El-P

"Hey Pillman, how about you carry that albatros like Rick Martel used to do ?" "Okay" So yeah, they had some really good stuff to their resume, because Pillman was that good, and Zenk only had to not fuck things up.

I'd rather watch them than the Hardys in 00. Not too bad for dying ECW, they definitely had potential.

The JTTS tag team that should have been pushed in the Nitro era. Good stuff against the Faces of Fear, but sadly the tag division was taken hostage by the wahsed up Steiners, the awful Harlem Heat and the Outsiders (notice I didn't say anything bad about them). Very good utility guys, obviously.

Doring was boring and mediocre, but honestly Roadkill wasn't anything but a big guy with a goofy gimmick bumping hard, he was overrated as hell in late ECW. I'd rather watch EZ Money & Julio Dinero.

If you are uneasy about talking about some issues, that's your own little problem. I have none and I don't pass judgement on anyone about this particular match I might add. Sean and other people explained why they didn't see it as sad and enjoyed it, and everything was going pretty well and respectfully until you showed up bitching. So stop trolling me. It's not like I care one bit.

I had heard about it and the injury, and I was curious to see what was so "good" about the match. And I don't feel like I have to justify myself of why I watch a pro-wrestling match and talk about it on Pro-Wrestling Only if I want to. So there. As far as "spoiling the surprise", really ? Meltz already talked about it, it's on Youtube where you can get spoiled by reading the comments and the video was posted two days ago already. (plus the surprise is Terry Funk getting injured because Lawler threw a fireball straight into his eyes, so yeah, so much goodness there. Jeez, it's not like I spoiled the end of the Streak….) (oh, and "shiting on the match", really ? "I would agree about the match being as good as it can be when the average age in the ring is 68." "I love Terry, and I like Lawler, and yes, this was as good as you can expect it to be." well…)

I believe Meltz reported that Funk was hurt by the fireball, yes. I would agree about the match being as good as it can be when the average age in the ring is 68. But that's the problem to me. I don't want to see a pro-wrestling match involving two guys that old. I don't care how "good" their psychology is. At some point, I have to draw the line between what's fun to watch and what's not fun to watch. And two guys passed 65 having a pro-wrestling match just isn't any fun to watch, period. If you showed me that when I was 15, or even 25, not-yet-prowrestling-fan me and told me that those two are masters and this is very good as far as pro-wrestling goes, I would have thought it was stupid, crass and not interesting in the least. I love Terry, and I like Lawler, and yes, this was as good as you can expect it to be. But to me, and even if Funk hadn't been hurt, this is clearly on the "pretty sad" side of things, aesthetically speaking. (of course when it's guys who do need the money, then it's really fucking sad, but I was not refering to that, and I sure hope Terry doesn't *need* to do this)

You mean the part where 71 years old Funk actually gets burned by a legit fireball ? Sorry if I sound like an asshole, but I find this rather sad actually (not just the ending, the entire thing). And if we're calling this a "good pro-wrestling match" by today's standarts, then yes, I admit it, pro-wrestling has passed me by.

This card looks dreadful to me. Rusev in a six-man opener is sad. Ryback makes sure I don't give a shit about Owens. Dudz make sure I don't give a shit about the New Days. Kane makes sure I don't give a shit about Rollins. Roman vs Bray I sure don't give a shit either way. Charlotte vs Nikki, well, can't say I'm too interested, but still way more than the other stuff. Taker vs Lesnar gets morbid curiosity out of me. I only hope for a cool debut to face Cena and get the US belt. But I'm not really getting my hopes up either. WWE in 2015. Yep.

Edit : as far as pure shoot-style matches go : Tamura, clearly ahead. Then, since Han doesn't have the longevity and Fuji was mostly great in both UWFs, it would be a toss up. Some goofy pro-style traits of Fujiwara (those headbutts...) could hurt him, but then again, longevity. So, I dunno.

Volk Han was the Dan Kroffat of shoot-style in term of finishing stretches.

It's been a while, but I'm not sure I would say 96 was still her peak. 95 without a doubt, but wasn't she slipping a bit by 96 already compared to her 93/95 work ?

I already know who my #100 is. I believe last time it was Shinzaki, but I'm not sure.

Potentially, a top 50 guy easily. Practically, nope. Don't do drugs kids.

I always got a kick out of Terri Runnels saying that Ray Traylor was basically her best girlfriend on the road in the 00's. The Corny story of Bubba not selling a car door slammed on his hands because some maks were around, then screaming with his high pitch voice backstage is classic too. Actually, I haven't thought about Traylor in a while, and I really can't stand his last WWF stint, but from the 80's to about 94/95, he really was a very good worker that I always loved. Could snip in...

We should rename that thread "20 jazz funk greats"...

Ok. Can I see those lists ? Please ? (I'd love to have those references)

As I'm going through Ishin Gundan vs NJ, Ishin Gundan vs Jumbo's army & UWF vs NJ, it just occured to me that the two workers who basically revolutionized pro-wrestling in the 80's in Japan (Choshu & Maeda) were actually Korean. I wonder if that has been discussed before and if that played a role in how they were perceived by the audience, including the fact they played the role of rebellious people turning against the establishment.

As I'm going through Ishin Gundan vs NJ, Ishin Gundan vs Jumbo's army & UWF vs NJ, it just occured to me that the two workers who basically revolutionized pro-wrestling in the 80's in Japan (Choshu & Maeda) were actually Korean. I wonder if that has been discussed before and if that played a role in how they were perceived by the audience, including the fact they played the role of rebellious people turning against the establishment.

I used to love Devil so much. Except when she was doing that Super Heel shitty Taker like gimmick. But yeah, great worker. And like you said, probably the first veteran worker. The greatest smile in joshi puroresu too (could be a genuine gentle smile or a totally evil one).

So yeah, sometime we do see the same match. This is terrific indeed.

Yeah, but we really only use the last part as a running gag since 2002 : "I fully assume the responsibility for this failure and I drew conclusions by removing me from …." (whatever you're talking about at that moment) As a frenchman, it automatically popped up in my brain. Along with this (no translation needed) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9PjBgWOkng

I went into details about that match already. It's like we didn't watch the same match, but it's not the first time it happens, and I'm cool with that. To me Takada is better that Fuji at this point. To quote Will : "Different strokes for different people".

This. You know what you need to do now, Dan.

He couldn't be seen as the real deal when he was submitting to a Mutoh shitty figure four I believe. Still, that didn't keep him from going all shooty later, so. Yeah, terrific carny like I said. And really, should the HUSTLE work count for something ? I have no idea what he was saying over there, but it was so cool and goofy.