One and Only Demolition Thread

[cm funk]

I understand the common complaint about their look and ring gear, but it was the 80's. Metal was huge. Sure we'd all laugh at guys who came out dressed like that today, but there was nothing weird about it back then. You have to look at it in context of the era, some shit from the 80's gets trendy again (new wave, neon, the hip hop fashions of the day etc.)......a lot of it doesn't....but shoot, the 80's "S&M as high fashion" Grace Jones type of stuff has even become trendy again with pop stars like Rihanna and Lady Gaga. Not so much with men, but all it will take is one rock band that hits it big to bring that type of look back into style.

 

As far as Eadie goes, the dude looked like he could kick ass and stand toe to toe with the biggest and baddest without giving up an inch, he projected the vibe of being somebody you didn't want to f with, and that's really all you need in wrestling. I never cared that he looked old or fat, I just saw him in there against whoever and thought that he was one of the toughest SOBs around. In the early 90's it was definitely noticeable that he was aging and hurting and slowing down, but Demo in their prime? Ax was badass.

[Victator]

How does Darsow suck? His selling and offense and generally good.

[cm funk]

Also, they have one of the raddest themes of the era

 

HERE COMES THE AX

AND HERE COMES THE SMASHER

WE'RE DEMOLITION

WALKING DISASTER

 

Does it get any better?

[rzombie1988]

Well, when the Warriors finally did arrive in WWF their first angle was with Demolition and it was based on the Warriors calling them Road Warrior rip-offs. And Demo was saying "No, they're ripping US off!" in a display of heels saying outrageous lies.

So, yeah. Demolition were Vince's Road Warriors.

They were supposed to be Vince's Road Warriors(even the Observer said so) but eventually the Roadies became Demolition rip offs. The PoP's ended up becoming Vince's Road Warriors(again, the Observer).

 

The Demo's were definitely supposed to be heel but the PoP's didn't get over and the Demos did. If you take out the PoP's feud, Demolition could have had a really different career.

[goodhelmet]

How does Darsow suck? His selling and offense and generally good.

From project comments on Darsow's offense...

 

So far this match has been very good but then Darsow is asked to continue doing body part work.

Darsow applies a terrible Boston Crab and Alfred calls him out on it.

Darsow was particularly bad for the Demo's.

Demolition played their role fine, but it was the Rockers that totally make the match. I'm not as down on Darsow here. I've seen a lot worse Darsow work. The quick tag arm work from the Rockers was awesome. Just a good solid tag.

Who doesn't have great punches is Darsow. His offense sucked in this match which Phil agreed with.

[Victator]

Demolition played their role fine, but it was the Rockers that totally make the match.

That match was all Demolition. If it were left up to the Rockers, most of the match would of been bumping and stooging.

[cm funk]

Demolition was different in a lot of substantial ways, and they actually weren't a McMahon creation but a gimmick that Eadie came up with if you believe him (and he did win that court case, so somebody did), but they definitely became Vince's answer to the popularity of the Road Warriors once he started pushing them, I don't think that's arguable.

 

If Vince had wanted an out and out copy of the Warriors he would have taken a couple of huge stiff working roid freaks and threw paint on them. Powers of Pain were the blueprint copy of the Road Warriors, and they were created by JCP to feud with the Roadies!

[Johnny Sorrow]

I'm only talking about the gimmick. There were lots of Road Warrior inspired dudes back then. Demolition was definitely one of them, (and the most successful one at that). Admitting that doesn't suddenly make them irrelevant, and hey, they got over. Good for them. And if you're a huge fan of them then fine. Admitting that they were Vince's Warriors shouldn't affect any fond memories you have of them.

 

What's next? The Midnight Rockers weren't Rock N' Roll Express rip-offs with a name taken from both the R n' R and The Midnight Express?

[cm funk]

Yeah, I think even Eadie gives credit to the Road Warriors for being an inspiration for the gimmick, that and the Judas Priest/Twisted Sister style of metal that was huge in the mid 80's. They became Vince's answer to the Road Warriors for sure, I just don't think they were a copycat gimmick per se.

 

Blade Runners in CWA/UWF were a total Road Warriors copy, Powers of Pain as noted, and I'm sure other territories had their own low rent versions as well

 

That's kind of an interesting topic of discussion actually, who are some of the more notable forgotten and failed copycat gimmicks in 80's territories?

[Matt D]

I think Demolition was absolutely driving and controlling the Rockers match. They kept things under control so that everything had more meaning. The Rockers did the flashy stuff (though Demolition turning up the pace for them to make the armwork WORK is impressive and shouldn't be underlooked. If they couldn't eat that super fast offense, it wouldn't have worked after all), but flashy offense doesn't make a match. We know that. Demolition weren't the props in that match to be worked around, the Rockers were, if either team was. They were just super flashy props.

 

As for Smash, I'm way more concerned that he's controlling the ring space, selling well, interacting with the crowd and not losing the structure of the match. This is 80s WWF. I don't necessarily want snug stuff, which isn't to say that at least a good portion of his stuff doesn't look good. It's just that I find wrestling symbolic and there are 30 things I care more about than moves even connected. If the fans buy it and it makes sense, that's generally good enough for me. IF it looks good, even better, but I care about it making sense and working in the context of the match way more.

 

That's just my personal preference though. If I want meaningless stiffness, I'll watch the Road Warriors. If I want good, smart wrestling I'll watch Demolition. I can understand how people would feel otherwise, but I am arguing on a very specific matrix, and it's qualities that are important to me. John Cena's offense looks like shit and we all argue he's a great wrestler. Why, because it works. The fans buy it. Wrestling is symbolic. I don't necessarily say that Demolition is unconditionally great. I argue some very specific points of some very specific qualities that I found in their matches that I was very impressed by and that I had never seen discussed before. These are areas I find really impressive especially in the environment that they had to work in. I try to engage on those points, and often find a hard time finding people that will engage me on these points, whether it's due to the fact we're in a "GREAT MATCH" culture, and a lot of what they did impressive and what stands out is seen over time in relatively short WWF matches or because people won't look past the FAKE ROAD WARRIORS talking point or the mythos talking point, neither of which I care about in the least. I believe that if you're watching EVERY show, you'll notice what they do, and it'll stand out because it did for me when I wasn't expecting it to, but that it also may not lead to picking a lot of matches on the set.

 

And seriously, full god damn marks to rzombie, because he seems to get it in a way I've obviously failed to help others with. Thank you.

 

My arguments are pretty damn specific, but they are of things I find wildly impressive that I never expected to see in these guys and that I've not seen almost at all in other 80s WWF work and rarely in a team that's not of the caliber of Arn/Tully. I think I've made them very clear by reviewing over 30 matches and summing things up repeatedly. I'm not sure what else I can do.

 

That said, a lot of what Smash does is pretty good. He has more lapses than Eadie, but not as many as you'd think. He also has a few more big moves and a bit more athleticism.

[Franchise]

Demolition has always & will always be my favorite tag team & they are @ times my favorite thing about Wrestling. Growing up I was always a Demo fan & as I got older & watched my tapes more & more I grew to like them even more but for different reasons.

 

As a child I liked them because they kicked butt & had awesome theme music. I really dug how they would take anyone on & win, lose or draw they never acted weak.

 

As I grew older I learned to appreciate the simple things they did so well. They always did a good job of playing to there own strengths & they never got tied up trying to impress the crowd or got fooled into playing the other teams game. They also always did a good job of only doing things that made sense. They never got caught trying to do a high flying move or did some stupid spinning move. They just kept moving forward @ there pace & played the game the way that best suited them. I don’t mean this from a “smart point of view” I am speaking from a regular pro wrestling fan point of view. I felt this way long b4 I knew about move sets or work rate etc.

 

As far as the whole Roadies v Demo situation I never really cared for the Roadies after the 4th or 5th time I saw them. Maybe it was because I only saw them squash teams on NWA TV but they seemed to unbeatable to be interesting to me. It was like the Ultimate Warrior, you just new he was never going to lose. If it is to predictable it becomes boring, I liked that Demo could lose & still come across as tough dudes. I don’t have the dirt sheets from back then so I have no idea what the smart opinion was but copy or not I prefer Demo.

 

The only thing I really hated about Demo was how they went out. @ the time I was just pissed but looking back I wish they would have repackaged them as a updated Demo w/ a new look. I think if they would have taken them off the screen after the WM loss & brought them back in better shape w/ shaved heads & w/ Ax as the manager I think they could have gotten another few years out of them. I am not going to deny that by 91 Smash was looking out of shape & Crush looked goofy. Ax & Smash had growing bald spots all of these things could have been fixed but for some reason they weren’t. I don’t like them any less because of it but I think the WWF wasted them a little by not correcting it & giving them another shot. The tag division was pretty lame @ that point & a real challenger for the Roadies would have added some interest.

[Grimmas]

One thing I really love about Demolition is that they were one of the best teams at using actually teamwork. I don't mean double team moves, but tag team psychology. They cut off the ring, made quick tags, etc...

[shoe]

I'm on the fence on Demolition. I don't think they are great, but can be a serviceable tag team. I thought Bill Eadie had a solid psychology. I do like the Rockers MSG match with the Demos. I do think the Rockers make the match. By making the match I mean making it entertaining, The Rockers offense was so much more entertaining. They were much better at selling in the bout. Sure Demolition was driving the car in the sense that they weren't going to do anything they didn't want to do. Just cause Demolition thought they couldn't bump for a Rockers drop kick. It would take 2 or 3 for them to take the bump doesn't mean they made the match. Sure they made the Rockers work and the psychology played into the big team vs little team motif overall. To me though it was all the stuff that the Rockers brought to the table that made the match good.

[Victator]

If Demolition was controlling the match, they are the ones who made it. If the Rockers had control, Demolition would of been bumping and stooging the entire match.

[Matt D]

And it's possible shoe might have liked that match even more. That argument seems like a taste thing to me. if the guy likes flashy, entertaining offense over storytelling, then that's fine.

[Victator]

With Demolition doing more of the bumping, which he said the Rockers did better? Demolition knew how to structure a Rockers match better than the Rockers did.

[Matt D]

I think trick here would be to look at other Rockers' matches from this point in 88.

[Victator]

A good comparison would be the Brainbusters matches. Which are good, but have way too much stooging and bumping from Tully and Arn. Who make it look good, but the Rockers lacked the offense to make it compelling for too long. By the time The Busters gain control, the match is over.

[Dylan Waco]

With Demolition doing more of the bumping, which he said the Rockers did better? Demolition knew how to structure a Rockers match better than the Rockers did.

That's odd since the Rockers v. Buddy/Doug happened a couple years before and those matches were awfully good and far better than the match in question.

 

In fact I'm not sure the best Demo's match I've seen would crack a top five Rockers v. Buddy/Doug match.

 

And I actually like the Demo's

[KB8]

Feels like there's a cooky 'team driving the car/team playing the music in the car and doing shit to make the journey fly by' analogy right there to be made re: the Demolition/Rockers match. Although I'm not creative enough to come up with anything that'd do it justice (if it even makes a lick of sense in the first place).

 

FWIW I love that match to death. I actually last watched it about a year ago, which, funnily enough, was around the time of the 2011 version of the Demolition debate.

[Victator]

With Demolition doing more of the bumping, which he said the Rockers did better? Demolition knew how to structure a Rockers match better than the Rockers did.

That's odd since the Rockers v. Buddy/Doug happened a couple years before and those matches were awfully good and far better than the match in question.

 

In fact I'm not sure the best Demo's match I've seen would crack a top five Rockers v. Buddy/Doug match.

 

And I actually like the Demo's

 

1. I'll take that bet.

 

2. The Rockers were not calling those matches now were they?

 

 

Also you guys prefer stooging and bumping to sound tag work. Which there nothing wrong with that. But that is what comes down to with some of these teams. I have not seen the Somers/Rose match in two years. That was the one on the big Shawn DVD set. I was not overly impressed by the work in it. It just felt like Somers and Rose working schtick to kill time. But as teams working stooging and schtick I like Adonis and Murdoch better.*

 

 

*Which is based on what little of Rose and Somers I have seen. Which is admittedly not much. I still need to see the bloodbath match with the Rockers.

[Dylan Waco]

I prefer stooging and bumping to sound tag work? That's news to me. I'd be interested to know how stooging and bumping is mutually exclusive from sound tag work as well. From where I stand the best of the Rockers v. Doug/Buddy matches featured some great stooging and bumping and some great cutting off the ring, working cuts, milking heat, et. Far better than I've ever seen in any Demo's match (though to be fair I have only watched a handful of the Demo's stuff you and Matt have).

 

As far as calling matches, I don't think anyone would say that the Rockers called those matches. I also don't think anyone would say they were Doug/Buddy carry jobs, but then people are trying to say the Demo's carried the Rockers in this thread, and while I'm more than willing to give the Demo's credit for their end of the match, I don't remember thinking it was something that even bordered on being a Demo's carry job.

 

I think Adonis/Murdoch is probably the worst team of all time involving obviously great wrestlers.

[Victator]

I don't believe in carry jobs. So I don't think Demolition carried them, but I do think they were directing the action.

 

Bumping and stooging are not mutually exclusive from sound tag work. No more than big moves are mutually exclusive. But I do think some teams use it in place of putting together a well thought out match. Which I think Adonis and Murdoch did most of the time. They were just great at it.

[shoe]

And it's possible shoe might have liked that match even more. That argument seems like a taste thing to me. if the guy likes flashy, entertaining offense over storytelling, then that's fine.

 

Actually for me the things that I like are good work, work that makes sense, I enjoy matches where we see good work on body parts. I will admit flashy offense was important to me in like 96 or 97.

 

Now with Demolition I thought they played their roles well, and had a sound psychology. Still to me they needed really good workers to have good matches. To me their best matches were against the likes of the Rockers, Tully and Arn, Hart Foundation, and Bulldogs. I bet these guys best matches wouldn't have Demolition in their top 5. Maybe the Hart Foundation.

[Victator]

You would be wrong on that. Especially if you restrict it only to their WWF runs.