flyonthewall2983 Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 The main branch of the subject usually is Steve Austin, but in a way WCW losing Vader and Dustin Rhodes hurt the company in their own ways too. Especially Rhodes, who could legitimately have had a shot at being a top guy if he stuck around. It's especially painful to consider this with how ultimately unremarkable the Goldust character was from a wrestling standpoint when the character was fresh. He worked with top talent, but it wasn't terribly consistent and thus was given less opportunities to shine in the ring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(BP) Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 I think Dustin probably would have floated around the US/TV title picture and then eventually ended up an NWO midcarder. His output in ring would probably be better than his initial Goldust runs though. I would hope Vader would have been kept strong and stayed at the top of the card as a foil for the NWO. I certainly would have loved to see Vader/Goldberg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 I could see them putting Vader in the role Giant ended up in, kind of like the enforcer for the NWO. If he would have stayed on the WCW side, it'd have been silly to book the NWO so strong when they had a 450 pound monster on Team WCW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisZ Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Marc Mero was also gone in 1995....if he doesn't go then there is probably no Sable in WWF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Sorrow Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Marc Mero was also gone in 1995....if he doesn't go then there is probably no Sable in WWFExactly. I love that basically they traded rosters over the course of a few years and at first it looked like Vince got the raw end of the deal, but eventually Austin, Mankind, Sable, HHH, Goldust, Simmons eventually, etcetera became the big part of the roster that hit bigger than anything ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra Commander Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Marc Mero was also gone in 1995....if he doesn't go then there is probably no Sable in WWF gone in early 1996, to be exact. With a quick turn around from his last WCW to his first WWF. Not sure when non-competes became more common Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petey Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 They also had Sabu for a cup of coffee. Too bad he didn't get a longer run. I've been re-watching the early Nitros and dude was seriously awesome. *EDIT* I don't know if Sabu was fired, quit or if it were a "mutual parting of the ways". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra Commander Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 I think Sabu has claimed that he was on a per-appearance arrangement and not a contract in 1995 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthedoctor Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 I think Dustin probably would have floated around the US/TV title picture and then eventually ended up an NWO midcarder. His output in ring would probably be better than his initial Goldust runs though. I would hope Vader would have been kept strong and stayed at the top of the card as a foil for the NWO. I certainly would have loved to see Vader/Goldberg. If Dustin had stayed id like to have thought he would have got a run with the World title. After he held the US belt a few times this is the next step up which would have been a great feud with Flair in 1995. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 I can't see Vader fitting in on either side of the WCW/NWO war. Even though he didn't have the greatest WWF run, I don't think staying in WCW would have been very good for his career in the long haul either. He was never going to be the dominant monster heel after Hogan showed up, and after the NWO started he would have been knocked down another peg or two. I don't think Austin would have, or could have, ever been Stone Cold in WCW. Stunning Steve Austin was never going to go above upper midcard, especially not with him losing his hair. Dustin is the only one I think MIGHT have been better off staying in WCW, but then you have to think about the fact that after WCW ended, he would have been going to WWF as plain Dustin Rhodes with the Goldust character never having been created. The odds of him still wrestling on WWE TV in 2015 without ever having been Goldust aren't good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Guitar Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 I can't see Vader fitting in on either side of the WCW/NWO war. Even though he didn't have the greatest WWF run, I don't think staying in WCW would have been very good for his career in the long haul either. He was never going to be the dominant monster heel after Hogan showed up, and after the NWO started he would have been knocked down another peg or two. I don't think Austin would have, or could have, ever been Stone Cold in WCW. Stunning Steve Austin was never going to go above upper midcard, especially not with him losing his hair. Dustin is the only one I think MIGHT have been better off staying in WCW, but then you have to think about the fact that after WCW ended, he would have been going to WWF as plain Dustin Rhodes with the Goldust character never having been created. The odds of him still wrestling on WWE TV in 2015 without ever having been Goldust aren't good. I agree that we were never going to get beer drinking, bird flipping Stone Cold Steve Austin in WCW, but if he'd hung around I don't see why we wouldn't have at least gotten a rougher, tougher version of Stunning Steve Austin in WCW. That promo he cut on Ricky Steamboat at Fall Brawl 94 is pretty much prototype Stone Cold. Plus gimmick change or not. Austin was already losing his hair it was only a matter of when he would take the plunge and cut it all off. Personally I think that even if Bischoff hadn't of fired him, Austin would have gone to the WWF in 1996 when his contract expired. He'd pretty much hit his ceiling in a Hogan run WCW and after 5 years with the company may have felt it was time for a change. If he had stayed the only real role I can see him in (based on what actually happened during that era) is in DDP's spot, as the long time WCW guy who steps up to fight the NWO. That,s also pretty much the same role I think Dustin would have been in if he'd stayed too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.S. Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Dustin is the only one I think MIGHT have been better off staying in WCW, but then you have to think about the fact that after WCW ended, he would have been going to WWF as plain Dustin Rhodes with the Goldust character never having been created. The odds of him still wrestling on WWE TV in 2015 without ever having been Goldust aren't good. Yeah, Dustin being better off in WCW is only true from an in-ring perspective. In every other way, jumping to the WWF was the right and only move to make. Goldust gave him career longevity that he never would've had otherwise. Look at Cody Rhodes as a perfect example - career midcarder under his own name and bland persona, and ineffective as a Goldust clone. Cody's trajectory is basically what Dustin Rhodes in WCW would've been - plain old Dustin and then some crappy gimmick during the nWo era. Edit - Don't get me wrong: I loved the fuck out of "plain old Dustin," but that would not have had legs in the nWo era of WCW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawkeye12 Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 I can't see Vader fitting in on either side of the WCW/NWO war. Even though he didn't have the greatest WWF run, I don't think staying in WCW would have been very good for his career in the long haul either. He was never going to be the dominant monster heel after Hogan showed up, and after the NWO started he would have been knocked down another peg or two. I don't think Austin would have, or could have, ever been Stone Cold in WCW. Stunning Steve Austin was never going to go above upper midcard, especially not with him losing his hair. Dustin is the only one I think MIGHT have been better off staying in WCW, but then you have to think about the fact that after WCW ended, he would have been going to WWF as plain Dustin Rhodes with the Goldust character never having been created. The odds of him still wrestling on WWE TV in 2015 without ever having been Goldust aren't good. I agree that we were never going to get beer drinking, bird flipping Stone Cold Steve Austin in WCW, but if he'd hung around I don't see why we wouldn't have at least gotten a rougher, tougher version of Stunning Steve Austin in WCW. That promo he cut on Ricky Steamboat at Fall Brawl 94 is pretty much prototype Stone Cold. Plus gimmick change or not. Austin was already losing his hair it was only a matter of when he would take the plunge and cut it all off. Personally I think that even if Bischoff hadn't of fired him, Austin would have gone to the WWF in 1996 when his contract expired. He'd pretty much hit his ceiling in a Hogan run WCW and after 5 years with the company may have felt it was time for a change. If he had stayed the only real role I can see him in (based on what actually happened during that era) is in DDP's spot, as the long time WCW guy who steps up to fight the NWO. That,s also pretty much the same role I think Dustin would have been in if he'd stayed too. I think Austin was more likely to join the NWO, not fight against it. He was already billed from Hollywood and done the Blondes gimmick, so putting him alongside Hogan (which was the goofy gimmick he proposed apparently when Hogan first arrived) makes more sense. I could see him in the Bagwell role as the longtime WCW guy that jumped sides as opposed to the DDP role. There was really no babyface quality to Austin ever in WCW. It's kind of odd looking back that despite five different bookers in five years or so, not one guy ever turned him babyface or even hinted at it. Then again WWF didn't view him as a babyface either for quite some time, they didn't even think he was worth having speak for himself lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthedoctor Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 If Austin had stayed with WCW who on earth would they have paired against Rock in WWF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 To a large extent you can actually quote Rocky on that. It doesn't matter. Mania 17 doesn't do quite as many buys, but both of them are blowing up without the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthedoctor Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 To a large extent you can actually quote Rocky on that. It doesn't matter. Mania 17 doesn't do quite as many buys, but both of them are blowing up without the other. From a personal choice I preferred their mania 15 match because it was a clear cut winner. Mania 17 just seemed chair shots to win the match, I know they were heading for a Heel Austin but I dont think that run went over as much as they wanted. Many a times I could hear people chanting Austin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cm funk Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Even as a teen I thought the way Dustin was fired was ridiculous. You book this and fire one of the wrestlers because there was blood in the match?!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthedoctor Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Even as a teen I thought the way Dustin was fired was ridiculous. You book this and fire one of the wrestlers because there was blood in the match?!! Yeah thats odd. So what if there is blood you still booked the match. Sorry but I wouldnt buy into a cage match with no blood. Its why I hate WWE's style of cage matches today because no one gets busted open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
van_Fair Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 I recently watched that match and the whole show. (Verdict: absolutely horrible) I actually paid attention to the blood because I knew the guys got fired for it, but it is barely noticeable. The whole thing is so shakey and filmed from far away that if you didn't knew they bled you would have missed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyonthewall2983 Posted February 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Them getting fired for bleeding has always seemed so strange to me, since that was far from the first match in WCW where someone bled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.S. Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 I recently watched that match and the whole show. (Verdict: absolutely horrible) I actually paid attention to the blood because I knew the guys got fired for it, but it is barely noticeable. The whole thing is so shakey and filmed from far away that if you didn't knew they bled you would have missed it. Them getting fired for bleeding has always seemed so strange to me, since that was far from the first match in WCW where someone bled. Here's what's really bizarre... The match was not live. It was pre-taped. Any blood - what little there was - could've been edited out before Uncensored aired. What a bullshit firing by a bunch of incompetent yokels. Typical WCW for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebottom Posted February 3, 2015 Report Share Posted February 3, 2015 I think Sabu has claimed that he was on a per-appearance arrangement and not a contract in 1995 People put forth the "Sabu should be a millionaire" thing all the time and I'm not doubting his influence to 90's wrestling and everything that spawned off that, but the fact is that the man had terrible business sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthedoctor Posted February 3, 2015 Report Share Posted February 3, 2015 Yeah seems odd why they got fired just by blading. Could you imagine WWF doing that in terms of Vince going mental when Flair bladed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeCampbell Posted February 4, 2015 Report Share Posted February 4, 2015 I think Dustin could have made it into top guy territory if he stuck around. He was than good enough in the ring to carry his end of the matches. He'd have been a natural (pun intended) standing alongside other WCW stalwarts like Sting against the nWo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Sorrow Posted February 4, 2015 Report Share Posted February 4, 2015 The idea that Dustin would have been better off NOT becoming Goldust is what insane people think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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