Ricky Jackson

I think the Spoiler/Jardine was Super Destroyer in Carolinas (also AWA).

There seems to be a fair amount of 70s Stampede kicking around, or at least the late-70s/ early-DK and Bret era. I'm no expert, but there also seems to be plenty late-70s Georgia TBS stuff, and some Crockett, Florida, and Memphis, among others. Isn't there also a fair amount of AWA from the 70s around? Or is most of this territory footage hidden away in a vault in Stamford? Anyway, I think a decent set could be made of (at least) 75-79 wrestling and it would not have to be overwhelmingly WWWF/Japan. Unfortunately, most of the big house show matches from the main territories were never filmed, so it would be mostly TV angles and matches.

I'm not sure it was the hottest period ever, as I've read that the 70-73 period was maybe the hottest as far as having the most territiories doing record business at the same time is concerned. Also, many once thriving territories like LA, San Fran, Detroit, Vancouver, St. Louis, Amarillo, and Montreal either declined greatly or outright died during the 77-84 period. That being said, it was still a pretty hot era, and in the last few years I've really come to see the 77-84 period (I would even say 75-85) as perhaps the most exciting and diverse period ever. WWF, Crockett, Georgia, Stampede, World Class, Memphis, Toronto, Portland, AWA, Mid South, Florida, etc. all went through super hot periods with tons of memorable characters, matches, and angles during the time, of which I've barely scratched the surface when it comes to watching certain territories. And this is not even factoring in Japan, England and other countries. Just a really fun time, and sometimes I wish I had been old enough to have been a fan then (born in 77, but not a fan until 86).

I was thinking the same thing as Jerry. I think there is no doubt Buddy being a jobber/joke in many fans eyes during his last national run will likely effect some voters opinions. I think Buddy getting in will depend heavily on how many voters are open to seriously evaluating his career through watching the available footage of Buddy's best matches/angles/promos. Also, Dave's excellent bio on him from a few years back made him look like a million bucks and really made a great case for him being a HOF guy, which should improve his chances somewhat for those voters who have read it. I know reading it opened my eyes big time to Buddy and led me to seek out his career highlights. Personally, I'd love to see Buddy get in, but reversing years of negative or underwhelming opinions on a wrestler can be a massive hurdle to overcome. I think Patera and Blackwell, as well as others I've mentioned like Rich and Slaughter (other than his contoversial run in 90/91, he was not big time player after 85 or so), all fall into this area to varrying degrees.

The supposed main event of Lockdown 2012 does not sound very appealing on paper.

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss....

Just a random late-night observation, but it almost seems like there is some sort of HOF bias against a lot of wrestlers who did well in the 1977-1984 period, but whose careers dropped off after that point, like Rose, Blackwell, and Patera. You could also add Mr.Wrestling II, Tommy Rich, Sgt. Slaughter, and maybe JYD to that group. Of course, I'm sure there are plenty of exceptions.

This is seriously what they are charging for a mask? What a fucking rip-off.

Good. Honestly, I think I'm more interested in seeing the Bad Company vs Funks (w/Mike Shaw!!!) match from that show.

One of my great regrets as a wrestling fan is failing to attend this card even though I lived in Calgary at the time. I know I've seen clips of the show (maybe only when they aired on the local news), but does anyone know if there is any good footage of this match and card in full out there?

I think it is also ironic/interesting that Cornette, the "B" Memphis manager, is in the HOF, and the RnR's, the "B" Memphis babyface tag team, will likely get in, while the "A" manager (Hart) and "A" babyface tag team (Fabs) are not in the HOF and may never get in. I'm not sure how it would work with the Fabs since Lane is already in, or if they even had a HOF run together, despite being very influential.

Maybe the bad timing of Jimmy being involved in a less than spectacular babyface run with Hogan just before the first class was put together, and the general malaise of his career from about 91/92 onwards, contributed to him being overlooked. I know his late-WWF/ WCW run made me forget about his glory days for a long time.

This is a great match, one I believe holds up well today. I can still remember watching it on Raw during the early days of it being broadcast on TSN in Canada, when it was on late at night on a Friday or Saturday (this would not change until early-97). I guess airing the match on TV was a ploy to sway viewers away from Nitro. Anyway, I look at this match, along with the debut of Goldust and Hart regaining the strap, as a symbol of the awakening of the WWF in late-95 after the long coma that was Diesel's run on top. I had missed most of 95 and was just getting back into wrestling when this match aired. The addition of blood, at a time when it was extremely rare in WWF rings (first juice since Mania 8?), helped kick things up a notch, as did Davey's use of the powerslam on the floor and Bret using la magistral for the pin. Just a fantastic match in my books. Totally different and more exciting than their more famous encounter in Wembley.

No Jimmy in HOF.

Exactly. Also, if we accept this statement as true, did Lesnar really draw more pro wrestling fans during that period than Cena? Sure, Lesnar headlined huge drawing shows, but only 6 in total over those years. Cena must have been the main draw (sorry, it's not just the brand, despite what Vince wants everyone to believe) for what, 25-30 PPV shows, at least, over that same stretch? Yes, they did not draw the monster numbers of the UFC shows (though the Mania's did), but even if Lesnar averaged 1 million buys for the 6 to total 6 million fans, and we assumed ALL of those fans were also pro wrestling fans (obviously not), a Cena average of, for example, 250,000 over 25 shows = 6.25 million fans (ALL pro wrestling fans). The Cena number is also being conservative. And, of course, this doesn't take into account the fans Cena drew to house shows over those years. Any way you look at it, there is NO WAY Lesnar drew more pro wrestling fans. I think Meltzer and others are so desperate to push through the whole MMA=Pro Wrestling agenda they have become totally delusional.

He has such an awkward writing style. So hard to read. More power to him if he is getting paid to write about wrestling, but God I hope not.

I remember reading somewhere (probably Meltzer) he was one biggest stars of the old 60s/70s Australian WCW promotion when it was on fire. I know Perez was basically dismissed as being a non-factor as a draw unless he was teamed with Rocca. Otherwise, I don't know much else about the guy other than he receives little to no respect by historians, despite the fact only a dozen or so guys in New York/WWE history were part of more big drawing main events.

Well, I didn't even spell his last name right, so obviously he was a nobody in pro wrestling. Seriously though, his career was simply too short to be seriously considered, despite any great strengths he had as a performer. There literally must be 100 candidates with better resumes. Still, based on how the winds are blowing these days, my gut says he gets in.

All things considered, I'm mostly fine with the Hall as it is. I do think there are a few flaws with the voting process . I also, like many of you, think there are a handful of individuals who shouldn't be in. But even then, I tend to go back and forth on guys like Angle, Jericho, and HHH. Right now, I'm heavy into wrestling history, so those three don't "stand up" to the numbers put up by many hall of famers, at least in my eyes (actually HHH probably does, but I'm still recovering from years of hating the guy). Every hall of fame, be it sports, music, etc., has a few questionable inductees in their midst, and the resulting debate over who is "worthy" or not is usually fun and mostly harmless anyway. My main criticism with the Hall is that several individuals should have been inducted years ago. Honestly, when I look at the list of people on the ballot, of the ones I am familiar with (that is, most of the North American candidates), I would be fine with almost all of them being inducted, outside of Batista, Edge, and maybe Moolah. The way things are going, I would venture to say that a large percentage of them eventually will get in, even though it may take several years or even decades. Really, even though my knowledge of some of them is relatively limited, I think Schmidt, Albano, Jarrett, Ventura, Owen, Monsoon, Slaughter, Mr.Wrestling II, Apter, Gary Hart, Morales, the RnR's, Koloff, Crockett Jr., the Assassins, and the Andersons should already be in. Others, like Sting, Murdoch, Hennig, Owen Hart, Arion, Sabu, and Snuka are a notch or two bellow, but still very memorable performers who wouldn't "disgrace" the Hall by being inducted. And mostly for personal reasons (although I don't think his inclusion would be that out of place), I think Jake Roberts, despite drawing power issues, belongs in the Hall. I've also heard that Buddy Rose and Jerry Blackwell have been criminally overlooked Anyway, next years debate should be fun. Lesner getting in may be the final straw that leads to the schism of the Church.

On the subject of promoters not in the Hall, could somebody explain to me the knock against Don Owen? I'm no expert at all, but wasn't he the promoter of Portland Wrestling for a million years, during which time the territory was always pretty successful, except for a few years here and there and at the end? I'm guessing he wasn't responsible for much of the booking. Anyway, I've always been curious because he's never pimped very heavily and I don't know the history of Portland very well.

An opinion like that pretty much sums up why Russo has booked so much garbage over the years. If he was in charge of the NFL he would advocate scrapping touchdowns and field goals in favour of teams scoring points based on which players delivered the best hits or some such nonsense. Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if he had a hand in the original XFL concept somewhere along the line.

What I don't understand is that if Hogan and Bischoff are in charge of the big stuff, why did they allow the writers to push Roode so hard in the first place if he wasn't the "right guy"? Maybe they have only recently gained total control,

Yeah, they drew a ton of money with the feud. Probably the most Vince has ever made with a program. The heat was off the charts. Ratings were sky high. Everybody watched Raw. But if I live the rest of my life without seeing the Austin vs Vince stuff from that era again I'll be fine with that. The feud was good at the start, great even. The cage match was likely good, but I can't remember because I haven't seen it since the day it aired. But in the end, the feud went on way TOO LONG and was the start of TOO MUCH VINCE AND FAMILY on TV, which I couldn't stand then and can't stand now. Really, it's about my personal taste. Outside of a few moments here and there, Vince as Mr. McMahon has never really done it for me. Give me babyface announcer Vince any day. And Rumble 99 was horseshit

So, do you guys think this was Edge's best shot, considering his retirement and being fresh on voters minds and all that?

The suspense is killing me!!!! (It's up on the site, so the floodgates will open any minute now) Anyway, while we're waiting, Dave mentions that next year "huge names" will be on the ballot for the first time. Cena is one and I'm guessing Danielson is another. Who else? Cena obviously gets in. Danielson, if Angle and Jericho (and maybe Sexton) are in, may have a chance with the voters I guess. Personally, I think he is good in the ring and has a subtle type of charisma that gets him over when given the chance, but no way can he be considered a hall of famer at this stage in his career. Maybe down the line if he somehow gets a serious main event run in WWE, but not yet. So, any thoughts on next years crop? Edit: Nevermind. Well, we can still talk about next year, but probably not for a day or two.