Grimmas Posted May 31, 2021 Report Share Posted May 31, 2021 Started his career as the hot tag in a high flying ant team and was amazing in that role. Later turned into the best comedy wrestler ever, and has transitioned that into some insanely great matches (David Starr, Pac, etc..) .The commitment to character and the different ranges between them is pretty damn impressive. Recs: Fire Ant vs Vin Girard (2008-06-15 Chikara) Orange Cassidy vs David Starr (2018-11-25 Beyond) Orange Cassidy vs PAC (2020-02-29 AEW) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoS Posted June 1, 2021 Report Share Posted June 1, 2021 For someone with a comedy gimmick, he is one of the best at showing fire as a face that I have seen in modern wrestling. At his best, he makes fans bite every single nearfall, and if he does get the win, the crowd goes crazy. The triple threat from Double or Nothing yesterday was whatever, but Cassidy was the biggest reason for the best parts of the match, and the fact that he got the fans thinking he might win a match where no one believed going in he had a chance is a testament to how good he is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotJayTabb Posted June 1, 2021 Report Share Posted June 1, 2021 I need to watch some more Colony stuff, but as OC he'd be pretty far from my list. It's my least favourite kind of comedy gimmick, the kind that requires the opponent to make themselves look stupid in order to get the gag over. He's capable enough, but the pool of wrestlers to trim to 100 is already big enough without him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Posted June 1, 2021 Report Share Posted June 1, 2021 I liked Fire Ant, one of my favorite guys on the indies during his run, but I'm much more interested in GOOD wrestlers than FUN wrestlers, and OC is probably the most glaring example of a FUN wrestler ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 I don't know. I think OC is pretty good. He has shown an ability develop a unique character, tell good stories with that character, and integrate that character into more serious wrestling scenarios/interact with more serious wrestlers. His ability to change pace really allows him to sprinkle in drama with some pinpoint accuracy. He is pretty fluid and athletic. His offense is pretty dynamic and I think his selling is solid. I agree that on first brush he strikes the eye as more "fun" than anything else, but I am not sure I think that is fair... or at least maybe he is on the verge of really building a case against the distinction. AEW has given him some great chances to shine (ex: I thought he looked great Sunday), but they have also proven to maybe not to know how to string good months instead of weeks together for him (ex: first Jericho match was built well and that whole thing had diminishing returns until they devolved into leaning too heavily on FUN for my taste). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 I would say, for me anyway, for any of the stuff you mentioned: integrating his character, his offense, his selling, to matter, you have to have a certain amount of buy-in, that I just don't have because I don't like the presentation at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strobogo Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 I think his whole shtick runs its course after the first time you see him have a match where he "tries". At least it did for me. We know he can wrestle like that all the time, so why doesn't he? And why are the announcers still surprised 2 years in when he actually does impressive wrestling stuff? It was all fine and dandy and entertaining when he was just doing this stuff on the outside of a match or as a third in a trio, but once he had the match with PAC, the facade of his character and gimmick were shattered but they keep up the pretenses of this cool guy who doesn't care about anything but very clearly does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeg Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 I enjoy his shtick, but I also agree with @Reel . For the whole shtick to work the people in the ring with Cassidy have to play along. Playing along with his schtick to make it work has made a lot of guys look foolish. I laugh of course, but that doesn't mean I think its a good idea to have top heels have egg on their face to get an underneath comedy act over. Its like the old Lorne Michaels saying "it gets a laugh but is it the right kind of laugh". I always am entertained by his work, but I don't know if thats a good thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strobogo Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 22 minutes ago, joeg said: I enjoy his shtick, but I also agree with @Reel . For the whole shtick to work the people in the ring with Cassidy have to play along. Playing along with his schtick to make it work has made a lot of guys look foolish. I laugh of course, but that doesn't mean I think its a good idea to have top heels have egg on their face to get an underneath comedy act over. Its like the old Lorne Michaels saying "it gets a laugh but is it the right kind of laugh". I always am entertained by his work, but I don't know if thats a good thing. It's one thing for all the heels to continue to pound on Hogan as he's hulking up and then throw punches to feed into the sequence. It's another for every guy on the roster to stand there for the hands in pockets spot or tapping kicks instead of just punching him in the fucking mouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 I get all that. I think buy in is sort of the foundational point here. It took me a while, but I am more or less "in" on Cassidy on the whole. However, I still think he is a good wrestler independent of that act. Now... obviously you can't ever completely separate the two because they both inform what he produces, but I think he demonstrates qualities of a good wrestler with a shtick that they are presently trying to figure out how to make more than fun. A great deal of work is left to be done on that front though. In all, I do totally get the point being made here. I guess I just think the fun label sells him a little short. Here it is applied fairly, but in other parts of the internet it is applied lazily and in bad faith as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetlag Posted June 7, 2021 Report Share Posted June 7, 2021 You know, I take offense to him being labelled "greatest comedy wrestler ever". Especially when Mokujin Ken has been nominated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DylanZero Posted June 7, 2021 Report Share Posted June 7, 2021 Strobogo's totally right. Once he shows he can actually wrestle seriously then all appeal of his gimmick faded away. I also agree the opponents constantly looking like fools to get him over is one of the worst comedy gimmicks. You can't deny his popularity and they've more or less succeeded to the AEW realm of fans of getting him over as a main event level guy despite everything logically wrong with him. As a wrestler when it's time to fire up and be serious he's not bad by any means, but not special in my opinion. At the end of the day there's a reason he's who he is and known for his gimmick more than actual wrestling. Which there's totally nothing wrong with btw but just not a very good case as one of the best pure in-ring performers of all time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urbanecowboy Posted July 23, 2022 Report Share Posted July 23, 2022 It’s so crazy that after every time Orange Cassidy has a great match on ppv or Dynamite there’s a discussion about whether or not he should Be taken seriously. He should. He’s one of the most compelling wrestlers of the last few years. Way more clever than comedic. And I haven’t seen a match of his that wasn’t psychological sound. I’m sure I will be the high vote on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JewishJoshiStan Posted August 2, 2022 Report Share Posted August 2, 2022 My current academic project is looking at Orange Cassidy vs. Hulk Hogan and asking (here is a rough sketch of the inquiry): "Are Orange Cassidy and Hulk Hogan doing the same 'thing?"" By thing I am indicating core artform, not genre. Obviously if we accept that they are both pro wrestlers (I don't know if I do) then their genre is fundamentally different-excluding the fingerpoke-but I'm not sure if that's the right question. Cassidy's provoking that question means I have to consider him for my 2026 top 100...assuming I decide he is in fact a pro wrestler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strobogo Posted August 2, 2022 Report Share Posted August 2, 2022 On 6/7/2021 at 4:27 PM, DylanZero said: Strobogo's totally right. Once he shows he can actually wrestle seriously then all appeal of his gimmick faded away. I also agree the opponents constantly looking like fools to get him over is one of the worst comedy gimmicks. You can't deny his popularity and they've more or less succeeded to the AEW realm of fans of getting him over as a main event level guy despite everything logically wrong with him. As a wrestler when it's time to fire up and be serious he's not bad by any means, but not special in my opinion. At the end of the day there's a reason he's who he is and known for his gimmick more than actual wrestling. Which there's totally nothing wrong with btw but just not a very good case as one of the best pure in-ring performers of all time. I must say, since this post the gimmick has been tweaked to all the nonchalant comedy stuff being mind games and psychology, and as a result, OC feels like a much more complete wrestler and character. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DylanZero Posted August 2, 2022 Report Share Posted August 2, 2022 14 minutes ago, strobogo said: I must say, since this post the gimmick has been tweaked to all the nonchalant comedy stuff being mind games and psychology, and as a result, OC feels like a much more complete wrestler and character. I agree with that and do think he is much better now and they've handled him incredibly well which has helped a lot too. I like to think we can combine to take credit for that after he read our posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmare007 Posted October 30, 2023 Report Share Posted October 30, 2023 Is OC the most successful gimmick of the 2020s in the U.S and Japan? I don't want to include México as I don't follow lucha but man, the way Cassidy has been able to integrate his very unique style and character and become one of the most reliable workers in a national promotion is the sort of thing that should count on his favor I think. Dude got better each year and did it in "hard mode", so to speak. Seems to me he'll end up a very viable candidate to enter a top 100 by 2026. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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