If not Backlund who?

[evilclown]

I think Malenko is an obvious non-starter to, but I want to point that there is great reason to believe people would have been higher on Ted than Joe at that point. Dibiase was already regarded as very charismatic and a strong prospect by that point. Was he a major star? Not really, but he was someone on the radar. Too my knowledge Joe wasn't.

You also have to consider that his trainer was a pain in the ass and his dad was a pain in the ass. Not sure he didn't come into the business with baggage.

[KrisZ]

Joe Malenko never worked a territory other than his father's and they were complete outlaws going against the legendary Eddie Graham.

[khawk20]

Brunzell was 6'2 and had been working heavyweights. He was never really booked as a light heavyweight in the AWA that I can remember even though he was a "High Flyer."

Yeah. He carried his weight well and looked about the same as Backlund to me, size-wise.

[Dylan Waco]

Brunzell was 6'2 and had been working heavyweights. He was never really booked as a light heavyweight in the AWA that I can remember even though he was a "High Flyer."

Yeah. He carried his weight well and looked about the same as Backlund to me, size-wise.

 

 

He was very credible opposite Bock when they worked each other, which admittedly is completely different than what he would have been asked to do as a WWWF champ.

 

One thing I will say about Backlund is that his insane conditioning and health freak status is something that might be overlooked in this discussion. I still don't think he was the only living person who could have had that run from a pure talent/fitting the mold perspective (I honestly think Brunzell and possibly even Martel though he was young could have done very well), but it is possible he was the only living person who could have put in the work with so few injuries (any?) over that period of time.

[puropotsy]

Just some guys not mentioned yet:

 

Pat Patterson- On the radar as he ended up being a main guy a couple of years later and was a solid worker. The French Canadian thing didn't effect him later that I know of

 

Leo Burke- Of course I would mention him, but in 1977 he was 29 and an 11-year veteran. He had wrestled world title matches, headlined in more than one territory, had experience in Amarillo and some in Japan and lots in Missouri (most KC). He could have been a good white meat babyface, I actually think he would have been a good heel opponent for Backlund around 1981-1983

 

Ron Garvin- He was 32 in 77 and had a lot of experience. He would have fit the white babyface role and had a workman type presentation

 

Wahoo McDaniel- He would have been 39 in 77 but was in some of the better years of his career. The Native gimmick was over in New York with Chief Jay Strongbow but Wahoo would have carried the added advantage of not being Strongbow. He was a good worker with an athletic background that included two years playing for the New York Jets

 

Pedro Morales-Had a previous history on top of the territory and was 35 at the time. I would assume it must have at least come up in conversation

 

All this being said I think the best alternative choice to Backlund would have been Dusty. I love his matches against Graham and he was crazy over with the New York crowd.

[Dylan Waco]

I think Patterson was seen at that point as a guy who's best years were behind him. Same with Pedro, albeit to a somewhat lesser extent perhaps.

 

I don't think there was a shot in hell of it, but the idea of Garvin or Leo as champ is hilariously awesome

[puropotsy]

Ya, I don't think either of them would have been picked but I think they had the ability.

 

And I definitely think Leo could have been plugged in as a heel challenger in the early 80s in the mode of Adrian Adonis or Buddy Rose.

 

I do think Wahoo could have been a good pick although his behavior outside of the ring probably would not have helped matters.

[MikeCampbell]

Backlund was pretty much the end of the WWF's 20 year tradition at that point, a longtime babyface champion to appeal to an ethnic demographic. Just like Bruno and Pedro before him (Superstar was the first heel to get an extended run with the strap). To determine who, if not Bob, you really have to first determine what the criteria was for choosing Bob. Was VJM looking for that Jack Brisco type of champion, or just to appeal to another ethnic group (IE the white boys).

 

Assuming it's the former, then he's definitely not going to find them in his territory. So he's got to find someone who fits the bill, is willing to make the move, and prove they can get over with the Northeast fans before the title change. Because, let's face it, I don't think he's going to magically select, say, Dory Funk, jr, and tell him "You start on this date, and you're going to beat Superstar in Feb." and then find out the hard way that the fans in MSG, The Spectrum, the Civic Arena in Pittsburgh, etc. don't give a flying shit about him.

 

It seems more likely that it's the latter, and VJM never had a big shortage of ethnic names on his roster to choose from. Putski, Strongbow, Garea, Arion, Bellomo, etc. He could have slotted any of them in Bob's place. Do I think they'd have gotten over better than Bob (wait a sec, Bob wasn't over, just ask Larry!)? Probably not. Do I think that PWO would be discussing great MSG Title matches like Ken Patera vs. Ivan Putski? Probably not. But, I don't exactly seen a ton of pimping for Pedro Morales matches either.

[Matt D]

Ok, so how much do we believe the idea that Backlund was mainly because Vince Sr wanted someone he could control?

[Ricky Jackson]

I don't know, but I would like to think Vince Sr saw that Bob was a very good worker and was highly regarded by other promoters Vince Sr respected. He thought Bob had a chance to be a big star, which he became, despite many fans refusal to accept this fact.

 

I'm actually really fascinated by the whole debate over Bob's legacy as 6-year WWF champ. Has anyone ever had to justify their track record as a great draw and worker as much as Bob has? I think a lot of the dismissal of Bob comes from fans who came to wrestling after 1984 and have a hard time accepting the fact that someone who looked so "average", yes, even dorky, as Bob was ever a big star, especially when compared to the steroid freak look of Hogan and the Road Warriors that came to dominate. Surely it doesn't help Bob's cause that the only pre 90s match most fans have seen of him in action is where he dropped the strap to the Iron Sheik, coming at a time when he had developed an extremely unflattering and unimpressive look for a major world champ, with the crew cut, singlet, and loss of muscle due to a change in workout routine. Meltzer and other smart fans of the 80s also set the tone for the future by dismissing his major accomplishments by praising the undercard and the heel challengers as the real reason the WWF drew so well, on top of writing Bob off as a poor worker to boot. True, Bob's style of work isn't for everyone, but many fans will always dismiss anything pre 90s anyway as too boring.

 

I think his reputation will only continue to improve, but most fans will probably only stick with the surface-level impression and continue to be baffled that he lasted so long as champ in NYC.

[BrickHithouse]

I can't get past the horror of the image of Ivan Putski: WWF Champion. Probably one of my least favorite wrestlers ever.

 

[flyonthewall2983]

Love the story Zbysko told on his Timeline about Putski. Fans are screaming rather racist Polish jokes at him, but he goes after the guy who calls him short.

[KrisZ]

AWESOME.....he did get a run with SBG

 

I need a photoshop of Dominic DeNucci with the belt

[BrickHithouse]

[BrickHithouse]

While a fine WWWF Champion, DeNucci could not hold a candle to the Great Bulldog Bob Brown-suke, who held all major belts simultaneously and retired undefeated:

 

[KrisZ]

You have won the internet sir

[soup23]

BrickHitHouse, you have reached your peak with the Great Bulldog. I cant stop looking at it.

[PeteF3]

The only way that can be topped is with a Bob Brown-suke vs. Harley Race poster.

[Dylan Waco]

Backlund was pretty much the end of the WWF's 20 year tradition at that point, a longtime babyface champion to appeal to an ethnic demographic. Just like Bruno and Pedro before him (Superstar was the first heel to get an extended run with the strap). To determine who, if not Bob, you really have to first determine what the criteria was for choosing Bob. Was VJM looking for that Jack Brisco type of champion, or just to appeal to another ethnic group (IE the white boys).

Agree that you have to get to the root, but Backlund was never cast as "great white hope," though he worked his fair share of "evil" foreigners I'm sure (though Sheik is the only one I can think of off hand). More to the point "the white boys" was not an ethnic group in any meaningful sense of the term.

[khawk20]

Agree that you have to get to the root, but Backlund was never cast as "great white hope," though he worked his fair share of "evil" foreigners I'm sure (though Sheik is the only one I can think of off hand).

Iron Sheik (79 and 83)

Ivan Koloff (78 and 83)

Peter Maivia (well, he was a foreigner, and he was evil at the time.... )

each of the Samoans

Iron Mike Sharpe (damn Canadians! )

Spiros Arion

Killer Khan

 

there are probably more, but yeah, he wasn't wrestling in the mold of Slaughter or anything...

[Happ Hazzard]

I think Dusty would have been the best choice to take the title in 1978 but he couldn't have held the title until 1983 like Backlund did. You'd have had to have him lose the title at least a couple of times during that period, and probably have a heel have a decent run with Dusty chasing the belt.

[flyonthewall2983]

Was Dusty that over in NYC? It would have been interesting to see them transition from a local hero to a southern guy.

[JerryvonKramer]

I think Dusty would have been the best choice to take the title in 1978 but he couldn't have held the title until 1983 like Backlund did. You'd have had to have him lose the title at least a couple of times during that period, and probably have a heel have a decent run with Dusty chasing the belt.

Were Dusty's short title runs because he was incapable of carrying a long run or because a lot of his time was tied up booking and promoting?

[khawk20]

I think Dusty would have been the best choice to take the title in 1978 but he couldn't have held the title until 1983 like Backlund did. You'd have had to have him lose the title at least a couple of times during that period, and probably have a heel have a decent run with Dusty chasing the belt.

Were Dusty's short title runs because he was incapable of carrying a long run or because a lot of his time was tied up booking and promoting?

 

My take:

 

First run (June 21 - 26, 1979) was a simple bit to pop Florida, and to set up a huge feud with Terry Funk, who cost Dusty the title by breaking his arm before their second rematch.

 

Second run (June 21(?) 1981 - September 17, 1981) allowed for Flair to rematch with Race to help set up the eventual 7th title win, if they wanted to go that way (no idea if they had that thought out two years in advance), plus made for more compelling Race-Flair rematches in the wake of Flairs title win. It was very similar to what the AWA did with the Bockwinkel-to-Jumbo-to-Martel title changes in 1984. He was simply a transitional champion, and Dusty was enough of a name that he could draw for a few months, at least, while travelling around with the belt.

 

Third Run (Summer of 1986? two weeks, exact dates escape me) was more the Bash tour getting recognition as a "major event" by having the title change hands on the tour once.

 

Dusty was a safe choice to have a run of short title wins like that because he was over and because Dusty in the role of "people's champion" was enhanced in each case by acheiving the dream, only to have it snatched away pretty quickly, getting him a sympathetic rub from the fans as a guy who could do it, but always got jobbed out of it when he did.

 

That's how I've always seen those title changes. Dusty as NWA Champion over a long period never seemed in the cards to me, and all his title wins sort of caught me by surprise, to be honest.

 

Dusty as WWWF Champion would have worked for a bit as he certainly seemed over in the area in the appearances he made in the late 70's and early 80's. I don't know how well it would have worked over a longer haul, or even as a lose-it-one-month, win-it-again-the-next-month sort of titleholder. Dusty was always better chasing, IMO.

[tomk]

Reading through this thread, I think people are missing that Backlund was a guy who was way more Furnas than he was Kroffat.

When you watch him, there is a direct power wrestler babyface line that runs from Sammartino through Backlund to Hogan.

 

People are recommending a bunch of Kroffat's, when Furnas is what appeals to the WWWF fans (or what the fed knew how to book for their fans).