 1996 3. The Long Topic: Rogers' Corner / Victory Corner wih Roger deBord To write in to the mailbag, tweet @allan_cheapshot or @JerryvonK Follow along on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLS1QYjCSmymiX0epEWAgRLn1JYdx-mCFQ Dailymotion supplemental: http://www.dailymotion.com/playlist/x4nvn8_jerryvonk_letters-from-kayfabe-3/1#video=x42tuj

Conrad booking Bruce Mitchell for Flair this week looks like stoking the flames quite a bit.

I've witnessed them laughing in the middle of matches on numerous occasions and it has not always been clear why. That in itself isn't bullshit, it's just an observation. This hasn't been in comedy matches either but main events. Next time I come across it I'll be sure to note down time stamps. The picture was also an observation.

Dick Slater vs. Greg Valentine (2/25/84) This must be the semi final for the TV title. I've just watched Slater defeat Dory Funk Jr in the quarter. Was curious to see this one. Greg goes straight for Slater with elbows. Slow armdrag and twist from Greg. Hammer blow. Bodyslam. Drops the leg on Slater's arm. Arm bar. Incidentally the other semi is Assassin #2 vs. Mark Youngblood (curiously under stacked side of the draw, compared with this side). Gut punches by Slater. Gullotines Greg on top rope. Vertical suplex. Elbow drop. Nice one. Side Russian legsweep. Greg comes back. Blows back and forth now. Elbow smashes by Greg. Big knee drop. Nasty wishbone. Cover gets two only. Elbow. Stiff as hell. Headbutt by Slater. Inverted atomic drop by Greg. Second rope elbow. Slater rolls out of ring. Greg throw him back in. Slater tries to run. Hammer blow from Greg. Side suplex by Greg. Slater tries to work out again. Full Nelson on the outside. Back in. No, the bell has gone. Sly, Slater with the cheapest of the cheap count out wins. This was a really heated ten-minute TV match. Stiff and intense, especially from Valentine. Worth a watch. *** I might seek out some more Slater from this run, looks like he was getting a major push here.

Dory Funk Jr vs. Dick Slater (2/18/84) This is from a bunch of Mid-Atlantic stuff that came online recently. Quarter final for the TV title. Winner faces Greg Valentine. Caudle and David Crockett on commentary. Quite a big match to have on TV this. Slater is US champ here. Tommy Young the ref. Hip toss and an arm drag by Dory, into a pinning predicament. Arm bar. Up to a vertical base. Uppercuts. Forearm smash. Arm bar into a double wrist lock. Slater manages to wriggle across to counter. Nose swivel and an elbow drop. Goes for figure four but Dory counters, and Dory uses the arm drag again, into arm bar. Elbow smash by Slater. Lateral press by Slater. Dory rolls over. Uppercut. And another. Third. Cover gets two only. Cradle gets two. Rolling cradle. Two only. Headbutts from Slater. Back suplex. Cover gets two only. Forearms from Dory. Elbow smash by him. Spinning toehold! But Slater dumps him. Dory back in. Turnbuckle shot. Two more near falls. Side Russian legsweep. Handful of tights, and that's a pin! Slater pins Dory! I think Dory must have been booker for Crockett here. I wonder if that Slater vs. Greg match is around, I'd love to see it. **1/2

Dory Funk Jr and Terry Funk vs. Abdullah the Butcher and The Sheik (12/13/79) For some reason I've not seen this. Let's see if it lives up to any of their other classic encounters. This is obviously the RWTL final. Tournament highlights are alys fun to watch. Long time readers of Learning to Love Dory will note that I gave their last encounter (7/15/79) 4.75. The Funks AJPW theme is one of the all-time greatest. They were incredibly over here. Terry especially. Dory sporting a beard here. It's a good look for him. Funks clean house to start. I really like Sheik and Abby as a Dick Dastardly and Mutley style duo around this time. Sheik and Terry start out. Headlock by Sheik and he immediately tags out. Abby throws something in his eyes. Throat jab. Headbutt. Throat jab. And again. Wild comedy punching from Terry. Another jab to the through from Abby. Terry goes for spinning toehold. Dory in. Patented forearm smash. Goes for suplex and gets it! Abby is a big man to suplex. Stomps from Dory now. Terry in. Texas jabs from him. Fist drop. After all the stomps and punches, Abby is busted open. Massive diving fist drop from Terry now. And he's BITING THE CUT. Probably inadvisable. Dory in. Double forearm smash. Funk special. Cover gets two. Sheik in with cheapness. Terry dumps him. Dory with more fists on Abby who just drops. SEVEN elbow drops from Dory in a row now. Abby is just a bloody mess. Blood all over the ring. Sheik grabs Dory and has the pencil, spiking him in eye and forehead as ref can't see. Abby has his fork. Jabs Terry, sends him packing. Does a fork drop on Dory now. Fucking nasty. Elbow drop. Two only. Sheik jabs Dory with the pencil some more. Fork shot by Abby to Terry who is screaming in pain. Quite disturbing noises. I think it's his ear. Abby promptly bites the ear. Fork to the ear. Sheik chokes Dory with the pencil meanwhile. And of course is busted open. Uppercuts by him on Abby now, while Terry is in agony on the outside. Sheik in. Pencil shot to throat, running forearm by Dory. Terry in and has pencil. Crowd is fucking wild. Pencil shot to the head by Terry on Sheik. Right in his face now. Abby spikes Terry on the top of the head with the fork. The ref completely lost control of this a good ten minutes ago. Abby with some sick shots with the fork to Terry's hand now. Can see the cuts in the hand where the fork was. Another if fork shot. Terry looks like he's been crippled. A third big fork shot on the hand. Sheik in with more cheapness. Abby in and he's biting the wrist. Samoan drop by Abby. Cover gets two. Elbow drop. Cover gets two. Terry com back with Texas jabs cut connects with the injured hand. Sheik in with a camel clutch. Crowd is so loud. Terry manages to stand up with Sheik on his back almost and gets the hot tag to Dory. Abby in. Sleeper by Dory. Dory covered in blood, Abby covered in blood. Some of the blood has dried across Dory's forehead. Abby fading but the arm doesn't drop. Cover gets two only. Reverse chinlock from Doey but Sheik comes in with a blatant choke. Terry in. Nose swivel on Abby. Blatant choke from Terry. Terry is still selling his destroyed hand by the way. Spinning toehold from Terry, Abby with a counter. Sheik in. Dory in. Sheik holds Dory but Abby connects with him accidentally, and Dory pins Sheik. Look at that a clean job from Sheik right in the middle. Abby is escorted out with a jacket over his head. Sheik skulks. This is a total bloodbath but it lacks some of the psychology of the 2/3 falls from 7/15/79 because all semblance of there being any rules at all is thrown out of the window. Where in that match Abby and Sheik cheated like crazy, here they were just blatant, almost openly using weapon shots. It also lacks some of the insane wildness of the 5-star classic 9/19/78. Terry's selling is borderline disturbing during this. And the attack on his hand with the fork by Abby is truly psycho stuff, and I can't think how they did that other than by hardway. Sheik seemed much more limited in what he did in this one. It's definitely worth seeing, and is a good match, but it's not up with their very best encounters. ***3/4

You don't deserve love or happiness in your life; all your friends secretly dislike you.

Three big pieces of backstage news. First, that bastard Inoki booked Muta to win the AWA Unversial title with no warning ... Second, I've offered Flair a HUGE contract after seeing this news ... Third, I've bought out ACW as a developmental territory. I've picked up a number of promising youngsters to harness their talents down there: AWA Championship Wrestling, June, Week 1, 91: This was a dark match. Also a dark match. Solie *grave*: Ladies and Gentlemen. There is a new AWA Universal Champion. Two nights ago in Kobe World Hall, Kinki, Japan, Keiji Mutoh, otherwise known as The Great Muta, defeated Ricky the Dragon Steamboat to become the new champion. Word out of Japan is that it was a classic enounter: an extremely gruelling match that took a lot out of both men. Caudle: Well, Gordon, I'm in shock. Solie: But that is not all. The Great Muta is here TONIGHT. As part of AWA rules, a losing champion is entitled to a rematch within 30 days of losing the belt. Ricky Steamboat has immediately triggered this and The Great Muta has granted a rematch TONIGHT on AWA Championship Wrestling. Caudle: An AWA Universal title match, between the Great Muta and Ricky Steamboat here? Tonight? By golly, Gordon, that's something. Solie: Stay tuned folks. If Inoki does that again, he will be expelled from the alliance. Sunday Night Wrestling on MTV, June, Week 1, 91: *Butch Reed is walking through a smokey urban street, mist seems to be everywhere coming up through the sewers. Reed has a ghettoblaster over one shoulder. Music that sounds suspicously like Run DMC and Aerosmith's "Walk This Way" but isn't quite it plays out. Reed seems to spot someone. He cups his hand to his mouth to call over to them. Reed: Hey, 2 Cold. Hey 2 Fly! *2 Cold Scorpio backflips into the scene. 2 Fly Gemini strolls into view.* Reed: Hey Soulman! Hey Big Daddy V! *SD Jones dances down the street. Big Daddy V comes out of a building. The beat gets louder and ... Reed starts to rap to it.* Reed: Call me Boombox Butch, call me Boombox Reed I pack more punch than Apollo Creed I'll put you down with my powerslam We're the Boombox Brothers and we don't give a DAMN! 2 Cold: Too hot to handle, but too cool for school I come off the top, but I don't break the rules Three-quarter twist as I spin through the air, We're the Boombox Brothers and we just don't care! 2 Fly: Just 'cause I'm from England it don't mean I can't rhyme I fly through the air and I fly down the line I got the World in Motion just like John Barnes We're the Boombox Brothers and we don't give a darn! Jones: I got a Special Delivery, it's called VICTORY Boy my history ain't no mystery My head hits harder than a 62-yarder The Soulman brother ain't no midcarder Yo, I ain't gonna slow down, I got my flow down, I tell all the ladies come on and go down You know you want to just a little bit We're the Boombox Brothers and we don't give a .... Big Daddy V: I'm the Daddy mack, here come the black attack I go "wack wack, boom, boom, clack, clack" Let me hear it: "wack, wack, boom, boom, clack, clack. Yeah: "wack, wack, boom, boom, clack clack" Wack, wack, boom, boom, bam, bam All: We're the Boombox Brothers and we don't give a DAMN!!!!!!! DJ Petersen seems to be the worst guy ever. Yakuza. Will. Get. Over. This MTV product sucks. I need to send over some established talent and soon. Gonna have to tweak MTV brand so I don't keep getting this "dangeous spot" note. Another terrible MTV show in the books.

This week's "Ask Naitch" had me laughing a good bit during the answer to "What town had the wildest ring rats". Especially when he said "Tokyo ... if you like Asian women, man, they are everywhere" From around then onwards, it's a pretty funny one.

More like this mate:

Yeah I just think it would be more interesting to see what others think. It does feel like we watched two different matches, but I can only call it like I see it. I guess I do want the dramatic selling of Steamboat or Bret or Savage (or Kawada or Kobashi or Misawa or Flair or Pat Patterson or Martel or Funk), I've been conditioned as a fan to look for certain things in a selling performance and something about the way that Styles sold in this one just wasn't hitting it for whatever reason. I outlined some of my problems with the psychology (if some are wondering:here). Like I said more heat and atmosphere as well as a better finish might have helped. But other perspectives will make this richer.

Best continue in the match thread where I left a reply.

Just letting the shock of reading this review settle in. Well, I guess it goes to show that the eye of the beholder is all in these matters. We're pretty night and day on this, it's almost like my review is the Polaroid nagative of yours. There it is. Might be interesting to see where others land. I didn't see anything approaching an all-time match, but Sleaze did.

AJ Styles vs. Bobby Roode (12/11/11) Reviewed on request from Marty. He's making me watch TNA from 2011 so there better be a good reason. Build package is not very good. Going to try to tune out announcing and crowd and just look at what's happening in ring. Just in passing, some notes on presentational elements: I checked the date on the video again to check this wasn't 2001 rather than 2011, looks so staid and dated. Music is passé. Arena lighting is poor, whole thing looks like an old RAW. It's actually vaguely shocking a product that looks like this drew 11,000 people, which is a crowd 92 WCW would have killed for. Okay, let's put all that stuff out of mind and look at the match. I'm also going to try to put out of mind the fact that there is another iron man match with a man called "Rude" in it, let's put all that to one side. Very little about Roode's heel character work is natural in the early going. Just seems to be thinking too much about what he's doing. Some submission exchanges to start worked around headlock and body scissors, pretty oldschool sequence, 70s staple. Around the six minute mark they start breaking out chop exchanges in the corner. I think it's quite early in the match to be busting out a big strike exchange and it feels entirely unearned here and it dissipates into a back body drop. That whole sequence just fell flat. What was the point of it? No drama in the exchanges, and stakes feel low. AJ takes a tumble to the outside. And he's hurt his leg which Roode targets. They move into some pin attempts and counters. Deep armdrag by Styles. Clothesline gets two. Reverse chinlock. Back to the side headlock. Roode sneaks in a shinbreaker. Styles's leg is hurt. And soon Roode goes 1-0 up. 10 mins in. Chop block by Roode. He's stayed on that knee. I've liked the methodical pace with which Roode has gone about dismantling this leg. He's not rushing. Styles is still far from out though and comes back fighting. Roode cuts him off with a knee to the face. Hamstring snap -- straight out of the Dory playbook that one. Styles still fighting. Single leg crab by Roode. I feel like Styles needs to have shown a bit more vulnerability than he has so far. Seems quite sprightly for a man whose leg has been destroyed for fifteen minutes. Gets to the rope, and I have to say I didn't at all buy his pain or struggle there. Just too much zip about him still. Figure four by Roode and I'm hoping this might wear Styles down a bit. He's like bloody Zebedee out of the Magic Roundabout. He taps to the pain. I dunno what it is, maybe it's the specific type of selling here, but there's something about Styles that doesn't seem dead or beaten enough. If a guy is tapping to the figure four I really want to see that pain properly, the agony, the exhaustion. And in this fall, as in the first, it has not come through enough. Roode kicks the leg out again. Still seemingly too much zip about Styles in the way he's selling this leg. Although he is starting to slow down. Styles manages to hit a Rock Bottom type move and then immediately crawls over for the crossface. Sorry guys I'm just not buying this guy has a blown-out knee 18 minutes into this. Roode taps to the crossface. So it's 2-1. The selling of this leg seems to disappear momentarily as he does some arm wringers now. It's almost like the selling is mechanically turned on and off. Roode manages to get back on the leg but Styles breaks him. I don't really get why Styles is even going for kicks when he's got a bad wheel. He goes after Roode's arm but is cut off by an eye rake. Roode clobbers Styles with a clothesline but it's with his injured arm, which Roode sells pretty well. Styles slides over for a cradle out of nowhere to even it up at 2-2. 9 mins left. Roode attacks the leg with kicks. Inzaguri from Styles. Spinebuster by Roode. He does a kind of DDT on Styles's foot, which is pretty cool. Roode goes for a catapult but Styles flips back from the turnbuckle, hits a reverse DDT and then does a springboard forward somersault thing off the top for three. 3-2. His leg is still hurt and he did sell it as he was covering. That said, I am still not really getting this idea of bursts of adrenaline leading to superhuman sequences where the leg is forgotten. I'm not keen on the psychology of it, and ALL three of Styles's falls so far have come from that source. 6 mins left. Roode manages to get in a cheap pin holding the rope for 3-3 around 5 minute mark. Styles is pissed now and beats on Roode in the face. Nasty looking. Goes for a superplex. Not happening. But Styles now runs to arm drag Roode of the top. And then nurses the bad leg. The stop-start psychology of the leg selling is weird to me. 3 mins. Back suplex by Styles. Shoulder and arm of Roode badly damaged now. Styles goes for a suplex but Roode kneecaps him. Goes for a perfectplex but Styles slips under for a cradle. Styles goes for a crucifix, but Roode charges and he lands awkwardly on his leg. That looked nasty. Roode slips outside and Style dives out after him landing on his leg. The psychology of the idiotic hail Mary move is another one I'm not that keen on, all very Shawn Michaels. 1 min left. They are still outside. Back in. 15 seconds left, and Roode evades. Chase. And that is so so cheap. All that and a Honky Tonk Man finish? Come on. Did I watch the right match here. This? Is this a rib? Tell me I watched the wrong match. There was a lot I found wanting in this match, but first the good: the basic psychology of the injured leg versus the injured arm / shoulder was solid. They also paced it pretty well apart from that early and poorly-timed chop exchange. I was also impressed with Roode, who was surprisingly good here. However, some issues: - stop-start selling from Styles. Up until about 10 mins left, he's far far too sprightly for a guy whose knee has gone. Maybe it's an expectation thing. I grew up watching Bret, Savage, and Steamboat, real masters of selling a body part, so I guess I expect exhaustion, pain, everything to be a bit of a struggle. Styles in this match seemed to have these bursts where he somehow forgot about the leg to do something explosive, and then he'd go back to selling it. Just something about that whole story wasn't working for me and they went to the same well three times. - Complete lack of real drama. I guess this is one where the almost church-like atmosphere of TNA can't really be overlooked. Bland announcers and a really quiet (or at least badly micced up) crowd didn't help things. Where was the heat? This really came to the fore in the strike exchanges. Styles's reverse knife edges are fine but they echo out seemingly into emptiness. It would have helped so much if the crowd were really roaring for his comebacks, but their reaction made it seem like just another match for the most part. - Awful finish. What was that? It seems custom-made to be disappointing but perhaps as a consequence of the fact the guys knew it was coming the match doesn't really build to a hot finish. Our emotional high point is the suicidal dive to the outside, it's not really what one wants from an Iron Man. Didn't sense that desperation of the timer ticking down, which is surely half the psychology of a match like this. It didn't happen. - About that suicidal dive, just a taste thing I guess, but that entire Jeff Hardy trope of doing stuff despite supposed massive injury isn't great psychology and I've always found it hard to get behind. All in all, I found the match pretty disappointing. If this is an all-time Styles selling performance, I wouldn't at all put him with the Brets or Steamers in that department, I just didn't believe the pain enough especially during the first twenty minutes. I'm afraid I can't recommend this one. ***1/2

I wonder if Dory will follow suit ...

Just listened to the open and Bruce really lays into the dirtsheets pretty hard calling Meltzer and co the biggest marks going who have been "worked by the boys" for years, reserving special contempt for Bruce Mitchell. I actually thought the much more interesting part than the idea that Vince was paying off Dave, was the idea that Dave has consistently put over his chief informats (Flair was the only one named, by Conrad pushing Bruce, but by implication that's also Ross and Cornette, among others) in exchange for information. There might be a little bit to that actually. Dave seldom has a bad word to say about Flair in 80s and even into 90s. He seldom if ever criticises Jim Ross on commentary -- I've read through his coverage in of WCW in 1992 over the past year of WTBBPs, and Ross didn't have a banner year imo, but Dave never picks him up on anything. He generally sides with Cornette in his various contract disputes, etc. etc. I think if there's any interesting point made by Pritchard in that opening diatribe, it's that. But it's all done by implication since Flair and Corny are right there as MLW stable mates. Who was Dave's inside guy at WWF?

Up until the steroid scandal, Dave wasn't particularly critical of WWF either though and gave credit where it was due, especially in the areas of production and the television product, the matches / wrestling quality less so. Yes, the occasional moan that Dibiase was being wasted with Hercules or Owen Hart wasted as Blue Blazer or whatever, but it seems to me that through that whole time frame Dave was far far more critical of Dusty's booking than he was of Vince's. But that could just be even-handedness on Dave's part calling it like he sees it. I mean WWF was generally well booked and promoted in late 80s and NWA / WCW generally wasn't, even if it had the better match quality. Also, it's always seemed more like 80s Dave sees through the eyes of an NWA fan seeing his side getting beaten every week, whereas when he reports on Titan he feels more like a journalist. None of this has anything to do with what Pritchard has alleged (not listened yet), but just some observations.