shoe Posted January 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 So all this talk of great NJ booking and how they set up the story beautifully for Okada to win. What happened? Maybe they knew they were going to have a lot of new eye balls on the product and wanted to stay with a safe hand. Still coming out of the show I want to follow Okada's journey. His reaction after the match was tremendous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Wiz Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 So all this talk of great NJ booking and how they set up the story beautifully for Okada to win. What happened? Sometimes great booking is doing the obvious. Sometimes it's doing the opposite. At the start of the next chapter is usually the worst time to judge, particularly in a promotion that makes an effort to grow things organically for the most part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Schneider Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I have a Nakamura v. Ibushi review coming up on Segunda Caida whenever Eric adds to it, but I also watched Okada v. Tanahashi and I still don't get it. They do a nice job of building drama I suppose, but I have a hard time getting into matches with such mediocre execution, both guys threw some of the worst bodyslams I have ever seen, and their elbow exchanges looked dainty, this is Shinya Hashimoto and Yoshiaki Fujiwara's company, lay it in a bit. Then to have the whole match finish be built around such bad looking frog splashes, I guess it isn't for me. This reminded me a lot of a Cena v. Orton match actually, nicely layed out and all, but nothing about it popped Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Schneider Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Who'd've thought Ibushi/Nakamura would've been loaded with Ishikawa/Ikeda-esque potato shots? The brutality in that match was such a refreshing change from the usual forearm exchange stuff. I thought Ibushi showed a hundred times more charisma there than he ever has as a junior - the way he condescendingly laid into Nakamura was fantastic. I'm really excited to see him work as a heavyweight now. Â Â Let's not go crazy here, they had some nasty stuff, but go rewatch Ikeda v. Ishikawa, this wasn't that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 So, that Kenny Omega, he really is an atrocious pro wrestler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pol Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015  Who'd've thought Ibushi/Nakamura would've been loaded with Ishikawa/Ikeda-esque potato shots? The brutality in that match was such a refreshing change from the usual forearm exchange stuff. I thought Ibushi showed a hundred times more charisma there than he ever has as a junior - the way he condescendingly laid into Nakamura was fantastic. I'm really excited to see him work as a heavyweight now.   Let's not go crazy here, they had some nasty stuff, but go rewatch Ikeda v. Ishikawa, this wasn't that.   Hyperbole  And I pretty much agree with you about Tanahashi/Okada, despite liking it much more than you did. I actually thought to myself a little after watching "that was like the best possible Orton/Cena match". Tanahashi is a very "macro" guy; all about the structure and drama and average to weak at the moment-to-moment execution. If you need the latter in your wrestling it makes sense that you won't get much out of his matches unless he's in there with a micro-wrestling specialist like Suzuki or a killer who will bring the violence like Shibata. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantastic Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 It's becoming cliche, but really this holds true: "WWE, that is how you do Wrestlemania". Â As for star ratings, I reckon: Â ** for the Rumble ***3/4 for the Junior Tag Team match ***1/4 for Bullet Club vs Tencozy and Honma ***1/2 for NOAH vs Suzukigun **** for Suzuki vs Sakuraba ****1/2 for Ishii vs Makabe ****1/4 for Omega vs Taguchi **** for Anderson/Gallows vs Shibata/Goto ****1/2 for Styles vs Naito ***** for Nakamura vs Ibushi ****3/4 for Okada vs Tanahashi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I.....don't get how anyone could rate those matches that highly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Wiz Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 If I put stars on matches, my list would look much different. Â You must feel that was the best show ever, no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pol Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I don't sweat people's contextless star ratings too much. There's a ton of variation in what those mean to people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soup23 Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 So all this talk of great NJ booking and how they set up the story beautifully for Okada to win. What happened? Â Kind of interested in this too. Before King of Pro Wrestling, all the talk was how everything was setting up for Okada vs. Styles, then boom Tana wins and everyone talks about how that of course was the logical booking for Okada to get his big win over the ace of the promotion. That didn't happen here. I am intrigued where stuff goes but am starting to get a little weary and think talking about how brilliant the booking is setting up one thing to happen and then that not happening seems dubious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantastic Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 If I put stars on matches, my list would look much different. Â You must feel that was the best show ever, no? Â Just going with the idea that Dave has 7 ****+ rated matches. Â For me, the only ***** match on the card for sure was Nakamura/Ibushi. Okada/Tanahashi was about ****1/4 at best personally, it wasn't my favorite of their encounters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soup23 Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I think Dave will rank the junior tag opener at **** and not the Omega match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parties Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 As goofy as Striker can be, he had self-policing moments where he knew to shut up, and there were several others where he covered for Ross getting things wrong, rambling, or sticking too close to his rote phrases.The version I watched unfortunately is missing the battle royal. Â Junior 4-way: Thought with ReDragon in, you'd see attempts at shoot style mimicry from Romero and Time Splitters, but this was the same match they've worked a hundred times. Not sure what the function of this division is anymore: redundancy interchangeable with what they did on the last few Dome shows. Highlights were Kushida hulking up and Fish's top rope Michinoku Driver. Lowlight was Nick Jackson's terrible pug face sucking wind the whole match. Â Tenzan/Kojima/Honma vs. Jarrett/Fale/Yujiro: The intros were tremendous, and this was better than it needed to be. Lots of sports entertainment, but they all sold for each other and played to the crowd. Fun finish to a short trifle that wouldn't have been out of place on an Attitude era PPV. Â Yano/Marufuji/Nicholls/Haste vs. Iizuka/Smith/Archer/Benjamin: At least they put most of the worst workers in one match. Iizuka-as-Killer Khan is fun. Archer has become a perfectly solid Acolytes-era Bradshaw: I await his run as a hedge funded world champion in 2021. Finish sucked and Marufuji is worse than ever. Â Sakuraba vs. Suzuki: Odd structure: Suzuki as the resilient face in white fighting through injury, with Saku as the ruthless one. Also not really sure how that was supposed to be under UWFi rules, as they didn't have time to utilize the rounds, points, and rope breaks. When they were competitive on the mat, this was cool. Way too short and I thought the finish lacked heat as no one bought it as the end, but good while it lasted. Â Ishii vs. Makabe: Best Makabe match I've seen. Brutal suplexes and head drops throughout, including a truly sick looking fireman's carry slam off the top from Makabe. This wasn't just an Ishii carry-job: both guys worked hard, especially given how injured Ishii is. Â Taguchi vs. Omega: Omega is such a nerd. So many other young guys they could have in this role. I liked Taguchi's butt attacks and other unorthodox stuff throughout. Two guys cosplaying Savage-Steamboat. Good that Taguchi kept trying to reel Omega in, but he couldn't halt all that goofy overacting. Admirably violent finish: they went out on the high note. Â Anderson/Gallows vs. Shibata/Goto: Anderson's improved greatly in the last year. Particularly liked the sequences of Shibata as unstoppable force and Gallows as brick wall. Didn't love this as much as some and it felt a bit short, but two badass teams throwing bombs works for me. Â Naito vs. Styles: Match of the night thus far. Naito's never looked more crisp in motion But Styles was the story here: great offense, like that inverted neckbreaker and his signature headdrop spots. Great submission in the Calf Splitter. Great bumps including some crazy stuff to the floor. I do question Naito's role here. He's a guy who looks like Richard Simmons on paper but has evolved into one of their best workers. Â Nakamura vs. Ibushi: Scratch that: this was the best of the night. What an entrance from Nakamura. The finish was perfect: just when you thought they were risking overkill, a definitive beatdown is laid out. But from start to finish the offense was really on-point and the contrast in styles worked. Â Tanahashi vs. Okada: These two aren't on the level of Nakamura/Shibata/Ishii. Okada as an elite worker never made sense to me. His closest American comparison would be the Rock: big star, not a great wrestler. This feud is what Rock vs. Michaels would have been if main eventing in '99-2001: some fun stuff and a main event spectacle that pops crowds, but none of the execution is great. I did like the backdrop on the ramp. Bad matwork thrown in just to have an "epic". I don't mean to totally bury this: they worked hard. Okada's flat back bump over the guardrail was the Terry Funk tribute the show needed. But Tanahashi taking breaks throughout what's supposed to be the natch of the year to do his poses and meander around the ring seemed odd, and the big counters at the end were telegraphed (forgivable when playing to a Dome crowd). Watching this: do you find Okada to be a killer who can beat you with raw power or a knockout strike? A great technician? A speed demon who wins on pace? I don't understand what I'm supposed to think makes this guy elite. Good dropkick though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoe Posted January 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I think Dave will rank the junior tag opener at **** and not the Omega match. I'd bet the farm he went 4 on Omega. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I didn't get to see Sakuraba-Suzuki and I skipped the main event, because I had no desire to watch a really long Okada-Tanahashi match ever let alone that late. Â However, I did have one match over 4 stars and that was Nakamura-Ibushi at 4 3/4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Last NJ shows I have watched were a bunch of G1 stuff from a few years ago, when Naito was still tagging with Yugiro. So yeah. Out of the loop.  And now I remember why I loved puroresu so much. Excellent show, with nothing bad except the Kenny Omega match (damn, that guy is putrid, the most atrocious facials and maneurisms this side of Edge and Randy Orton). The multi man tags after the opener were fine for what they were, although Jarrett busting out a guitar… I mean, really ?  Cool opener, in terms of spot wrestling, it was kinda terrific. The shoot-style match, well, fun in a goofy way, and I enjoyed hearing the old UWF theme in 2015, but nothing special. The tag team titles match was decent for the most part and build into quite the good stuff at the end. Ishii vs Makabe developped into quite the excellent match, really cool stiffest in the tradition of Hash and Tenryu. Naito vs Styles was good, with a very good ending stretch, but I'm not sold at all on Styles as this great worker. Some of his stuff still looks too overthought to me, and it felt a little bit disjointed at times. But yeah, good stuff nonetheless. Nakamura vs Ibushi. Ok, WTF happened to Nakamura ? When did he developped this character ? Anyway, great match, as simple as that. Tanahashi vs Okada. I'm not sure about great, but pretty close nonetheless, and it didn't feel too long to me. Tanahashi is such the Man it's not even funny. I can see why he connects with the japanese crowds so well.  As goofy as Striker can be, he had self-policing moments where he knew to shut up, and there were several moments where he covered for Ross getting things wrong, rambling, or sticking too close his rote phrases.  Agreed. And Ross was good at reining in Striker too when necessary (I enjoyed the whole "I don't know what swerve means, I've never been swerved." bit)  I should follow NJ again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbo Slice Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I thought the show was fine, but there wasn't anything completely blow away outside of the Ibushi/Nak match, which felt like the only truly special Dome-level match on the show. Takahashi and Okada seemed content to throw out their greatest hits in a lot of ways, and while I enjoyed the tag title match and Naito/Styles, there wasn't much on this show that made me feel like it was this godsend product at all. There's definitely a high ceiling to NJPW right now, but I don't think it's leaps and bounds ahead of everyone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fando Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Nakamura / Ibushi were the shit, most heated in-ring exhanges I've seen in the last year.This note about the entrance is cool, too: http://tapla.tumblr.com/post/107131246555/the-concept-of-shinsuke-nakamuras-entrance-atSounded like a long night for Ross, but him and Striker did okay having to explain and sell the show with making exciting calls for the most part. One "car crash" line too many, maybe and the "Wrestle Kingdom moment" Striker tried to get over was lame but Ross's final swipe at Vince about never being ashamed of being a pro wrestling fan was perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Enthusiast Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I thought the show was fine, as well. Nothing completely blow-away to me, and some real letdowns with the Omega match and Makabe/Ishii. Maybe I was just in a pissy mood after watching the UFC show before it this morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Another thing on "great" NJ booking. During the G1 I argued that it was insane that Honma did not get a win. A lot of people argued it was stupid to do it then and to save it for something bigger. Was a throwaway six man on the undercard of the Dome really a bigger deal than the G1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoe Posted January 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Another thing on "great" NJ booking. During the G1 I argued that it was insane that Honma did not get a win. A lot of people argued it was stupid to do it then and to save it for something bigger. Was a throwaway six man on the undercard of the Dome really a bigger deal than the G1? I felt it was wasted because it was rushed . So it loses its impact. Plus it was kind of portrayed as Tenzan and Kojima gave it too him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tim Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Given the 36k number, is there anything NJPW can really do to get the kind of attendance numbers people were projecting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmare007 Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Don't know about "great" booking, I think for the most part Gedo has done a good job in the last 5 years or so but he's done some weird ass booking in their Dome shows for a while now. Â I thought the show was better than I expected. I normally feel very underwhelmed with Dome shows and this one delivered a ton of good matches (and a great one in Nakamura/Ibushi) without having to sit through 4-5 hours of wrestling. Â The hyperbole it's whatever to me at this point, people love them some New Japan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 NJPW booking has been comically overrated for some time now. Don't get me wrong. They are a company on the rise in many ways, you can't say they have done a poor job at all. But they do not have real depth at the top of the card and that is the fault of the booking. That said they also have a promotional model that makes it far easier to get by with three guys clearly a peg above everyone else. If they had seven or eight hours of weekly television to fill no way in hell they could get away with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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