Grimmas

TV report is up... yeah I went in a different direction for giving out results.

excerpts from the Wrestling Observer Newsletter Letter's Page for January 9th, 1985 Dear Dave, My friend mentioned to me that he stumbled across this wrestling from Mexico on Galavision that airs every Sunday. I love my local wrestling with Dusty Rhodes, Ted DiBiase, and Tommy Rich so I was really curious about it. It turns out I had never heard of any of the wrestlers on the show before, and they don't even call it wrestling. Instead they call it lucha libre. Luckily I speak a some Spanish, so I was able to pick up bits of what was being said. The show started off with a video package of the show clips from the 51 year history (yes this company says it started in 1933) of the Empresa Mexicana de Lucha Libre. Most of the guys wore masks which was different. There was a lot of bloody brawls like I'm used to in the USWA, but a lot more high flying. This video package was really cool. It then stated the EMLL has left the NWA and are now called the Consejo Mundial de Lucha Libre (CMLL) going forward. I guess this was the show to start with. The first segment was someone called Paco Alonso, who is the President of CMLL, welcoming a bunch of talent from the now defunct UWA. Some dudes in masks came out and shook his hand while the crowd popped. Others came out and didn't shake his hand, and it seems a handful more just didn't want to come out at all. This was very odd, I guess CMLL took over UWA and joined together, but some of the guys aren't happy about it? The first match is a title match for the Mexican National Light Heavyweight Title as Valente Fernandez defended against Negro Casas. They both had managers with them, although the managers looked like wrestlers too. In fact those managers got involved a lot brawling with each other. One was a cowboy called Gran Cochisse and the other was named Black Terry. Something I figured out here is that matches are 2/3 Falls. The first fall Casas jumped Fernandez and just beat him down all match, before hitting a big lariat for the win. Black Terry got in some cheap shots just like Skandar Akbar. There was a break between falls, where we got replays of a huge part of the first fall. The second fall was more beating down by Casas and more cheating by Terry. Until Gran Cochisse had enough and went nuts on Terry with some awesome punches. In the confusion Fernandez jumped over the top rope and landed on Casas and then threw him in the ring and pinned him with a splash off the top. The third fall lasted as long as the first two combined and those two really went at it. It was pretty heated, Casas was able to get this leg submission in for the win and to become the new champion! It kind of looked like a Boston Crab, but with the legs crossed over. Either way this was pretty cool match, although it's different than my USWA. Starting with a title change seemed very important. The next thing we got was insane. We got a group of three guys in a similar mask, where one of them was really fat. They were at a party in someone's back yard with a bbq and everything. They said some things about coming into the CMLL. The fat one ate like 20 hamburgers. I don't know what just happened. That was followed by clips of these three men (called Los Brazos) taking on another masked trios team (called Los Villanos). Wow is all I can say. This was the most exciting wrestling I've ever seen. I need to see more of these guys. Dives, comedy, intensity, this was so great. Hopefully we can get a full match out of these teams in the future. The main event was another 2/3 Falls match and this was a six man tag. The teams were Cien Caras (a tough looking guy in a mask who was called Captain), Perro Aguayo (who looked like Bruiser Brody with furry boots, only smaller), and Sangre Chicano (who had long hair) against a unit called Los Infernales consisting of El Satanico (who was a captain too, and might be a devil worshipper), MS-1 (who looked super cocky and had died blond hair), and Pirata Morgan (a pirate in a mask). This is where the show got confusing. The first fall had some amazing brawling, especially with MS-1 and Chicano going at it. This was really intense and super heated. Morgan pinned Chicano with a flying dive off the top, but the match continued and a few moments later Satanico faked getting low blowed by Aguayo and then got his hand raised. What? Satanico laughed like a madman after, so I guess he out tricked the babyfaces. The second fall was only a minute where Aguayo destroyed Satanico and then faked getting low blowed too and the referee gave him the win. I guess revenge? The final fall was more heated brawling with all six men getting involved. Something I didn't mention is that tags are not well enforced. It turns out just rolling outside the ring counts as a tag. These referees are odd. In fact there is two of them in the ring. Chicano hit a huge punch of Morgan to pin him. These two were squared off all of this fall. I hope to see them against each other again. The match continued with Agauyo pinned MS-1 with a foot stomp a minute later. All in all the main event was really great, I'm just not sure what is happening exactly. The show was a breeze to watch and I will watch again next week and let you know what is happening in CMLL. It's fascinating. Stan Grimmas Thanks Stan, keep the reports coming. In Los Angeles I saw many of these luchadores come here and they were always impressive. As for the rules, the way I understand it is each team has a Captain and to win the fall you have to either pin the Captain or the other two members of the team. Hope this helps. Dave Meltzer

This was a fun little spotfest with everyone looking good, including Ringo Mendoza who I really dug as an old man luchador. Just a bunch of fun, but really nothing special to go out of your way to see. ** 1/2

The lucha skit was great. By the way I think Blue Panther murdered Olimpico to end the first fall. Holy shit what a devastating way to get someone into an armbar. The remaining match is 3 on 2 and Casas shows great fire. I really liked Lizmark Jr's face in peril segment too. Blue Panther was the rudo stand out. I think it was a mistake to have Negro Casas not #1 on my GWE ballot. ***

This was glorious. Atlantis and Villano III's feud was even more heated then I remember. The beat down with a DQ for ripping off the mask was just bad ass. The second fall Atlantis tries to fight back, while covering his face was one of my favourite moments I've seen in a long while. Of course he gets his mask back and kicks ass, and the tecnicos get DQ'ed. Then in the final fall, the great feud continued, but also Casas & Wagner Jr. were doing 6/9/95 tribute spots and Mr. Niebla was crazy good and Casas was all fire. I LOVED this match. **** 1/4

Well.. that's a NJPW thing.

I did a search for Shibata on my google sheet and yielded this: vs Goto (6/22/2013) **** 1/2 (rating system before 1/4) vs Ishii (8/4/2013) **** (rating system before 1/4) vs AJ Styles (7/20/2015) **** (rating system before 1/4)

So, you don't see the difference? Foley in contract signings does this big promo and it's all about him getting over HIAC. Bryan is just there to pop the crowd, and the focus is on Alexa-Becky. I didn't call you dumb, I gave out other options for why you could be stating that opinion that is just plain wrong. If you think you are dumb, then so be it, that's not up for me to decide.

I'm sorry you feel that way. However, when you make statements like you don't see the difference between Foley/Steph and Bryan/Shane you are either trolling, don't watch, aren't paying attention, or I don't know really dumb. Steph and Foley are involved all over. Foley is there for the final segment promoting Sasha/Charlotte. Steph is all over the show, feuding with Bayley. etc... Plus, you know, Steph is a heel Bryan and Shane aren't even on every week. Shane comes out form time to time, and Bryan does administrative work. Sure he's the host on Talking Smack, but how is that the same. One show has an evil boss and a boss trying to play good cop, but stay goods with the boss. The other has two good people who let the workers do the work. How do you not see this difference?

Did you come on a discussion board to just state your opinions and that's it or did you want to discuss them? This is a discussion board, not your blog. I disagree with people on lots of stuff about wrestling and I engage on them. That's what a board is all about.

You don't see the difference between Steph/Foley and Shane/Bryan? If you don't see that, I don't know what to tell you, but they are nothing alike. Yes, SD has issues. There is no show in history without issues. I'm not putting words in your mouth, I'm just trying to figure out what you actually mean, because the words don't match reality.

Yeah, exactly. I'll make my requests in the proper sections.

I do watch at least one or two eps a month and clips, plus Talking Smack. I follow SD much more than Raw. SD has Bryan on about as much as Raw has Steph on, and then Bryan gets 20-30 minutes on Talking Smack to complain about his job and put talent on the spot with questions that can ruin them politically if they go to hard in one direction. And often outright shitting on the booking anyway. In the first 3-4 months, Bryan started and ended almost every show. They have him as the GM who makes matches in the middle of the show and books petty matches against talent he doesn't get along with. It's the same thing that people have been complaining about Stephanie doing for years, but he's doing it to heels. At the same time, the SD is brutally thin, leading to Becky vs Bliss 8 times since August, AJ Styles (probably the hottest guy in the company) having all of 2 matches since August that weren't against Dean Ambrose or James Ellsworth (and one of them was at SS which featured both Dean and Ellsworth in the match), and Miz vs Ziggler 5 times since September eventhough they've already had 2 multimonth long feuds in the past. All the issues of Raw are present on SD, but they have the luxury of not having to stretch their show out for another hour. Raw would probably be a pretty decent weekly show if it was back to 2 hours as well. I doubt people would be proclaiming it perhaps the greatest wrestling show of all time even if it actually was, because Raw droolz, SD rulez has been the talking point since the original draft. You gotta stop with this "anyone whose view doesn't line up with mine obviously isn't watching/is dumb" stuff. It's terrible for discussion. I see in SD what everyone hates about Raw, but to a lesser degree. I wouldn't see anything if I wasn't following and watching. The issues you are pointing out don't really exist. Bryan doesn't dominate the show. Those matches are done a few times, because they are feuding and it's a logical progression. None of it feels like what you are saying. By the way SD is 2.5 hours, if you include Talking Smack. Thats only 30 minutes shorter with one less division. Yet, SD can have 3 women feuds at a time and Raw can have 1. SD can have a compelling tag division with multiple challengers, Raw only have two teams at a time, etc... Time is not the issue here.

Easier to hide faults in trios matches and stro I'd a troll.

It's going to be on NJPW World too.

Cubsfan should on Tuesday

I was one of those. They were fucked in the draft. The booking has made the show better.

Pretty clear stro doesn't watch sd.

Wait... I forgot this year's Anniversario show is cancelled due to a earthquake.. so yeah, he would be scheduled to face Atlantis who is emerging as a top star and headlined in 84... the match will be cancelled due to the earthauqe though, so Hansen gets no haircut.

All the 80s TV I have watched has lots of jobber matches.

The only TV of those I watched is 97 WWF. 97 TV had better top program, but SDLive is easily better bottom to top. Everything on the show is good and everyone is being used. There is three different women's feuds all progressing weekly, even.

It's in the same vein. I think it's the best overall WWE/F/WWWF product they've had. It's not AJPW TV in the 90s, but that was 30 minutes of just a main event. I'd take this, but that's a way different beast.

What's weird is Smackdown is as good and old school and new school as any wrestling, maybe in history. The show utilizes everyone and builds to stuff. It's great.

I'm going with a six star rating starting January 7th, just trying to figure it out. Will there be a ***** 1/2 or just 5s and 6s? The annoying part is going into my database and fixing all my old ratings.

Don't worry everybody I am working on a new six star scale, just hashing out the details before I post it.