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The grand and pathetic journey of the Undertaker at WrestleMania
El-P replied to El-P's topic in Pro Wrestling
Still, that goof Snuka is a match where he does less than a regular Wrestling Challenge match... Super weak for a Mania match. He could have gotten Tito at least and the match would have been much better even in zombie mode. Indeed. One reason being is that they weren't "streak" matches, which is what I intend to demonstrate by doing this little project.- 206 replies
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Well, if we can be sure of something this year of uncertain times still, is that there won't be another Taker match at Mania. I wanted to do this for a while now, and since I'm living in "almost-lockdown" (I mean, why go out when everything is closed and there's a curfew after 6pm anyway), I figured this was the perfect time to revisit Taker's infamous Mania Streak and beyond. And try to decipher what was so special and fun about it, or maybe what was actually pretty bad about the whole thing too, as it's quite a bumpy ride to say the least despite a narrative that would make you think Taker at Mania was always that awesome event it became in the later years. Also, like I said before I basically became a pro-wrestling fan 30 years ago and the timeline begins a few months before the debut of the Undertaker in 1990. And I stopped being a fan of WWF (then) in 1999, about at the time the Undertaker, who had been from the very start one of my absolute favorite characters, really became kinda unbearable because of the booking aspects of you-know-who. Over the years I have seen all these matches already, I'd say the first third as they happened, the second third after the fact and the last third as they happened again as I slowly went back to at least watch Mania again at the turn of the 2010's. I have tried to watch this with the most open mind possible (and that include not being clouded by whatever my feelings may be about the politics of Mark Calaway), like it was a discovery, or at the very least a re-discovery. I realized I totally undersold some of this stuff. I realized some was even worst than I remembered. I was pleasantly surprised by some and pretty underwhelmed by others I thought were better. And since it's all about Taker at Mania, I'm going to have my own little streak consisting on rating whether it worked (win) or not (loss). So. GONG !!!!!!!!!!!! Chapter 1 : Mean Mark Callous is a zombie WrestleMania VII (1991) : Undertaker vs Jimmy Snuka Hey ! Everybody’s favorite girlfriend murderer Jimmy Snuka is already in the ring. You know what that means : JTTS. Interestingly enough, Gorilla was calling him the Phenom still, which is how Taker was gonna get called in the futur. I don’t see what was so phenomenal about Snuka in 1991, apart from the fact the wasn’t in prison for homicide. And so there it is, Taker’s first Mania appearance, redhead as hell and looking like Mean Mark in a Western movie undertaker gimmick. Walking a bit too fast compared to his mortuary pace later on. Honestly, for all the talk about the Fiend being ridiculous, Taker in 1991 was cartoony as fuck, especially with Paul Bearer making completely ridiculous over the top facials and evil wails and moans. Tons of reaction shots from kids who are supposed to be scared, although some look bored instead. We’re still deeply in the 80’s Hulkamania aesthetics. The gimmick is great though and Calaway does a terrific job with the way he moved and carried himself. There was this interesting contrast between his immobility and the way he delivered his offense, in a very sudden, snappy way, which really was unheard of for a huge guy like him. And this match was all about getting over the gimmick still, although we’re months after his debut on a PPV, so it’s a bit odd they did not have something more interesting for him. I mean, he did beat Dusty Rhodes during Survivor Series already. Snuka gets jackshit, as Taker barely registers anything he does. The flying clothesline comes off as a super impressive spot, again, almost shocking for a guy his size. On the other hand, no rope walk, no chokeslam (he was doing kind of a Big Boss Man version of it then, grabbing people as they ran into him), which is kinda odd as he was already doing all this in regular squash matches, so although Snuka bumps around quite a bit (and pretty well too), it’s a less impressive outing than a usual Superstar squash honestly. They also manage to screw up the spot where Snuka gets catched from a springboard dive (which they were doing on house shows) and Taker actually has to put him down before getting him up for the Tombstone, so there goes the big highspot of the match. So there, basically a less impressive squash than usual on a guy who had been a JTTS for a while now, six months after his much more impressive debut two PPV’s before (and that's in the era of only four a year)... with the big highspot pretty much blown. Can’t really call that a success. 0-1
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WWE TV 02/01 - 02/07 PALMEIRAS IS THE LIBERTADORES DA AMERICA CHAMPION
El-P replied to KawadaSmile's topic in WWE
This. Interesting fact, being the most streamed artist "in the world" really doesn't mean he is well known *all over the world*. Some artist nowadays are hugely popular in their own linguistic community (to speak very, very broadly) and if it happens to be a huge one, they get huge numbers because of the streaming services. But apparently, Bad Bunny really isn't very well know in Europe at all yet. Granted, I'm not a mainstream person, like, at all. That being said, although I have *never heard* any of her songs and I wouldn't be able to identify her voice, I know who BIllie Eillish is. -
WWE TV 02/01 - 02/07 PALMEIRAS IS THE LIBERTADORES DA AMERICA CHAMPION
El-P replied to KawadaSmile's topic in WWE
The more people talk about it and projecting stuff into it (Belle Delphine, DBZ Deviantart character, super saiyan transformation), the more I think it could have been totally super awesome in LU and would be super awesome in IMPACT still. BTW, speaking about looking old, Randy Orton is only 40. Sure, his body looks great, but damn, he doesn't look a day under 45. -
WWE TV 02/01 - 02/07 PALMEIRAS IS THE LIBERTADORES DA AMERICA CHAMPION
El-P replied to KawadaSmile's topic in WWE
I doubt any AEW fans is making fun of the Alexa Bliss stuff because it's "supernatural" stuff. I sure ain't. Hell, when Meltz said the other day that it was "Lucha Underground bad", that's when it actually peaked my interest because I loved that shit there. And like I said, I actually kinda like the idea. However, context and execution matters. Announcers talking in hush tones while Alexa Bliss is doing transformation tricks while a proper basic pro-wrestling match is going on is fucking pathetic. The Matt Hardy stuff was totally tongue-in-cheek and meta and it's not just a detail, it changes everything. I wouldn't go that far, her delivery of those (legit awful) scripted promos is pretty fucking bad. She was soooo good a few years back as the petite bitch heel rolling over the entire roster (I sense this is gonna turn into another "Hey, this sucked back then don't romanticize" shit ). But like I said I do like what she does with this stupid-ass stuff in term of body language and in-ring stuff. Really now, people need to watch Angelina Love being drugged into a zombi by Winter in TNA in 2011 ! Too bad Bliss is probably WWE 4 Life, because she's someone I'd like to see how she would do away from the machine. -
WWE TV 02/01 - 02/07 PALMEIRAS IS THE LIBERTADORES DA AMERICA CHAMPION
El-P replied to KawadaSmile's topic in WWE
Have you seen Raven lately ? Hey, he seems at a pretty good place in his life, considering what he put in his body for years, more power to him. It's funny because I remember an interview where Raven was saying he did not even listened to Nirvana and stuff, he was an old Neil Young and classic rock fan rather than the 90's stuff (which makes sense, he was almost already 30 years old when grunge was big) Heyman is one of those guys who looked 50 when he was 30. About the Bliss stuff, remember when the WWE stans were saying how AEW was killing the business when Matt Hardy was doing his transformation bits during Stadium Stampede, which was a complete cinematic and goofy match to begin with ? I wonder what the same people say now. What makes this absolutely idiotic is that it's during a legit in-ring match context and that the announcers are selling it without even a hint of wink-wink nudge-nudge like they always do in AEW when they pull that kind of stuff (that is when they use some meta aspects of BTE). But hey, I actually find the idea quite funny, it's just that the booking and execution (not by Bliss, who's actually good at pulling this off like say, Angelina Love was good at doing the idiotic AngelinaTaker gimmick during the early Winter angle in TNA) is dumb as fuck. -
WWE TV 02/01 - 02/07 PALMEIRAS IS THE LIBERTADORES DA AMERICA CHAMPION
El-P replied to KawadaSmile's topic in WWE
Come on, one year older is not older once you get past 18 years old. He was born in 64, they are both from 65. Sounds pretty logical to me, both Levy & Callaway are the product of the late 80's. -
The Thread Killer Talks Too Much: The Recaps
El-P replied to The Thread Killer's topic in Pro Wrestling
What else is new ? We've heard from decades the "hilarious" ribs Hennig was pulling on people. This culture of hazing which was found to be "funny" during the days of good old RF Shoot Interviews is nothing more that locker-room jock harrassement culture. The most infamous instance is Hennig being responsible for Jacques Rougeau getting beat up by Dynamite Kid, which in an ironic twist of fate, ended up with the bully getting broke because you just don't fuck with the Rougeaus (and forever we had to hear the stories about how awful they were for basically setting Dynamite Kid's up, while there was nothing wrong apparently about Dynamite abusing Jacques, and many many other in downright criminal ways at times). -
Jushin Liger. Because not only was he the top star of his division, but he was also the booker. Rock is probably the best instance of a top guy losing so much, but it was not his choice. Of course he could have "lost his smile" but who knows how that would have ended up, Austin basically shoot himself in the foot by (rightfully) refusing to do that job to Lesnar. The powerplay was much different in a context where the business was under a monopoly that during the territory days of the WWF/WCW rivalry, that has to be taken in consideration, you just can't compare things in a vacuum.
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Honestly, I always thought it was an angle anyway. Jay White vs Ishii. I'm so there.
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It absolutely does. As much like with the "pointing at sign", this is part of the WWE mentality (well, current ultra-capitalism) that puts the Brand above everything else (aka above every human being). The participants matter less than what they do inside the strict context of the Rumble. By dropping this ridiculous avalanche of useless stats, it makes everyone homogenized, from the guy with the most impressive records through the guys with the stupidest records. They are just passing through. The only constant which matters is the Rumble. The stars don't make the match, the match itself is a huge machinery of recycled tropes (some of which incredibly annoying like the "if you feet don't touch you're not eliminated" which was cute at first but has now long sunk into offensive dumbfuckery as showed by Naomi's spot this year, she was laid out flat on her back outside but yet not eliminated ? Da fuck) which produces stats assigned to seemingly random WWE peons. From Steve Austin to Bushwhacker Luke to Rey Mysterio, everybody is just a stat, what matters is The Rumble Brand, the workers are just interchangeable. Of course it's getting even worse when you're having these guys doing their hundred's Rumble in a row, and I thought this year was really telling in term of how dull the Men's Rumble was, including in its surprises (really, people, you were this happy to see fucking Carlito ? Can't wait for the Elias cameo in 2035, that is if he doesn't spend the next 15 years here to begin with). In the end it's why as much as I loved BeLair's win (and the ending stretch which was terrific), I did not care one bit for her post-match interview, because it was a little girl crying because she could Point@Sign. The Boyhood Dream is in full effect, but there's a totally patronizing way of making their current generation's people a bunch of fragile little beings whose only goal in life is to be in WWE (that's what Companies want, really, that your "life dream" is working for their Brand, whatever it may be) and go to Mania, not because they are the fucking Gods of Pro-wrestling and shit but because they want to go to Mania because they want to go to Mania because... There's a reason why WWE can't make new stars. Because they don't want too. The Stars of the promotion are named Mania and Rumble, these two big ones have swallowed every other event (the fact Rumble is pretty much the Door to Mania really means that Mania is the only star) and also swallowed every worker in the company. Of course, if done right, the Rumble can either make someone or validate the choice of the audience (in term of who is over and who do they want, which is something that has been destroyed during the "not Daniel Bryan" years) and the Women's Rumble this year was a good exemple of this. Although the match itself like I said really wasn't that great in term of inner workings, there was enough fresh and exciting workers in it to make up for it. But their ability to follow-up on anything these days in a non-dumbass fashion is really in question.
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Come on it was obvious. The second Orton showed up it was way too much of a bullshit finish to be believable. Glad for Bianca BeLair. Sasha vs Carmella was really good. The rest was pretty much trash (the men's Rumble had a few cool spots but also Kane and a really stupid choice of a winner). 5am. Good night people.
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Edge. They managed to get this guy back because they have no one else from the previous generation and no one else from his generation either. 50+ demo, here we come.
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I was thinking the same thing. Probably because they do less cut when there is so much people in the ring, but now it's just epileptic city.
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Are they piping a fake "This is awesome" chant ?
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Braun in 2021 is like the Big Show by the late 00's, dated and tired already. No Fiend fuckery ? Color me disappointed !
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Orton is coming back, right ?
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You wanted Becky, you got Seth.... Yeah, the disappointment is huge, I know.
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Everybody is over 40. It's the WWE.
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AJ Styles, well, you know the drill. But he REALLY was from TNA fame.
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CHRISTIAN CAGE, YOU KNOW IT, OF MOTHERFUCKING TOTAL NONSTOP ACTION FAME !!!!!!!!!!
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Hurricane Helms as Bushwhacker Luke.