El-P

I've got headaches already. I find the rules to be overly complicated TBH, if you got the same points, just do fucking barrage matches like in sumo ! The same. I'd love ZSJ to win the Block, but I think he's gonna get beat by Tanga Loa, which is quite a disappointing final match. As much as I enjoyed Tama's matches, I find Tanga's work to be mediocre and unengaging still. Also, I may have given O-Khan a bit too much credit, as I thought the Takagi match was clearly overlong and got redundant at the end. The reliance on gimmicky spots and especially the fucking claw (maybe the worst pro-wrestling spot this side of the heart-punch) still makes him someone I *don't* want to watch often in big singles matches. That one was one too many, despite Takagi's greatness. The next two days look rough as hell, tomorrow is the most mild B-Block day imaginable (and Cobb facing EVIL is gonna be frustrating), and last day of A-Block is a one match show, that is if KENTA shows up (and he should, against Ibushi), and only the final result really interests me. Yeah, I do feel burned out as the lack of depths as finally caught up in the last few days (best combination of matches have pretty much all been done now). Quick, get to the Budokan already !

And don't forget to watch WWE Crown Jewel on the WWE Network on October 21. This announcement has been paid for by MBS, authoritarian leader, warmonger and murderer of journalist.

Brutal. Never forget. That being said, the one positive thing about this segment is that it did not lead to a match. Because no one deserved to watch a Rick Steiner single match in 1998. That was the true horror.

Fair enough, from that point of view I can totally see it, yes. If you haven't seen the Dustin vs QT Marshall match from a few weeks ago on Dark, I really recommend it. Basically both trainers showing their students how it's done, very enjoyable match with some cool little twists.

And here's a guy that should get more and more talk as the years go by. If he keeps on going strong like he did this year and gets for instance some shit to do in Japan, he probably gonna get a good shot at the final list. Also, time to rename this thread into Miro.

Oh yes, not the greatest worker in the ring, but I was impressed with how she carried herself as a star during this show. And those promos ? Although I've been enjoying her & Kiera Hogan I had not seen this coming. Seems like she really found herself. Cool for Slamovich, looking forward to see more of her.

Dustin actually did not look that great in the match. He looked good for sure, but everything was not exactly on point either, as it's been talked about in the weekly thread. Like I said, I love Dustin, but to me the idea that he's one of the best guy in AEW is just reaching because he's an old-school favorite. He's still *very good* and there's nothing wrong about that and it's totally a credit to him. But let's not get carried away either. I love having Dustin show on on my TV and kicking ass in 2021 still. Is he a *great* worker in 2021 ? Nope, I would not say that. Is his AEW stint adding to his resume in a very positive fashion ? Yep, for sure.

Agreed. They do this big comeback show after like 3 months of non-programming and they spend an entire segment doing... a news show ??? Taking about AEW and WWE ??? WTF Court Bauer ? I'm not as high as many on Fatu (then again MLW has been consistently the worst place to look great for some reasons), but he did impress me there, and Hammerstone is much more than his look indicates too (and he can cut promos). MLW still running the stupid Contra angle and they have this awful Kane-like guy now that I guess they are gonna push. They brought back Dario Cueto but honestly it's such a waste as there's nothing even comparable to LU on the show (and I heard they brought back Catrina too, which is cool and all). IMPACT is the promotion where they could have used him SO WELL in term of working his character into the show (if they can have the Undead Realm, they can have some LU offshoot). The fact Will Ospreay is working their next tapings is cool for them, but MLW has been a sinkhole in term of producing really good stuff, Bauer's ideas are usualy just *bad* and the show is very poorly produced and paced, so yeah, that's a disappointment when he could have showed up in AEW, IMPACT or, hell, GCW ! @Jimmy Redman thanks !

His TNA stint was awful. Worst time of his career. Worst character, worst shape, totally out of it. Don't watch it, people, it's bad for you. I dunno about Japan, but I remember that dog of a match against DBS that is mentionned in @KinchStalker's awesome biography thread. The Tokyo Dome match teaming with his father vs Kim Duk & Masa Saito is not exactly setting the world on fire either, but can't blame Dustin there. Since I've been watching some 90's NJPW lately (well not since the G1 has begun), I have been thinking about an analogy that may come off super odd to many, but actually makes sense to me. Keiji Mutoh. Ok, now I love Dustin, and I have for a long, long time. And I also love Keiji Mutoh, including as the Great Muta, which I always find to be a compelling, quite fascinating character (yeah, the snail pace, the blood, the mist, the explosive Mutoh spots in between, not to mention the cool looks). Both had periods where they are just awesome workers. In the early 90's, Mutoh is just wonderful to watch (when he's on) and clearly the second best worker behind Hase (you thought I was gonna say Hashimoto ? Well think again, he really did not hit his stride before a few years later). Then he has his period where he just doesn't seem to give a fuck (period or matches actually). Well, Dustin was the same, he was awesome (but on a much steadier way) for most of the first half of the 90's, then by the time he got into Goldust mode he wasn't so awesome (although, much like with Muta, the presentation is one of my all-time favorite) and then in late WCW and TNA he wasn't good at all. Like Mutoh would just overshot his moonsault, Dustin would hit his running bulldog and yeah, cool, whatever makes contact with the mat Dust, really ! BTW I do think people cut some slack to Dustin because he's so beloved in term of some of his stuff not looking *that* great. The delayed punch where he drops on his knees is a cool looking but completely idiotic spot (yes, really) in that in 90% of the case, it looks just too damn delayed for the other guy not to see it coming. But then again, it's a cool looking spot that still gets a pop, like Mutoh's infamous elbow. And then Mutoh reinvents himself in the early 00's and all of a sudden he's the coolest wrestler in the world *again* (he was, everybody was doing Shining Wizard) and he's twisting up his style a bit and having a new bunch of big matches. And then also sometime in the early 00's, Dustin gets back in shape and reinvents himself as a part of the high end working crew of WWE, working with a younger generation and fitting just right in. After much ups and downs, Dustin at 50 has one of the best match of his career. Mutoh remains a frustrating and puzzling worker at times, yet managed to have a pretty cool main event stint in NOAH at *58* years old. I love both overall and their peaks are awesome, and their lows are abyss-deep. And they have created two of the most unique characters in pro-wrestling. I have no idea where they would fit in my list (Dustin is probably overall better, Mutoh being the biggest star had more opportunity to deliver in big, important settings and he's also super important in term of style in the grand scheme of things, Tanahashi, Naito & SANADA are pretty much direct offsprings) So there, that was a complete disorganized rant...

The one thing I was wondering about during the entirety of Mox vs Gage was if Renee was tweeting during this ? It's pretty unthinkable that having a big money contract from a mainstream promotion, the guy would actually want to do this kind of stuff. Which is what makes Mox so unique. Having Foley announce was the perfect fit ("Fuck Matt Cardona" was classic Foley), as in another time, he actually worked FMW shows, including doing a brutal deathmatch against Kanemura, while under contract with WWF. Something that is unimaginable today. So, ok, I do get the cult of Gage, I get the whole "Dusty Rhodes of light bulbs" persona and indeed he's from the direct line of the Sandman's and the New Jacks, but still, his stuff looks rotten more often than not whenever he has to do something physical that isn't just cutting someone. I guess him taking the most horrific bumps is part of the "charm". But I wonder what Minoru Suzuki will be able to do with him though... Speaking of which, Suzuki vs Janela was yet another proof of how much Suzuki gets pro-wrestling as a whole (meaning, he knew exactly how to play to this particular crowd at points when they just don't react like your typical NJPW audience). That "one slap too many" spot was awesome. Also "I don't speak English, sorry. FUCK YOU YOUNG BOY !" to Chris Dickinson was funny AF.

WTF ? HOLY SHIT ! 2021, never stop being awesome please !

That's quite interesting and seems it would be a fair use indeed !

Chase Owens is actually having a terrific G1. Also, the fact Okada made me actually legit buy a nearfall as a possible finish, and that despite the fact there was no way in hell Owens would have another galactic upset (but the *idea* that he could was probably helped by the fact he actually had one, as crazy as it seems, so that's some brillant booking trickery here), says everything about the genius of Okada putting together those ending stretches. It's easy to get caught in our little bubble of micro-analysis while forgetting the big picture, it's the G1 so everybody is supposed to step up (both storyline-wise and in reality), plus there are less matches because of the restrictions, but you still have to deliver to the fans enough content so they don't feel cheated. YOSHI-HASHI has also stepped up, but I admit I fast-forwarded a bit for his match against SANADA, since it's as close as Lance Storm vs Tim Horner in term of Charisma Deathmatch goes and the fact they are both make-koshi already. Really, that Sendai night was all about Cobb vs Tanahashi and did it deliver just that great match it was supposed to. Plot thickens and gotta hand it to Gedo, who still can book a cool G1 even with the restricted roster (although really, some new blood would have been welcome). Of course you gotta deal with EVIL matches being an important part of the equation and that is annoying (Kevin Kelly sounding super annoyed actually helps because you can almost feel some empathy for the poor viewers in a meta yet discreet way).

They knocked it out of the park with that show. Awesome Kong being announced for the HoF, and of course being the woman she is, she makes it about Daffney rather than herself. Some good matches in the tournament, which in the end, is won by Mercedes Martinez ! Great job by WWE to let her go after doing nothing with her, so now we can have either Mercedes vs Deonna or Mercedes vs Mickie James, of both ( I mean, gotta make a spot for Eva Marie I guess, can't have them all) ! I was expecting Chelsea Green to go into the finals, but I guess maybe they want to keep that match for later. Deonna Purrazzo had yet another terrific performance, and damn I want more of Masha Slamovich ! I saw her at Empowerrr too but really she was a revelation here. She rules ! And I love the look which is totally reminiscent of Ruth Wilder as Zoya the Destroya in G.L.O.W ! Hopefully they bring her back. And Deonna is and remains one of my favorite pro-wrestler in the world. It was kinda bittersweet that after last year when @Superstar Sleeze invited me to do the top 25 TNA matches ever, I actually brought up the infamous Monster's Ball match with Daffney and Taylor Wilde (I had it at 23 I believe), and now it gets some talk but due to those tragic circumstances. I had loved to see Taylor Wilde come back to wrestling last year, and she paid a really nice tribute to Daffney talking about this match. And speaking of which, nice of Kimber Lee to bring a crowbar in the ring and just play it like she was in IWA Japan in a countryside town show or something, bumping into barb wire, getting smashed with wired kendo stick, bumping into tacks. Alisha is funny because she's all cute and petite but you know she wants to roll into those tacks and show her husband she's hardcore too. Cool match. And damn the Influence are such a fun act, with of course Madison Rayne being her hilarious self. I was half-expecting the IIconics to show up at the end of the show, but we got the vignette instead so yeah. They'll be right at home in IMPACT, and since they won't have WWE's bad comedy written for them, they'll probably be much better at what they do, happy to see them pop up there (the interactions with the Influence *have to* happen. Please). Main event was quite the good and fun affair, being a babyface suits Havok so much more too. They sure have given a serious push to Decay as tag champs, which is nice, all the titles feel important. Cool clip about mental health awareness too, with tons of people from many places, I did not even recognize everyone. Oh yeah, and Melissa Santos is STILL the best ring announcer in the world.

Gail Kim Because she spent most of her career in TNA, she's one of the most overlooked great worker of the last 20 years. In 2007 TNA made her their first woman champion, and she had a bunch of great matches against Awesome Kong, which were basically the first time women's pro-wrestling was taken and treated seriously in the US in decades. That was the real women's revolution, if you will. Gail Kim is great at everything she does. She's an *incredible* bumper, a quality that is less talked about now that most pro-wrestler do much more big athletic stuff, but Gail still is striking in how she would bump in really brutal and explosive ways (without looking like she would kill herself like Sasha Banks). She can take a beating like no one else and at the same time showcase that attitude of always fighting back. Great seller. But she's also a great bitchy heel with tons of details in her game in term of character work, hell, she's probably a better heel actually even though her most famous matches were as a babyface. She can make a spectacle of a match if necessary against a super green worker, as showed by the Taryn Terell match at Slammiversary, and basically always made everyone around her look better than they were. I'm not done with exploring her second TNA stint yet (in which the context was much less favorable as the first one, at least for a while), but to me she was clearly a great worker whom, transferred into current WWE or AEW, is right up there with the best women. Her last match at 41 years old in 2018 against Tessa Blanchard showed that she was still excellent by this point. Gail Kim vs Awesome Kong (12/02/07 - TNA) Gail Kim vs Awesome Kong (01/06/08 - TNA) Gail Kim vs Taryn Terrell (06/02/13- TNA) Gail Kim vs Tessa Blanchard (04/28/2019 - IMPACT)

I think it was just wrong. Because I don't think any great workers having a great match do it ignoring they are having it. It's been said that Steamboat & Savage at WMIII absolutely wanted to have that great match that was gonna steal the show. And the more things evolve, of course there is more and more recorded great pro-wrestling matches that workers are aware of, and maybe want to inspire themselves from or simply try to outwork. And the more discourse is produced about pro-wrestling the more everybody is aware of all of this, so it's hard to not be self-conscious about it. Plus it feels like a judgement passed on some sort of matches that should be less thought of simply because they reached for epicness as a definite goal, which in retrospect seems silly to me (silly me!). I mean, whatever works. Of course I'll have my preferences, like I said the two Mania Taker vs Micheals matches and the first (second actually) HHH one are not exactly my preferred style (especially the HHH one, which I don't even enjoy for the most part), but there's no way I'm gonna deny today that these were matches that successfully created a sense of epic and were great especially in their context (well, the HHH one is tricky though, but conceptually it sure worked).

Killed me !

You read my mind or something ? I almost namedrop Sabu in my answer ! Yeah, I still love Sabu (last time I checked at least, and my current approach of pro-wrestling tells me there's no way that one would change). And yeah, I was thinking here's someone that has been crazy influent, much more than most people would admit I think, and has had a *lot* of matches I have loved. Plus, he was one of the guy that was always compelling to watch against *anyone*, kinda like Zach Sabre Jr. today (yeah, in a completely different way). I don't remember if I voted Sabu last time, but maybe revisiting some Sabu stuff eventually would be enough for me to just revel in my love for that guy's work, good taste/bad taste notwithstanding !

Me : "Kenny Omega and the Young Bucks are GOAT 4 Life, brutha" PWO : "You can go to hell ! Straight to hell !" I haven't watched the last few years of NXT Takeovers (none of the Gargano vs Ciampa stuff after the very first match I think), so I wonder what I'd think about them. I mean, even Meltz who's a big fan of the style said many times they were going too long.

Hum... That's a really good question. I guess where I will end up putting Dynamite Kid will be a good answer. I guess if you have the influence but also the great output (and I don't think Dynamite has that great of an output when all it's said and done), chances are you're gonna get pretty high. But simply being influential won't matter that much, I guess (then again...). I'm asking myself a bunch of questions and not answering much, sorry !

Since I actually coined the term, I have to say this. Before CM Punk and Danielson showed up in AEW, I rewatched some of their most famous WWE stuff. Including the match I coined the infamous term about : CM Punk vs John Cena (the Chicago one). And I was wrong when I did it. I was wrong about the match (it's great), I was wrong about John Cena's performance in the match (he's absolutely terrific) and I was wrong about coining that phrase. Watching Taker's matches at Mania earlier this year also taught me that I was wrong about calling the two Shawn matches by that denomination, these matches absolutely worked as epic Mania matches, whether I love them or not (and I don't love them, especially the first one, my favorites Taker matches being vs Edge and vs Batista). I voted Omega, of course.

I expected this question. Well, it is what it is. Whether people like it or not it entirely a matter of subjective taste, but there is a global historical evolution of pro-wrestling outside of the influence of just one guy, and it always went toward more, not less. Dynamite Kid is just a cog in the machine, but a cog that just was 10, 20, 30 years in advance, in that way he was so influential because it's like he showed how things would be eventually. Visionary for sure, not in a theorical (or even messianic ! ) way, but simply by how he worked and how his work transcended his own era. Now, if I consider my own enjoyment of pro-wrestling and how I have watched more great pro-wrestling watching current stuff in the last 5 years, of course I'll say it's positive. But honestly if Dynamite doesn't happen, someone else does it (and really he wasn't the only one either moving things along, of course, he's just extremely striking). I know the comparison won't float well with some if they can't stand Dynamite, but honestly at the same time, Jaguar Yokota strikes me as the same kind of super fast, super intense, pushing the pace and spots and attitude toward what modern pro-wrestling will be. To me the question is less "Is it positive or negative", because the "negative" answer reeks of a melancholic, almost sentimental, feel about the past that I have no time for (which is an attitude that isn't restricted to pro-wrestling for me, it covers a lot of ground), than "Why and how did things evolved that way ?", without any sense of judging, because again, it is what it is. I won't blame anyone who doesn't connect to today's mostly spread style of pro-wrestling since for a long time I did not either, but then again to me there's also more joy in trying to get what may be great about it even if it's completely different than what you were used too. Case in point, I probably never been more satisfied as a pro-wrestling fan than in those last past few years.

I'm not sure everybody agrees with this sentiment either on here. And really, the idea of "reigning in" and "slowing down" the Lucha Bros is simply not getting what they are all about and how you can have the greatest matches with them. They are maximalists luchadors and they are not working their best stuff in the constraint of the "classic" southern tag-team formula (and wanting every tag-team match to be worked that way is simply a very narrow and reductionist view of pro-wrestling, and "less is more" is an empty cliché). Which is why FTR actually did not work that well with them (the match was still really good, but nowhere near as good as you'd think on paper because they did not compliment each other the best) while they had the greatest of all matches against the Young Bucks (who also had the greatest of all matches against FTR and Page/Omega, because they can do whatever the fuck they want and excel at everything, which is why they are the GOAT).

Not nearly enough Pieter camera shots.

Kota Ibushi : "Wanna do shoot-style shit ?" Great O-Khan : "Ok" O-Khan definitely turned the corner with me during this G1. Of course it was against exceptional workers, but still, he was game as fuck and has shown he was able to have that kind of match. Meanwhile, Ibushi might be the greatest high-concept worker ever. That O-Khan match was WTF is happening awesome. I mean, it made me forget I just saw Ishii vs Takahashi, which was awesome, and ZSJ vs KENTA, which was excellent too. Depending on where the conversation takes place I guess. Ibushi is awesome. I usually don't think of him as highly as Omega (to keep it in contexts that are more comparable, although, please, please, PLEASE, make it comparable for Danielson sooner than later ! G1 2022 ? PLEASE !!!!!), but then he shows up with the kind of match he just did against O-Khan (or last year against Taichi) and my mind is blown.