Horrible matches between great wrestlers

[soup23]

Choshu vs. Jumbo is a pretty big dog surrounded by a really hot period. Having them go an hour is one of the biggest booking mistakes Baba made in the 1980's.

[grapplin' apple]

I remember Flair vs. Bret Hart at NWO Souled Out '98 (and many other Flair vs. Hart matches) being very disappointing.

[Phil Schneider]

I keep forgetting to do it but eventually I'm going to deconstruct that match in order to prove it's actually good as was Fujiwara's performance in it. Their tag from 1996 or whenever was way better though.

 

That is a completely insane opinion, looking forward to reading it

[ElHijodeGorgeousGeorge]

I'm surprised that Steve Austin vs Scott Hall isn't on here. I understand both guys were definitely passed their primes, I felt like that match could have still been much better. Didn't help that the build was god fucking awful.

[GSR]

 

The Shawn Michaels-Mr. Perfect match at Summerslam '93 is abysmal, and not only that, but their house show run (as we have it on handhelds) in the months leading into that match is pretty bad too.

Damn it, Loss, you posted what I came in here to post.

 

Seriously though, yeah, I remember being super disappointed by this match.

 

Does Savage vs. Warrior at SummerSlam count? Like we're seeing with AJ Styles and Gallows/Anderson now, they built up a big storyline (which one is buddy-buddy with Flair?) that ended up leading to nothing, and on top of that, the match ended in a DQ or something unsatisfying like that.

 

I realize Warrior was no workrate king and Savage was past his prime by then, but they'd had a great match previously.

 

(BTW, I realize the AJ and Gallows/Anderson stuff is ongoing, but I'll be shocked if it actually leads to much. At least, I don't think we'll end up getting either of the scenarios everyone wants - AJ reforming some version of Bullet Club with them or Finn Balor coming in and aligning with them as Balor Club. But we'll see.)

Warrior hardly fits into the category of 'great' wrestler.

[El-P]

I remember Flair vs. Bret Hart at NWO Souled Out '98 (and many other Flair vs. Hart matches) being very disappointing.

 

It was not. It was as good a Flair match you'd see in 1998. Plus Flair & Hart never gelled to the higest level, for obvious reasons (they have very different ideas of what a good match is). It was a very good match, only insane expectations make it disappointing. Flair was not a great worker by any stretch of the imagination in 98. Bret got the best out of him like he did with Luger later in the year (hell, Luger gave a much better effort all thing considered too).

[cad]

Jerry Estrada vs Pirata Morgan from 1993 was not just disappointing, it was seriously bad.

[C.S.]

Warrior hardly fits into the category of 'great' wrestler.

 

Did you even read my post? Just curious, because I said: "I realize Warrior was no workrate king and Savage was past his prime by then, but they'd had a great match previously."

 

Rewatch it on the network, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. I essentially forgot they wrestled on that card, until about 8 months ago. When I gave it a fresh look I liked it a lot.

You guys have convinced me. I'm going to give it another chance. I think childhood me was just disappointed by the DQ finish (or whatever it was). Remember, this was in an era when PPVs meant something and such finishes were even more egregious than they would be now.

 

It went an even 28:00 bell-to-bell, with a long post-match angle. I didn't think it was that great of a match but if anything it was too long, not too short.

I'm shocked to hear it went that long. Wow, my memory must really be fading. I'll have to give it another go.

[MikeF]

 

Definitely should consider the bizarrely one-sided Bob Backlund vs. Harley Race: Unification Match (9/22/80) - MSG. Pretty sure Loss did a great write-up of that one.

I don't think it was horrible, but it was certainly bizarrely one-sided. At MSG, I'd expect Backlund to have the edge on offense, but maybe a 60/40 split, not the 90/10 split that occurred.

[MikeF]

Oh, jdw actually did that write-up. I have yet to see the match, believe it or not.

 

It's on Dailymotion if you're interested.

[Ricky Jackson]

I thought Bob vs Harley was great the first time I saw it, but upon a second viewing, with a lot of great Bob matches recently in the rear view mirror due to Titans, it left me kinda cold. It's a weird match. The crowd totally laps it up and loves seeing Bob kick Harley's ass, like seeing the Yankees pummel the Dodgers in the World Series. There is a unique buzz in the air because a lot of fans were expecting Bob to walk out with both belts. But yeah, detached from that, there are tons better Bob title matches during his run on top

[Jingus]

I'm surprised that Steve Austin vs Scott Hall isn't on here. I understand both guys were definitely passed their primes, I felt like that match could have still been much better. Didn't help that the build was god fucking awful.

When's the last time Scott Hall had a genuinely good match? And I mean something which featured a really strong performance from him, not just "well, that three-way with Jarrett and Sid wasn't too bad".

 

Also, they were screwed from the start by the booking. I don't think the WWF crowd really gave a shit about the Outsiders in 2002, they were mostly just excited for Hogan's return while Nash and Hall rode on his coattails. Putting Austin into this feud was seen as a step down for Stone Cold, who should never be wrestling a sub-ten-minutes match deep in the undercard of Wrestlemania against a worker whose finish Austin can't even physically take. It doesn't help that Hall was trying to wrestle a Rock-type sprint, and simply didn't have the ability to do that and pull it off.

[Robert S]

Jerry Lawler was in quite some stinkers in mid-90ies WWF, most of all against Bret Hart at King of the Ring 95.

[supremebve]

 

I'm surprised that Steve Austin vs Scott Hall isn't on here. I understand both guys were definitely passed their primes, I felt like that match could have still been much better. Didn't help that the build was god fucking awful.

When's the last time Scott Hall had a genuinely good match? And I mean something which featured a really strong performance from him, not just "well, that three-way with Jarrett and Sid wasn't too bad".

 

Also, they were screwed from the start by the booking. I don't think the WWF crowd really gave a shit about the Outsiders in 2002, they were mostly just excited for Hogan's return while Nash and Hall rode on his coattails. Putting Austin into this feud was seen as a step down for Stone Cold, who should never be wrestling a sub-ten-minutes match deep in the undercard of Wrestlemania against a worker whose finish Austin can't even physically take. It doesn't help that Hall was trying to wrestle a Rock-type sprint, and simply didn't have the ability to do that and pull it off.

 

Scott Hall is like Tony Romo. Scott Hall is a guy who is simultaneously better and worse than what you think he is. When he is good, you don't understand how anyone could think he's not one of the best in the world, but when he's bad he's really fucking bad. I honestly think that Scott Hall is up there with Barry Windham on pure talent. He's just not someone who ever really maximized that talent.

[grapplin' apple]

 

I remember Flair vs. Bret Hart at NWO Souled Out '98 (and many other Flair vs. Hart matches) being very disappointing.

 

It was not. It was as good a Flair match you'd see in 1998. Plus Flair & Hart never gelled to the higest level, for obvious reasons (they have very different ideas of what a good match is). It was a very good match, only insane expectations make it disappointing. Flair was not a great worker by any stretch of the imagination in 98. Bret got the best out of him like he did with Luger later in the year (hell, Luger gave a much better effort all thing considered too).

 

 

Interesting. It's been a long time since I've seen it and I will have to watch it and re-evaluate it. Thanks!

[Gregor]

I didn't think that it was bad when I last watched it. They built it up like it was going to be something special, though, and then Bret and Flair wrestled their standard 1992 house show match. There was no attempt to make it anything special. "Disappointing" sums up what I thought about it, too.

[JRH]

Not sure if i'd call it horrible, but Shawn Michaels vs HHH from Royal Rumble 2004. They had some good matches previous, but that one was just a disapointment.

[Jimmy Redman]

That one I don't get at all. I watched it fairly recently and thought it was a pretty good brawl actually. They got a lot out of what they did. And I had always thought it was disappointing too.

 

Their HIAC is the real shit show.

[ElHijodeGorgeousGeorge]

 

 

I'm surprised that Steve Austin vs Scott Hall isn't on here. I understand both guys were definitely passed their primes, I felt like that match could have still been much better. Didn't help that the build was god fucking awful.

When's the last time Scott Hall had a genuinely good match? And I mean something which featured a really strong performance from him, not just "well, that three-way with Jarrett and Sid wasn't too bad".

 

Also, they were screwed from the start by the booking. I don't think the WWF crowd really gave a shit about the Outsiders in 2002, they were mostly just excited for Hogan's return while Nash and Hall rode on his coattails. Putting Austin into this feud was seen as a step down for Stone Cold, who should never be wrestling a sub-ten-minutes match deep in the undercard of Wrestlemania against a worker whose finish Austin can't even physically take. It doesn't help that Hall was trying to wrestle a Rock-type sprint, and simply didn't have the ability to do that and pull it off.

 

Scott Hall is like Tony Romo. Scott Hall is a guy who is simultaneously better and worse than what you think he is. When he is good, you don't understand how anyone could think he's not one of the best in the world, but when he's bad he's really fucking bad. I honestly think that Scott Hall is up there with Barry Windham on pure talent. He's just not someone who ever really maximized that talent.

 

I think you said it perfectly, supreme. Hall was always a guy that was inconsistent as fuck but when he was on, I'm not sure there are too many people that are better than he was. I'd say that by 2002 everyone was beyond sick of the whole nWo motif and yes it was clear that the whole revamp was a vehicle to bring Hogan back to the WWF fold. Hall was truly done by 99 in my view though, I think my source of disappointment was the build because as Jingus put it, no one gave a shit.