If Rick Rude didn't get injured

[MikeCampbell]

Like the 'Mania IV and '89-90 threads, this really isn't supposed to be fantasy booking, but designed for simple discussion. But, if Loss or Will disagree, then they'll move it over there. Let's say that Rude doesn't get hurt in Japan. What direction does Rick Rude's career go in? I honestly, don't see him sticking around in WCW much past '95. Unless he was making crazy good money and not ready to give it up. The WWF was in hell at the time, and smaller groups like ECW and Smoky Mountain couldn't afford him.

 

When he got hurt he was the WCW International World Champion, but that was about to be merged with the regular WCW Title, and Hogan was on his way in. Hogan and Flair was the natural feud to start off Hogan, doing the one thing that the WWF dropped the ball on, Hogan vs. Flair on PPV. Feuding with Flair had Hogan locked up until the end of October. Rude had been feuding with Sting over the International Title when he got hurt, but I don't see much reason to keep that feud going without a title. After Hogan and Sting, the top babyfaces would probably be Steamboat (who was retired by September, and feuding with Austin over the U.S. Title), and Dustin (feuding with the Stud Stable). Any other babyfaces (Badd, Pillman, Beefcake, Duggan) weren't anywhere close to his level.

 

Rude being the masked man who jumped Hogan at the Clash would have worked. Rude could have headed to New Japan for the G1 and maybe a tour afterwards, to explain why he hadn't been around. Hogan/Rude headlining Starrcade is certainly better than Hogan/Beefcake, although not turning Brutus means that WCW needs to find something else to do him, and with Sullivan and Tenta. But, after Starrcade Hogan was programmed with Vader. Rude could feud with Savage, but Savage was programmed as Hogan's running buddy, just like Sting. So, I don't see a place for Rude.

[Mr. Lacelle]

Rude was slated to go face against Vader and it would have been all sorts of awesome. I know it's been said to death about everyone from Dr. D. To Badnews but I really think Rude would have been a predecessor to the Stone Cold shtick. Hogan neutered everything around him. I could see Rude having an Austin like hissyfit leading to an ECW launch pad to a New Generation Stone Cold type character who would have gotten over huge against Diesel in a snark heavy crowd not unlike Sid against Shawn circa SS96.

[MikeCampbell]

Rude was slated to go face against Vader and it would have been all sorts of awesome.

I'd never heard that before, but it makes sense with the finish to the Sting/Rude match at Spring Stampede. Wow, I can totally see Rude doing his trademark "What I'd like to have right now" bit, directed at Harley and Vader.

[ohtani's jacket]

There was a set-up for the feud at Spring Stampede where Rude got into a backstage fight with Race and Vader.

[cm funk]

Anyone know what Rude's relationship with Hogan was like?

 

If he was friendly with him he would have stuck around WCW during the initial Hogan years. Vince wasn't in the business of handing out guaranteed contracts until 96 when he was forced to to compete with Turner. If Rude's contract had come up in that 94-95 period I'm sure Bischoff would have thrown a big guaranteed deal at him to keep him from going to WWF. He would have been a natural fit to join the nWo in 96 (which of course he later did as a manager type)

 

Rude had heat with Vince at that time too, stemming from the way he left WWF and testifying in the steroid trial. When he went back in '97 Vince was in desperation mode, and he promptly turned around and screwed Vince for Turner money.

 

I think if he'd left WCW he would have gone to Japan, not WWF.

[Matt D]

Story says that Hogan wanted nothing to do with him in WWF since he worked too stiff the first time they worked. Let me see if I can find anything.

[Kil]

Rude was slated to go face against Vader and it would have been all sorts of awesome.

 

Wasn't that going to be promoted as heel vs heel? I didn't think either one of them was going to turn face out of that angle.

[Sidebottom]

As the story goes, Rude was aiming for a comeback before his death. I've always found this more interesting to see how he would have fit in with a new crowd of wrestlers.

[JerryvonKramer]

What is interesting to think about is if Rude jumps back to WWF in 1994 and has a title feud with Bret Hart. Or a bit later there could have been an interesting "battle of the sexy boys" type feud with Shawn.

 

Thinking about it, Rude vs. Bret is something of a dream match, did it ever happen?

[Migs]

His character really was tailor made for the era that he just missed out on. You can see it in the way he's used in ECW - his lothario character makes a lot of sense in a context where the women are all scantily clad and becoming major parts of the storylines.

[Sidebottom]

Shit, Rude vs Hart in 1994 would have been something great. never thought about that before. Esp considering the chick were major into Hart back then for real without Bret particularly looking for the reaction a la Rude / Michaels etc. I can imagine great matches also as the two had a tonne of respect for each other, as Rude proved in 1997.

[FedEx227]

As the story goes, Rude was aiming for a comeback before his death. I've always found this more interesting to see how he would have fit in with a new crowd of wrestlers.

This always fascinates me more than what he would've done from 1993-1996ish. Would he have been re-hired by WWF as a full-time wrestler, how would he fit in clearly being a part of the older guard? What would his gimmick be?

[jdw]

Long term, Rude was screwed in WCW and he knew it. He rather openly said he wasn't going to job to Hogan, which is a problem when the whole company was going to revolve around Hogan. In the other direction, his departure from the WWF in 1990 was a big falling out with Vince, and 1994 wasn't a time when Vince felt the need to take back people who had really pissed him off. At the time, people pretty much thought the "injury" was bullshit in the sense of forcing him to "retire". They thought he knew he was screwed in both companies, the options for making money at the time other than WCW and the WWF were limited to Japan where (i) there were few jobs that paid what Rude wanted, and (ii) his options there were limited as well. There was the Lloyd's of London money sitting there to be taken while not having to work.

 

Of course if there wasn't Lloyds money, and he simply left WCW in 1994 at some point and largely sat around, the landscape would have changed in 1996 to 1997 where (i) Vince would have been more willing to take back headaches, (ii) any issues with WCW would have been squared off, and (iii) Rude would have seen the money being made and wanted to work the two companies against each other for the best deal.

 

You get the sense that Rude just might have been good enough with his money to sit out in that time stretch then take advantage of the changes. He was out of making the big money for pretty much a year in 1990-91 after leaving the WWF and before going to WCW. That wasn't super common in that era for people who were at the level Rude was when he left the WWF. WCW may not have been offering what Rude wanted in terms of $$$ in the Herd Era, and perhaps the purse strings did loosen up around the short Kip Frey era.

 

John

[Migs]

Long term, Rude was screwed in WCW and he knew it. He rather openly said he wasn't going to job to Hogan, which is a problem when the whole company was going to revolve around Hogan. In the other direction, his departure from the WWF in 1990 was a big falling out with Vince, and 1994 wasn't a time when Vince felt the need to take back people who had really pissed him off. At the time, people pretty much thought the "injury" was bullshit in the sense of forcing him to "retire". They thought he knew he was screwed in both companies, the options for making money at the time other than WCW and the WWF were limited to Japan where (i) there were few jobs that paid what Rude wanted, and (ii) his options there were limited as well. There was the Lloyd's of London money sitting there to be taken while not having to work.

 

Of course if there wasn't Lloyds money, and he simply left WCW in 1994 at some point and largely sat around, the landscape would have changed in 1996 to 1997 where (i) Vince would have been more willing to take back headaches, (ii) any issues with WCW would have been squared off, and (iii) Rude would have seen the money being made and wanted to work the two companies against each other for the best deal.

 

You get the sense that Rude just might have been good enough with his money to sit out in that time stretch then take advantage of the changes. He was out of making the big money for pretty much a year in 1990-91 after leaving the WWF and before going to WCW. That wasn't super common in that era for people who were at the level Rude was when he left the WWF. WCW may not have been offering what Rude wanted in terms of $$$ in the Herd Era, and perhaps the purse strings did loosen up around the short Kip Frey era.

 

John

And without the injury, if he's just sitting out for a bit... doesn't he end up working with Paul E in ECW sometime in 1995-1996 and probably becoming a hot free agent? Or is he too far above that?

[jdw]

He did end up working in ECW in 1997. But with the "injury" it wasn't really working as a wrestler.

 

There were some people who passed through ECW from one company to the other, like Austin and Pillman. Well... Pillman hadn't really "left" WCW, but instead Eric thought he was going to resign Pillman and the ECW stuff would just play into Pillman's gimmick. Austin was banged up at the time of getting the axe at WCW, and wasn't really on Vince's radar.

 

Rude was a bit different: he had headlined both promotions in a rather big way. If he was healthy and just sitting out after quitting WCW, he really wouldn't have needed ECW to heat himself up. Both Vince and Eric knew who he was. If he had the money, he could have just sat back, let his name get floated out there, and work the two offers. Vince at a certain point in 1996 was starting to get a little desperate.

[Johnny Guitar]

He did end up working in ECW in 1997. But with the "injury" it wasn't really working as a wrestler.

 

There were some people who passed through ECW from one company to the other, like Austin and Pillman. Well... Pillman hadn't really "left" WCW, but instead Eric thought he was going to resign Pillman and the ECW stuff would just play into Pillman's gimmick. Austin was banged up at the time of getting the axe at WCW, and wasn't really on Vince's radar.

 

Rude was a bit different: he had headlined both promotions in a rather big way. If he was healthy and just sitting out after quitting WCW, he really wouldn't have needed ECW to heat himself up. Both Vince and Eric knew who he was. If he had the money, he could have just sat back, let his name get floated out there, and work the two offers. Vince at a certain point in 1996 was starting to get a little desperate.

I agree with what you said. But even if he was healthy and just sitting out, I could see him agreeing to do one match for Heyman as a favor. If for nothing else than to shake the ring rust. Kind of like the match with Honky in IWCCW.

[JerryvonKramer]

That would actually invalidate the Lloyds of London deal. I believe taking a single bump could void that.

[jdw]

But even if he was healthy and just sitting out,

What Johnny is implying is what I was saying: leaving WCW healthy rather than leaving it taking the insurance money.

[Dooley]

Rude was a bit different: he had headlined both promotions in a rather big way. If he was healthy and just sitting out after quitting WCW, he really wouldn't have needed ECW to heat himself up. Both Vince and Eric knew who he was. If he had the money, he could have just sat back, let his name get floated out there, and work the two offers. Vince at a certain point in 1996 was starting to get a little desperate.

If Rude had bailed on Hogan-era WCW while healthy I'm not even sure it would have taken him until '96 to go back to Vince. '95 had business tanking and WCW heating up (even though they hadn't really pulled ahead yet). Being able to get a viable main eventer at that point may have convinced Vince to give Rude a "get out of jail free card" at that time.

[Mad Dog]

I remember he was starting to do some stuff in the ring in 1998. I remember them absolutely beating the shit out of someone on Thunder and Rude gave them a DDT which was the first move I had seen him do in a long time.

[JerryvonKramer]

But even if he was healthy and just sitting out,

What Johnny is implying is what I was saying: leaving WCW healthy rather than leaving it taking the insurance money.

 

Sorry bit confused about this. You made it sound like he had an option and that he might have worked if he wanted to. Why would he have just sat out if there was no gain? I don't get that.

[Johnny Guitar]

But even if he was healthy and just sitting out,

What Johnny is implying is what I was saying: leaving WCW healthy rather than leaving it taking the insurance money.

 

Sorry bit confused about this. You made it sound like he had an option and that he might have worked if he wanted to. Why would he have just sat out if there was no gain? I don't get that.

 

It's not without precedent. Whilst Shawn did fuck his back up and needed time off. He could have wrestled between 99-02. Its just that Vince didn't want the ball ache, and with Austin and Rock on fire, didn't need him. Plus they were paying him anyway. And even then Shawn did the match with Paul Diamond which held no fianical gain.

 

Still, Rude seems to have been sensible with his money. Apart from the one shot with Honky he didn't work between WWF and WCW he didn't seem to have the need to too.

 

If in 1994, when he left WCW, Vince had promised him a run against Bret, who he liked. He would have found a way too work. All the guys who had Lloyds of London insurance money (Hennig, Animal and some others who i'm blanking on right now) ended up working again for one reason or another.

[JerryvonKramer]

I believe DiBiase sat on his. His neck injury was in the same ballpark as Austin's.

 

All I was saying is that the minute you step into the ring you void the insurance payout. What I don't get is the scenario where Rude has an injury (not career ending, but enought to give him the option) and then doesn't take the insurance money but sits out. Can't see any motive for doing that, you might as well take the money if it's there.

 

So Shawn didn't take any Lloyds money in 99-02?

[Johnny Guitar]

I believe DiBiase sat on his. His neck injury was in the same ballpark as Austin's.

 

All I was saying is that the minute you step into the ring you void the insurance payout. What I don't get is the scenario where Rude has an injury (not career ending, but enought to give him the option) and then doesn't take the insurance money but sits out. Can't see any motive for doing that, you might as well take the money if it's there.

 

So Shawn didn't take any Lloyds money in 99-02?

I don't know if Shawn had Lloyds money or not. Regardless he signed a 5 year contract in 96, so was drawing a monthly paycheck anyways.

 

I do know that he was considered a massive liabality and pretty much a death risk during that time frame. And after what happened with Pillman and Owen. He was a guy that you wanted too keep far away from the media

[jdw]

Rude was a bit different: he had headlined both promotions in a rather big way. If he was healthy and just sitting out after quitting WCW, he really wouldn't have needed ECW to heat himself up. Both Vince and Eric knew who he was. If he had the money, he could have just sat back, let his name get floated out there, and work the two offers. Vince at a certain point in 1996 was starting to get a little desperate.

If Rude had bailed on Hogan-era WCW while healthy I'm not even sure it would have taken him until '96 to go back to Vince. '95 had business tanking and WCW heating up (even though they hadn't really pulled ahead yet). Being able to get a viable main eventer at that point may have convinced Vince to give Rude a "get out of jail free card" at that time.

 

He didn't bring back Warrior until 1996 until he was getting really desperate in the face of WCW doing well. Similar falling out, except that Vince saw Warrior as a bigger star than Rude and "his" star. I don't see a lot of panic in Vince in 1995 over *talent* even as the business is bad. He stuck with Nash a whole year. He didn't replace Nash by pulling something out of his ass: Old Reliable Bret with the plan to go to Shawn who already was a top guy by that point.

 

Are there any moves with talent in 1995 that look desperation?