Comments that don't warrant a thread

[rovert]

Is that why Dave wanted Gary Cappetta's contact info on Monday?

Putting 2+2 to make 5 here. Do think Flair is driving this change?

[kjh]

Apparently 4,783 words is not enough for Warrior to bury Ted DiBiase, he's coming back later for Part II!

[jdw]

Typical TNA stuff: throw money at Cappetta when you could get any local indy ring announcer for chump change because he'd like to hang out with the boyz.

 

John

[KrisZ]

Nulty lives in Florida.

[Loss]

Gary Cappetta was really, really awesome, but yeah, I'm not sure this means much.

[sek69]

I always felt that Capetta's voice was way too annoying and nasally, especially when he had to do those drawn-out WCW intros (THIIIIS IIIIIIS STIIIIIIIIIING!).

[Dan]

He wrote a pretty good book on WWWF and WCW. So I favor Cappetta getting a TNA gig, just so we can read about all the messed-up behind the scenes stuff. (Which I imagine would make his previous experiences seem normal by comparison.)

[rovert]

I always felt that Capetta's voice was way too annoying and nasally, especially when he had to do those drawn-out WCW intros (THIIIIS IIIIIIS STIIIIIIIIIING!).

Either that or droney, indecipherable Penzer

[Loss]

I know this has been mentioned about him before, but Gary Cappetta's intros of War Games matches was always incredible.

 

I think his nasal voice can partially be attributed to WCW production, which made Jim Ross sound a little chipmunky at one point too. They seemed to fix those things after a few problems early on, because by '92, both Ross and Cappetta sound great.

[kjh]

Typical TNA stuff: throw money at Cappetta when you could get any local indy ring announcer for chump change because he'd like to hang out with the boyz.

 

John

But poor Gary Michael Cappetta may not be making enough money from a normal job in these tough economic times!

[El-P]

What is Joel Gertner doing these days ?

[Boondocks Kernoodle]

Gary Cappetta was really, really awesome, but yeah, I'm not sure this means much.

Of course it doesn't, I just want to hear him say "TAG. TEAM. ACTION" one more time.

[S.L.L.]

Am I the only person to find the Daniel Bryan attacks Michael Cole angle to be pretty lame? For a disgruntled midget feuding with the lead announcer, Tazz was so much better in the role. And well, we all know what happened to Tazz afterwards.

You might be the only person. I was at the show last night, and it got a tremendous reaction from the crowd. Of course, a lot of the audience has changed and probably wouldn't remember the Tazz angle that was like 10 years ago.

 

Yeah, I think that thought needs to be expanded upon. I can see where one would find flaw with this...I don't think comparing Danielson to Tazz really illustrates anything by itself. Danielson's actual "attack" part of the attack didn't look great, but I think Cole deserves some blame for his selling. I don't think Tazz ever actually got to attack JR before Lawler stepped in. Also, the Tazz heel turn and attack on JR was really out of nowhere, and seemed to just be them trying to shock the audience into caring by having Tazz make fun of Ross' Bell's palsy. This angle was actually backed up by something and seemed to successfully advance a character. I mean, you could complain that the promo was too inside and shooty. But it actually wasn't even that bad in that regard. Basis of the promo was WWE's hiring practices, which is something a character could complain about without this NOT BEING PART OF THE SCRIPT~!, and Cole being a poor replacement for Jim Ross is a sentiment a lot of fans could get behind. And it's not like Danielson is a guy who doesn't have a proven track record of quality working an anti-corporate gimmick.

[Herodes]

You have to put it into perspective, and think does your average WWE fan - the 10 year old kid wearing the Cena shirt in the mall - have any clue who this geek is, what his background is, what he is talking about and why he is attacking Michael Cole? It's shit like this since the mid 90s - whether it be Shane Douglas, Pillman, Russo etc - that meant wrestling deviated from its incredibly fundamental and simple premise, and made it worse. Wrestling fails when it attempts to be post-modern, it's charm and appeal is in it's universal, basic morality and exaggerated characters. Imagine some early 90s jobber suddenly SHOOTING and claiming he is actually the best in the world (despite the vast majority of the audience knowing nothing about him other than he is small, plain-looking and loses a lot) and then attacking Sean Mooney.

 

I've got nephews aged 10/11 and they watch WWE and love Cena, Rey, Taker etc, they buy the shirts and figures and all that shit, and my view is that if anything in the programme goes above their heads then it's a fundamental failure, because that's their real audience and the rest of us are guys who haven't grown out of watching a children's show. Wrestling is as low-brow and simplistic as it gets, and shouldn't aim to be anything other than that. Kids and rednecks don't want to watch some nonsensical shooting when they sit down and watch their wrestling, nor should they.

[Guest Talon]

Typical TNA stuff: throw money at Cappetta when you could get any local indy ring announcer for chump change because he'd like to hang out with the boyz.

 

John

But poor Gary Michael Cappetta may not be making enough money from a normal job in these tough economic times!

 

I think he's a headmaster at a private school or something. at least he was back in 2002-2003. So I imagine he's not doing too bad for himself.

 

Also about Gary, when his book was out I got to spend about an hour with him at a book signing (the bookstore botched the promotion and I was pretty much the only one to show up) and actually he sounds in person nothing like he does an an announcer, and it was a very good conversation we had too.

[Sean Liska]

The weird thing is WWE rarely ever does insider stuff. This was super-insider, with the talk about Vince McMahon on headsets, Vince only pushing big guys, Vince not liking guys that aren't WWE-created, etc. How about heels CM Punk and William Regal smiling and nodding when Miz asked if Danielson was better than him? The whole show is so strange.

[El-P]

It's shit like this since the mid 90s - whether it be Shane Douglas, Pillman, Russo etc - that meant wrestling deviated from its incredibly fundamental and simple premise, and made it worse. Wrestling fails when it attempts to be post-modern, it's charm and appeal is in it's universal, basic morality and exaggerated characters.

Shane Douglas never did any of this. It was part of his character in ECW to vent his own personnal frustration on Flair and Michaels, and that appealed to the us vs them mentality of the ECW crowd. They ate it up, and it made Douglas look legitimate as the guy who would rather be there in ECW rather than deal with politics that would keep him down elsewhere. It didn't prevent him from getting nuclear heel heat. There was really nothing "shooty" about Douglas character.

The Sully vs Pillman angle was stupid because it led nowhere, but I guess it could have if Pillman had stayed in WCW. I guess he could have a big feud with Sully, but it was a failure in essence and execution The "Loose Cannon" character was pretty hit and miss to me.

And Russo's stuff is stupid because it's basically "everything is fake but THIS is real" shit.

[S.L.L.]

You have to put it into perspective, and think does your average WWE fan - the 10 year old kid wearing the Cena shirt in the mall - have any clue who this geek is, what his background is, what he is talking about and why he is attacking Michael Cole? It's shit like this since the mid 90s - whether it be Shane Douglas, Pillman, Russo etc - that meant wrestling deviated from its incredibly fundamental and simple premise, and made it worse. Wrestling fails when it attempts to be post-modern, it's charm and appeal is in it's universal, basic morality and exaggerated characters. Imagine some early 90s jobber suddenly SHOOTING and claiming he is actually the best in the world (despite the vast majority of the audience knowing nothing about him other than he is small, plain-looking and loses a lot) and then attacking Sean Mooney.

 

I've got nephews aged 10/11 and they watch WWE and love Cena, Rey, Taker etc, they buy the shirts and figures and all that shit, and my view is that if anything in the programme goes above their heads then it's a fundamental failure, because that's their real audience and the rest of us are guys who haven't grown out of watching a children's show. Wrestling is as low-brow and simplistic as it gets, and shouldn't aim to be anything other than that. Kids and rednecks don't want to watch some nonsensical shooting when they sit down and watch their wrestling, nor should they.

On principle, I agree with everything you just said. And there were definitely better ways to get Danielson over than what they've done with him.

 

That said, let's consider a couple of things:

 

1. We know who this geek is and why he's attacking Michael Cole. His character and motivation has been established for weeks now.

2. Despite an obvious surface shootiness, I think it actually wasn't nearly as shooty as I feared it would be when I first read about it. Promo was about WWE's hiring practices. In-universe, the WWE must have some kind of hiring practices, so one can talk about them in promos without it being a Russo-style shoot. Oh sure, it could easily lend itself to that, but consider Danielson's specific grievances: they prefer to hire big guys, and they don't like to hire guys they didn't create. Those are things that can be true in-universe. You don't have to shoot to complain about that in the interview. And again, this is all about hiring practices. Danielson didn't complain about being "held back" because of his size and "self-made man" status like Douglas would have in that situation. He complained about not getting a job in the first place because of those things. The one part other than the weakness of the brawl that I took umbrage with was the line about Vince telling Cole what to say over the headset. Inside joke issues aside, Cole is a face in everything except this one. Painting Cole as a heel toady to McMahon doesn't make a lot of sense. Still, Vince as guy who orders his staff around so that they send the message he wants them to send is hardly out of character for him. He wasn't accusing him of booking guys poorly or anything fourth wall-breaking, he was accusing him of being a guy who spreads propaganda. That's totally in-line with the Mr. McMahon character. You don't have to shoot to say that, although it was inadvisable for other reasons. But nothing he said was necessarily a shoot, strictly speaking. It's stuff they haven't brought up on camera before, but hey, there was a time when Vince McMahon running the company wasn't brought up on TV. You can incorporate these things into angles without resorting to Vince Russo "THIS ISN'T PART OF THE SCRIPT" silliness. Nothing said in that promo didn't make sense on an in-universe level, it's just that they discussed things that had never really been discussed in-universe before.

3. This promo was all about basic morality and exaggerated characters. Bryan Danielson is a gifted young wrestler who wants to make his living on the grandest stage of them all. When he finally gets his chance, he is deliberately undercut at every turn by the egomaniacal "Pro" who was supposed to be helping him, and he's ultimately eliminated not by the vote of the Pros (who had earlier ranked him as the best of the NXT rookies despite his never winning a match), but by management who dismiss him because he's small and because he's not a homegrown talent. In other words, he's your classic working class hero, a tiny, pale, vegan Dusty Rhodes or Steve Austin. Yeah, that's a pretty loaded comparison, but that is clearly what they're aiming for with him. Working class hero denied a job by corrupt management after being hamstrung by an arrogant heel taking out his frustrations on a stuffed shirt who served as corrupt management's public face is a totally valid wrestling angle.

4. If the crowd's reaction is any indication, this didn't go over their heads. It didn't blow the roof off of the place, but pretty clear they were into it.

[BruiserBrody]

Typical TNA stuff: throw money at Cappetta when you could get any local indy ring announcer for chump change because he'd like to hang out with the boyz.

 

John

But poor Gary Michael Cappetta may not be making enough money from a normal job in these tough economic times!

 

I think he's a headmaster at a private school or something. at least he was back in 2002-2003. So I imagine he's not doing too bad for himself.

 

Also about Gary, when his book was out I got to spend about an hour with him at a book signing (the bookstore botched the promotion and I was pretty much the only one to show up) and actually he sounds in person nothing like he does an an announcer, and it was a very good conversation we had too.

 

GMC was at a local Green Bay area fair here in 01 or 02 trying to sell his book. He was too busy trying to convince me to buy his WCW posters, Pictures and his book to talk about anything deep wrestling wise. I do recall him saying he was impressed by people's allure to Andre, even many years after his death

[Guest Talon]

Typical TNA stuff: throw money at Cappetta when you could get any local indy ring announcer for chump change because he'd like to hang out with the boyz.

 

John

But poor Gary Michael Cappetta may not be making enough money from a normal job in these tough economic times!

 

I think he's a headmaster at a private school or something. at least he was back in 2002-2003. So I imagine he's not doing too bad for himself.

 

Also about Gary, when his book was out I got to spend about an hour with him at a book signing (the bookstore botched the promotion and I was pretty much the only one to show up) and actually he sounds in person nothing like he does an an announcer, and it was a very good conversation we had too.

 

GMC was at a local Green Bay area fair here in 01 or 02 trying to sell his book. He was too busy trying to convince me to buy his WCW posters, Pictures and his book to talk about anything deep wrestling wise. I do recall him saying he was impressed by people's allure to Andre, even many years after his death

 

Well I think he mainly stuck around and talked because he had nothing to shill and was getting paid to be there so he might as well stay because somebody wanted to talk about the game but he seemed like a nice enough guy, but he was kind of pissed at Borders because he had sent them all kinds of promotional material to promote the signing and they failed to use any of it, deciding just to use a single 8x10 printout they made and stuck to the front door

 

and yes he did give me a ton of free autographed 8x10's because of the fact I actually scouted out the appearance and showed up.

[kjh]

I don't think comparing Danielson to Tazz really illustrates anything by itself.

I think it serves as a useful reminder for hardcore fans not to get their hopes too high up about Danielson's future within the company.

 

Danielson's actual "attack" part of the attack didn't look great, but I think Cole deserves some blame for his selling.

I'd blame the scripting myself. I don't think Cole was scripted to properly sell the attack.

 

Also, the Tazz heel turn and attack on JR was really out of nowhere, and seemed to just be them trying to shock the audience into caring by having Tazz make fun of Ross' Bell's palsy.

Mild mannered Daniel Bryan being fired and freaking out was pretty out of left field too and was WWE Creative's attempt to shock the audience into caring about Bryan after they killed his heat with a botched modern day 1-2-3 Kid losing streak gimmick. Wasn't the original plan for Bryan was to be the Rookie who actually won the competition?

 

Basis of the promo was WWE's hiring practices, which is something a character could complain about without this NOT BEING PART OF THE SCRIPT~!, and Cole being a poor replacement for Jim Ross is a sentiment a lot of fans could get behind.

Suggesting that Cole is a poor replacement for Jim Ross is dumb if Ross isn't coming back.

[kjh]

Typical TNA stuff: throw money at Cappetta when you could get any local indy ring announcer for chump change because he'd like to hang out with the boyz.

 

John

But poor Gary Michael Cappetta may not be making enough money from a normal job in these tough economic times!

I think he's a headmaster at a private school or something. at least he was back in 2002-2003. So I imagine he's not doing too bad for himself.

I was being sarcastic with the knowledge that Cappetta was a teacher and probably doing OK for himself - making fun of Dixie Carter for possibly bringing Cappetta in at a time when she needs to make financial cutbacks. Dixie Carter is far too nice to ever be a succesful wrestling promoter.

[S.L.L.]

I think it serves as a useful reminder for hardcore fans not to get their hopes too high up about Danielson's future within the company.

Suggesting that Cole is a poor replacement for Jim Ross is dumb if Ross isn't coming back.

These are good points.

 

Also, the Tazz heel turn and attack on JR was really out of nowhere, and seemed to just be them trying to shock the audience into caring by having Tazz make fun of Ross' Bell's palsy.

Mild mannered Daniel Bryan being fired and freaking out was pretty out of left field too and was WWE Creative's attempt to shock the audience into caring about Bryan after they killed his heat with a botched modern day 1-2-3 Kid losing streak gimmick. Wasn't the original plan for Bryan was to be the Rookie who actually won the competition?

I don't know. Either way, this really wasn't that far out, nor is it a particularly big shock as far as shock moves go. This one was at least organic - he had the obvious motivation for his actions, he had reason to be frustrated, and you saw him progress from "mild-mannered" to "freaking out" over the course of the interview. I doubt this is what they were meaning to build to, but it is something that was built to, even just within the segment itself, as Danielson starts out calm, and his anger boils over. You can't say that for Tazz, who turned heel and gave JR a hard time basically for the hell of it.

[KrisZ]

Something about the Taz/JR angle that gets forgotten is that JR came up with it as an homage to Gordon Solie who had just died and his angle with Muraco with Lawler playing Roddy Piper.

[KrisZ]

Silvervision, the WWE's European DVD Distributor announced the complete matches and details for the forthcoming WWE Ricky Steamboat DVD: The Life Story of the Dragon, which you can pre-order by clicking here:.

 

DISC ONE:

 

Documentary Chapters:

Growing Up

Training

Traveling

Mid-Atlantic

The Dragon

WrestleMania III

World Champion

Fire Breathing Dragon

Mentoring

Hall of Fame

Legacy

 

Special Features:

Ricky’s First Car

 

Mike Graham Remembers Richard Blood

 

Ricky Forgets His Name

 

Having a Positive Attitude

World Wide Wrestling – February 16, 1982

 

Tuesday Night Titans – April 5, 1985

 

Steve Lombardi Remembers Ricky’s First Match in the WWE

 

The Body Shop

All-Star Wrestling – June 22, 1985

 

Becoming the Dragon… The Three Moments of Truth

 

Chris Jericho Meets Ricky Steamboat For The First Time

 

Tuesday Night Titans – September 10, 1986

 

Update with Gene Okerlund

Superstars – January 31, 1987

 

Dragon in the Oven

Superstars – April 11, 1987

 

Return from Japan

World Championship Wrestling – March 18, 1989

 

William Regal Remembers Watching Ricky Steamboat & Ric Flair

 

World Television Champion

WCW Saturday Night – September 19, 1992

 

Ricky Steamboat’s Induction into the WWE Hall of Fame – April 4, 2009

 

DISC TWO:

 

NWA World Tag Team Championship Match

Jack & Gerry Brisco vs. Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat & Jay Youngblood

Starrcade November 24, 1983

 

NWA World Heavyweight Championship Match

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs “Nature Boy” Ric Flair

Boogie Jam March 17, 1984

(Commentary by: Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat & Matt Striker)

 

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. Cowboy Bob Orton

Capital Centre July 20, 1985

 

Lumberjack Match

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. The Magnificent Don Muraco

Maple Leaf Gardens September 22, 1985

 

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. Jake “The Snake” Roberts

Boston Garden August 9, 1986

 

Intercontinental Championship Match

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. Randy “Macho Man” Savage

WrestleMania III March 29, 1987

(Alternate Commentary by: Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat & Matt Striker)

 

DISC THREE:

 

2 out of 3 Falls Match for the NWA World Heavyweight Championship

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. “Nature Boy” Ric Flair

Clash of the Champions VI April 2, 1989

 

United States Championship Match

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. Lex Luger

The Great American Bash July 23, 1989

 

WCW World Tag Team Championship Match

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat & Dustin Rhodes vs. Arn Anderson & Larry Zbyzsko

Clash of the Champions XVII November 19, 1991

 

Iron Man Challenge Match

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. Rick Rude

Beach Blast June 20, 1992

 

No Disqualification Match for the WCW World Television Championship

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. Steve Austin

Clash of the Champions XX September 2, 1992

(Alternate Commentary by: Ricky Steamboat & Matt Striker)

 

Ricky “The Dragon” Steamboat vs. Chris Jericho

Backlash April 26, 2009

 

The DVD will be released 6/29