ESPN's Grantland

[evilclown]

Has anyone read this guy? Beneath some pretty fine (for wrestling) prose, this is like a handbook for smark talking points. This guy could have been a member of the old Workrate Cru.

[soup23]

I read his stuff at the site launch and was not a big fan. He seemed so determined to make his own theories work, "the reality era" that when they didn't take off, he just seemed disillusioned and uninformed on the actual landscape of the wrestling business.

[Ricky Jackson]

When he stays away from trying to push the "Reality Era" and other bullshit postmodern theories, like he mostly did with his last column, he can be pretty good. His piece on Bruno was just really, really bad and embarrassing.

[WingedEagle]

I imagine most folks on here at a level of fandom such that they find his schtick unreadable at best and insulting at worst. Interestingly, I sent a couple friends who came to Mania to read his stuff as they're casual fans at best and they found it interesting and informative. Go figure.

[Cross Face Chicken Wing]

I enjoyed his Dead Wrestler of the Week posts at Deadspin. His Grantland work has been terrible.

[Childs]

He's awful. He can't get past his whole reality-unreality-postmodernism schtick.

[jdw]

What Childs says.

 

He's had a few pieces that were okay, but they don't stick with you (I can't remember them). But for the most part... it's pretty throw away.

 

I remain stunned that Dave, who has a track record with Simmons, didn't try for an MMA job at Grantland and try to hook someone else up as the weekly wrestling writer.

 

John

[Cross Face Chicken Wing]

Grantland's style is mostly essays and navel-gazing. Even though the content is thin and meaningless, it's usually written well. Dave's run-on sentences and "unique" grammar would seem very out of place.

[Childs]

I actually think Grantland has hit a pretty good stride overall -- less pointless navel gazing than at the beginning. I'm a big fan of Zach Lowe, their NBA writer, who mixes advanced statistics, video and more traditional reporting in a really insightful way. Jonah Keri and Bill Barnwell are strong on MLB and NFL, respectively. Their movie and TV writers are solid. I've loved their oral histories.

 

Shoemaker is one of their weakest regular contributors. I agree that Dave wouldn't be a perfect fit stylistically, but he is a lot more readable when working with a real editor. The one MMA piece he did for Grantland was pretty good as I recall.

[Bigelow34]

Keri, Lowe and Barnwell are fantastic, easily the best thing going there. I like Andy Greenwald too and Molly Lambert makes me laugh.

 

The decreased deadlines and workload as improved Simmons's writing as well, for the most part.

 

Shoemaker is obsessed with all the meta shit, as mentioned above, and it gets old for sure.

[jdw]

After reading CFC's comment, I was going to bring up Lowe... and was glad to see Childs and Bigelow beat me to it. A very good writer, is regular in producing content, breaks things down in ways that are easy to understand, will write both shorter and longer items, and has that section at the end of things he likes / doesn't like that gets across he's a NBA Fan in addition to be a writer / analyst. He also clearly has developed sources within the game in coaching staffs and front offices. Very good at what he does.

 

Barnwell was with Football Outsiders for 6+ years. I read of FO regularly, but folks whose opinions I respect on football say positive things about how FO has move writing and analysis on football far beyond the old hack days.

 

I don't know Jonah Keri... just don't follow baseball like I use to. But one gets the sense from the hiring of Lowe and Barnwell that Simmons was going to hire a similar type of person for baseball. He's a Prospectus guy, so that fits the bill.

 

I agree on Andy Greenwald. He writes about a lot of shows that I don't watch or care for... but he writes about so much television that he'll hit something in your wheelhouse, and you'll be blown away by how spot on it is. Anyone who watched cooking shows on TV over the years probably will get this:

 

Eat Bray Love: The corruption of Anthony Bourdain, the return of Emeril Lagasse, and the state of food television

 

That's just a fantastic piece that bounces all over the place... except it's totally focused on where it's going. I'm a long time watcher of this stuff, going back to Julia and the Galloping Gourmet in the 70s, all sorts of PBS stuff in the 80s, the dawn of Food TV in the 90s and the evolution of television FoodTainment (the food equiv of Vince's vision of Sports Entertainment)... and guys like Bourdain pulling it back from the depths with No Reservations. So that Greenwald piece hits so many marks that I really wish he'd write a book on the history/evolution of subject rather than doing recaps on stuff like Walking Dead and Game of Thrones.

 

There are a heck of a lot of good writers over there. There are some guys being hip... but even a lot of them can toss out wickedly entertaining shit. The one of TV Opening Credit Fonts of the 90s was fantastic and funny.

 

John

[Bigelow34]

Yes...can't believe I forgot Rembert. He is good too. Simmons may be grating and annoying, but the dude has built an empire and has an eye for talent.

[Phil Schneider]

You would think Barnwell would just get Dean the wrestling gig

[BrickHithouse]

As far as FO goes, I was glad to see Barnwell go. Mike Tanier is the guy I miss. Seems FO has taken a dive the past couple of years without those two, but it might just be my perception.

[evilclown]

You would think Barnwell would just get Dean the wrestling gig

I'm honestly shocked that Dean hasn't been scooped up to write somewhere. Does he still write regularly? Does he make enough money from DVDVR to keep him from moving on to a bigger platform?

[Cross Face Chicken Wing]

After reading CFC's comment, I was going to bring up Lowe... and was glad to see Childs and Bigelow beat me to it. A very good writer, is regular in producing content, breaks things down in ways that are easy to understand, will write both shorter and longer items, and has that section at the end of things he likes / doesn't like that gets across he's a NBA Fan in addition to be a writer / analyst. He also clearly has developed sources within the game in coaching staffs and front offices. Very good at what he does.

 

Barnwell was with Football Outsiders for 6+ years. I read of FO regularly, but folks whose opinions I respect on football say positive things about how FO has move writing and analysis on football far beyond the old hack days.

 

I don't know Jonah Keri... just don't follow baseball like I use to. But one gets the sense from the hiring of Lowe and Barnwell that Simmons was going to hire a similar type of person for baseball. He's a Prospectus guy, so that fits the bill.

 

I agree on Andy Greenwald. He writes about a lot of shows that I don't watch or care for... but he writes about so much television that he'll hit something in your wheelhouse, and you'll be blown away by how spot on it is. Anyone who watched cooking shows on TV over the years probably will get this:

 

Eat Bray Love: The corruption of Anthony Bourdain, the return of Emeril Lagasse, and the state of food television

 

That's just a fantastic piece that bounces all over the place... except it's totally focused on where it's going. I'm a long time watcher of this stuff, going back to Julia and the Galloping Gourmet in the 70s, all sorts of PBS stuff in the 80s, the dawn of Food TV in the 90s and the evolution of television FoodTainment (the food equiv of Vince's vision of Sports Entertainment)... and guys like Bourdain pulling it back from the depths with No Reservations. So that Greenwald piece hits so many marks that I really wish he'd write a book on the history/evolution of subject rather than doing recaps on stuff like Walking Dead and Game of Thrones.

 

There are a heck of a lot of good writers over there. There are some guys being hip... but even a lot of them can toss out wickedly entertaining shit. The one of TV Opening Credit Fonts of the 90s was fantastic and funny.

 

John

Yeah, my comments were a little unfair. Lowe is great. So is Keri. Grantland has gotten better since it launched. I guess with Lowe and Keri, I've been reading them for so long, I didn't even think about it when they went to Grantland. They're still Zach Lowe and Jonah Keri to me, not Grantland writers (which is unfair to Grantland).

 

Bill Barnwell is a snarky wanna-be sabermatician. Barnwell (and Aaron Schatz, who remains at Football Outsiders) try so hard to be relevant like the baseball stats guys, but they're nowhere close. They're like your little brother, constantly tugging on your arm and saying, "Hey, pay attention to me!" Andvanced analytics and metrics has a place in football, but not to the extent that Barnwell and Schatz try to make you think it does. Instead of evolving and recognizing this, they've decided to turn into pompous assholes.

 

Mike Tanier is fantastic. One of the best football writers (not reporters) going today.

[tomk]

You would think Barnwell would just get Dean the wrestling gig

Umm. While Dean probably still watches more prowrestling than anyone else around, I don't think Dean has watched a WWE match in three plus years.

[tomk]

You would think Barnwell would just get Dean the wrestling gig

Umm. While Dean probably still watches more prowrestling than anyone else around, I don't think Dean has watched a WWE match in three plus years.

[NintendoLogic]

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who can't stand that guy. If he really thought that Rock winning the title at the Rumble was an attempt to hit the reset button rather than something that had been planned for over a year, he's either clueless or deluded.

[W2BTD]

Our new columnist, Nich Lichter (ex-SB Nation's "Cageside Seats") takes veiled shots at the latest Masked Man piece.

 

http://www.voicesofwrestling.com/2013/07/2...ilityvsreality/

[Jmare007]

Read his Grantland Summerslam preview and the podcast and man, this guy just loves to overcomplicate things with "big words". It was funny how in the podcast he started doing the same weird analogies he does in his pieces and after both guests responded with silence the Masked Man just said "never mind" or something like that

[Migs]

Yeah, my comments were a little unfair. Lowe is great. So is Keri. Grantland has gotten better since it launched. I guess with Lowe and Keri, I've been reading them for so long, I didn't even think about it when they went to Grantland. They're still Zach Lowe and Jonah Keri to me, not Grantland writers (which is unfair to Grantland).

 

Bill Barnwell is a snarky wanna-be sabermatician. Barnwell (and Aaron Schatz, who remains at Football Outsiders) try so hard to be relevant like the baseball stats guys, but they're nowhere close. They're like your little brother, constantly tugging on your arm and saying, "Hey, pay attention to me!" Andvanced analytics and metrics has a place in football, but not to the extent that Barnwell and Schatz try to make you think it does. Instead of evolving and recognizing this, they've decided to turn into pompous assholes.

 

Mike Tanier is fantastic. One of the best football writers (not reporters) going today.

Schatz is much, much better than Barnwell at couching his arguments in the limits of football stats. Barnwell comes off as full of himself.

[Migs]

An interesting interview with Triple H.

 

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/958836...fficer-triple-h

[Bix]

Holy unnecessary footnotes.

[alexoblivion]

For some reason I find the idea of Hunter watching Foley's death matches in Japan very appealing.