Low Ki

[Grimmas]

Discuss here.

[W2BTD]

Doesn't Low Ki have a thread already? Or was Parv posting his reviews of this guy someplace else?

[JerryvonKramer]

Joe - I post reviews in The Microscope section and then match highlights / thoughts / deeper analysis in the GWE section.

 

Re: Low Ki, I still haven't done enough reviews to offer any of the above, still forming my views on him really.

[goodhelmet]

Surprised Low-Ki hasn't received much attention.

[stomperspc]

Low Ki is as or more responsible than any other wrestling for establishing a stiff, mat based style as a viable style during the early 2000's indies explosion. He might not always get enough credit for being so versatile. He fairly easily could have made a career working a pure Japanese junior/WCW cruiserweight style with a focus on flying but branched out. He was a great, realistic mat worker and submission specialist during a time where very people were focusing on that style. The series with American Dragon from 2001 - 2002 was as good of a young guy vs. young series as I can recall (2/24/01 ECWA Super 8; 7/21/01 ECWA; 10/27/01 King of Indies final; 3/03/02 ROH; 6/7/02 JAPW tap out match). He sort of peaked early as you can argue he was never as good as he was circa-2002, but he had a long career has an above average wrestler in TNA, ROH and Japan. He's still above average and can be really good when he wants to be. The Galloway pole match was way better than it had any right to be and I was a big fan of the Ricochet match from 2014. You could make an argument for him being the top junior heavyweight of the past 15 years. He'll be towards the back end of my list, but he'll definitely be on it.

[Timbo Slice]

He's probably the most divisive indies-based candidate on the list because I'm not sure there's a guy with a higher ceiling than Ki, but at the same time, I think he decided that stiffness for the sake of being stiff was paramount in his matches above all else and it suffered. I'm not sure I really saw him carry a guy to a truly great match, although he was great in squashes, but I also think he was a victim of bad timing, as if he was still a relatively name a couple years later, he would have been in NXT. It's really weird to try and figure out where he is in the end, but I'm not sure he has enough when you consider as wide a scope as we're talking about with all these candidates.

[Phil Schneider]

His match with Chris Dickinson from JAPW this year was my favorite Indy match of the year, and that would be a guy he carried. I am a big Monsta Mack fan, but the Ki singles from the early 2000s was worlds above any other singles match Mack had. Has a really great aura which is missing from most indy guys, he will be on my list for sure

[Dylan Waco]

Interested to hear how people would compare Ki to Red. In some ways I think they were the two most dynamic guys of the early indie boom period and both sort of faded out of the limelight albeit for different reasons. From a resume perspective Low Ki feels like his case is deeper, but as a fan I was much more excited to see Red at his peak (and even now) than I was Ki.

[elliott]

I am a big Monsta Mack fan, but the Ki singles from the early 2000s was worlds above any other singles match Mack had.

 

Was this a hardcore match? I remember absolutely loving a Ki vs Mack hardcore match from 2002ish where they brawled all over the building.

[GOTNW]

Interested to hear how people would compare Ki to Red. In some ways I think they were the two most dynamic guys of the early indie boom period and both sort of faded out of the limelight albeit for different reasons. From a resume perspective Low Ki feels like his case is deeper, but as a fan I was much more excited to see Red at his peak (and even now) than I was Ki.

Don't really see the case for Red at all. He was a good worker but Ki has much higher highs and a much deeper body of work. Last I saw of Red he was working as an uninteresting FIP in his(?) indy promotion. Am I missing something?

[JRGoldman]

There are few things that stand out in my mind as clearly as that kung fu sequence with Red from Road to the Title. I remember seeing it for the first time and thinking that I was actually watching the future of wrestling. Not just two wrestlers who were in line for great things, but this was a glimpse in to what wrestling was going to look like some number of years down the road. I think Low Ki was the last wrestler I can think of that had this Sabu like quality to him; you heard his name from people, and you knew you had to check him out and he just had this different aura about him that made him stand out so much. It's sort of bizarre that he isn't really viewed as a peer of the Punk/Joe/Bryan group that really put ROH on the map, because I think his work from 2002-2006 rivals what they were able to do with their later peaks. He's one of the few guys in Indy history that was able to be a believable special attraction (like a tiny Andre), and the fact that he was so protective of that role probably ended up being to his detriment. I think he will probably end up making my ballot, although he will end up lower than he should be simply because he was never able to have a sustained run outside of ROH. No matter how much I love that match against Necro Butcher or some of the JAPW stuff, I can't justify it being as meaningful as Punk or Bryan's WWE runs, for example.

[GOTNW]

Ki had obvious influences but he managed to come up with enough of his own moves and mannerisms to come off as an interesting pastiche of them rather than a bland copy. I really like his work and will probably rank him.

[Mando]

Low Ki is one of a handful of primarily indy guys that'd definitely stand a chance of appearing on my ballot. He has a uniqueness that regardless of his opponent I'm always interested in seeing his matches strictly on the strength of his performances alone (for example: he'd be one of few guys who'd make me interested in a match versus Abyss).

[Phil Schneider]

It is weird to think about it with Indy guys like Ki, but he has had a way longer elite career then a lot of older guys. Think about a guy like Savage, his run was maybe 1984-91 maybe? With an occasional cool thing after that, that is 8 years as a top wrestler. Windham was about 83-91. Ki had his first great matches in 1999 and had a stone cold classic with Rey in 2015, that is 16 years of great wrestling and there is no reason to think he is at the end of his career.

[Phil Schneider]

Ki might have been a top 5 guy in 2015, he really only wrestled a handful of times, but they were all great, Ki v. Rey Jr. is my MOTY, loved Ki v. Dickinson, the AAA trios was a blast and Cide/Ki v. Hit Squad was another great performance. I honestly could see myself ranking him above Danielson, although I admit that might be a bit crazy.

[Cap]

I like the comparison of him to Sabu. He really was the unique wrestler who stood out, made matches feel different and special, and helped set shows he was on apart. He was to the indy boom (particularly ROH) what Sabu was to ECW. I sort of agree that his stiffness for stiffness sake can be a real downer. He doesn't elevate lesser talent (like say Danielson, Joe, Styles, and even Daniels did at the same time). Rather, he often would just beat them senseless. Still, his high end stuff since 2002 is just so good, so much fun that I can see him anywhere from 75-100 on my list.

 

I will need to take a look at his early nonROH stuff and some of what he has done since 2012 before I make a final decision.

[Quentin]

Since 2016, we’ve gotten really good Ki stuff in MLW vs Fenix and Thatcher, his tag match with WALTER facing Starr and Devlin was fantastic and had maybe the best match of Sami Callihan’s Triple H run as AAW champion. Not sure if it moves Ki up for me at all but it at least means his spot is safe and that he still is delivering on an elite level in big spots.

[GlassS0Ldier]

His 2010s was far quieter than his classic 2000s run, but a handful of his matches in MLW I think have been impressive enough to show he's still got it to some extent. Wasn't crazy about his NJPW run earlier in the decade, as much as I enjoy guys like Taguchi I don't feel as if most of his singles from that run were all that impressive.

More does need to be said about his versatility though, working shitkicking brawls with Necro Butcher to matching guys like Danielson on the mat. He's a rise or sink kind of guy, able to match some of the greats but also capable of stinkers when paired with a less interesting opponent. That alone might ward off some from considering him Top 100 category, but I do believe the best of Ki in the 2000s vastly overshadows his lows. 

Like a lot of his indie peers, he's a guy with very transparent inspirations and derives much of his offense from them (I roll my eyes a bit when he does the Mutoh running elbow drop mannerisms), but unlike many others, he doesn't feel like a shameless wink-wink nudge nudge copycat, cultivating his own identity through his demeanor and body language, no matter how goofy they sometimes came off as. He'll make the bottom half of my list for certain, missing out on getting higher because of his later inconsistency.

[Childs]

Ki is another guy who does well by the random match theory approach. He has not had long, consistent runs, but he's wrestled all over and rarely been boring. Sure, he's a self-defeating nut job, but he made my list in 2016 and he'll make it again in 2026. 

[elliott]

I'm wondering if someone at some point can make a comprehensive case for Low-Ki. I know the rap is that he had a bad attitude and it prevented him from reaching his potential. I'm kind of curious of an analysis of the bad as much as the good. I've seen a lot of the good and I'm a huge fan of it. I'm more likely to vote for Low-Ki than not and there aren't many wrestlers from the last 20 years I'd say that about.