El-P

Who in their right mind would ? (and he still pimps tons of WWE matches as "great" too, despite not being great at all in my book)

They're ok for the experience level. Much better than Nia Jaxx, that's for sure. Just that. Ok. Fine. Bad looks (I always hated the Shield look, dating back to Big Boss Man in 1999) but fine otherwise. The match still was a pre-programmed clusterfuck. I like chaos and stupid shit when it looks like chaos and stupid shit, not carefully set-ups spots where you can almost write the script as it is going on.

Big ladders, small ladders, medium ladders... I climb slow, look at me setup a cute spot... Put up some ladders, Eliminators would yawn... Holy shit ! Holy shit ! Jeff Hardy taught us to work ! That ladder match was exactly the kind of stuff I don't care one bit for in 2017, especially when it's such poorly paced and way too written in advance. Seriously, the AoP just are greenhorns who look like they think about the script before each move they make. Way too contrived, felt inorganic as hell and this is basically the Hardys/E&C/Dudleys/MITB school of ladder matches, which I can't stand. Taking huge, dangerous and painfull bumps for the sake of it. Tell me again about the wonderful WWE mentality being better than the indies or NJ in term of busting up bodies. Worst match of the night. The heel turn was excellent though. Well, apart from that, that Takeoever was still the best in a long time.

Thanks for the lecture. I wouldn't thought about this, really. Except, really, TNA 2006 was still was closer to what ECW was in term of letting the rules fly, for better or worse. When this shit turns basically into a texas tornado match, you go with the flow. Makes much sense ? Nope. But does it work in context ? Sure. Oh, anyway...

Maybe, but I don't give a fuck about any of them (and that includes the announcers whom I don't have to suffer through anyway, and the crowd who sucked).

The only worthwhile stuff Davey did in WCW was a mini-feud against other european guys on Thunder, working against Finley, Regal (I believe he was still there) and Adams.

I thought Roode vs Itami was better than the UK match. Sure, that UK match was full of cool shit. But, not being familiar with either of them, that's what it looked like to me. A match full of cool shit that you kick out of many many times, then do a fun shot exchange that would go over like crazy in Japan, then more cool shit and stupid bumps and a finisher that looks right out of Chris Sabin/Petey Williams/Eric Shelley X-div match in 2006 (I should know, that's what I'm actively watching these days). And for what it was, yeah, tons of fun. *Great* match ? I wouldn't go that far. I wonder how much the novelty aspect plays into the overhype for this stuff. But to me, it's toward excellent mindless indy spotfu. I like Bate the most (love the Backlund-like strenght stuff). Meanwhile, I thought Roode & Itami worked a match that showed more purpose, with lots of great selling, actual cool offense too at times although it wasn't nearly as spectacular of course. But as a pro-wrestling match with, wait for it, "storytelling" and more of a sense of a build, it was better and I enjoyed it more. They worked perfectly well together, unlike the Nak match (which tells something about Nak to me, again). I despise the "glorious" bit, although I guess Roode isn't even supposed to be a heel anymore, is he ? Anyway, I thought this was excellent. Odd to see that Roode is basically the exact character he was when he quit Team Canade in 2006 to become "the hottest free agent in the business". He's basically the same guy... ...whereas Eric Young, while not being the same guy, was already showing signs of being out of his rocker at the same period in 2006 after Team Canada was disbanded. Kinda odd and funny sense of logic here. Match with Strong went too long, but it was a perfectly solid match. I don't see the issue about Young at all. Except of course the whole Sanity stuff is stupid when they do those robotic WWE intro... ...much like the girl of the group is doing. Kinda embarrassing and not credible one bit. Pillman looked crazy (while still overdoing it tbh). She's just doing a bad routine. As far as work goes however, I liked her a lot. I also enjoyed Ruby. And Asuka ruled as always, and despite Three-ways being one of the most annoying gimmick, they had a very good match. Rough around the edge, but it made the cool shit un-cutesy, which is nice. I always enjoy the fact we have different types of bodyshape and looks here. Asuka taking advantage of the situation got me back to that multi-man with Samoa Joe in, well, TNA 2006, and although it's obvious it's not exactly the same kind of aura and booking, there's something comparable to their unbeaten streak. Right down to the "Joe/Asuka is gonna kill you" chant. Which is one of my favourite chant, dating back to Taz in ECW, where it all began I believe. Keeping the tag match for later. But with a solid match at worst, a very good one and two excellent ones already, this show is easily the best Takeover in a long time and murders this terrible Sunday PPV. Yeah, NXT sure is a winner as far as training new talent... well, wait... well, it's fun anyway. (hearing Kenta Kobashi & Manami Toyota names on a WWE broadcast, how times have changed)

I should have copyrighted that stuff.

Agreed (although I haven't watched his career in detail, but I know that's always been his reputation). That being said, he has coasted in *every* match in WWE thus far. There's a reason for that too as of now, his body is broken down after years of abuse in Japan, so it's very understandable. There's that, but there's also that whole India deal that comes to mind. We have a guy who sucks (basically), who's roided to the grill, who was a JTTS his whole career, and who only gets a world title push because of a TV deal in India, where WWE doesn't even tour (yet). It's like, fuck the audience who's actually paying to watch the show in the building, what matters are the executives of some TV channel in India where, if you believe Meltz, they don't even sell shit in merchandise (yet). Charles said earlier in this very thread that the audience that mattered today was Wall Street. Surely that's a topic that should go in the MIS but it's kinda depressing when you think about it because it fucks up the product like never before because basically, the viewing audience *doesn't matter*. And no matter how hard people are defending the Roman Reigns push, the reality is that in any other era, a guy rejected as he is would simply not be pushed as a babyface like that or would be turned heel to try and make it a success in another way. Today, it doesn't matter anymore and we indeed get the kind of meta booking that is funny 1 out of 1000 time (like Reigns at the Rumble) but mostly makes the product pretty unwatchable in the grand scheme of things. It's all shallow "writing", trolling the "smarts" and checking the value of your stocks.

Of course. Although it would simply be a lesser version of their NJ classic, for obvious reasons. But that's the way to go. I guess the Indian market is more important than the Japan market (although they raid Japan now, which sucks for small companies like Stardom). Yeah, but that match was the epitome of Simmons not being a main event player and Barbarian being a JTTS pushed in the main and failing to deliver since he's just there to do a job. This felt like so not a World Title match. Just like Orton vs Mahal.

Mid-card guys until they get injured or fired. Bulldog doesn't go to WCW, doesn't get injured on the Warrior trap door... maybe doesn't do that much drugs.

Agius & Chereau rule. I have to state it every damn time. Nakamura vs Doph Ziggler. Well. Way to not showcase Nak at all. Average, fakely epic borefest. Ziggler is working at a snail pace. Wonder if that's a Mutah tribute or he's just emulating Paul Roma circa92 at this point. Anyway. Nak is coasting. Glad for him he got the money, because he's not doing a third of what he used to do in NJ. Probably saves his body. Good for him. That being said, his WWE story to me is the Sami Zayn match before Mania last year. Still, he should be in the main event scene yesterday (especially THESE DAYS). Instead of that, we get Ziggler dominating 80% of the match yet not being able to finish his opponent. No one wins. Tag team match ? WWE comedy. You know, I do have some other things to do. Like, I dunno. Search for leaks or something. Anything more interesting. Sami Zayn vs Baron Corbin. I still don't see shit in Corbin. He's ok at best, has no charisma, terrible hair. Still, this was a good, solid match because Sami is your regular Ricky Steamboat here. Totally worked around that *big stiff* (I'm so vintage, hell, I have an AOL email adress) with his excellent offense and great selling. Made Corbin look better than ever. Still. Switch Corbin with your generic big guy with no charisma and you get the exact same match. Switch Sami Zayn with some scrub and you get a shitty, boring, nothing match. Well, that's what we used to call a *carry job* back in the days, ya know. They should totally push Sami to the moon. Don't tell me he wouldn't sell merchandise to the kids. Nor draw women' attention. Nor sell tickets to the hardcores. He's a great worker and terrific babyface. Charlotte & Becky & Naomi vs Tamina & Natalya & Carmella. So Charlotte is a babyface now ? Damn. What's the point ? Kinda kills the momentum she had as a heel. Naomi's entrance is still glorious. The match isn't. Carmella is legit awful. Tamina doesn't have a purpose. Wow. What happened to the women having killer matches ? Charlotte & Becky want their talented opposition back, they can't do everything by themselves. AJ Styles vs Kevin Owens. Funny to see this get no love here. I thought this was a great match. Built into a sprint which goes faster and harder. Some brutal spots including that awful suplex on the ring apron. I love how they cut to a woman in the crowd who was very clearly saying "What ! The Fuck !". Got into greatness territory with the knee injury. Finish was creative. AJ Styles is a top ten GOAT contender (and no, I'l not saying that because of a few years in NJ and WWE, going through TNA is enlightement as far as overlooked workers, and I've not even seen his ROH stuff). Wyatt feud. Ah ah, like I care one bit. That Indian Guy vs Das Black Hole. Like it's been said, Mahal is not even bad enough to be entertaining. He's mediocre at very best but dull. Orton on the other hand manage to fuck up a guy's neck, that great worker that he is. Bad, boring match, although Mahal made Orton look good in comparison. You don't say. I probably had some sort of odd foreshadowing back then. Or the WWE is trolling ME ! And really, I understand the Indian market stuff yaddi yaddi yadda, but at the end of the day, who fucking care ? I have no WWE stock. This is a bad deal. It felt like Ron Simmons vs Barbarian, only way worse. And really, despite the Indian part being most, if not all, of it, no one can ignore the steroid part and the terrible message it sends. The Wellness Policy is once again looking like a complete joke. And really, Mahal's skin is disgusting. Who wants to inject chemicals into their body to look like this ? Repulsive. So there. "That Indian Guy" is WWE champ. From bad to bad. Probably won't last very long though. Well, there was one great match at least, but otherwise a pretty bad show. I have kept Takeover on the side. Probably a good idea.

Hard Justice 2006 Tag Titles Match AJ Styles & Christopher Daniels vs. LAX The fact it was rough around the edge only made it better to me. Who care about tag legalities in 2006 ? Yeah, it was a bit messy at times and yes Hernandez is still green, but it came off as a true struggle with two teams really hating each others. Spotty ? Yes. But damn good at being spotty. Excellent match. On the same show, Rhyno vs Samoa Joe vs Monty Brown in a Falls Count Anywhere match was quite the amazing brawl too.

That's a wretched card if I ever saw one. And I saw tons of them.

Well, you're listening to the wrong podcast if you don't have a fondness for WCW bullshit, because half of the fun of WCW was the bullshit. And I do love how Tony pulls no punches with the WCW bullshit while at the same time brings tons of interesting hindsight about the business at the time. He's also quite fair toward Meltz reporting (unlike office stooges like Pritchard who make it a gimmick of bashing "da dirtsheets") and fair toward the product (and his own biases) in general. And he seems to have the time of his life while not taking himself seriously one bit. I really enjoyed Schiavone a lot before (at his best, I have him above JR) but I really love the guy now. As far as Uncensored goes, gotta love the "buckethead" Anderson anecdote as well as the fact him and Heenan were actually pushing the "Uncensored" tagline as smart-asses because they knew they were actually being censored on the blood. Now that he's back in the realm, I would oh so love to see Schiavone do some stuff with KC. Probably would be more of your liking too (more serious stuff) while still being entertaining as all hell.

What undesirable directions ?

I don't care about ****** matches, the NXT tag team division, WWE Women having the best matches, English indie wrestling, G1 coming up, Lucha Underground coming back soon. The best thing in pro-wrestling in 2017 is Tony Schiavone's podcast.

Love sumo guys, for obvious reasons (no spoil on current basho, thank you fellow sumo fans). Taue doing the tsuppari attack always gets a pop from me. Meng did some sumo shit when he worked there (SWS I remember). Kitao was plain offensive.

So, he is gonna get bestendeavoured before the end of his contract ?

So, Meltz said Eva Marie was done with pro-wrestling. What a great stint. That was worth the time.

Ok, there you go. Here we are. You reached *that* moment. I admit I had to go back to some old sources to remember exactly what happened there. Since you're watching a best-off comp, you don't even know about the Ryo Miyuki debacle that went on in January. The story is, Miyuki was a tall, athletic, fairly good looking girl whom Rossy Ogawa wanted to push the hell out of despite being a total rookie with zero experience and… in-ring potential. Aja was opposed to that apparently. Miyuki's debut performance was embarrasing. And then we get that shoot-angle that turned into a shoot, with Aja basically "leaving" the promotion along Miyuki (yeah, makes all the sense in the world), hence letting Yoshida getting destroyed by LCO. On the same show, you had the infamous Ohmukai vs Miyuki "job-of-doom" where Miyuki shows up in street clothes and does the job in one minute (because she doesn't want to work here anymore, ya know). Thing is, Aja and Miyuki really did leave the promotion that day and never returned back. So there, Aja was pissed at Rossy because of his booking and Miyuki was a failed rookie debacle that ended up sucking in GAEA a few months later, then went on to work for DDT for a while. A month later, this was Fukawa's retirement show, which was quite fitting as ARSION as a cool little upstart company was no more. A few months later, Lioness Asuka would get the keys to the kingdom and would effectively kill the company by doing what she does : putting herself over everybody and garbaging up the product. By the end of the year, ARSION was going the way of what I'd call back then, a zombi promotion, with the depressing Carnival 2001 show. I think it went one until 2003 when Yumiko Hotta, of all people, took over and the promotion turned into AtoZ. To me, 2001 is where I simply stopped giving a fuck. It had been my all-time favourite pro-wrestling in 98 & 99. 2000 was rougher with Fukawa's injury but Hamada's rise to the top was cool. The Miyuki debacle, Aja's departure and Lioness taking over put the nails in the coffin in 2001

Damn. It's not a matter of kayfabe anymore. It's a matter of knowing way too fucking much about these people, especially their worst traits that emerge through social networks. Keep just a wee bit of mystery, will you ? (and no, I don't mean clean up you phones either)

She should work an Azealia Banks gimmick. Kill chicken in her closet, make Trump supporting tweets and insult entire countries. Seriously, she even got the right last name !

#dumbasfucktwitterfeud You know, some days I do yearn for the older times...

Without Shawn pushed as the main guy in DX and Nash & Hall in WCW, Trip never get passed the mid-card, it's as simple as this. The New Age Outlaws and Chyna were more over than he was months after he got the DX leader position. He only got there by SummerSlam working with Rocky in the ladder match. No main event push, no Stephy angle, no son-in-law, no 15 years of suck and boredom on top. Doesn't matter if Mr. McMahon doesn't get the "Bret screwed Bret" stuff, the anti-authority nature of Austin was still there by mid 1997. Before Bret left, Austin had already stunned JR if I recall right. The seeds were there. And Rocky still happens too, and working with Bret certainly beats the tepid HHH matches of the Summer of 98 (yeah, I know they were super heated despite being tepid, but that's neither here nor there, Rocky didn't need HHH to get over). Oh, and of course, Russo doesn't get to do half the shit he did because Bret wasn't gonna allow it. And Micheals doesn't get his "great" comeback stint as a living legend in the 00's with all those overrated self-consious epics and those DX revival shit. Damn Vince, why didn't you pick Bret ?