BigBadMick Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Listening to the WWBBP on SuperBrawl 1 and Clash 15 reminded me how frustrating it is when matches are rushed. To me, it's worse than a bad match that cannot be saved irrespective of time allotment - all that glorious potential going to waste. Anyway, what are the most glaring examples of 'Come on! Give that another 5-10 minutes and you've a classic!' you've experienced? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohtani's jacket Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 I'm not a fan of short matches. I don't like lightning matches in lucha and I was never a big fan of Nitro era matches or the Saturday Night stuff. Matches where the bouts end early because of an injury angle or a run-in/outside interference are obviously worse (unless it's some sort of spectacular angle.) If you're looking for an example of a match that could have been longer, I think a longer Pillman/Windham match in '91 may have been remembered as a classic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 A lot of matches that Liger jobbed in the 90s for were really short. Prime example is he jobbed to Ultimo Dragon in less than 3 minutes at the J Crown Tournament. That was like my 3rd ever puro tape and I was super disappointed when Dragon beat him so quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheapshot Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 The first one that popped in to my head was Owen Hart vs. 1-2-3 Kid from KOTR 1994. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 I'm not a fan of short matches. I don't like lightning matches in lucha and I was never a big fan of Nitro era matches or the Saturday Night stuff. Agreed. Although I enjoy the early Nitro era quite a bit, I usually get more of out the big angles than out of most matches, as I find frustrating to have short competitive matches between two guys that should get at least 10 minutes together. Had the same issue with joshi in the late 90's in GAEA (and ARSION at times). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfman Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Sorrow & I went to one of the Royal Rumbles (the one Benoit won) and I remember thinking Hardcore Holly and Brock Lesnar was way too short. It was basically a jobber match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soup23 Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Windham vs. Pillman is criminally short from SuperBrawl and could have used another 3-4 minutes. Even something like Atlantis vs. Panther from 1997 felt a little short to me. Great match in spite of it but would have been a MOTYC with another 5-10 minutes of great wrestling building to a crescendo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 One of my big criticisms of TNA since I've been doing the reviews (five weeks and counting) is that even when they have a match up that looks good on paper, and in fact is good in practice, it's not long enough to be fully developed. This weeks Eric Young v. Bobby Lashley match is a perfect example of that. The work itself was fine, good even. But the match got six or seven minutes and the story they were telling needed at least five minutes more to really work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantastic Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Edge vs. Lance Storm - KOTR 2001 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Windham vs. Pillman is criminally short from SuperBrawl and could have used another 3-4 minutes. Even something like Atlantis vs. Panther from 1997 felt a little short to me. Great match in spite of it but would have been a MOTYC with another 5-10 minutes of great wrestling building to a crescendo. Windham-Pillman was also the one that came to mind for me. At 12-15 minutes, that would've been a classic. Both those guys were on a hell of a roll in '91. More recently, I wish Bryan and Regal had gotten 15 minutes to work together on a pay-per-view, though that's not asking for a specific match to go longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenjo Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 I dislike short matches in general as there isn't time for a beginning, middle and end. It depends on style but any match I consider less than 'full' length will be restricted in what rating it can achieve. The vast majority of TV matches never have a chance to achieve anything because of time constraints. Of course for bad matches, the shorter the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 But what's short? I'm not clear we're all defining that the same way. In recent years, for example, the WWE has cranked out a bunch of good TV matches in the 15-minute range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chief Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Edge vs. Lance Storm - KOTR 2001 If it's SummerSlam you're talking about, I think the time they were given was just fine for those particular workers. They didn't wrestle at King of the Ring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohtani's jacket Posted July 7, 2014 Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 But what's short? I'm not clear we're all defining that the same way. In recent years, for example, the WWE has cranked out a bunch of good TV matches in the 15-minute range. I wouldn't call 15 mins short. When I think of short matches, I'm thinking sub-10 minute matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxnj Posted July 7, 2014 Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 I dislike short matches in general as there isn't time for a beginning, middle and end. It depends on style but any match I consider less than 'full' length will be restricted in what rating it can achieve. The vast majority of TV matches never have a chance to achieve anything because of time constraints. Of course for bad matches, the shorter the better. I don't agree with that generalization at all. Look up Daisuke Ikeda vs. Takeshi Ono and you'll see 4 minute match that still manages to be very engaging with a clear beginning, control segments, and even some big nearfalls. It may actually be my 2010 MOTY regardless of length. I'll admit you're not going to see that quality on throwaway TV matches, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenjo Posted July 7, 2014 Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 I dislike short matches in general as there isn't time for a beginning, middle and end. It depends on style but any match I consider less than 'full' length will be restricted in what rating it can achieve. The vast majority of TV matches never have a chance to achieve anything because of time constraints. Of course for bad matches, the shorter the better. I don't agree with that generalization at all. Look up Daisuke Ikeda vs. Takeshi Ono and you'll see 4 minute match that still manages to be very engaging with a clear beginning, control segments, and even some big nearfalls. It may actually be my 2010 MOTY regardless of length. I'll admit you're not going to see that quality on throwaway TV matches, though. What control segments and big nearfalls? I disagree with what you're saying, but it was an entertaining way to spend 5m. So thanks for that. It was too short BTW. For shoot style matches the desirable duration can be a lot shorter than any other style because of the intensity. I would say the BME rules are also less of an issue because of the unpredictability in length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaymeFuture Posted July 7, 2014 Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 Owen/Kid from KOTR 94 was the gut instinct pick. Also, if I recall, didn't Liger lose in three minutes to Ultimo because he had the brain tumour? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantastic Posted July 7, 2014 Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 Edge vs. Lance Storm - KOTR 2001 If it's SummerSlam you're talking about, I think the time they were given was just fine for those particular workers. They didn't wrestle at King of the Ring. My mistake, Invasion era is a blur! You're right, it was Summerslam. However, I still think if they had maybe five minutes more, and some more big moves, it could have been a real kickass match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted July 7, 2014 Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 I think Owen/Kid was just right for what they were doing. I would have loved to see them go longer, but I also don't think the match lost anything because it was short. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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