Loss Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Was wrestling always this bad and I'm just now noticing? Both shows were pretty wretched tonight. I should save that TNA show anytime I'm nostalgic for WCW. If WCW was still around, that's what it would look like now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artDDP Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 TNA hopes to capture casual fans with a show that would only make sense to the most die-hard Internet-savvy fans? Isn't their entire fan base Internet fans who already knew all the big surprises were coming a day ago thanks to Twitter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditch Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I stopped watching WWE in 2003 because middling skits and short matches aren't what interest me. Thankfully there's endless reams of old-school and puro. I tuned in tonight to see what they had to offer, but gave up after a couple embarassing segments on Impact and an embarassingly DULL Raw. The Hogan debut segment was especially putrid. I seriously don't know how people can watch these shows live every week. It was one thing when WWE had better talent, and you'd get a Rock promo and a short-but-sweet Eddie match to go with the hit-or-miss segments. But now... eh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohtani's jacket Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I only read the transcript of the Bret angle over at DVDVR, but I don't see how he can say "the WWE Universe" so many times without wondering what the fuck has happened in 12 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I didn't watch TNA because I figured it would be bad (and from the reports, I was right), but I didn't see anything wrong with Raw (Hornswoggle/DX stuff aside). Seemed like standard fare to me though the Bret segments was better than most of the guest host crap they've been putting on. Now I'm not making an apology for Raw, because it's what it is, but what were you guys expecting? An epic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditch Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 There was a fair amount of hype for Raw. The Bret segments were dry as toast. I guess that's because they're going to stretch things out, but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cox Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I liked the Bret segments with Shawn and Vince, and the DX tag match with Show and Jericho was good, and Kofi/Orton was decent. The rest of the show was kind of boring, and as much as I liked the Bret/Vince stuff, it still felt a little anti-climatic, although I guess they were limited in what they could do with Bret. Impact, however, was actively horrible. That cage match was the shits. Why did they pick poor Homicide to be the guy to go through the hole? Jeff Hardy debuting should be good for them, but they'll probably make him just another guy within 6 months. Angle/Styles was horrible, I didn't realize how much I don't like Angle until tonight. He just doesn't know how to build drama in what he does, all he can do is exchange moves, but he can't tell a storyline with moves and doesn't know how to do the little things to build drama in a match, like make a nearfall look important. Of course, none of that should be a surprise to anybody here. Hebner is also an amazingly shitty ref after all of these years too. I like Styles, but not against Angle. The nWo vs. Jarrett/Foley is going to be terrible. I mean, Waltman and Hall were shitty enough that WWE fired them both eight years ago, and never once tried to bring them back. Nash has been gone about seven years himself. Meanwhile, nobody gives a shit about Jarrett as a face, and TNA has pretty much used up Foley after a year where he's turned like five times, so nobody gives a shit about him either. Can't wait until they add Russo as the third member of their team! The Dudleys vs. the Nasty Boys, that's going to get fans flocking to TNA! The only thing about TNA I liked was Pope D'Angelo Dinero, TNA has something in that guy. WWE made a huge mistake wasting him and firing him, he's really talented. He's also probably a week or two away from being just another guy. They already tried damn hard by inserting Orlando Jordan into that interview for some reason, I guess because they're both black? Poor Nigel, he's going to be the fourth member of British Invasion before too long, doing 10 minute Explosion tags with the Young Bucks. Why did TNA even advertise Abyss/Rhino or Beer Money/British Invasion if they weren't going to deliver either match? P.S. Abyss is fucking terrible. Overall, I'm kind of glad I watched TNA, because I won't feel tempted to watch it again anytime soon. Raw might have been boring, but TNA was flat out awful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditch Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 No you see Styles vs Angle was a ****1/2 MOTYC and you review it by writing stuff like ANGLE SLAM! 2.999999! ANKLE LOCK, NO, COUNTERED TO THE STYLES CLASH, 2.999999999999999!!!! 450 MISSES! ANGLE SLAM! 2.9999999999999999999999999999! Etc. But the sad thing is that Meltzer will probably call it a ****1/2 MOTYC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I just can't believe the guys over at Wrestling Classics messageboard actively liked Impact. It just sounded so terrible. I was seriously considering catching the replay on Thursday earlier on, but then the show happened. Now? I doubt I even watch it on Thursday or at any point in the future. I was going to give Hogan a shot with TNA, but that shit just sounded so atrocious. But hey, they gave away Angle/Styles on free tv which is always good for an IWC creamjob. I'd take the "boring" Raw over that any day. Hell I'm pretty sure Orton/Kofi was the actually better match with the story they told, and they weren't given 20 minutes for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditch Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 The Hogan segment was so bad it might be worth going out of your way for, if that makes sense. I literally can't believe anyone would like it. It's over the heads of non-smarks, it's pushing people smarks tend not to like, the execution is bad, and all of that in the biggest segment for TNA in years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1004Holds Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I actually liked Impact. It was pretty exciting and seeing guys like Styles and Pope do their thing was pretty fun. I don't really think too much about psychology and all that stuff when I'm watching; I just kind of switch it off until I get online. Raw was better than the past two weeks but I think that was only due to Bret Hart. His return disappointed me because I felt he groveled too much (not sure how else to put it). Seeing the guy who used to slap Vince around and routinely dominate HBK suddenly hugging and shit was a real turn off. It was as if all his arrogance and anger that made the Hitman memorable to me disappeared. I know he's been through a lot, but it was eerie. I'm just sad that Jericho won't be on Raw; I can't stand this version of DX. It's like the worst parts of the first two versions combined with kid-pleasing crap. I don't know how any kid could stand it because I know I would have hated it if I were 10 again. Hearing HHH didn't help matters. I don't understand why Orton would be afraid of his lackeys who kept getting beatup half the time. Sheamus does nothing for me as champ and why they have their champion fighting Evan Bourne (nothing against him; I like the guy in fact) is beyond me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cox Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 It's like both WWE and TNA wanted to relive 1997 tonight for some reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1004Holds Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 It's like both WWE and TNA wanted to relive 1997 tonight for some reason. Can you blame them? I didn't get that vibe from TNA though despite the appearances of Hall, X-Pac, Ric Flair. Hogan (marked out for the nWo theme but I like Hendrix), and I'm sure I've missed a few people. Raw felt the same as always though I changed the channel when the Screwjob footage came up yet again. I was like "ALRIGHT ALREADY!" I hope ROH can find a better network and NWA can appear on more stations because more wrestling on my TV is good with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I know what you mean by that, but I'm not really a fan of the whole trainwreck concept. I mean Raw didn't exactly win me over with their show tonight, even though I appreciated the Bret/HBK opening and the ending was a fine way to continue whatever angle they're pushing towards Mania. But it was not the total circle jerk that Impact seemed to be. It seemed like Hogan was trying too hard to put over the idea that this would be different this time, yet it all came across as the same. I just wonder if people looked at the Angle/Styles match (which I haven't seen, but judging by the PBP commentary) and declared the whole show a success by default. If that is the case, it only makes me dislike Angle more. I couldn't believe that he was getting a lot of talk as Wrestler of Decade in a lot of places, and it's the same guy berating Eddie Guerrero for selling too much. Just ugh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Death From Above Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Honeslty I tried skimming over that 37 page monster thread that tonight spawned on DVDVR, and the only thing that stuck in my mind was the mention that TNA has a PPV in 2 weeks with no announced card whatsoever, and only one more week of TV to build. It's the death throes of WCW brought back to life. Which is hilarious for about 25 seconds but isn't really encouraging. And really the fact that it's now 2010 and we have Bret Hart/Michaels/Vince on one show and nWo Reuinion/Nasty Boys/Mick Foley is old on the other, it's just fucking amazing. It's like watching wrestling cannibalize itself until it dies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I agree that both shows were not good but someone summed it up nicely over at DVDVR... it was nice to switch channels between two wrestling shows for the first time in a long time. I am working on the Death of WCW comp right now and if I thought Dixie Carter would watch it, I would send it to her. Seriously, NWO 2010 is not new, not fresh, not different. It is just so disappointing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerpride Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I thought the Bret stuff was really cool, and I'm interested to see where they go with Bret v. Vince after tonight. I give them credit for not paying everything off in one night, and the HBK stuff was sweet in a way. TNA was just a trainwreck. They debuted Jeff Hardy, the hottest thing in wrestling a few months ago, in the opening segment. If anything, I think all the debuts took away from each other, I think they would've been better off spreading it out over a few weeks. Where do you go from here now that you have two hours to cram it all in? And the ending with Foley confronting Bischoff, only to be attacked by the nWo as Hogan looks on? Really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Whoever mentioned the old guys being showcased, don't forget they are also pushing HBK/Taker for Mania, which is something you could see often in 1997... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Sorrow Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Whoever mentioned the old guys being showcased, don't forget they are also pushing HBK/Taker for Mania, which is something you could see often in 1997...Since HBK/ Taker at last year's Mania was awesome...I'm willing to give a rematch another chance. And Hart wasn't "groveling", he was doing a "Hey, I'm willing to let bygones be bygones" deal and then Vince had to be a douchebag. And he will pay for his douchebaggery with a beating! From what I saw of Impact, it stunk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1004Holds Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Whoever mentioned the old guys being showcased, don't forget they are also pushing HBK/Taker for Mania, which is something you could see often in 1997...Since HBK/ Taker at last year's Mania was awesome...I'm willing to give a rematch another chance. And Hart wasn't "groveling", he was doing a "Hey, I'm willing to let bygones be bygones" deal and then Vince had to be a douchebag. And he will pay for his douchebaggery with a beating! From what I saw of Impact, it stunk. I would rather see Taker vs. Cena. The sequel generally isn't as good as the original. I wish that Vince would pay, but giving Raw's records with follow-ups over the years I think when it happens it will probably be dissapointing and I don't think I could sit through stuff like the Divas and DX long enough to get to that point. Glad to see MVP finally get used properly again though instead of being wasted doing lame rap songs and skits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondocks Kernoodle Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 TNA signed Jeff Hardy, the 2nd most popular wrestler in the country, and featured him in a two-minute midcard angle while the main angle of the show featured Scott Hall and X-Pac. This company is hopeless. Also, having Tenay enthusiastically announce the Spike was going to let them stay with the title match until there was a winner and then immediately cutting to commercial was the most WCW-ish moment in wrestling since, well, WCW. Funny note: I had closed captioning on and when Flair first appeared it referred to him as "'Nature Boy' Riki Choshu." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest John O'Neill Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I enjoyed Bret's segment with Shawn. To me any feud between them would feel similar to when Matt Hardy and Edge were feuding. When Hardy and Edge were feuding at first I thought they hated each other in real life, but as you saw them cooperate in segments together etc you realised there wasn't much to get excited about. It wasn't a feud I was captured by despite them delivering some good matches. Best just to see Bret and Shawn move on I think... Their segment was interesting though in that it felt a little awkward. Is it just me or was that a really emotion-less hug? Funny I read this on JR's blog not long after: "The dialog between HBK and the Hitman sounded so natural that I thought I was eavesdropping on two old rivals' conversation. They were simply being themselves." I had no beefs with the Vince segment either. Good to see Bret back really! Really I feel as satisfied as Michael Schumacher winning a race after seeing Bret. It's good to see him back. The segments didn't bug me etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted January 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 The frustrating thing about the Bret angle is that Shawn got to say Bret was in the wrong and that he disrespected the business, but it happened 12 years ago. Bret got to make no points in return about Shawn. You could say the same about Bret and Vince. Vince refuses to come out when Bret asks him to, only doing it on his own terms. Bret still thinks Vince's apology is sincere, and the kick in the gut catches him off guard. He just looked really dumb. The TNA show was just so, so, so terrible. Hall and Nash look ridiculously old -- they look older than Hogan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovert Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I liked the Bret segments with Shawn and Vince, and the DX tag match with Show and Jericho was good, and Kofi/Orton was decent. The rest of the show was kind of boring, and as much as I liked the Bret/Vince stuff, it still felt a little anti-climatic, although I guess they were limited in what they could do with Bret. Agreed but little could live up to the history in fairness. The first segment of IMPACT was the dirt worst first first impression wise with the fans, I want chairshots, clusterfuck cage match ending in a DQ to the sound of bullshiy chants. The most depressing thing about last night and in mainstream Wrestling in general is the lack of new and innovative ideas, even in just the delivery of those ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditch Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Funny note: I had closed captioning on and when Flair first appeared it referred to him as "'Nature Boy' Riki Choshu."I'd give anything to know how that happened, that's way too intentional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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