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Hulk Hogan vs. Gawker Lawsuit


goodhelmet

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This is a good breakdown of the issue from the New Yorker: http://www.newyorker.com/culture/cultural-comment/the-stakes-in-hulk-hogans-gawker-lawsuit

 

As someone who is a reporter but doesn't have much sympathy for either party involved, I'm torn on this one. I do think celebrities try to have it both ways--capitalizing on gossip and then screaming privacy when it suits them.

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Yeah this is like trying to justify Plessy v. Ferguson. Just because an asshole judge made a ruling don't make it right.

 

That is a way, way over the top comparison.

 

And the protection of the First Amendment is a very important thing. Any limits on speech, especially for a news organization, should be very narrowly crafted. You never know when something that is similar might produce very important news that it's imperative for us to hear (imagine, for example, that Hogan was a politician caught using the n-word on camera in a sex tape - you'd want to know that).

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Yeah this is like trying to justify Plessy v. Ferguson. Just because an asshole judge made a ruling don't make it right.

 

That is a way, way over the top comparison.

 

And the protection of the First Amendment is a very important thing. Any limits on speech, especially for a news organization, should be very narrowly crafted. You never know when something that is similar might produce very important news that it's imperative for us to hear (imagine, for example, that Hogan was a politician caught using the n-word on camera in a sex tape - you'd want to know that).

 

There is ways to report and show some being a racist without releasing a whole sex tape. That's a horrible argument.

 

Freedom of speech is great, but freedom of privacy is another thing that is also very important. Just because it's newsworthy that a celebrity had sex, does not mean that a news company can just released a sex tape. That's crazy.

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Yeah this is like trying to justify Plessy v. Ferguson. Just because an asshole judge made a ruling don't make it right.

 

That is a way, way over the top comparison.

 

And the protection of the First Amendment is a very important thing. Any limits on speech, especially for a news organization, should be very narrowly crafted. You never know when something that is similar might produce very important news that it's imperative for us to hear (imagine, for example, that Hogan was a politician caught using the n-word on camera in a sex tape - you'd want to know that).

 

There is ways to report and show some being a racist without releasing a whole sex tape. That's a horrible argument.

 

Freedom of speech is great, but freedom of privacy is another thing that is also very important. Just because it's newsworthy that a celebrity had sex, does not mean that a news company can just released a sex tape. That's crazy.

 

 

First, they released pieces of a sex tape, not the whole thing. The appellate court opinion quote above distinguishes the two specifically.

 

And you absolutely might need to show a piece of a sex tape to convey something newsworthy. Simply reporting "we saw this" is going to get called bullshit in a "pics / video or it didn't happen" culture. The Hogan case is fairly frivolous, and I think you could theoretically try to draw a line between this sex tape and ones that are more "important" - but that's always a hard line to draw, and I don't like courts getting to decide what is newsworthy.

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imagine, for example, that Hogan was a politician caught using the n-word on camera in a sex tape - you'd want to know that

Sure, if he was a politician. But he's not. Public officials and people in positions of great power are the only group of people whose private lives and opinions should be fair game for scrutiny like this, because of the power they wield over everyday citizens. Not just some wrestler/actor/reality TV star/aging has-been. The public has zero right to know anything about his personal life that he doesn't specifically choose to disclose.
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imagine, for example, that Hogan was a politician caught using the n-word on camera in a sex tape - you'd want to know that

Sure, if he was a politician. But he's not. Public officials and people in positions of great power are the only group of people whose private lives and opinions should be fair game for scrutiny like this, because of the power they wield over everyday citizens. Not just some wrestler/actor/reality TV star/aging has-been. The public has zero right to know anything about his personal life that he doesn't specifically choose to disclose.

 

 

Did people have a right to know he used steroids? That's his "private life." But him being a steroid abuser was absolutely news, and important news given his stance on "training, saying your prayers, and eating your vitamins."

 

If we had footage of Bill Cosby committing one of his crimes... that would be news too. Same idea.

 

I get it, in this case they are publicizing something with somewhat minimal news value. But draw me a line. If he's profiting off an image that's bullshit, people have a right to know about that.

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Did people have a right to know he used steroids? That's his "private life." But him being a steroid abuser was absolutely news, and important news given his stance on "training, saying your prayers, and eating your vitamins."

No, I never did think that the steroid controversy was a newsworthy issue for public consumption. They're private citizens, it's not a real sport, it's nobody's business.

 

 

 

If we had footage of Bill Cosby committing one of his crimes... that would be news too. Same idea.

No, different idea, because the Cosby deal is about accusations of criminal activity in which he attacked other people. It affects much more than just Bill himself.

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I am not sure what America's laws are regarding hate speech, so this might be wrong, but I do not see any similarity between what happened with Bill Cosby and Hogan. Bill Cosby raped multiple women. He committed a crime on those women. This is more like if Cosby had been recorded in a very intimate moment ranting about how all Indians are cow-worshipping dotheads, or whatever slur some of you use against us, and then had that tape released without his consent.

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I also have no idea how the Bill Cosby stuff even entered into this conversation. Bill Cosby is accused of multiple criminal acts. If he had been recorded during any of that, it would be evidence in a criminal case. Hulk Hogan didn't do anything illegal, there is absolutely no basis of comparison.

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I also have no idea how the Bill Cosby stuff even entered into this conversation. Bill Cosby is accused of multiple criminal acts. If he had been recorded during any of that, it would be evidence in a criminal case. Hulk Hogan didn't do anything illegal, there is absolutely no basis of comparison.

 

Because Jingus argued that what happens in the bedroom of celebrities is irrelevant, full stop. Sometimes it is. And frankly, it doesn't even need to rise to the level of Cosby's crimes (admittedly a weak analogy, but someone tried to compare this case to Plessy v. Ferguson earlier in the thread) to be absolutely newsworthy and of value to report on and show, based on the situation. The point is that restrictive laws on speech potentially edge out very valuable speech. It's why we protect even somewhat frivolous speech, to avoid chilling valuable speech in the future.

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Because Jingus argued that what happens in the bedroom of celebrities is irrelevant, full stop.

I seriously have to add the disclaimer "unless it's an act of felonious sexual assault"? Come on. That's obviously not even the same category of thing that we're talking about. Criminal activity is newsworthy; private events between consenting adults who have every right and assumption of privacy are not newsworthy.

 

And never in the history of the fucking planet has the leak of any celebrity sex tape ever been "valuable speech".

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I also have no idea how the Bill Cosby stuff even entered into this conversation. Bill Cosby is accused of multiple criminal acts. If he had been recorded during any of that, it would be evidence in a criminal case. Hulk Hogan didn't do anything illegal, there is absolutely no basis of comparison.

Because Jingus argued that what happens in the bedroom of celebrities is irrelevant, full stop. Sometimes it is. And frankly, it doesn't even need to rise to the level of Cosby's crimes (admittedly a weak analogy, but someone tried to compare this case to Plessy v. Ferguson earlier in the thread) to be absolutely newsworthy and of value to report on and show, based on the situation. The point is that restrictive laws on speech potentially edge out very valuable speech. It's why we protect even somewhat frivolous speech, to avoid chilling valuable speech in the future.

The Plessy reference wasn't trying to equate a celebrity sex tape with segregation. The point was that you can't use a court decision as moral justification. Courts, including the Supreme Court, get it wrong.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Just wanted to mention that I'm 100% pro-Hogan in this whole thing and have been since the story broke.

Ditto. He has a right to privacy, didn't know he was being recorded, and shouldn't have something like that surface online, unless it has his permission and the other party's permission as well. Which it clearly didn't. So I'm glad he won, and hope he wins the appeal too.

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  • 1 month later...

It's obviously hard to feel much sympathy for Gawker. But the ultrawealthy secretly funding lawsuits they have no personal stake in for the purpose of bringing down outlets they don't like is a cause for concern. If you sue someone openly, you at least have to worry about sustaining reputational damage and inconvenient/embarrassing facts coming out in discovery.

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So according to what I've read online today, the judge in this case issued her "final judgment" which upheld her original finding. Gawker's reaction was to file for Bankruptcy, but I'm not sure if this was done to protect their assets from Hogan ever seeing any of their actual money? American Bankruptcy law seems to differ from Canadian, so I'm not sure if I understand how this all works now. From what I read, it looks like Gawker can just declare bankruptcy, sell to a new owner, and don't have to pay Hogan anything?

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