JerryvonKramer

I need to go in and have a close look to see how much of him in there is from the 70s. He worked in a lot of different places. I think he's going to be someone who will require an argument that isn't based on Great Match Theory though. He has been legit great in every single context I've ever seen him in.

http://placetobenation.com/titans-of-wrestling-46-wwf-june-to-september-1981/ Parv, Pete, Johnny and Kelly celebrate their return to WWF in 1981 by looking at a bunch of stuff from June to September before providing one whole HOUR of bonus content on the difficult-to-find Sgt. Slaughter vs. Pat Patterson matches from the Philly Spectrum. On the docket tonight: 06-20 SGT SLAUGHTER vs RICK MCGRAW WWF TV 07-11 DON MURACO vs STEVE KING WWF TV 07-20 DON MURACO vs PEDRO MORALES IC TITLE MADISON SQUARE GARDEN 07-25 MOONDOGS vs GAREA/MARTEL TAG TITLE WWF TV 08-01 ANDRE THE GIANT vs MOONDOG REX PHILADELPHIA SPECTRUM 08-01 BOB BACKLUND vs MOONDOG REX WWF TV 08-81 DON MURACO PROMO WWF TV 08-15 GREG VALENTINE vs MUHAMMED SAAD WWF TV 08-15 MURACO SQUASH, RICK MCGRAW INTERVIEW WWF TV 08-22 FUJI/SAITO vs HENNIG/SD JONES WWF TV 09-19 ANGELO MOSCA SQUASH, HITS PAT WITH PITCHER WWF TV Bonus: 04-18 SGT SLAUGHTER vs PAT PATTERSON PHILADELPHIA SPECTRUM 06-27 SGT SLAUGHTER vs MIL MASCARAS WWF TV CAPITAL CENTER 08-01 SGT SLAUGHTER vs PAT PATTERSON (alley fight) PHILADELPHIA SPECTRUM Highlights include: - "... and my name is, Joooooeee McHugh!" - Kayfabe most successful manager - Mini-bios for super-obscure jobbers Mohammad Saad and Tom Lynch - Random discussion of Lord Alfred Hayes and Vince Jr's odd love for him - Discussion of Masa Saito's career - And in the BONUS hour ... round up on the Slaughter vs. Patterson series, including comparisons of the Philly and MSG matches

They are promoting Flair in the promo too.

Watching through WWF in 1981, I have come to really disagree with this take.

Guy needs a closer look.

What were Vince and The Grand Wizard doing in Portland here in 1982?

It was actually meant to be in a bar or something in the arena. Imagine a bar in the arena which had a pool table in it. The camera being there can be explained by someone on commentary teeing up these skits by saying "And now for an exclusive look behind the scenes". Or something like that. Just that every time it's happened to be Martel and Liz getting themselves in compromising positions as Savage is walking in. Alright Keller and Meltzer, satisfied?

The game counts Delaware are part of the New England region, probably because Rhode Island and Maine are hardly big wrestling towns, and the North East area is big enough. So the the purposes of this thread, Delaware is in New England. Week 30 (August, Week 2) Philly Spectrum: Decent crowd, but still not quite a sell out. But not bad for a card headlined by Waldo von Erich in 1983! Missing match is the main event, Snuka vs. Waldo. Debut for Harley Race here, Snuka's final challenge at Summerslam in the Three Wise Men gauntlet. Just after this match, Chief Jay Strongbow finally hung up his boots properly and retired from in-ring action. Nice way to go out: taking a spike piledriver from Arn Anderson! Really this is amazing. Waldo under-performed, is ancient (49), and had been retired for a few years. This is the equivalent of digging him up from the grave and putting a zombie Nazi in the ring, and Snuka STILL pulls out a B. He's consistent, you've got to give it to him. Superstars: Ironically, this is one of the highest rated shows I've produced thus far. Yet again, Andre vs. Studd pops a massive rating. I've yet to figure out why because Studd is not really that over and I've jobbed him out massively. They don't even have a chemistry note. Finally, oh boy are the Meltzer crowd going to love this segment ... In order to commemorate the retirement of Chief Jay Strongbow, Jimmy Snuka and The Islanders throw him a party. The music hits, it's the soft samba kettle drums of Lionel Richie's All Night Long SD Jones: Well, my friends, the time has come To raise the roof and have some fun Throw away the work to be done Let the music play on (play on, play on) Snuka: Everbody sing, everybody dance Lose yourself in wild romance We're going to party Karamu, fiesta, forever Come on and sing along! Muraco: We're going to party Karamu, fiesta, forever Come on and sing along! Everyone: All night long! (all night) All night long! (all night) All night long! (all night) Steamboat: People dancing all in the street See the rhythm all in their feet Youngblood: Life is good wild and sweet Let the music play on (play on, play on) Jones: Feel it in your heart And feel it in your soul Let the music take control We're going to party Liming, fiesta, forever Come on and sing my song! Everyone: All night long! (all night) All night long! (all night) All night long! (all night) All night long! (all night) *As all of this goes on, Chief Jay Strongbow shows no emotion and remains entirely stony-faced, seemingly unmoved and unimpressed with what he's seeing before him* -------- In one bit of backstage news, this happened: Just like Tony Atlas, he was immediately fired. There will be no drugs or steroids in this company!

Week 29 (August, Week 1) WWF Tour: Made an incursion into Denver, Colorado. Another AWA town, but in the "Mid-West" region (as opposed to "Great Lakes" like Chicago). Very disappointing gate. Missing match is the main event, Snuka vs. Murdoch: Snuka seems incapable of having a bad match, but I'm also waiting to see him pop a rating higher than a B+. Let's take a look at his matches so far as Champ: His best matches have been with Slaughter, but also his worst match was with Slaughter too. I don't want to be too demanding, but I think he should be having slightly better matches against the likes of Hansen and Murdoch. The fact he was popping the same rating vs. Baker and Arion -- two guys brought out of semi-retirement for a last run -- on the one hand is impressive, but on the other is disappointing. I want a bit more from Snuka now. Superstars: Since I started running the new schedule with the Tour, Philly and MSG, I hadn't run a show in New England. So this TV taping came from Delaware (sell-out). No scripting or flavour for the DiBiase / Arn and Tully TV segment, just some final promos before their matches at Summerslam while gloating about their actions the previous week. Road Warriors have now gone 7 and 0. Continuing to push the Savage vs. Martel angle on TV, this week it's gotten SERIOUS: Miss Elizabeth is backstage playing pool with SD Jones, she's struggling to hit anything. Rick Martel walks in and sees her having trouble. So he goes over to help her. He shows her hold to hold the cue while standing behind her. Just at this moment, with Elizabeth bent over the pool table with Martel behind her, Savage walks in. This time he goes absolutely crazy and attacks Martel. They brawl in the pool room. Jones pulls Elizabth to one side to protect her as the two men go at it in the pool room. This is a bit of in-ring time for several guys on TV. But also furthering the Martel vs. Savage build. Still not as over as they could be, but this is partly because Savage is less over in Delaware than he is in the New York.

Week 28 (July, Week 4) Superstars: Not much happening on this show beyond Andre coming out during Khan's match to keep that feud going. Albano and Murdoch on the Supershow, plus another win for Murdoch ahead of his title shot at the next WWF Tour show (likely Chicago again). And a big recap of the Bruno-Ted feud ... January, Week 4 - Royal Rumble - The Elite (Ted DiBiase, Randy Savage, Arn Anderson and Tully Blanchard) attack Andre after winning the Rumble January, Week 4 - Superstars - The Elite attack Bruno Sammartino during a special interview in which he was talking to Vince about life after wrestling. Denucci comes out to try to make a save but gets decked. February, Week 1 - Superstars - On an edition of Billy Graham's Superstar's Supershow, The Elite cut money promos on Bruno. February, Week 2 - Superstars - On another edition of the Supershow, The Elite assault the 60-year-old Buddy Rogers, turning a distraught Billy Graham in the process. Bruno comes out but it is too late, and lets out a roar of anguish. February, Week 3 - Superstars - Seeing The Elite as a new threat in the WWF, Bruno enlists the aid of his friends: Andre, Lord Alfred Hayes, Superstar Graham and Dominic Denucci. February, Week 4 - Superstars - WWF Champion Bob Backlund was stripped of the title after injuring his leg in a defense against Kamala. Shortly after Vince McMahon Sr's announcement, the Elite ambushed Backlund on his way back to the locker-room, severely attacking the injured leg in an attempt to put him out of wrestling forever. Andre and Bruno came out to escort Backlund on the stretcher. A tournament for the vacant title was announced. March, Week 1 - Superstars - During a first-round tournament match between Ivan Koloff and Dominic Denucci, Arn and Tully run-in to attack Denucci before being chased off by Bruno. March, Week 2 - Superstars - The legendary Buddy Rogers lays out Ted DiBiase with a pair of brass knucks during his first-round tournament match with Billy Graham. March, Week 3 - Superstars - Bruno advances in the tournament by beating Hiro Saito. March, Week 4 - Superstars - With his head bandages from Rogers's punch, DiBiase pays for 10 minutes alone in the ring where he cuts a heated promo on Bruno, repeatedly calling him a "has been". Later on he has a stare-down with Bruno after his quarter-final match with the Iron Sheik. April, Week 1 - Challenge - DiBiase advances in the tournament by beating Dusty Rhodes in the quarter-finals. April, Week 1 - Superstars - Bruno cuts an emotional promo on DiBiase in which he demands a cage match with him at Wrestlemania. Later DiBiase declines the challenge. Then Bruno has a semi-final match with Sgt. Slaughter, during which DiBiase comes out to interfere causing a countout loss for an enraged Bruno. On the same show, DiBiase has a semi-final match with Jimmy Snuka, and Bruno pays him back by causing him a countout loss. DiBiase and Bruno brawl to the locker room. To everyone's surprise, the final of the tournament will be Snuka vs. Slaughter. April, Week 2 - Wrestlemania - DiBiase and Bruno headline the first Wrestlemania in an intense and heated cage match. In a massive upset, DiBiase wins with a fast roll-up pin grabbing the tights.[Various smart fans were said to have criticised the booking of this match in the dirt sheets] Shortly after this match, Bruno cuts a tearful promo in the ring announcing his immediate retirement. April, Week 2 - Superstars - DiBiase makes an appearance on Jesse Ventura's new talk segment, The Bodyshop. He brags about how he's the man who put Bruno Sammartino out of wrestling. April, Week 4 - Superstars - An emotional Bruno appears on The Bodyshop with a new determination to stay in wrestling, taking back his decision to retire, and vowing to destroy Ted DiBiase. [May-June - The comeback run: various tag matches featuring Bruno and friends vs. The Elite, mostly with Bruno winning] July, Week 4 - Superstars - Bruno appears once again on Billy Graham's Supershow, when he's assaulted yet again by The Elite (DiBiase, Arn and Tully). After the assault DiBiase stuffs a $100 down in his mouth and claims he's working for charity. ------- July was a good month financially: Snuka has been a good drawing champ so far with some able support from Bruno. I need to start thinking about the other side of Summerslam. Main thoughts: Probably will program Muraco with Valentine to feud over IC title. Arn and Tully will feud with Steamboat and Youngblood Snuka probably to transition to a feud with DiBiase. Savage and Martel to keep going If I can get to November with these as the main feuds, the main event of Survivor Series can be a 5 vs 5: The Islanders (Snuka, Muraco, Steamboat & Youngblood) and Rick Martel vs. The Elite (DiBiase, Arn, Tully, Savage) and Greg Valentine. That's one possible plan.

Moments after I posted the update, this happened: So long Tony. You're never coming back.

Week 27 (July, Week 3) MSG: Look at that crowd! Mainly still executing the 8-week plan to Summerslam. Bruno on good form here. Promising for the big blow off vs. Ted. What's that old saying about making chicken salad with chicken shit? This is a major feather in the cap of Snuka, to get a match with this rating out of a 49-year-old semi-retired Ox Baker who isn't that over. Remarkable. This 3 Wise Men storyline was designed to make Snuka into a real star and establish him as champ without really damaging any of my up-and-coming heels, it's been doing the trick and I'm pleased with how it is going. Superstars: Still using the TV to push the angles that need heating up. So mainly Martel-Savage and Bruno-DiBiase, which needed an injection of new life. Backstage, Rick Martel is taking a shower after winning his match. Miss Elizabeth is wandering through the locker room looking for Randy Savage, lost. Just as she has entered the locker room, Martel comes out of the shower with a small towel around his waist. Elizabeth clearly takes a look at Martel's body and steps back a moment slightly out of breath. Martel: Why Miss Elizabeth, you shouldn't be in here! Elizabeth: I can't find the Macho Man, have you seen him anywhere? Martel (rubbing a towel on his ripped chest): I don't think he'd be in this locker room, he'll be with Ted DiBiase and the rest of them Elite guys. *Just as Elizabeth goes to speak, Savage walks past the door. He does a double take as he sees her talking with the half-naked Martel* Savage is beside himself with anger. Savage: What are you doing here?! Talking with ... oohoo why I ... He grumbles incoherently as he grabs Elizabeth roughly by the arm and almost drags her out. Martel shakes his head in bemusement. The last of these promo videos. I made some artwork for this one and all! Superstar Graham welcomes Bruno for another appearance on Superstar's Supershow on WWF Superstars. Graham: One of my favourite guests now, ladies and gentlemen, the great one, the LIVING LEGEND, Bruno Sammartino! Bruno: Well thank you Billy, thank you. Graham: You made an appearance again at Madison Square Garden this past week Bruno, brother. How did it feel to be back in the building you sold out so many times, brother? Bruno: Well, ya know, Billy Grahan, it felt great. And I hope all these people saw how I'm back and fitter and stronger than ever. And I'm ready to take on Ted DiBiase at Summerslam! After all what I've been through with him, it's time to teach him some lessons -- in the ring and in life. At this moment, DiBiase saunters onto the set flanked by Arn and Tully carrying their tag titles over their shoulders. DiBiase: Well, well, well, look what the cat brought in. If it isn't the old people's retirement home for FORMER champions. I thought I'd put you out of commission Graham, this show was a lot better when Jesse Ventura was running things. And, you Bruno, how many times am I going to have to beat you before you stay down? How many retirements is it going to be Sammartino? Bruno (losing his temper already): You've got no right talking to me that way! You was lucky at Wrestlemania, boy. I was just coming back to ring fitness then and I was a step behind. But I've been training and training for MONTHS now. I'm at the top of my game. DiBiase: Ha ha ha ha, we'll see about that. But I just wanted to say Bruno, from the bottom of my heart ... that I'm ... *DiBiase extends a hand as if he's about to say sorry. Bruno looks at the hand and then looks back at him. He pauses for what seems like an age and then goes to shake the hand. As he does so, DiBiase flips him around into a Million Dollar Dream. Arn and Tully swarm the set, Arn takes Graham out with a football tackle as Tully nails Bruno (while in the hold) with his tag strap. Bruno is out cold. DiBiase stands over him on the floor.* DiBiase: I want all you people to watch this. This man who you think is your hero, this HAS BEEN. This LIAR who said he was retired and then wasn't, who changes his mind like a fickle and bumbling OLD MAN. I want you to remember this moment. *DiBiase goes into his pocket and produces a $100 bill. He stuffs the bill in Bruno's mouth* DiBiase: Because you see, we in the Elite, have money and class. We can do anything we want. And that right there is CHARITY. That's what I call "care in the community". Bruno can take that money and go and buy himself a nice old-man suit that he can wear when he's hanging out with Dominic Denucci. *Takes an imaginary sip of whiskey* "I was a wrestler once, it's a tough racket". Come on, boys, let's get out of here. Remarkable to think I've still got Soul Patrol lurking around on the roster. I thought Atlas might do something to earn his money tonight, but he can't even have a good match with Greg. ---------- And in the most minor news of all time, this happened:

Now I'm wondering if there was a Ron Fuller vs Ernie Ladd match. With both at almost 7' that would have been a natural feud. I need to get back to scouring 70s Florida footage. Billy Robinson is on the to do list too.

How about we keep the thread a Triple H-free zone from here on in? Pretty please. Such a tired and boring topic.

Ted needed the win more to get his heat back.

Big John Studd, Rumble 89 Chief Jay Strongbow, anytime he won

Some other running thoughts: Laughed out loud during Blair - Mike Graham comparison. Best Blair match I've seen is from 84, I think, vs. Paul Orndorff. Shown on the very first PTW. Poor Jumping Jim. Can you see him getting over in JCP?

I'm exactly 1:04 in with 1:04 left. Very enjoyable so far and honestly no real audio issues so far. I enjoyed the discussion of fan perspectives on Hart Foundation and Rockers and why people might think the things they do. On structure and house style, I'd break it down as follows: AWA - extended shine, double heat. Often babyfaces get ten minutes before twenty mins of FIP with heels working both guys over. WWF - Heel in peril, face in peril. For me this is actually pretty similar to AWA with the extended shine, but often FIP sequence is truncated and seldom is there more than one. Southern - shine, FIP, hot tag, finish Agreed?

Best examples I can think of are Larry Z vs Ivan Putski and Greg Valentine vs Chief Jay Strongbow. Both 4-star or near enough affairs featuring good workers against complete dogshit opponents. Those are carry jobs for me because Putski and Strongbow are both literally terrible in every other match you'll ever see them in.

Quick note: Steven asked me if I'd seen Cena vs Brock Extreme Rules on this show, and I was like "nah", but Chad reminded me that I've seen and reviewed that match in The Microscope and gave it five stars. Sorry, I blanked. You might have noticed that I do that quite often when Steven asks me questions, ha ha. Also, yes, the Bret / HBK analogy is way better. Also, I don't agree that the best tag team should beat the top two singles stars. I get the rationale, and I get putting over tag team wrestling as a particular specialism. But I don't buy Murdoch and Adonis beating Hogan and Andre. I also don't buy it in the context of All Japan where aces often double as tag specialists anyway. Kawada made his name in a tag team, him and Misawa were tag champs going into this. They are also positioned as #1 and #2 babyface on the roster. No way ... Absolutely no way MVC should be going over as strong as they did in that match. Like I said on the show, Doc and Gordy are two of the most strongly pushed and protected guys ever. And I still can't figure out why exactly.

More discussion of that match here: http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/30833-best-matches-youve-come-across/?p=5664492 The existence of Ziggy Stardust doesn't downgrade Hunky Dory for me, that's my line of argument. Freewheelin' Bob Dylan doesn't stop being a five star album even if Highway 61 Revistied is better.

My argument is "yes, but all of Crockett". Any time, any promotion, that's a five star match in my book. Doesn't matter what else comes.

Kawada vs Hansen from 2/28/93 is just so good that I can't understand why it is not more hyped and talked about. Instant desert island match for me and five star.

http://placetobenation.com/all-japan-excite-series-6/ Steven and Parv can barely contain their excitement for another batch of 90s classics. 10/21/92 - Mitsuharu Misawa vs Toshiaki Kawada 11/27/92 - Mitsuharu Misawa vs Toshiaki Kawada vs Kenta Kobashi & Giant Baba 01/30/93 - Mitsuharu Misawa & Toshiaki Kawada vs Steve Williams & Terry Gordy 02/28/93 - Stan Hansen vs Toshiaki Kawada

Baba vs Brisco from 12/5/74 (here).