El-P
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Patrick really was excellent during these times. Very good promo and he had a nice chemistry with Gene.
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Excellent vignette. I wonder how DiBiase would have carried on as the boss of the nWo if Eric hadn't been thrown in the mix, as he was really good here. 4 Life gang style hand-sign, yet another brillant gimmick for the nWo.
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Again, interestingly enough, Sullivan says in the Timeline that he didn't though the idea of Sting "joigning" the nWo was good because Sting had no ties with them from the past. Anyway, this is still the second big money angle in the nWo saga, leading to Sting becoming the hottest babyface in the country while only having to hang out in the rafters. Nick Patrick leading Luger to the slaughter was a great touch, and the rainy, stormy weather only made the visuals ever more perfect. I admit that seeing Rick Steiner in his wrestling trunks holding an umbrella later on cracked me up. Great angle, great execution (really, who could have thought it wasn't Sting here ?), and great way to put it over *huge* during the remaining time of the broadcast, with the announcers acting both depressed and nervous and the Horsemen interview being conducted while a match is taking place, like a newsbreak from the usual show. Terrific stuff.
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Hum… that was kinda the character, you know. The self-pity party guy who thinks he's saying profound stuff while blabbing pretentious, morose bullshit about himself.
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I love Raven. Loved every twist of his character, down to the ridiculous comedic WCW vignettes at his rich house. Bray Wyatt doesn't look remotely as sick, twisted or creepy as Raven to me, because of the sanatized nature of WWE. Plus the Raven character was multi-layered, there was always some comedic, funny, ironic elements about it (which suited the whole gen-X slacker nature of the gimmick too) carried by his entourage. Not to mention the awesome SM gay vibe of the Flock. About the Wyatts, yes, the intro is great, the music is excellent (especially now that 99% of the music themes suck), but when I see the Wyatt Family, they look more like the Godwinns rather than a dangerous cult to me. And really, the heel Godwinns with the Deliverance-like banjo theme looked dirtier. So yeah, I think the gimmick has potential, but the execution and the way WWE product is presented now just hampers it a lot. And really, Bray Wyatt isn't Mankind. He's a whole lot better than Abyss (then again, everbody is), but like I said, Spivey doing Waylon Mercy was creepy and fun. Wyatt is just cute to me.
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Sullivan also adressed the issue of Waltman, which couldn't jump or appear on TV right away because of contractual issues. Sullivan wanted the nWo to be Nash/Hall/Waltman with Hogan, but Waltman's debut was delayed. He said he didn't like the idea of the Bulldog being paired with these guys either since he didn't had any connection with them in the WWF. -
Terrific angle. Yes, the Horsemen and the DoD got punked around, but they got atacked from nowhere after battling out for more than ten minutes against each others, and the Giant was the übermonster at the time. The promo bit was awkward, but Giant showed his inexperience here, and for better or worse, Hogan made the point and got the spotlight on himself. Interestingly enough, on the 96 Timeline, Sullivan said he was opposed to the Giant turn, so I guess it was a Hogan thing. And yeah, it really didn't make a whole lotta sense since he had no tie with the WWF. And the nWo *was* basically the WWF guys banding together. So although the angle, beatdown and post-beatdown promos are memorable (Hogan's that is), it can be considered as the first faux-pas in the growing nWo angle. The fact the Giant would turn back only a few months later kinda confirms it.
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Sullivan has said that Hogan kicking the globe was the moment he got relaxed and started to cut good Hollywood Hogan promos during this session.
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He's good in that match, but it was very slow and plodding. Blame Bigelow, who's doing a really poor job at trying to be Vader I thought. One of the clear cut "Bigelow wasn't that good" match to pass around.
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The Network thread just reminded me of the existence of Steve Blackman. Man, WWF has so many dull and useless workers in the late 90's.
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(threads like these are why I love this board BTW, and why I still enjoy to read/talk about pro-wrestling in 2014, well after it has effectively passed me by)
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The modern overscripted promos style of the WWE is one reason I find the product unwatchable as a whole. It doesn't comes off like bad pro-wrestling promos or cheesy badly acted pro-wrestling vignettes, it comes off like just terrible acting from a fourth rate TV show or old-school porn-movie (you know, when they used to have actual scripts and stories). The way they cut the scenes is awful too, with those awkward two seconds too many after each backstage skits. What is acceptable for pro-wrestling would just look downright embarrassing in any other entertainment business really. And don't get me started on their many attempts at doing comedy. To me it started with Russo, but really got settled with Stephy in the early 00's. 14 years later, it's the exact same thing and it's putrid. One huge turn-off of the modern WWE style for me.
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No, you're not. It always seemed obvious to me that HHH tried to emulate the Franchise character at that time. The whole "Cerebral Assassin" gimmick, the serious deliberate promos, all of this was basically "The Franchise" done poorly. One of the differences being that Douglas oozed pure heel charisma on promo in the mid-90's, and even when he went too long by the end of the decade he was always making a point and was getting his opponents over. And he wasn't insecure and showed tons of ass all the time.
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Andre the Giant Battle Royale - Worthless, total waste of time. Usos vs Real Americans - What Will said. Could be fun, I guess. Shield vs Kane & New Age Outlaws - Holy shit. Kane & New Age Outlaws. Remember when these guys were fresh, in 1998 ? 16 years ago ? It's like having Rocky Johnson & Tony Atlas to put over some hot new guys at Wrestlemania 2000. Poor Shield. They win, of course. Divas match - Anyone gives a fuck ? John Cena vs Bray Wyatt - Total throwaway match to me. Cena not involved in a big main event or a title match sounds wrong to me, no matter how played out he seems to be. He's still the Man at this point. Cena wins. Wyatt has no legs. It's a cute character, but he's not even as creepy as Waylon Mercy. IF they give him the win, it'll quickly end nowhere, I don't see him ever being a major player. Undertaker vs Brock Lesnar - Again, this doesn't seem as special as it probably should. Taker wins. HHH vs Daniel Bryan - Only interested in the result. Hopefully short, because God knows no-one wants to see a long HHH match in 2014. Bryan wins. Right ? Right ? Batista vs Randy Orton vs Daniel Bryan - Same thing. Only the feel-good moment interests me, as I couldn't give a crap about either of Bryan (right ?)'s opponents. So as a main event, really it's not compelling at all, especially since 3-ways is a shity gimmick to begin with. But the final pin and celebration should, could be a great moment. Right ? RIGHT ? But yeah, quite the underwhelming card.
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Call it the global WWE influence I guess. It's only logical. Less major promotions around the world, less place to learn different style.
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Douglas' stint in WCW in 2000 once he got hooked with Torrie Wilson was actually really solid and he made the most out of poor booking and awkward gimmick matches every time around. He was one of the saving graces of WCW TV for a short while. The Revolution stuff was awful, but it wasn't his fault. Yeah, big time Shane Douglas fan myself. Terrific babyface in 93 and great heel promo later on (before he went overboard at times especially in ECW and indies). Peaking in 95/96 and having a resurgence as a veteran-like worker in 99 (his last program in ECW) and 00. Interesting to hear Steve Austin giving him major props as a face worker and heel promo. Austin said that his only problem was that his heel work wasn't on par with his promos at the time, and that his babyface in-ring work was great but that he didn't had the great babyface promo ability.
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Ah ah !! Riggs already did a long ass interview with Highspots a few years ago, and it dragged because of Highspots long drawn out style of interviewing. This one looks chockfull of sleaze stuff I don't want to get mental pictures of. Riggs is an interesting character though. SMW, WCW, ECW… Lot to talk about.
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Totally agree with what's been said above. I always enjoyed Hunter's 96/97 work the best. He was exactly where he belong then, and was efficient and quite good at it.
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Those Regal's episodes are great. Regal's got such a soft spoken voice and delivery, it's an oral pleasure to just listen to him talk. And I got a big kick out of him and Austin singing the first few verses of El Paso. Regal talking about his musical tastes over the years, from the british metal bands like Saxon to the ska revival, Northern Soul and going through the early rave period was pretty damn cool.
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Yep. Actually, the best parts are HHH sucking up to McMahon to the point of grabbing Brisco so McMahon could put his shit under his nose, and big steroid ass HHH not being able to hold on to old man Brisco. What a man.
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I'm surprised they inducted that youngster. Hey, a Royal Rumble 93 reference. We're so damn old.
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[1996-08-19-WCW-Nitro] Sting & Lex Luger vs Ric Flair & Arn Anderson
El-P replied to Loss's topic in August 1996
Great segment. Arn is the standout, but Sting holds up his end pretty well. McMichaels was actually pretty damn good too. I agree with Loss, the unlikely teaming was a great touch and made the whole nWo angle even better, and it's too bad it got forgotten. And damn, Woman in those mini-shorts was smoking at this time. -
Saw hundreds of match with Nick Patrick, and he never bothered me. And he was great as a heel, and excellent promo too. Hebner's delayed dramatic counts did annoy the hell out of me though.
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I've got to the point where I can't watch a Dean Malenko match without thinking he's ridiculously overrated. He's just dry as hell. It works well against some great opponents who fit his character as an opposition, like Rey Jr., but against Regal or Benoit, it's just great mechanics but not much substance to me. Malenko is the prototypical worker for the jerk-off-fests "clap-clap-clap ! This is awesome !" kinda matches that would follow in the years to come (basically all based on Eddie vs Dean in ECW). So yeah, some really smooth exchanges, but I don't give a shit even though Regal is heeling up. Bring back Finley already.
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Or Tony Atlas…...